Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Jul 18, 2009 Read more: Webbunny tumblelog 237,693
Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Read more

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#171380 Jul 9, 2013
You mean two questions as that is a question. But sure go right ahead. I can only provide tested facts, your accepting the truth is another matter entirely.
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
May I ask you a question?

“a.k.a. GhostWriter2U”

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#171381 Jul 9, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>Do you really believe the gospels were written by eyewitnesses? There was no Matthew, Mark, Luke and John-these names were made up to conform to prophecy. There is also no contemporaneous record of Jesus' life and the NT was written hundreds of years after Jesus died. The NT is conjecture and we cannot rely on it.
Yes I do believe they are eye-witness accounts. Knowledge of eye-witness statements in both history and court proceedings is very helpful in determining this.

The Gospels were all written early. There is a mountain of evidence to support this claim. I understand that not everyone will accept individual portions of evidence as conclusive, but when taken as a whole, there is a lot of evidence to more than adequately support this assertion.

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#171382 Jul 9, 2013
Historical proof that Paul even existed? And no the bible doesn't count.
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Paul was 20 years after. Not that long.
Xcntirk and I had discussions about that. He ranted and raved about 50-70 years later for Paul. Then I apprised him of the fact that AD started with the birth, not the crucifixion. After months of his BS, he disappeared a day or two after that.
Paul is thought to have died between 62-68 AD, under the rule of Nero, who died in 68 AD. Subtract 30 odd years from that. He started writing before he died.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#171383 Jul 9, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Paul was 20 years after. Not that long.
Xcntirk and I had discussions about that. He ranted and raved about 50-70 years later for Paul. Then I apprised him of the fact that AD started with the birth, not the crucifixion. After months of his BS, he disappeared a day or two after that.
Paul is thought to have died between 62-68 AD, under the rule of Nero, who died in 68 AD. Subtract 30 odd years from that. He started writing before he died.
Hog wash , he even admits he never actually saw him, it's complete bs. Now how do you tell all about a person you never even saw, but had a vision of even 20 years after they dead? Make shit up that's how. They got their made up shit standardized in 325 under Constantine and made a set belief system.
There may have been a few different people that suffered the crucifixion but their no real evidence there was a Jesus.

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#171384 Jul 9, 2013
It was stolen, often word for word from surrounding people of the region.

susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>You obviously don't know what the Torah is about. Have you ever read it? It is a history of God, the world and Israel and was revealed to Moses and the prophets by the living God. The law was not given to other people except through Israel. A lot of the laws only apply to the children of Israel and it's ludicrous to believe it was stolen from other people who the living God did not call.

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#171385 Jul 9, 2013
I have heard of the Jesus son of Pantera account that has a wealth of historical proof unlike this so called Jesus of the bible which has none whatsoever.
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
There is evidence in the Roman archives, military records and tax records that he did not exist as depicted in the babble.
Military records – Mary was raped by a roman soldier named “Tiberius Julius Abdes Pantera” of Sidonm he was reprimand and posted from Judea to Germany following the offence, his grave stone still exists
Tax records show Mary bore a son from the rape, named Judas who grew to be a terrorist with two aliases, Judas of the Sicari and Judas the Galilean.
He was captured with the help of a guy named Saulus (later to become known as St Paul)
Back to military records, He was put to the cross for his crimes, however his terrorist oppo’s bribed the guard and he was released, the guard was punished. Judas was seen out and about after he was “supposed” to have been crucified. He died a few weeks later of probable blood poisoning caused by the nails.
His terrorist band was named of the fourth philosophy and took the name as their posthumous figure head.
The Roman archives for the time of Emperor Titus Flavius describe how Titus in collusion with Josephus (of some fame) plotted to discredit the Hebrew Sicari terrorists. By messing with the posthumous leaders name Judas of the Sicari became Judas Iscariot, the man who betrayed himself.
It was not until many years later that when the records were being translated to greek some wiseass thought two judas’s makes a bad story, we’ll give one the good greek name of jesus.
See the books of
Sara Reinke - Pantera
Robert Eisenman – James, the brother of Christ,
Hyam Maccobys – The Mythmaker,
Danial Underbank – Judas the Galilean: the flesh and blood Jesus
Paul Cresswell – Jesus the Terrorist

Since: Mar 11

Louisville, KY

#171386 Jul 9, 2013
Oh a wealth of information, Christian writings started with the works of the so called Paul which came decades later and he never met the man. Decades after the Paul letters we finally get Mark written as a prequel. Matthew, Luke and John followed and they all contradict each other. Several books in the NT today are noted forgeries written long after the others.

