Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#166174 May 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
Trying to organize atheists is like trying to herd cats.
Oh, they are very easy to route march. Not so easy for them to march in any sort of precision, though. Too many random firing neurons.

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#166175 May 28, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again you're too stupid to understand the context. Too bad you can't twist Einstein's thoughts. We do understand your religion has taught you to lie.
The inspiration of the bible depends on the ignorance of the person who reads it.
We should be agnostic about those things for which there is no evidence. We should not hold beliefs merely because they gratify our desires for afterlife or immortality.
If you really believe that death leads to eternal bliss then why are you wearing a seat belt?
You belong to the church - stay there
Your youthful and immature intellect is amusing.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#166176 May 28, 2013
Bongo wrote:
<quoted text> pee wee and the stray cat shuffle bwhahahahahahahaha
Hey. You stole my laugh, you big yankee.

Might have to drive north and line you up.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#166177 May 28, 2013
Dave isn't going to like his chubby man bride doing that.
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>Hey. You stole my laugh, you big yankee.

Might have to drive north and line you up.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#166178 May 28, 2013
How many head injuries did it take you to get like this?
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>Oh, they are very easy to route march. Not so easy for them to march in any sort of precision, though. Too many random firing neurons.
Imhotep

Charlotte, NC

#166179 May 28, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Your youthful and immature intellect is amusing.
Wrong on both counts again Dave.

It's blatantly obvious you don't have anything to share except the tired old doctrines that you were brainwashed into. Not one post of any factual information.

We would be 1,500 years ahead if it hadn't been for the church dragging science back by its coattails and burning our best minds at the stake.

Which is why a complete maroon like yourself has nothing of value to share. Like I said before - stay in church- it's where you belong.

A religious person is a dangerous person. He may not become a thief or a murderer, but he is liable to become a nuisance. He carries with him many foolish and harmful superstitions, and he is possessed with the notion that it is his duty to give these superstitions to others.

That is what makes trouble. Nothing is so worthless as superstition.

Violence has come to be regarded by ever larger sectors of the population - as a legitimate instrument, indeed as the only instrument to change reality and achieve progress and development.

This, to put it simply, is religious madness.
You should seek help but frankly I think you're beyond it.

You display a persistent sense of inadequacy, a tendency to self-diminishment, and excessive aggressiveness through overcompensation.Booze is probably the only refuge left.

“ IT'S A CHOICE !!!”

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#166180 May 28, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>

Goedemorgen, ik hoop dat je een leuk weekend! IK heb een "beeld" voor u ... uw Internet vriend ...
http://www.google.com/search ?

q=california+gold+weed&tbm =isch&tbo=u&source=uni v&sa=X&ei=j8ekUa64CsTu rQGOx4HgBQ&ved=0CDYQsAQ &biw=1130&bih=709

Enjoy!

“ IT'S A CHOICE !!!”

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#166181 May 28, 2013
Hi Imhotep, Als die link niet word probeer deze eens ... lol Interessante kleuren!

http://www.brobible.com/life/slideshow/the-co... .

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#166182 May 28, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Take a very cold shower!
Then avoid religion at all costs in the future.
“Organised religion is violent, irrational, intolerant, allied to racism, tribalism, and bigotry, invested in ignorance and hostile to free inquiry, contemptuous of women and coercive toward children.”
~Christopher Hitchens
Hitchens was a great speaker and a great man, he is missed. Like Plato he will be remembered for as long as humans continue to exist.
blacklagoon

Brookline, MA

#166183 May 28, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Hitchens was a great speaker and a great man, he is missed. Like Plato he will be remembered for as long as humans continue to exist.
He certainly was right about religion poisoning EVERYTHING!!!!

Glad we have other brilliant people to demonstrate the metal illness that accompanies religion, like Sam Harris.

