Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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“NUK NUK NUK....HEY MOE!”

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#172255
Jul 16, 2013
 

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T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>ask him I don't know!! if you say he don't exist! who did make childhood cancer? was it evolution
T-Town, you're one of the few people I still see who's been posting as long as I have and that's a rare site these days!

You rarely see anyone either still posting or using their original moniker.

“YO BOO”

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#172256
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Thinking wrote:
Really?
Revelations 22 says christians will end up in servitude.
<quoted text>
you don't it believe do ya? or are you a bible believer now! Way to go thinking we need you to spread the good news the gospel!!!!

YEA THINKING A FOLLOWER OF JESUS CHEIST HIS LORD AND SAVIOR

“YO BOO”

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#172257
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Richardfs wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL
if you think that was funny! look down move yo big ol belly to one side and OPPS there it is a very funny joke... Its hard to see but very funny... hehehehehe yo now you have Bro. Clownie's permission to post under the new handle as fly-rod

“YO BOO”

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#172258
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Ricky F wrote:
<quoted text>T-Town, you're one of the few people I still see who's been posting as long as I have and that's a rare site these days!
You rarely see anyone either still posting or using their original moniker.
We old vets deserve respect from these rookies! but do we get it? Hell No... most of them have been banned 3 or 4 times or more! Yet you and I hang in like rusty nails...

Since: Jul 13

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#172259
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Givemeliberty wrote:
This wasn't directed to you stop cowering from my questions.... Or did you just stumble and show that you are using sock accounts?
I was under the impression that your comments were directed at me.
Givemeliberty wrote:
Again why was it that "Paul" who never met Jesus outside of dreams and visions/hallucinations was the first to write about him?
Would you consider the following as a plausible explanation?

Paul was the first to write, because Paul was a member of the Sanhedrin. Members of the Jewish Sanhedrin were very well educated. The men that Jesus chose as His disciples were (with the exception of Matthew) working class men. In that culture,(a predominantly oral culture) it's not unreasonable to infer or conclude that a better educated man would be the first to write everything down.

Isn't that a reasonable alternative to consider?

Since: Jul 13

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#172260
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Givemeliberty wrote:
They voted on what books would be in the bible and even on how those books should be worded. Several edits were made, in some cases drastic edits completely rewriting and even adding entire pages worth of new additions.
If you do not even know that Paul had visions and dreams about Jesus I can clearly see you have a very low understanding of the bible. I try to dumb or down for you guys I really do. But even then there comes a time when I can't just hold your hand on everything. Do read up on Paul and try to catch up to when I was in Sunday school.
Thanks
<quoted text>
Please don't be so hasty in your thought process. I asked YOU to tell me where exactly in the NT Paul claimed that his account of seeing Jesus is only a dream or vision. I know the story of the Damascus Road incident. I'm asking you to provide evidence that Paul claimed that it was ONLY a VISION or DREAM.

Insulting remarks don't move the dialogue forward very well do they?

“There is no god!”

Since: Jun 12

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#172261
Jul 16, 2013
 

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T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>you know this how? prove it
waiting for christard to prove that god and jesus exists

“There is no god!”

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#172262
Jul 16, 2013
 
T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>CHRISTIAN! I've told you hard head! next you want to know how much I give the church each month... none of your BIZZ
guessing that you are a catholic

“There is no god!”

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#172263
Jul 16, 2013
 
T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>what are you gonna do about it? and no you can't play with my junk = THE LARGE ONE
you are lying it's so small you'll need a microscope to see it

“YO BOO”

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#172264
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Mikko wrote:
<quoted text>
waiting for christard to prove that god and jesus exists
waiting for science atheist and other knuckle-draggers to disprove Jesus, if he don't exist prove it...

waiting + grinning

“YO BOO”

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#172265
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Mikko wrote:
<quoted text>
guessing that you are a catholic
nope!

“YO BOO”

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#172266
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Mikko wrote:
<quoted text>
you are lying it's so small you'll need a microscope to see it
thank GOD for science! or Mikko would never see his tiny package

“NUK NUK NUK....HEY MOE!”

Since: May 07

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#172267
Jul 16, 2013
 

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T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>We old vets deserve respect from these rookies! but do we get it? Hell No... most of them have been banned 3 or 4 times or more! Yet you and I hang in like rusty nails...
I agree, but there were several times I could have been banned as well but somehow made it through, now I wonder if mods give us any more respect due to our making it this far? I'm not sure I have the answer either? lol

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#172268
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Isn't your celebration a bit premature? What Baptist church did you attend? First Baptist? Cavalry Baptist?
I attended Catholic church until my parents divorced. Then attended First Baptist as a teen. I lost my faith in my twenties and just came back to it within the last 7 years. Now I consider myself Protestant non-denominational. I believe in the traditional orthodox Protestant view as established at the Council of Nicea and the Council of Laodicea. I believe Martin Luther was correct in his action to nail his 95 Theses to the door of the church in Wittenburg, Germany. This paved the way for the common man to learn the truth of the gospels and break the man-made authority imposed by the Catholic church. I agree that Constantine used the church more for political expediency than for his own spiritual growth.
Now you know my Christian history. What is your history?
Interesting. Then maybe you **would** be interested in what this guy has to say.

