Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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#175315
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Bullshyt.
What "causes" radioactive decay?
What is the "cause" from one moment to the next, that "makes" a radioactive atom suddenly break into smaller atoms?
Hmmm?
We have had discussions about this before.

Poly says magic, I say readjustment of energy transfers on the universal scale.

Everything is tied together per science. Move one tiny bit and it crosses the universe.

You have two ways for that decay to occur. A tug from somewhere else on that particle, or a barrier to it is lessened allowing for its imbalance to seek balance.

Atoms are part of the universe. You do understand that, don't you?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

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#175316
Aug 24, 2013
 
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Face it you can't prove anything you have faith in your belief. End a rounds in conversations do not change that. You all ready admitted the truth stop being a bull er.
You mean when I said we all have subjective realities? Yes, that's true.

It also disproves your deity.

Thanks for the admission.

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#175317
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean when I said we all have subjective realities? Yes, that's true.
It also disproves your deity.
Thanks for the admission.
You have some oddly twisted logic. Your spurious signal generations are affecting your thinking.

To have a subjective reality you have to have a reality to create the subjective one. Its a matter of a daughter force bouncing off the larger one it is derived from.

You walk into a rec hall or a movie theater and engage in action/reaction. Means are provided. The same is done here.

Pay the proprietor on the way out.
blacklagoon

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#175318
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Some believers have higher I.Q. scores. My cousin is an example of a poorly educated atheist. He quit school to pursue his interest in partying, burning out more brain cells in the process. He denied the existence of God for years. After several years of mental health problems and a few hospitalizations, he wasn't any closer to a positive example of academic achievement. He had to apply for Social Security Disability, which is hardly a six-figure income.
Your statement is really nothing more than a carefully crafted superiority complex, and reveals a very superficial and linear understanding of theological concepts. You seem to have an aptitude for science, math, and music, but that could also be an indicator of
autism. It's well known that people with a sensory handicap such as blindness often develop a more highly developed sense of hearing and/or smell to compensate. In a likewise manner, some people with a "spiritual handicap" attempt to compensate for it with academic studies. Academic and intellectual achievement is a wonderful thing, but only until the point is reached where a person feels "superior" over others. At that point, humility itself is handicapped and crushed to death under the weight of self absorption.
Yes I'm sure "some" believers do have higher I.Q. scores, and giving ONE example of a poorly educated Atheists is kind of pointless, don't you think? Now that I think of it, giving "one" example to make a point is really foolish, especially when we are talking about huge numbers.

Research has shown that Atheists have higher intelligence than people with strong religious faith, the difference is 5.8 according to findings in Developmental Psychology. Only 7% of members in the American Academy of Science believe in God. Several Gallup poll studies of general populations have shown that those with higher I.Q.'s tend to NOT believe in God.

Do your own research if you like as I did, I'm sure the results will show the higher intelligence belonging to Atheists. It only stands to reason, part of being intelligent is being skeptical, and understanding how the world around us works. We do not accept unsupported premisses and abhor gullibility.

My statement is far from a carefully crafted superiority complex, it is factual information available to anyone. Further research will show how well countries that have a high percentage of Atheists do in many areas such as health, crime, education, income, and general wellness.

"Spiritual handicap"....too funny, as is "Theological concepts." Theology, the study of what can only be imagined. Of course all of our points dealing with academics as a way of compensating for a "spiritual handicap" ( what ever the hell that is) are totally unsupported. Typical of most Theists. You throw around words like *spiritual* and *soul* and expect us to take them as something real when you have zero evidence that they exist.
blacklagoon

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#175319
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You are not going to get petted with that attitude.
Go eat a bug.
Thanks for your NON-responce. Glad to see you agree with my assessment of your extremely faulty analogy.

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#175320
Aug 24, 2013
 

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blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>Thanks for your NON-responce. Glad to see you agree with my assessment of your extremely faulty analogy.
More of your assumptive thinking processes and lack of higher intelligence to appreciate such things.

You must be a horn blower. Totally absorbed in your own noise.

Hey, do the fish gather around you out sailing like the squirrels in the park? Try fish food. Like the peanuts for the squirrels.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#175321
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
You delude yourself into thinking you live in some other universe, when the one he speaks of includes you in it. So the physical laws apply to you also, whether you like or admit it.
No question we do, it should be embraced. To post as you have. You have no belief in Quantum physics, or you don't believe it. So be it.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

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#175322
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
We have had discussions about this before.
Poly says magic, I say readjustment of energy transfers on the universal scale.
Everything is tied together per science. Move one tiny bit and it crosses the universe.
You have two ways for that decay to occur. A tug from somewhere else on that particle, or a barrier to it is lessened allowing for its imbalance to seek balance.
Atoms are part of the universe. You do understand that, don't you?
I am sorry Dave I can't see why you waste your time going into details. Bob sees things strictly how it favors his own personal delusion. He is a fundamentalist, therefore he is here to spread his delusion. He does it religiously, while making a shield claiming he is not religious. True atheist would frown on Bob's ways. That is why Bob is an Atheist. With a large cased A not the smaller cased a.

