Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#163337 Apr 11, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Sharkey's article references official Nuremberg investigation documents.
.
Hey Buck.

For a fun thread, check out Why Should Jesus Love Me.

Several of your old friends and foes are over there.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#163338 Apr 11, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Sharkey's article references official Nuremberg investigation documents.
They are available publicly - catalogued by Rutgers University and Cornell University, and published worldwide.
But of course, your preference is quoting the madman Hitler, taking his public words as sincere, then smearing personally the writer of the NY Times article.
You could not find your ass if it had a bell on it.
Goebbels, Nazi Minister of Propaganda, noted:
"The Fuhrer is deeply religous, though completely anti-Christian. He views Christianity as a symptom of decay. Rightly so. It is a branch of the Jewish race... Both [Judaism and Christianity] have no point of contact to the animal element, and thus, in the end, they will be destroyed."
"The National Church has no scribes, pastors, chaplains or priests, but National Reich orators are to speak in them.
"The National Church demands immediate cessation of the publishing and dissemination of the Bible in Germany...'"
"On the altars there must be nothing but 'Mein Kampf'(to the German nation and therefore to God the most sacred book) and to the left of the altar a sword.
"On the day of its foundation, the Christian Cross must be removed from all churches, cathedrals and chapels...and it must be superseded by the only unconquerable symbol, the swastika."
(The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, by William L. Shirer, p. 240 in some editions, p. 332 in others.
What you are too stupid to recognize or too dishonest to acknowledge is that Hitler used the familiar christian rhetoric for propaganda purposes, with its obvious appeal to the population. But he deeply hated Christianity and was determined to destroy it.
This is settled history. Wise up.
The cross of Christ and the swastika do not need to oppose each other, and must not do so, but rather they can and should stand together. One should not dominate the other, but rather each should maintain its own meaning and significance.

The cross of Christ points toward heaven and admonishes us:

Remember that you are Christian people, carried by the eternal love of the heavenly father, free through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, sanctified by the power of God’s spirit.

The swastika, however, points to the world as a divine creation and admonishes us:

Remember that you are German, born in German territory to parents of German blood, filled with the German spirit and essence, formed according to German nature.

Both together, however, the cross of Christ and the swastika, admonish us:

Remember that you are German Christian people and should become ever more whole German Christian people, and remain so!

Hanover, Easter 1934. Gerhard Hahn, President of the Provincial Church Council (Landeskirchentag)

http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/christ...
Lincoln

United States

#163339 Apr 11, 2013
Believing the lies of the Nazis is odd.
Gullibility of atheists?
Militant atheism was an integral part of the French Revolution, Soviet Union under Lenin and Stalin, Red China's Cultural Revolution.....

Peace

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#163340 Apr 11, 2013
Did Sharkey also mention some nice churches to visit in that article? Did Hitler write these papers himself? Or were they speculation about what he may or may not do in the future?

You say all his Christian speeches and work was just propaganda, this is merely an opinion and you know it. It would be impossible to say Hitler didn't believe any of what he was saying.

His actions speak louder than his words.

Closing atheist and free thinkers organizations and giving away their property to churches.

Mandating Christianity be taught in all public schools.

Demonizing and repeatedly attacking, imprisoning and even executing non theist secular individuals even to the point of dubbing secularists traitors with a death mark on their heads.

Championing his ideal version of Protestantism and proudly stating through him it would flourish.

Can you refute all of these actions? Note not mere words but actions? Because actions speak louder than words.

Hop to it fatass.
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>Sharkey's article references official Nuremberg investigation documents.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163341 Apr 11, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
If you wish to disqualify RR's link say so. Otherwise my facts stand and you know it.
Btw Buck? Lawandreligon.com ?
Are you for real? I mean seriously Buck? Why not just use another Christian apologetic website?
Goodness all that fat must be impeding blood flow to your brain.
Bottom line Hitler was a lifelong Christian who adored Martin Luther. He wished to champion his version of Protestantism across Germany and required Christianity be taught in school all the while bemoaning secular societies and atheists as evil godless lovers of communism.... Hey that last one sounds like many theist posters on topix!
Thanks for dancing puppet. Go check on your fiancé Dave to make sure he hasn't lost any fingers today :)
<quoted text>
Sure.