When you read the gospels and see all of these so called miracles, most stolen btw word for word from the local Hellenistic religions mind you, yet nobody thought at the time to document these miracles? They waited decades later when the supposed eye witnesses were dead or senile?

We have secular historical accounts of Jesus Ben Strada the so called evil Egyptian miracle worker who was caught and crucified, but not a word of this Jesus of Nazareth who raised the dead and went marching back from the dead with an army or Jewish Zombies? Jesus Ben Strada with his parlor tricks gets noticed and documented quickly, but the son of God walking on water and raising the dead doesn't get a single word written about him until decades later?

Not even his own supposed followers couldn't find the time to put pen to paper for decades? none of them? Not one?

You're telling me this guy cures the blind, heals the sick and raises the dead and nobody thought that was important enough to even write about?

People at that time documented recipes and boring information like water levels of the river, who was sleeping with who... But this guy marching into the city with hundreds of formerly dead Jews doesn't merit a word?
Roman Apologist wrote:
<quoted text>
Where is your evidence to support this claim?

“a.k.a. GhostWriter2U”

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#171387 Jul 9, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
You mean two questions as that is a question. But sure go right ahead. I can only provide tested facts, your accepting the truth is another matter entirely.
<quoted text>
I can only provide authenticated history. Your accepting the authenticity is another matter entirely. LOL

I wrote the second question as an after-thought. Sorry if I confused you.

My question is, what is your profession?

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#171388 Jul 9, 2013
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
Whatever turns you on
Do you mean that? cause I can get kinky dinky baby...

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#171389 Jul 9, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Hog wash , he even admits he never actually saw him, it's complete bs. Now how do you tell all about a person you never even saw, but had a vision of even 20 years after they dead? Make shit up that's how. They got their made up shit standardized in 325 under Constantine and made a set belief system.
There may have been a few different people that suffered the crucifixion but their no real evidence there was a Jesus.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coptic_Orthodox_...

Note the dates preceding Constantine.

You had various churches that later met and came up with doctrines.

It is amusing how atheists can believe a vast conspiracy by disparate groups of persecuted peoples from different locales with different accounts and beliefs could have been perpetrated on the world solely through Rome some 300 years later.

Totally amazingly amusing. They love good conspiracies.
Thinking

York, UK

#171390 Jul 9, 2013
DK Clunt only got sex when his girlfriend died.
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
Don’t need tweezers to laugh at the DK clown
And to think, hescrews his sister with that, no wonder she laughs at him

“a.k.a. GhostWriter2U”

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#171391 Jul 9, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
Historical proof that Paul even existed? And no the bible doesn't count.
Clement of Rome cites Paul in a letter dated 95 A.D. to the Church at Corinth. This letter still exists. Given that Paul is believed to have died in Rome around 66-68AD, then a thirty year gap isn't enough time to invent such a controversial leader in the early church as legend.

There was every reason to distrust Paul as a heretic and oppressor and guilty of sabotaging the early Christian movement, yet within 30 years of his death, he's being quoted in positive terms.

Chapters 5 & 47 of Clement's letter specifically mention Paul.

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#171392 Jul 9, 2013
Thinking wrote:
DK Clunt only got sex when his girlfriend died.
<quoted text>
you never had a girlfriend! just young boys and old men! I bet your bung ho is as big as the Grand Canyon

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#171393 Jul 9, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
Oh a wealth of information, Christian writings started with the works of the so called Paul which came decades later and he never met the man. Decades after the Paul letters we finally get Mark written as a prequel. Matthew, Luke and John followed and they all contradict each other. Several books in the NT today are noted forgeries written long after the others.
When you read the gospels and see all of these so called miracles, most stolen btw word for word from the local Hellenistic religions mind you, yet nobody thought at the time to document these miracles? They waited decades later when the supposed eye witnesses were dead or senile?
We have secular historical accounts of Jesus Ben Strada the so called evil Egyptian miracle worker who was caught and crucified, but not a word of this Jesus of Nazareth who raised the dead and went marching back from the dead with an army or Jewish Zombies? Jesus Ben Strada with his parlor tricks gets noticed and documented quickly, but the son of God walking on water and raising the dead doesn't get a single word written about him until decades later?
Not even his own supposed followers couldn't find the time to put pen to paper for decades? none of them? Not one?
You're telling me this guy cures the blind, heals the sick and raises the dead and nobody thought that was important enough to even write about?
People at that time documented recipes and boring information like water levels of the river, who was sleeping with who... But this guy marching into the city with hundreds of formerly dead Jews doesn't merit a word?
<quoted text>
Nothing like having conflicting accounts and beliefs in your official documentation to prove it was all one gigantic conspiracy, eh? Adds that touch of real experts, don't you know? All without the benefit of mass communications or rapid transportation.

