Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#172189 Jul 15, 2013
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do you view it that way?
I see it as not punishing the snooty customer, but as giving him a chance to re-evaluate his initial behavior. Remember, the guest was the smug one and was being sneaky and under-handed about it. The shop owner merely gave the snooter an opportunity to realize it for himself.
When I reiterated that the out-of-towner had been smug and condescending you replied "So?" as if the out-of-towner had every right to treat the store owner this way without any penalty or sense of accountability. Your reply seems, on the surface, to endorse the actions of the snooty customer as somehow socially acceptable. Am I interpreting that correctly?
I'm curious as to how that view is any less arrogant than that of the store owner. The store owner could have kicked the snooty customer out. And then what would the customer learn? Would he learn humility or would he learn that he just isn't welcome in that store any longer? My thoughts upon first hearing that were that the store owner was still willing to allow the customer to come back, but instead of pointing out the customer's behavior, let him do a little work that shows him he's not as smart as he thought he was. There is no better teacher than self induced humiliation. The snooty man was not obligated to follow the owner's instructions.
The best lessons are the ones that cause us discomfort and embarrassment, because they cause us (if we're honestly observant) to realize that we're no better than the next guy, and they hold us accountable. If we're so smug and snooty that we don't recognize it for ourselves, what's the better choice? Are we to be banished by the owner with no hope of redemption; or do we learn a lasting lesson from a journey in which we come to realize it by experience and humility?
In the end, the store owner did our a snooty customer a favor, not a disservice. The disservice would have been to kick the customer out with no redemption, or to let him continue with his condescending behavior which would only encourage him to continue such behavior in the future.
What would you have done?
He didn't say that the customer had a right to be snooty. It's this simple. I work at the front desk of a motel. When a guest comes in, they know what kind of room they are looking for. If we don't have the right type of room, then I would simply send them to another motel that may. That customer, after being told I don't have the double bed room that they are looking for, may become agitated, and they may start speaking to me in an angry or frustrated tone.

I, being the "store owner", would not treat this guest/customer badly and send them 2 hours away to another motel/hotel just because they got tone with me. This person could be tired because they have been on the road for 9 hours, they could have 4 kids in the car that have been driving them insane for those hours, they could be hungry...there are many different reasons why they may be acting the way they are. Should I tell that guest to be humble and shove their 4 kids plus their wife/husband into a single queen room? No, I should not. I should try to help them as best that I can to get what they are looking for.

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#172190 Jul 15, 2013
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Okay, you have your view, and I have mine.
I interpreted it differently when I heard it.
I tend to look for the good within what seems on the surface to be negative.
This is just my opinion and I'm not trying to be rude, but I don't think you were looking for the good in this story...you were simply making the store owner look like a good guy and the customer look like a bad guy. To me that's not trying to look for the good, it's just placing blame.

The customer, if he was being rude, should have been less rude, and the store owner should have been less rude.

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#172191 Jul 15, 2013
Joe Fortuna wrote:
<quoted text>
Respect runs deep in this one.
Did you learn your attitude in the church you go to?
I think he just shows up at this "church" to save face for his/her little buddies that attend. Extreme rudeness, I agree!

“a.k.a. GhostWriter2U”

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#172192 Jul 15, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
The vote was against revelations being put in the bible... Yes all of the books in your myth were voted on like a top 10 video count down. The words of God voted on and placed in by non believers lol!
And I won't even get into all of the books that were rewritten and heavily edited at the different councils... Oh yes there was more than one.
<quoted text>
Do you have scholarly evidence to support this assertion?

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#172193 Jul 15, 2013
T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>thats sad! you have been owned by Bro. Clownie the Anoitned and don't even know it!!!! my lovely I see you 0-0
I am lovely, but owned I am not *smiles

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#172194 Jul 15, 2013
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you have scholarly evidence to support this assertion?
By all the accounts-- and there are few-- the vote was nearly (if not totally) unanimously against Revelations.

But Constantine insisted for some reason.

Why?

One reason could be the single place where christianity is exclusive, is in Revelations-- and no where else.

Constantine required an exclusive clause, to justify forcing people to convert.

So....

“a.k.a. GhostWriter2U”

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#172195 Jul 15, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
By all the accounts-- and there are few-- the vote was nearly (if not totally) unanimously against Revelations.
But Constantine insisted for some reason.
Why?
One reason could be the single place where christianity is exclusive, is in Revelations-- and no where else.
Constantine required an exclusive clause, to justify forcing people to convert.
So....
You said "By all accounts..."