DONOVAN NUREMBERG TRIAL COLLECTION
Archive Index
General William J. Donovan, lead United States investigator at Nuremberg
148 bound volumes of original evidence, stored by Donovan at Rutgers University
Catalogued as a joint effort of Rutgers and Cornell in 1999 called The Nuremberg Project, published in 2001.

"SR & A 3114.4 / The Nazi Master Plan / Annex 4: The Persecution of the Christian Churches" / Office of Strategic Services / Research and Analysis Branch / Draft for the War Crimes Staff/ Approved by the Prosecution Review Board / CONFIDENTIAL
Abstract:

This R & A report provides its own description on its title page: "This study describes, with illustrative factual evidence, Nazi purposes, policies and methods of persecuting the Christian Churches in Germany and occupied Europe." The report characterizes the National Socialist ideology of aggressive warfare as inherently inimical to Christianity and the Christian Churches, and names specific actions the Nazis took to suppress, terrorize, intimidate, and otherwise persecute Christian clergy and churches within Germany and in the conquered territories annexed to the Reich. For each case, the report suggests a means of solving "The Problem of Proof." This document is a typewritten mimeograph copy of excellent quality on sturdy, slightly browning paper."

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163342 Apr 11, 2013




Kirchenkampf


First (spring to fall 1933):

Hitler makes efforts to assimilate the churches into the culture of National Socialism.
The Reichskonkordat was an outcome of this stage.
The preparation to create a unified single Reichskirche from the 28 regional Protestant churches, the Ludwig Müller controversy, and the beginning of the rise of the Confessing Church.

Second (fall 1933 – fall 1934)

The regime attempted to bring the churches under the control of the Nazi state.
Opposition to these efforts led to the emergence of the Confessing Church.
The regime breaches various portions of the Concordat.

Third (fall 1934 – February 1937)

The regime tried to bring the Protestant churches under its control by taking charge of church finances and governance structures.

Fourth (February 1937 – 1939)

More open conflict based on "Nazism itself and its anti-Christian worldviews".
The regime increased its imprisonment of resistant clergy, such as Martin Niemöller.

Fifth stage (1939–1945)

More clergy were imprisoned
Dietrich Bonhoeffer was imprisoned and executed
Clergy were drafted into the military
Church publications were censored or banned
Services and functions restricted or banned

Source: Lueker, Erwin L.; Luther Poellot, Paul Jackson (2000). "Kirchenkampf". Christian Cyclopedia. Concordia Publishing House. Retrieved 2008-03-09

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#163343 Apr 11, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Sure.
DONOVAN NUREMBERG TRIAL COLLECTION
"This study describes, with illustrative factual evidence, Nazi purposes, policies and methods of persecuting the Christian Churches in Germany and occupied Europe."
Sure he sanctioned the murder and imprisonment of all who opposed the NAZI plan, this extended to the leaders of the Catholic church when they would not support him any longer. But this is no different than the feuds between the Tudors and protestant vs catholic for ruling authority. Hitler was a highly religious Christian who believed in the words of Martin Luther.

The church must affirm without reservation the German people’s community growing out of National Socialism, and at the same time must do everything it can to make up for what has been neglected or ignored in the past!

The church must affirm without reservation Adolf Hitler’s total state, the last bulwark against the Satan of Bolshevism. It should not be forgotten that, had it not been for Hitler, we would long since have sunk into Bolshevism, and probably would no longer have had churches and ministers.

The church must affirm without reservation the Führer of the National Socialists, Adolf Hitler, the Chancellor of the German Reich. He expects the church to help build the Third Reich, and has proclaimed that National Socialist German Workers’ Party, which now forms the state, wants to stand on the foundation of positive Christianity. It is the task of the church to create and provide this foundation. It is the content of the absolute affirmation that the church has to make if it really wants to be a people’s church.

