Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 255265 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Webbunny tumblelog.

Since: Dec 12

Yes, I'm an Atheist.

#212227 Feb 13, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>You haven't established that Christians outperform atheists. You merely assume and assert it. If you aren't spending your charitable contributions directly on the intended beneficiaries, as in buying them groceries or paying their utility bills, you're probably accomplishing next to nothing except lining some scam artists pocket.

What fraction of the money given to churches do you suppose makes its way past the clergy and the cost of running those franchises? Money spent building new churches or paying the pastor's mortgage payment isn't what I call charity

KiMare wrote, " the most rewarding aspect of my life is my service for the sake of the Kingdom."

Really? That sounds hollow. I get my reward serving people.
Whether you still work or not, you serve/d humanity.

The church serves itself under the guise of piety and seeks to control humanity.
Bongo

Miller Place, NY

#212228 Feb 13, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm grateful for mine. Consider the alternative.
<quoted text>
So what? Do you think that is all that there is, or even the most important part? Of all the things that happened to you this week, how many involved killing or betrayal? The world has never been better. More people have good, long, safe, healthy, productive lives than ever in history.
You know how I feel about the darkness and pessimism of the Christian faith. It's terrible what it does to people - how much happiness and gratitude it strips them of. I read posts like yours from Christians every week. You almost never see that kind of nihilism from the humanists posting. I resent them doing that to you.
...1) Me too, all things in moderation. 2) Its just an observation. Btw a fiend of mine who is a professional just returned from Cabo recently. Said he felt safe but would never go to the mainland. A local traveler made that mistake recently. 3) What about this pessimism? Is it really empathy? Remember, and I surmise you should know more than most, many people seek God in severe adversity. There are a lot of hurting people out there. It can take many years to mature in the faith. I don't think nihilism is a proper description of it. A person can traverse life with the rose colored glasses, are you claiming that's better? Again, as the story goes, this is a fallen temporary state. Christians are in the world but not of the world......Do not love the world nor the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world.… I know you loathe these words but how can you adequately dispute their veracity?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212229 Feb 13, 2014
KiMare wrote:
Did you think I did it because I'd get something back? What self-centered idiocy.
There is no reason to believe that you have any other motive than saving your soul.
KiMare wrote:
You still have no reasoned response to the prophecy of Jesus. STILL being fulfilled right in your face.
Your prophecies are unimpressive. They're mundane. like those in a daily horoscope. Your god's best prophecies pale in comparison to those of science. What else would you like said about them?
KiMare wrote:
I guess that is why you shifted from stupid scoffing to childish taunts. Smirk.
Your lack of insight is impressive. You scoff at rebuttals without addressing their specific content, and you close nearly every post with a one word taunt.

You seem to have intellectual, emotional, and character issues. Just how is faith helping you?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212230 Feb 13, 2014
KiMare wrote:
I did. They didn't say what you claimed. Aside from the fact that those have been debunked. I'm just asking you to validate the first five. What's wrong? Smile.
I can't help you beside direct you to the claims. I can't read them for you, nor make you understand what the words say.

I also can't validate them. They are false claims.

And how did you or anybody else debunk any of the claims of competing mythologies. Faith?
Bongo

Miller Place, NY

#212231 Feb 13, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't established that Christians outperform atheists. You merely assume and assert it. If you aren't spending your charitable contributions directly on the intended beneficiaries, as in buying them groceries or paying their utility bills, you're probably accomplishing next to nothing except lining some scam artists pocket.
What fraction of the money given to churches do you suppose makes its way past the clergy and the cost of running those franchises? Money spent building new churches or paying the pastor's mortgage payment isn't what I call charity
<quoted text>
Really? That sounds hollow. I get my reward serving people.
.. When giving, and it should be to your local ministry not some tv evangelist its tax deductible and those clergy are fiduciaries. Whether or not they do the right thing is between them and God. You state rightly so, you got your reward. Christians store up their treasure in heaven. Its a spiritual thing, man.
Bongo

Miller Place, NY

#212232 Feb 13, 2014
Divinity Surgeon wrote:
<quoted text>
Whether you still work or not, you serve/d humanity.
The church serves itself under the guise of piety and seeks to control humanity.
Humanity does need control, isn't it obvious? There are 29 ways to skin a cat but which way is best?
Bongo

Miller Place, NY

#212233 Feb 13, 2014
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Could be.
On the other hand, they are consistendly azzholes, so...
... add in the fact that the principle owner of Fox Noise is also a bigot, and azzhole and truly a douchenozzle?
Well....
You sound biased and feminine, not that theres anything too wrong with that, Blob