I apologize for the introduction-- the sound is pretty poor quality. But the speech gets better.

Sound quality aside, this person is an actual historian, and approaches the question strictly from a historian's point of view, neither a believer nor a non-believer's view.
" http://www.youtube.com/watch... ;

The description: Published on Mar 28, 2013

Dr. Richard Carrier flew in from California to lecture the UNCG Atheists, Agnostics, and Skeptics on the historicity of Christ. The historicity of Christ has appeared in the public consciousness over the last few years because of such individuals such as Robert Price and Dr. Carrier. This topic deals with the analysis of historical data to determine if Jesus existed as an actual person.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#172269
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Givemeliberty wrote:
Bart cracks me up because he talks all the time about how inaccurate the NT especially the gospels are and how they cannot be looked at as reliable. Then in his book about Jesus existing his proof for Jesus existing? The NT gospels! Lmfao!
Yes he even destroys the Josephus and Tacitus forgeries stating that neither of these men could write as they did about Jesus and not suffer tremendously.
<quoted text>
My mistake-- it wasn't Bart, it was Dr. Richard Carrier. I've not heard your man, but I'll look for him.

The video I saw was here: " http://youtu.be/mwUZOZN-9dc" ; poor audio, but worth your hour to listen.

He's a real historian, using real historian's methodology.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#172270
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Givemeliberty wrote:
Bart cracks me up because he talks all the time about how inaccurate the NT especially the gospels are and how they cannot be looked at as reliable. Then in his book about Jesus existing his proof for Jesus existing? The NT gospels! Lmfao!
Yes he even destroys the Josephus and Tacitus forgeries stating that neither of these men could write as they did about Jesus and not suffer tremendously.
<quoted text>
Here it one example of Dr Ehrman, I'll give it a listen.
" http://youtu.be/eV9JVEtDS8E" ;

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#172271
Jul 16, 2013
 

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saidI wrote:
<quoted text>
Two men recently had bone marrow and stem cell transplants, and they no longer have Hiv/Aids. Science, winning.
**SCIENCE** for the WIN.

Again.

Science has also allowed the creation of replacement limbs that are pretty damn good replacements--considering.

In direct contrast to any god-- who apparently cannot manage that.

Soon?

Science will replace vision for the blind.

Yet **another** task gods are unable to perform.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#172272
Jul 16, 2013
 

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albtraum wrote:
<quoted text>
That would be fantastic! Got a link?
Here's an excellent summary, and why it's both exciting but also we need to keep a sober attitude.

ERV is an amazing researcher in HIV/AIDS, and her blog is an excellent resource for keeping up.

" http://scienceblogs.com/erv/2013/07/07/two-pa... ;

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#172273
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Roman Apologist wrote:
Would you consider the following as a plausible explanation?
Paul was the first to write, because Paul was a member of the Sanhedrin. Members of the Jewish Sanhedrin were very well educated.

The men that Jesus chose as His disciples were (with the exception of Matthew) working class men. In that culture,(a predominantly oral culture) it's not unreasonable to infer or conclude that a better educated man would be the first to write everything down.

Isn't that a reasonable alternative to consider?
One better: since none of the gospels were rendered into words, until 60 or 90 years too late, it's more likely these were written from "friend of a friend" stories, at least one or two generations later.

And that the people they were allegedly "written" by, were long dead by the time the stories were written down.

Moreover, whoever wrote the gospels, clearly copied from sources we no longer have, apart from John of course.

This lends credence to the idea that they were written by anonymous sources writing in the **name** of the traditional titles.

And, as you point out, the majority of the disciples were most likely illiterate and could not have written anything even if they had an urge to.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#172274
Jul 16, 2013
 

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Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Please don't be so hasty in your thought process. I asked YOU to tell me where exactly in the NT Paul claimed that his account of seeing Jesus is only a dream or vision. I know the story of the Damascus Road incident. I'm asking you to provide evidence that Paul claimed that it was ONLY a VISION or DREAM.

Insulting remarks don't move the dialogue forward very well do they?
Paul freely admits that he was the only person "there". He also admits that the "person" he saw was more like a spirit, than a man.

This reinforces the fact that Paul only writes about jesus as if he were pure spirit-- pure "angelic" or "heavenly" and never about jesus-the-man.

That fact, and the fact that Paul's stuff is the oldest verifiable NT writings, reinforces the notion that the Jesus-myth began as a celestial, non-corpreal being.

And only later, did the stories change to make him into a man.

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