Since: May 13

Hightstown, NJ

#166184 May 28, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>There is no quibbling over definitions here. The definitions I gave for FACTS is not up for debate, those are simply what facts are.
Something is either true or it isn't, there is no third choice. What methodology do we use to determine wether something is true of not? Isn't it extremely important to ascertain whether something is true or not? Is not evidence one of the most important aspects of making that determination? Without evidence you have NOTHING. Without demonstrable facts, you have NOTHING. Until someone can produce evidence for the existence of God, until someone can produce anything factual about God, then all that is left is because of absents of evidence it is a fact that no God exists. Personal experiences, anecdotal testimony, the words in holy books, the belief by millions, none of these can be used as evidence. You are simply left with a belief, not a fact.
And morals do NOT prove the existence of God, morals are governed by man and the various societies of man.
again the idea that God exists can be defended through various arguments, leaving his existance in dispute. therefor the facts arent so clear cut. so the absence of evidence can not equal evidence of absence. second, personal experience is still a viable peice of evidence unless you can come up with comprehencive defeaters of those experiences. people dont have reason to doubt personal experience of every day matters until the are presented with defeaters of those experiences. and as far as morals go,we can discuss that further if youd like. i firmly believe that morals are a pretty strong indicator of the existnce of God.
Imhotep

Charlotte, NC

#166185 May 28, 2013
Snevaeh legna wrote:
<quoted text>
Goedemorgen, ik hoop dat je een leuk weekend! IK heb een "beeld" voor u ... uw Internet vriend ...
http://www.google.com/search ?
q=california+gold+weed&tbm =isch&tbo=u&source=uni v&sa=X&ei=j8ekUa64CsTu rQGOx4HgBQ&ved=0CDYQsAQ &biw=1130&bih=709
Enjoy!
En een zeer goede morgen aan u!
Ik haat problemen openstelling uw link
Ik heb een geweldig weekend hoe gaat jouwe gaat gehad?
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#166186 May 28, 2013
Ray puelerico wrote:
<quoted text>
again the idea that God exists can be defended through various arguments, leaving his existance in dispute. therefor the facts arent so clear cut. so the absence of evidence can not equal evidence of absence. second, personal experience is still a viable peice of evidence unless you can come up with comprehencive defeaters of those experiences. people dont have reason to doubt personal experience of every day matters until the are presented with defeaters of those experiences. and as far as morals go,we can discuss that further if youd like. i firmly believe that morals are a pretty strong indicator of the existnce of God.
First of all, I wish to assert the right of a commenter to agree with one part of someone's comment, and to disagree with another part. I will do that first with you and then with the person you are in an argument with.

I agree that facts are not clear cut, in many cases. In many cases they are not known at all.

I do not think that absence of evidence is evidence of absence, on the God issue or many other things. But it is not an excuse for weak assertions to be claimed as "evidence", for either side.

The notion that something is true or not, may be correct by definition, but it sure does not imply that we know or can know what is true about everything that interests us.

You may have your opinion, but I do not see your alleged evidence as being real evidence. I also do not think that the atheists who claim to "know" there is no God have evidence that there is none, or that they know it. There are two issues involved, one is whether there is or is not something that can reasonably be called a God (and the definition is not clear or universally accepted), and the second issue is about the nature and extent of human knowledge.

I am an agnostic (not making a knowledge claim), and also an atheist (not a believer in a God). I doubt whether anyone knows or can know whether something that can reasonably be called a god exists. I depends on the definition, and on what thinks is a reasonable definition.

I personally feel strongly that an allgoodallpowerful God does not and could not exist, given the world we observe and feel, with pain in it.

I also think that there is a reasonable definition of a God that exists - which is that God is a name for everything that exists.

But I certainly do not think that the Christian God as described is allgood and allpowerful, nor do I think it is everything that exists. I do not believe in it because I think that the Biblical God is not a nice guy, and unworthy of worship, even more than I consider it to be unlikely to exist, as a matter of reason.
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#166187 May 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
Trying to organize atheists is like trying to herd cats.
That is true, but to get folks who say they believe in religion to reach common beliefs is also impossible on many matters. People have different opinions, and it is a very good thing that they do.
On many things. Maybe we should all want our planet to survive as a habitable place for humans and the plants and animals and ecosystems we value.
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#166188 May 28, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>There is no quibbling over definitions here. The definitions I gave for FACTS is not up for debate, those are simply what facts are.
Something is either true or it isn't, there is no third choice. What methodology do we use to determine wether something is true of not? Isn't it extremely important to ascertain whether something is true or not? Is not evidence one of the most important aspects of making that determination? Without evidence you have NOTHING. Without demonstrable facts, you have NOTHING. Until someone can produce evidence for the existence of God, until someone can produce anything factual about God, then all that is left is because of absents of evidence it is a fact that no God exists. Personal experiences, anecdotal testimony, the words in holy books, the belief by millions, none of these can be used as evidence. You are simply left with a belief, not a fact.
And morals do NOT prove the existence of God, morals are governed by man and the various societies of man.
Please read my two comments above. I do not agree with you that it is a fact that no God exists. I do not think we have agreed on an adequate definition of God so that we agree on what we are even discussing.
I also do not think that the absence of evidence is the evidence of absence.