We “German Christians” were firmly resolved to work to see that the church makes this affirmation clearly and unambiguously (that means without reservation). We are also firmly resolved to hold to this affirmation, and transform it into action. We will not be diverted from this by anything, including the quarreling of the opposition of today which has still not understood, or does not want to understand, and least of all by the forces of Reaction (regardless of how they may conceal themselves). National Socialists in the province should and must know:

On 28 August 1933 and 25 October 1933, the church publicly and solemnly spoke its affirmation, and is determined to hold to this affirmation and to carry it out.

http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/christ...

In Mein Kampf, Hitler listed Martin Luther as one of the greatest reformers. And similar to Luther in the 1500s, Hitler spoke against the Jews. The Nazi plan to create a German Reich Church laid its bases on the "Spirit of Dr. Martin Luther." The first physical violence against the Jews came on November 9-10 on Kristallnacht (Crystal Night) where the Nazis killed Jews, shattered glass windows, and destroyed hundreds of synagogues, just as Luther had proposed. In Daniel Johah Goldhagen's book, Hitler's Willing Executioners, he writes:

"One leading Protestant churchman, Bishop Martin Sasse published a compendium of Martin Luther's antisemitic vitriol shortly after Kristallnacht's orgy of anti-Jewish violence. In the foreword to the volume, he applauded the burning of the synagogues and the coincidence of the day:'On November 10, 1938, on Luther's birthday, the synagogues are burning in Germany.' The German people, he urged, ought to heed these words 'of the greatest antisemite of his time, the warner of his people against the Jews.'"

http://www.nobeliefs.com/luther.htm

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163344 Apr 11, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
Did Sharkey also mention some nice churches to visit in that article? Did Hitler write these papers himself? Or were they speculation about what he may or may not do in the future?
You say all his Christian speeches and work was just propaganda, this is merely an opinion and you know it. It would be impossible to say Hitler didn't believe any of what he was saying.
His actions speak louder than his words.
Closing atheist and free thinkers organizations and giving away their property to churches.
Mandating Christianity be taught in all public schools.
Demonizing and repeatedly attacking, imprisoning and even executing non theist secular individuals even to the point of dubbing secularists traitors with a death mark on their heads.
Championing his ideal version of Protestantism and proudly stating through him it would flourish.
Can you refute all of these actions? Note not mere words but actions? Because actions speak louder than words.
Hop to it fatass.
<quoted text>
Actions speak louder than words?

Taking over christian schools - is that an action?

Prohibiting Nazi soldiers from owning Bibles - is that an action?

Sending Christians to concentration camps - is that an action?

Executing Deitrich Bonhoeffer - is that an action?

Imprisoning priests - is that an action?

Ordering SS troops NOT to celebrate Christmas - is that an action?

Decreeing that officers in the Nazi Party could not hold an office in a Catholic or Protestant church - is that an action?

Hitler youth reciting:

We are the jolly Hitler Youth,
We don’t need any Christian ‘truth’
For our Leader Adolf Hitler, our Leader
Always our interceder.

Whatever the Papist priests may try,
We’re Hitler’s children until we die;
We follow not Christ, but Horst Wessel.
Away with incense and holy water vessel!

As sons of our forebears from times gone by
We march as we sing with banners held high.
I’m not a Christian, nor a Catholic,
I go with the SA through thin and thick.

- is that an action?

You're wrong, and you're stupid, Liverwurst.