“Robert Stevens”

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#175323
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean when I said we all have subjective realities? Yes, that's true.
It also disproves your deity.
Thanks for the admission.
I don't want to have my religion, faith or beliefs be part of this conversation. I am a Pagan sort. I consider many Pagans less religious than Atheist. Boy is that stamen a cheat, I doubt you could figure out the detail. With that said, I can prove my deity. It just goes off topic. You are so use to repeating your previous conversations, you failed to pick up on this point that should have been clear to you days ago.

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#175325
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
No question we do, it should be embraced. To post as you have. You have no belief in Quantum physics, or you don't believe it. So be it.
So many of these quasi-understanders of Science don't understand the underpinnings of the logic. They just fall in love with the mystical sounding terms. Then they get sucked into cults.

There is zero proof or even any indications this universe could arise from nothingness and our assemblage from chance. There is hardcore scientific evidence and proof that our level of intelligence and manipulation of matter requires some organization to even be formed. There is also the scientific intellectual understanding that our perceptions of the universe and our construction is strictly a result of our limitations to observe that which it was formed in. We can't see outside the box we are in. Science itself claims to see that box, just not what created it.

The BBT and laws of thermodynamics prove we are a machine as we understand machines. Topix atheists believe we are magic beings of our own making.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

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#175326
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You have some oddly twisted logic. Your spurious signal generations are affecting your thinking.
To have a subjective reality you have to have a reality to create the subjective one. Its a matter of a daughter force bouncing off the larger one it is derived from.
You walk into a rec hall or a movie theater and engage in action/reaction. Means are provided. The same is done here.
Pay the proprietor on the way out.
You are aware that one's subjective reality is not objectively real, right? You're also aware that one's subjective reality, no matter how hard they really, really, really believe in it, isn't subjectively real for all people, right?

You are aware that some people's subjective realities include different deities than the Abrahamic ones, yes? And that other people's don't have deities in them at all, yes?

And that physicists don't share your strange confabulation with the EM, yes?

Since no one's subjective reality is objectively real, since all kinds of mutually exclusive deities exist in lots of differing subjective realities, and since some have no deities at all, we can safely conclude that deities do not exist.

You can't have both mutually exclusive deities existing and no deities existing concurrently; hence objective reality includes none. They're just imagined beings - similar to your imagined explanations of reality by postulating that everything is EM based.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

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#175328
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't want to have my religion, faith or beliefs be part of this conversation. I am a Pagan sort. I consider many Pagans less religious than Atheist. Boy is that stamen a cheat, I doubt you could figure out the detail. With that said, I can prove my deity. It just goes off topic. You are so use to repeating your previous conversations, you failed to pick up on this point that should have been clear to you days ago.
Our conversation went like this: we both agreed atheists and believers have beliefs. Then we agreed that the faith atheists have in things like medicine is not akin to the faith believers have in their deities.

Then you claimed that physics proved your deity existed. Poly and I both asked for evidence and you were unable to present any, but you certainly put up a bluff "oh, I could if I wanted."

Here you do the same - "I could put proof of my deity up!"

Sorry, I don't believe you. Yes, I believe that you really and truly believe in your deities - enough to subjectively experience them as real. But at the end of the day, they're imagined beings made real to you through practiced behavior and your social experiences.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#175329
Aug 24, 2013
 
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Some believers have higher I.Q. scores.
Naturally!

Atheism is simply no faith in deities/supernatural.

That is **all** that it is, in spite of false claims to the contrary.

As such, simple distributive probabilities show that some atheists will be quite stupid (as compared to the standard norms).

However, after saying that? I **must** point out the obvious:

Religion and religious brainwashing is pretty much ubiquitous over much of the world.

As such, it is quite difficult to be born, and **not** exposed to religious indoctrination during one's lifetime.

And religion's insidious nature is such, that it's memes create mental barriers opposing dislodging the ideas.

The only real cure for those? Appears to be education-- once a person is fully brainwashed into a religion or religion's memes?

Only exposure to many and varied ideas seems to be able to overcome these brainwashing-created mental walls.

And so?

Atheists, for the most part, consist of people who have been exposed to many and varied ideas--

-- a phenomena which **tends** to lead to better thinking skillsets.

-- of which **tends** to lead to better testing under the old IQ memes.

And there you have it in a nutshell. <grin>

(admittedly, a rather **largish** nutshell... heh)

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

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#175330
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
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True Mr Quantum man, but that is just you in your universe. Your universe is true to you, and you only. Amen to that. It is clear it sucks to be you why wish it upon others.
The above is in no way a valid counter-argument to Polymath's statements.