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212234 Feb 13, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Do you know what an atheist is? It is a single idea: "I reject all unsubstantiated god claims," which is all of them to date. On that, yes, we all agree.
KiMare wrote:
You and I know that not all atheists agree on the basis for atheism.
What I said was that all atheists reject god claims. Read it again.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
I detailed the criteria for quality prophecy and explained why your stuff and lightbeamrider's doesn't make the grade. They lack specificity, are generally mundane, in one case it was self-fulfilling, and in every case, your prophecies are drowning in a sea of failed prophecies surrounding them.
KiMare wrote:
I could care less about your criteria
Obviously. But if you are looking for others to affirm your claims for biblical prophecy, you're going to need to start.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
I also compared religious prophecy with scientific prophecy. Yours didn't fare so well.
KiMare wrote:
You tried to equate scriptural prophecy and scientific theory. They don't.
Read my words again. I said that they are not equal. Biblical prophecy doesn't meet the standard for quality prophesy - you know, the ones you scoffingly dismiss without a rebuttal.
KiMare wrote:
You are still trying to pass scoffing off as a rebuttal. It isn't.
Smile.
You haven't presented a single reasoned argument, nor rebutted one, such as my argument that your prophecies are very low quality, and that scientific prophecies dwarf them.

Show me anything in any of your posts that isn't an unsubstantiated claim, scoffing, or a taunt.
Bongo

Miller Place, NY

#212235 Feb 13, 2014
Ians, how do you get normal type between the italics when responding?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212236 Feb 13, 2014
KiMare wrote:
I equated specific points of the Creation story to science.
Your myth got almost none of the facts right. The Genesis version completely overlooked the singularity, the expansion of the universe, the inflationary epoch, symmetry breaking, particle condensation, nucleosynthsis, the decoupling of matter and radiation, etc.. All it seems to have gotten right is that the universe had a beginning - just like every other creation myth.
KiMare wrote:
You didn't because you can't. Smirk.
That is correct. There is almost zero correlation between your myth and the scientific account..

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212237 Feb 13, 2014
KiMare wrote:
You implied a 'big''we' on here invalidated the prophecies I noted that are fulfilled. You implied a 'big''we' on here invalidated the prophecies I noted that are fulfilled.
My arguments stand. Your prophecies are respected by nobody except other faith based thinkers because they don't meet the minimum criteria of rational skeptics. Your claims that those prophecies are special or even interesting have been rejected by virtue of failing to meet these criteria - criteria that you have already conceded are of no interest to you. What more is there to say to somebody like you? We have no basis for discussion - no shared assumptions.

"Water is two parts hydrogen and one part oxygen. What if someone says,“Well, that’s not how I choose to think about water.&#12539; All we can do is appeal to scientific values. And if he doesn’t share those values, the conversation is over ." - Sam Harris

"If someone doesn’t value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove they should value it? If someone doesn’t value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" - Sam Harris
KiMare wrote:
Now you are trying to divert the exposed ploy. Caught you. Smile.
Your ideas and behavior speak to the merit of faith based thought.

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

#212238 Feb 13, 2014
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
My ancestors left the UK, and Europe for a reason.
From this migration based on hope and faith a nation was born. Unlike any nation on the Earth. The only nation that has sent men to walk on the moon. The most powerful superpower on the face of the Earth. The United States of America.
It is my observation mans inhumanity to mankind supersedes anything that God has done. Yet you ridicule God why your fellow man waits to kill you.
Yes it is this same God that freed the slaves from the hardships in Egypt. He must not have been committed to slavery that much since he set the slaves free. It is this act that gave courage to those African Americans who were in bondage.
For they cried out to God for freedom and freedom did come. For today this great nation has a President of African ancestry. And there will be others to follow in history.
This same God never once condoned rape of any kind. It was forbidden. Although it is commonly perceived by those lacking in faith to skew the truth. The facts are and will be forever that rape is a sin and a crime against humanity.
And Hitler whom you Atheist frequently and proudly proclaim was a Christian. Has his place in the lake of fire with Satan his father. For this we know that people claim to be and what they are in reality can be completely different.
For Hitler had the demonic mind of psychopathic killer that masked himself under auspices of Christianity. Only a fool would believe him to be a genuine Christian. And not to our surprise fools believe this nonsense.
Good, so glad you ancestors had the foresight and clairvoyance to p|ss off so you could be born across the Atlantic and not here

Yes the puritans moved over the water so they could be free to impose their religion on all by force, threat and violence if required. It seems that your ancestors did a good job.