It's settled history. You should stop trusting Hitler.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163345 Apr 11, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Sure he sanctioned the murder and imprisonment of all who opposed the NAZI plan, this extended to the leaders of the Catholic church when they would not support him any longer. But this is no different than the feuds between the Tudors and protestant vs catholic for ruling authority. Hitler was a highly religious Christian who believed in the words of Martin Luther.
The church must affirm without reservation the German people’s community growing out of National Socialism, and at the same time must do everything it can to make up for what has been neglected or ignored in the past!
The church must affirm without reservation Adolf Hitler’s total state, the last bulwark against the Satan of Bolshevism. It should not be forgotten that, had it not been for Hitler, we would long since have sunk into Bolshevism, and probably would no longer have had churches and ministers.
The church must affirm without reservation the Führer of the National Socialists, Adolf Hitler, the Chancellor of the German Reich. He expects the church to help build the Third Reich, and has proclaimed that National Socialist German Workers’ Party, which now forms the state, wants to stand on the foundation of positive Christianity. It is the task of the church to create and provide this foundation. It is the content of the absolute affirmation that the church has to make if it really wants to be a people’s church.
We “German Christians” were firmly resolved to work to see that the church makes this affirmation clearly and unambiguously (that means without reservation). We are also firmly resolved to hold to this affirmation, and transform it into action. We will not be diverted from this by anything, including the quarreling of the opposition of today which has still not understood, or does not want to understand, and least of all by the forces of Reaction (regardless of how they may conceal themselves). National Socialists in the province should and must know:
On 28 August 1933 and 25 October 1933, the church publicly and solemnly spoke its affirmation, and is determined to hold to this affirmation and to carry it out.
http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/christ...
In Mein Kampf, Hitler listed Martin Luther as one of the greatest reformers. And similar to Luther in the 1500s, Hitler spoke against the Jews. The Nazi plan to create a German Reich Church laid its bases on the "Spirit of Dr. Martin Luther." The first physical violence against the Jews came on November 9-10 on Kristallnacht (Crystal Night) where the Nazis killed Jews, shattered glass windows, and destroyed hundreds of synagogues, just as Luther had proposed. In Daniel Johah Goldhagen's book, Hitler's Willing Executioners, he writes:
"One leading Protestant churchman, Bishop Martin Sasse published a compendium of Martin Luther's antisemitic vitriol shortly after Kristallnacht's orgy of anti-Jewish violence. In the foreword to the volume, he applauded the burning of the synagogues and the coincidence of the day:'On November 10, 1938, on Luther's birthday, the synagogues are burning in Germany.' The German people, he urged, ought to heed these words 'of the greatest antisemite of his time, the warner of his people against the Jews.'"
http://www.nobeliefs.com/luther.htm
You are an idiot.

Hitler despised christianity.

It's settled history.

Hitler's religion was Darwinian evolution.

He was motivated by Darwinism, not Christianity.

Stings, don't it?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163346 Apr 11, 2013
"Connecting Hitler and Darwin", Human Events

http://www.humanevents.com/2008/04/18/connect...

Liverwust and Aunt Martha should read it, or if they can't, get someone to read it to them.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163347 Apr 11, 2013
You know why atheists are willing to lie to connect Hitler and Christianity, and equally willing to lie to deny the Darwin - Hitler connection?

I'll tell you.

With the pushing of the envelope by humanists for abortion/infanticide, euthanasia, human stem cell research, the authoritarian attitude of scientists, and the left wing anti-American agenda of university faculty...

They know people might suspect it could happen again.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#163348 Apr 11, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
"Connecting Hitler and Darwin", Human Events
http://www.humanevents.com/2008/04/18/connect...
Liverwust and Aunt Martha should read it, or if they can't, get someone to read it to them.
Second request.

Check out the Why Should Jesus Love Me thread.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163349 Apr 11, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
5. Adolf Hitler: Fulfilling God's Mission
What we have to fight for is the necessary security for the existence and increase of our race and people, the subsistence of its children and the maintenance of our racial stock unmixed, the freedom and independence of the Fatherland; so that our people may be enabled to fulfill the mission assigned to it by the Creator.
- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 8
6. Adolf Hitler: Fate of God
But if out of smugness, or even cowardice, this battle is not fought to its end, then take a look at the peoples five hundred years from now. I think you will find but few images of God, unless you want to profane the Almighty.
- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 10
7. Adolf Hitler: Sin Against the Will of God
In short, the results of miscegenation are always the following:(a) The level of the superior race becomes lowered; (b) physical and mental degeneration sets in, thus leading slowly but steadily towards a progressive drying up of the vital sap. The act which brings about such a development is a sin against the will of the Eternal Creator. And as a sin this act will be avenged.
- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 11
8. Adolf Hitler: Sacrilege Against God
Anyone who dares to lay hands on the highest image of the Lord commits sacrilege against the benevolent creator of this miracle and contributes to the expulsion from paradise.
- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf Vol. 2 Chapter 1
Ads
Peru Tourist InformationPeru.travelVisit the Peru Tourist Information and Assistance Web Site.
Miracle Prayer Requestswww.christianprayercenter.com Need Prayer? Thousands Will Pray For You.
9. Adolf Hitler: Confidence in God
Thus inwardly armed with confidence in God and the unshakable stupidity of the voting citizenry, the politicians can begin the fight for the 'remaking' of the Reich as they call it.
- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf Vol. 2 Chapter 1
10. Adolf Hitler: Gold has Replaced God
It may be that today gold has become the exclusive ruler of life, but the time will come when man will again bow down before a higher god.
- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf Vol. 2 Chapter 2
You trust Hitler's word. I don't. History proved me right, you wrong.