Fail.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

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#175331
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
So many of these quasi-understanders of Science don't understand the underpinnings of the logic. They just fall in love with the mystical sounding terms. Then they get sucked into cults.
There is zero proof or even any indications this universe could arise from nothingness and our assemblage from chance. There is hardcore scientific evidence and proof that our level of intelligence and manipulation of matter requires some organization to even be formed. There is also the scientific intellectual understanding that our perceptions of the universe and our construction is strictly a result of our limitations to observe that which it was formed in. We can't see outside the box we are in. Science itself claims to see that box, just not what created it.
The BBT and laws of thermodynamics prove we are a machine as we understand machines. Topix atheists believe we are magic beings of our own making.
I agree with you. I'd ad to the outside reader. When you encounter an atheist off line do not include online experiences. This crowd is more of a study of fundamentalist than atheist. I stand by my thoughts that most of them are over 400 pounds and don't leave their homes. I don't state that for purposes of slander. Giving the way they don't take a person's word for their statement, I don't believe what they say. It is why I don't make long post that they so frequently request. Nor would I invest the time to find quotes from people to support my statement. IN THE CASE OF THIS TOPIC. I HAVE HEARD MANY ATHEIST ADMIT. YOU CAN'T PROVE THERE IS NO CREATOR, AND NEVER WILL BE ABLE TO DO SO. I just don't want to waste my time gathering these statements. I would if I had a greater respect for their honesty, but than again. I really don't have that much free time.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#175332
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Face it you can't prove anything you have faith in your belief. End a rounds in conversations do not change that. You all ready admitted the truth stop being a bull er.
False.

Science is based in **fact** not faith.

Faith is just a systematic collection of LIES without any FACTS.

If you had FACTS?

YOU WOULD NOT NEED FAITH.

It really is that simple--

-- alas, it is STILL ABOVE YOUR ABILITIES.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#175333
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone else that could make it on any science channel says the exact opposite of you,
Now you are just making up more LIES to support your FAITH.

Lies are ALL that you have!

In any case? The pop-fictional "science" shows are not even a little bit accurate for the most part.

Fail.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#175334
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
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Everyone else that could make it on any science channel says the exact opposite of you, as I said you are in your own private universe, and one that really sucks. Perhaps the reason you're in the minority is no one wants to share your thoughts with children, because they suck. I am sorry for you that you are stuck in YOUR reality. What is true for you is not true for all. Mr so called Quantum, that is your Universe anyway. Amen to that.
Nothing in the above? Even comes CLOSE TO ADDRESSING MY 3 POINTS.

Nothing-- YOU DID NOT EVEN TRY. You just whined "IS NOT" over and over.

Here they are again:

Quantum mechanics proves beyond any doubts, that an omniscient god cannot exist within the present universe.

Period.

That proves to 100% that your god isn't real.

But it's worse: the theory of relativity--well tested-- also proves beyond any doubts that an omniscient god is impossible in the present universe.

That's two.

The Heisenberg uncertainty principle? That's 3 proofs you cannot have an all-knowing god in the universe.

That's three-- there's more.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

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#175335
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
You are aware that one's subjective reality is not objectively real, right? You're also aware that one's subjective reality, no matter how hard they really, really, really believe in it, isn't subjectively real for all people, right?
You are aware that some people's subjective realities include different deities than the Abrahamic ones, yes? And that other people's don't have deities in them at all, yes?
And that physicists don't share your strange confabulation with the EM, yes?
Since no one's subjective reality is objectively real, since all kinds of mutually exclusive deities exist in lots of differing subjective realities, and since some have no deities at all, we can safely conclude that deities do not exist.
You can't have both mutually exclusive deities existing and no deities existing concurrently; hence objective reality includes none. They're just imagined beings - similar to your imagined explanations of reality by postulating that everything is EM based.
Life is but a dream. Have a good one not a bad one.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#175336
Aug 24, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
We have had discussions about this before.
Poly says magic, I say readjustment of energy transfers on the universal scale.
So you claim... "MAGIC" here?

Okay-- but "magic" isn't real nor is it scientifically sound.

Fail.
Dave Nelson wrote:
Everything is tied together per science. Move one tiny bit and it crosses the universe.
Bullshyt.
Dave Nelson wrote:
You have two ways for that decay to occur. A tug from somewhere else on that particle, or a barrier to it is lessened allowing for its imbalance to seek balance.
Bullshyt.
Dave Nelson wrote:
Atoms are part of the universe. You do understand that, don't you?
Yes-- but obviously **YOU** do not. You invoke...

.... MAGIC as your "explanation".

This is hardly surprising... you BELIEVE in magic (gods)!

Silly.

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