What accounts are you proposing that I consider? I'll gladly research them.
Joe Fortuna

Eureka, CA

#172196 Jul 15, 2013
I_see_you wrote:
<quoted text>
I think he just shows up at this "church" to save face for his/her little buddies that attend. Extreme rudeness, I agree!
I wonder if he/she even has a church to go to. He/she just acts like a bully on here because no one knows who he/she is. They find they get more attention bullying than responding civilly. The people who respond in kind really makes their day.

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#172197 Jul 15, 2013
PantyPooper II wrote:
<quoted text>
We know you are!!!
you have just been pooped by the Great PantyPooper II!! Praise Jesus and His Short and Curlies!!!!
Hey Pooper!

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#172198 Jul 15, 2013
I_see_you wrote:
<quoted text>
I am lovely, but owned I am not *smiles
OK I believe you maybe a looker! but have been owned by Bro. Clownie daily on topix! FACT

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#172199 Jul 15, 2013
Joe Fortuna wrote:
<quoted text>
I wonder if he/she even has a church to go to. He/she just acts like a bully on here because no one knows who he/she is. They find they get more attention bullying than responding civilly. The people who respond in kind really makes their day.
Matthew 5:11-12

11 “Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

Thanks for helping me down here Joe! you're the best buddy

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#172200 Jul 15, 2013
Growing up I was a baptist and back then if someone asked me what church I went to I just answered them. I didn't have to cower and hide and run in circles trying to avoid this simple question.

What is heart warming as an atheist is when I see the decline in religion has grown to the point where believers are ashamed of their church.

It is exactly what I want to see happen :)
I_see_you wrote:
<quoted text>I know right!!! They can't stand to say which denomination they are. If they could just get their myths straight they could all be one big happy family lol.

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#172201 Jul 15, 2013
Never watched it, still ashamed to say what church you attend I see.

How nice to see we atheists are winning in that regard.
T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>I bet you are a huge fan of Glee !!!:) snicker

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#172202 Jul 15, 2013
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
You said "By all accounts..."
What accounts are you proposing that I consider? I'll gladly research them.
It's been years, sorry. I'll see if I can find the book titles. It was back in the 90's for me, pre-internets.

I remember reading about it when I was taking a college-level course on the whole bible. Back when I still believed in it.

I was rather surprised to learn that Revelations would not have been included, except that Constantine insisted over the objections of the council.

Further research showed me one interesting fact: the sole place in the NT which claims the **exclusive** path to heaven is the jesus way, is in Revelations...

... and it became clear to me, at least.

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#172203 Jul 15, 2013
You yourself brought up the fact they voted. Why must I teach you that which you already know. You avoid questions like wildfire may I add yet demand others answer your's.

Perhaps you can actually start answering my questions and we can have a back am forth instead of you asking me a question, I answer it, you run like hell and change the subject.

Let's start here. Paul did not meet Jesus in person he says he had visions and dreams about him. Why did this hallucinating dream noting man end up being the first person to document Jesus rather than people who supposedly met him? Also how can you prove his dreams weren't merely dreams and his visions not hallucinations?

Answer please.
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>Do you have scholarly evidence to support this assertion?

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#172204 Jul 15, 2013
Not to mention that is not the only version of Revelations. I think it was Luke that had his own version and scholars agree looking at the scrolls that Revelations likely had 3 up to 5 different writers based on wording changes and such.
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>By all the accounts-- and there are few-- the vote was nearly (if not totally) unanimously against Revelations.

But Constantine insisted for some reason.

Why?

One reason could be the single place where christianity is exclusive, is in Revelations-- and no where else.

Constantine required an exclusive clause, to justify forcing people to convert.

So....
Joe Fortuna

Eureka, CA

#172205 Jul 15, 2013
T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>
Matthew 5:11-12
11 “Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
Thanks for helping me down here Joe! you're the best buddy
Help you down, sorry but I don't run that way.:O):O)

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#172207 Jul 15, 2013
Joe Fortuna wrote:
<quoted text>
Help you down, sorry but I don't run that way.:O):O)
come on out!

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#172208 Jul 15, 2013
For fast reference Bart Erhman the apologetic friendly agnostic speaks on this very subject in many of his YouTube videos.
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>It's been years, sorry. I'll see if I can find the book titles. It was back in the 90's for me, pre-internets.

I remember reading about it when I was taking a college-level course on the whole bible. Back when I still believed in it.

I was rather surprised to learn that Revelations would not have been included, except that Constantine insisted over the objections of the council.

Further research showed me one interesting fact: the sole place in the NT which claims the **exclusive** path to heaven is the jesus way, is in Revelations...

... and it became clear to me, at least.

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#172209 Jul 15, 2013


Bro Clownie's preacher enjoy

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