Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162733 Mar 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
You're losing your argument badly, and you know it.
How many times has god talked to you and touched you since that first time?
What were the circumstances? We're you in church? Alone?
Had you heard of god before your experience?
Had you heard of or read the bible before your experience?
Had you not been exposed to Christianity before your experience, would you still believe it was the biblical god?
I've answered those questions already, several times.

It's not my fault you don't pay attention.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#162734 Mar 28, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> That is giving that the line was not an insertion, and there are plenty of seasoned historians who think it was. But even if we accept it as genuine, it is far less than revealing as a believer would hope.
It is a highly generic statement, that could in fact be in reference to about any christian who led the order.
I see it as a confirmation of rebellion existed to rule of thumb. so it is merely confirmation that elements contrary to absolute authority existed, and that some payed dearly for not fitting in like flynn.
It is pretty clear that the lines in Josephus are insertions, but it isn't so clear that the lines in Tacitus are. The 'flow' isn't disrupted in Tacitus like it is in Josephus.
Largelanguage

Chester, UK

#162735 Mar 28, 2013
Rush wrote:
<quoted text>
Congrats! I remember what it was like my first time..........Now next is when he hopes you are dead, or tells you to kill yourself.*sigh* Young love.
Are you a new user then?
Did you start off on the california threads?
And young love is such rebellion, little boys think that their love is new, and exciting, when really they are just trying to replace the lack of affection they had from their mother.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#162736 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I suppose you believe we've finished the periodic table....
No, and irrelevant. We know about protons and neutrons and that they can go together to form nuclei. The question in the periodic table is whether they can go together to make really big nuclei.

You like to argue that lack of *current* evidence of certain scientific phenomena is equivalent to the *permanent* lack of evidence of theological ideas. There is a HUGE difference. First of all, new evidence will come from areas we have not yet explored or been able to explore because of lack of technology. But anything detected is, by definition, physical. You, on the other hand, are claiming the existence of a non-physical which, again by definition, cannot have physical evidence. That means that it is impossible, even in theory to have evidence of your deity. You have even admitted as much.

I will admit that people have 'religious experiences'. There is actually a wide variety of such experiences produced in some fairly well-known situations. Read some William James some time if you want a more detailed investigation. The question isn't whether humans can experience this type of emotional upheaval. The question is whether there is a supernatural that in any way causes such experiences. THAT is the point you consistently avoid and that must be addresses before any mention of deities can even proceed.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#162737 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
A hallucination is the perception of something not present.
I didn't hallucinate.
Look, ass, you don't have to believe me. But you should accept that want I'm saying is my perception.
It's obvious that I'll never convince you. It should be obvious to you that you'll never make me doubt.
So shut that cock holster you call a mouth.
Yes, and those who hallucinate have deeply moving experiences also. They are experiences of things that do not exist, though. You *claim* you didn't hallucinate, but that would be my default assumption if I experiences such things.

How do you convince someone who has hallucinated that what they experienced was a hallucination?

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#162738 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Because I know.
How do you know when you're in love?
How do you know when you're jealous?
*shrugs*
You just do.
But go on, prove you love your mother.
I'll wait.
Love and jealousy are very different. They are *internal* experiences, not perceptions of *external* realities. You can have both emotions without there being any real external subject for them.

In the case of *internal* experiences, you can 'just know'. In the case of *external* reality, you cannot.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#162739 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I've answered those questions already, several times.
It's not my fault you don't pay attention.
I used to own a Dodge.

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#162740 Mar 28, 2013
Largelanguage wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you a new user then?
Did you start off on the california threads?
And young love is such rebellion, little boys think that their love is new, and exciting, when really they are just trying to replace the lack of affection they had from their mother.
WTF? You are so incredibly damaged...
Rush

Columbus, NE

#162741 Mar 28, 2013
Largelanguage wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you a new user then?
Did you start off on the california threads?
And young love is such rebellion, little boys think that their love is new, and exciting, when really they are just trying to replace the lack of affection they had from their mother.
Yes, first day.
No, Nebraska GBR!
Actually, young love starts with being horney, and goes from there.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162742 Mar 28, 2013
Largelanguage wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you a new user then?
Did you start off on the california threads?
And young love is such rebellion, little boys think that their love is new, and exciting, when really they are just trying to replace the lack of affection they had from their mother.
You love little boys?

Not surprising....

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162743 Mar 28, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
No, and irrelevant. We know about protons and neutrons and that they can go together to form nuclei. The question in the periodic table is whether they can go together to make really big nuclei.
You like to argue that lack of *current* evidence of certain scientific phenomena is equivalent to the *permanent* lack of evidence of theological ideas. There is a HUGE difference. First of all, new evidence will come from areas we have not yet explored or been able to explore because of lack of technology. But anything detected is, by definition, physical. You, on the other hand, are claiming the existence of a non-physical which, again by definition, cannot have physical evidence. That means that it is impossible, even in theory to have evidence of your deity. You have even admitted as much.
I will admit that people have 'religious experiences'. There is actually a wide variety of such experiences produced in some fairly well-known situations. Read some William James some time if you want a more detailed investigation. The question isn't whether humans can experience this type of emotional upheaval. The question is whether there is a supernatural that in any way causes such experiences. THAT is the point you consistently avoid and that must be addresses before any mention of deities can even proceed.
I wasn't talking about physical evidence for my non-physical experience.

But you make sense.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162744 Mar 28, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, and those who hallucinate have deeply moving experiences also. They are experiences of things that do not exist, though. You *claim* you didn't hallucinate, but that would be my default assumption if I experiences such things.
How do you convince someone who has hallucinated that what they experienced was a hallucination?
I understand.

But my default position is that I didn't hallucinate.

I doubt anyone could convince me otherwise.

I'm not a super spiritual kinda guy, I've never "spoken in tongues", I don't believe in ghosts or auras or karma...

None of that crap.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162745 Mar 28, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Love and jealousy are very different. They are *internal* experiences, not perceptions of *external* realities. You can have both emotions without there being any real external subject for them.
In the case of *internal* experiences, you can 'just know'. In the case of *external* reality, you cannot.
I disagree.

They are internal experiences caused by an exterior force.

It's pretty hard to fall in love with nothing or be jealous of nothing.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162746 Mar 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
I used to own a Dodge.
It was the Dodge Scapegoat, huh?

Figures....

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#162747 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>I understand.

But my default position is that I didn't hallucinate.

I doubt anyone could convince me otherwise.

I'm not a super spiritual kinda guy, I've never "spoken in tongues", I don't believe in ghosts or auras or karma...

None of that crap.
Anybody hallucinating would claim they were not.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#162748 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>It was the Dodge Scapegoat, huh?

Figures....
If you had been born on an island that had never encountered the bible or anyone familiar with it, would you still be able to experience the biblical god or Jesus?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162749 Mar 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
Anybody hallucinating would claim they were not.
Not true.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162750 Mar 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
If you had been born on an island that had never encountered the bible or anyone familiar with it, would you still be able to experience the biblical god or Jesus?
Yes.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#162751 Mar 28, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>It was the Dodge Scapegoat, huh?

Figures....
Actually, it was an Intrepid.

Like me.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#162752 Mar 28, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, it was an Intrepid.
Like me.
Hey cool.

The USS Voyager was an Intrepid class starship.

:)

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