Gee, you know what, come to think of it? THE WHOLE ROMAN EMPIRE MAY NOT HAVE EXISTED!! It could have just been a conspiracy to believe it existed for some nefarious purpose.

You are ridiculous.

There was major league social disruption in the area for a hundred years after, and Rome had lots of other problems to deal with besides Judea. Lots of building and records burned during the revolts. Not only destruction from the war, but also competing ideologies and religions of the area.

“a.k.a. GhostWriter2U”

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#171394 Jul 9, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coptic_Orthodox_...
Note the dates preceding Constantine.
You had various churches that later met and came up with doctrines.
It is amusing how atheists can believe a vast conspiracy by disparate groups of persecuted peoples from different locales with different accounts and beliefs could have been perpetrated on the world solely through Rome some 300 years later.
Totally amazingly amusing. They love good conspiracies.
It helps to know the nature of successful conspiracies. Criminal Investigators have known this for a long time.

There are 5 conditions necessary for a conspiracy to be successful.

1) Fewest number of people possible
2) Shortest time span possible
3) Familial bonds
4) Excellent communications
5) Little or no pressure on conspirators

There are only 3 root motives for any crime.

1) Financial gain
2) Sexual lust or relationship
3) Power or influence

I find it very difficult to believe that 12 people who had reason to distrust each other (Matthew a corrupt tax collector, Peter a cowardly fisherman) made up a religion in a time when there was no efficient communication; (no cell phones or e-mail) when they were beaten and imprisoned (pressured)over a period of 15 - 20 years (before the first Gospel was written) and separated by thousands of miles (not a short time span or distance); AND that the religion strongly opposed the three root motives of financial gain, sexual lust, and the pursuit of personal power.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#171395 Jul 9, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing like having conflicting accounts and beliefs in your official documentation to prove it was all one gigantic conspiracy, eh? Adds that touch of real experts, don't you know? All without the benefit of mass communications or rapid transportation.
Gee, you know what, come to think of it? THE WHOLE ROMAN EMPIRE MAY NOT HAVE EXISTED!! It could have just been a conspiracy to believe it existed for some nefarious purpose.
You are ridiculous.
There was major league social disruption in the area for a hundred years after, and Rome had lots of other problems to deal with besides Judea. Lots of building and records burned during the revolts. Not only destruction from the war, but also competing ideologies and religions of the area.
Simple minded creationist liar with no proof of god.

When he is brave enough to prove the god he's trying to convince us of he will have matured from troll to human being.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#171396 Jul 9, 2013
T-Town Clown wrote:
<quoted text>you never had a girlfriend! just young boys and old men! I bet your bung ho is as big as the Grand Canyon
More creationist love from the clown.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#171397 Jul 9, 2013
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
This is a joke right? No one today believes in stoning people to death for minor crimes, slavery, animal sacrifice or any other of these barbaric and primitive laws.
I agree, they are barbaric and primitive. The Torah was given to Israel thousands of years ago, in a different age. It was righteous and humane at the time. The Lord is coming to reign on earth and will modify and amend the law. Daniel 7:25 "...and shall think to change times and laws" Isaiah 2:3 "...for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem".

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#171399 Jul 9, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>I agree, they are barbaric and primitive. The Torah was given to Israel thousands of years ago, in a different age. It was righteous and humane at the time. The Lord is coming to reign on earth and will modify and amend the law. Daniel 7:25 "...and shall think to change times and laws" Isaiah 2:3 "...for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem".
Civil rights happened in the 60s. All that time your god encouraged slavery. Worthless faith didn't advance anything forward.

“YO BOO”

Since: Sep 07

land of BOO

#171400 Jul 9, 2013
Atheist are a bunch of gypsies, tramps, and theives! Oh I forgot thinking and Skeptic are flaming gay also !!!! What a crowd of pickle lickers...

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