I think it is rational not to believe in God, but arrogant to claim one knows there is no God (especially when there is no adequate definition of a God, and not enough understanding of what would constitute knowledge, as differing from even sensible opinion).

I am an agnostic (not making a knowledge claim) atheist (not a believer in any God I have ever heard of). I doubt that anyone knows or can know whether there is something that can reasonably be called God. But in general I prefer the opinion that there is not, given the usual very unacceptable (to me) descriptions of God and gods and their behavior, and also the usual totally unconvincing arguments for the existence of such Gods.

Again, I do believe one sort of God is totally impossible, and in a visceral sense of knowing, I feel that I know it does not exist:
that is the socalled allgoodallpowerful God. The existence of pain rules that one out, in my view.

also for fun, I advance a superpantheist definition of a God that does exist - that God is a name for everything that exists. It has the big advantage of being a bigger entity and bigger claimant for the title of a God that most others, and dwarfs them by comparison - even a socalled Creator God, who does not seem to include its own creation, and thus would be inferior to the All that Exists.

This definition should allow folks to minimize the claims of such inferior Gods as the God of the three big monotheistic religions.
My other acceptable God would be a very nice border collie, but that is my bias.
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#166189 May 28, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again you're too stupid to understand the context. Too bad you can't twist Einstein's thoughts. We do understand your religion has taught you to lie.
The inspiration of the bible depends on the ignorance of the person who reads it.
We should be agnostic about those things for which there is no evidence. We should not hold beliefs merely because they gratify our desires for afterlife or immortality.
If you really believe that death leads to eternal bliss then why are you wearing a seat belt?
You belong to the church - stay there
again that was to someone else, but maybe you and I have similar views, and if you wish to take the time to look at some of my comments above and reply to anything there.
I sort of object to saying that believers lie - when I define a lie as a knowing telling of an untruth. I think many believers to not knowingly do so. I think even when they warp things, it is because their thinking processes are warped, and/or minimal, rather than because they know and lie. I think many big bankers lie on purpose, and know better but want to fool folks for their own profit, for example. I think that is the correct use of the accusation of liar.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#166190 May 28, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>He certainly was right about religion poisoning EVERYTHING!!!!
Glad we have other brilliant people to demonstrate the metal illness that accompanies religion, like Sam Harris.
I am not a huge Harris fan, personally, I think he's a bit too fanatical at times. Hitchens thought out what he would say, and often stuck to the facts, while Harris seems more emotionally attached to his assertions. But, we all have our own preferences.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#166191 May 28, 2013
havent forgotten wrote:
<quoted text>That is true, but to get folks who say they believe in religion to reach common beliefs is also impossible on many matters. People have different opinions, and it is a very good thing that they do.
On many things. Maybe we should all want our planet to survive as a habitable place for humans and the plants and animals and ecosystems we value.
Agreed.

But when 80% of the population thinks there's some magical civil engineer coming back to fix everything for us, it's difficult to get 100% motivated.
Imhotep

Charlotte, NC

#166192 May 28, 2013
Snevaeh legna wrote:
Hi Imhotep, Als die link niet word probeer deze eens ... lol Interessante kleuren!
http://www.brobible.com/life/slideshow/the-co... .
Waarom vraag je me plagen?
Je weet dat ik hou van marihuana elke kleur!
Imhotep

Charlotte, NC

#166193 May 28, 2013
havent forgotten wrote:
<quoted text> again that was to someone else, but maybe you and I have similar views, and if you wish to take the time to look at some of my comments above and reply to anything there.
I sort of object to saying that believers lie - when I define a lie as a knowing telling of an untruth. I think many believers to not knowingly do so. I think even when they warp things, it is because their thinking processes are warped, and/or minimal, rather than because they know and lie. I think many big bankers lie on purpose, and know better but want to fool folks for their own profit, for example. I think that is the correct use of the accusation of liar.
Indeed we do share many views it appears.
That post you responded to was directed specifically at one person who lies constantly.

For one thing I'm not religious I'm a secular humanist.
I was not raised in to any religion.
Actually, until 911 happened, I paid scamt attention to it.

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