To each his own.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#163350 Apr 11, 2013
Link less heavily opinionated spam. Ignored and rightly so. Even then of correct it only shows Hitler planned to exert his muscle to implement his brand of Protestantism and you know it.

What do you think about Hitler ordering Christianity to be taught in all public schools? Certainly he wanted to make sure the children were well versed in Christian teachings

:)
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>Sure.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163351 Apr 11, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
You need to pick up some of those magic Mormon undies and Book a flight to:KOLUB
Mittens will introduce you to Joe Smith and his hallucinations. Mitt and GOP suffered the worst defeat in modern history
Tell me are Mormons Christians?
Or how about Fred Phelps Jimmy swaggert,
Cool dudes huh?
Worst defeat in modern history??

Mondale carried 1 state. And barely.

Got any more pearls of wisdom like that one?

I doubt you can top it.

Why are lefties so goddamned stupid?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163352 Apr 11, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Second request.
Check out the Why Should Jesus Love Me thread.
Hi, silk bloomers boy!

Any people still in Cal?

Or have they all moved to republican states?

How high is your gas now...40 bucks?

I hear after gay marriage, Cal's next step is making gayness manditory. Is that so?

Ain't liberal governance grand? How much was that city council member getting paid -$350K a year?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#163353 Apr 11, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
Link less heavily opinionated spam. Ignored and rightly so. Even then of correct it only shows Hitler planned to exert his muscle to implement his brand of Protestantism and you know it.
What do you think about Hitler ordering Christianity to be taught in all public schools? Certainly he wanted to make sure the children were well versed in Christian teachings
:)
<quoted text>
I already proved you don't know what the hell you're trying to talk about.

Do yourself a favor and shut the hell up.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#163354 Apr 11, 2013
Demanding Christianity be taught in public schools was one of his main focuses in regards to youth. Oh and there sure were a lot of proud Christians in the Hitler youth group. One even became the Pope!

Most of what you said is incomplete and exaggerated if not completely made up, even so he only went after those churches who he thought were stepping out of line.

It's settled history and you know it.
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>Actions speak louder than words?
.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#163355 Apr 11, 2013
He ordered Darwin's book be burned. You really gotta stop watching Fox News.
Buck Crick wrote:
"Connecting Hitler and Darwin", Human Events

http://www.humanevents.com/2008/04/18/connect...

Liverwust and Aunt Martha should read it, or if they can't, get someone to read it to them.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#163356 Apr 11, 2013
When his words on a subject matches his actions we can safely see where he stood.

Sorry Fatass, better luck next time.

Hey Hitler ordered Darwin's book to be burned! Michael Behe would have been so proud!
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>You trust Hitler's word. I don't. History proved me right, you wrong.

To each his own.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

NCAA Basketball Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Thousands Protest Roe V. Wade Decision (Jan '08) 17 min Brian_G 307,095
What role do you think humans play in global wa... 50 min Earthling-1 2,741
UCLA FOOTBALL NOTEBOOK: Neuheisel says Prince w... (Sep '10) 1 hr BRUINS FOR TRUTH 28,481
Should child beauty pageants be banned? 2 hr zubedaanur 693
Barack Obama, our next President (Nov '08) 4 hr UnderstandPeople 1,156,051
How to Recover Deleted or lost Contacts from Sa... 23 hr best bet 2
UConn vs. Duke Monday night 9pm ESPN2 Thu ivyawe 1
More from around the web