Ahh but China and India beats you on population numbers, China is catching up and due to overtake you on finance. Europe beats you on humanity and human rights. Oh yes and the African nations have been electing Black presidents for a long time so no need to get you nickers in a twist. Tell me have you had any female presidents yet? Honey you want to hype up the US with propaganda then you need to understand the state of the world before sticking your foot in your mouth.

Perhaps you are correct that in the US man in inhumane, not so much in Europe. I do not ridicule any god that’s just your own insecurity. What is the point of ridiculing a myth?

The threats to this world at the moment originate from/because of the 3 abrahamic religions, The Hebrews are determined to massacre the Palestinians and hence begin a war with Islam and Islam is determined to see their religions grow by wiping the christian aggressor off the map. So is seems that without the three abrahamic religions this world would be a safer place to live.

Ahh so you agree that while freeing his few chosen people your god carried out the first genocide, murdered tens of thousands of children and condoned rape and slavery?

He advised that the people his chosen few captured should be either murdered or kept as sex slaves and raped at will. It’s written in the babble so you can’t deny it.

Funny your wet dreams about Hitler because he has never been excommunicated and what he did he did with full knowledge and agreement of the Vatican/ As far as the head of the biggest christian church in the world was concern then he was still a good christian. It is not your decision who is or is not christian

Now you are being foolish, Hitler’s father was Jewish, the Hebrew people consider Satan to be a personal metaphor, the yetzer hara that tempts us to do wrong and metaphors do not sire children.

And still you have not seen the decency to respond to the original statement that “Not one addiction clinic in the UK is affiliated to any church”. Why is this, could it be that it shows you were wrong?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212239 Feb 13, 2014
Eagle 12 wrote:
It is my observation mans inhumanity to mankind supersedes anything that God has done.
Mine, too, but not anything that the Christian god is alleged to have done. Man has a long way to go to catch up to such things as creating hell, creating a master demon, and setting it loose on the earth. Even drowning nearly all life and almost sterilizing the earth pales in comparison to the other.
Eagle 12 wrote:
Yet you ridicule God why your fellow man waits to kill you.
We reject the idea of an omnipotent god creating murderers and exposing us to them rather than protecting us from them, and then being called loving.
Eagle 12 wrote:
Yes it is this same God that freed the slaves from the hardships in Egypt.
The hardships that he subjected them to out of petty spite, or allowed others to subject them to, depending on your theology.
Eagle 12 wrote:
This same God never once condoned rape of any kind. It was forbidden.
We must be talking about different gods, or different definitions of rape. Rape means nonconsensual sex to you, right?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212240 Feb 13, 2014
Eagle 12 wrote:
For Hitler had the demonic mind of psychopathic killer
Have you seen the list of deaths inflicted or ordered by Yahweh? Here's part of it:

http://commonsenseatheism.com/...

[1] God drowns the whole earth. In Genesis 7:21-23, God drowns the entire population of the earth: men, women, children, fetuses, and perhaps unicorns. Only a single family survives. In Matthew 24:37-42, gentle Jesus approves of this genocide and plans to repeat it when he returns.

[2] God incinerates 51 men to make a point. In 2 Kings 1:9-10, Elijah gets God to burn 51 men with fire from heaven to prove he is God.

[3] God slaughters all Egyptian firstborn. In Exodus 12:29, God the baby-killer slaughters all Egyptian firstborn children and cattle because their king was stubborn.

[4] God kills 14,000 people for complaining that God keeps killing them. In Numbers 16:41-49, the Israelites complain that God is killing too many of them. So, God sends a plague that kills 14,000 more of them.

[5] God helps Samson kill 30 men because he lost a bet. In Judges 14:11-19, Samson loses a bet for 30 sets of clothes. The spirit of God comes upon him and he kills 30 men to steal their clothes and pay off the debt.

[6] God kills 50,000 people for curiosity. In 1 Samuel 6:19, God kills 50,000 men for peeking into the ark of the covenant.(Newer cosmetic translations count only 70 deaths, but their text notes admit that the best and earliest manuscripts put the number at 50,070.)

[7] 3,000 Israelites killed for inventing a god. In Exodus 32, Moses has climbed Mount Sinai to get the Ten Commandments. The Israelites are bored, so they invent a golden calf god. Moses comes back and God commands him:“Each man strap a sword to his side. Go back and forth through the camp from one end to the other, each killing his brother and friend and neighbor.” About 3,000 people died.

[8] The Amorites destroyed by sword and by God’s rocks. In Joshua 10:10-11, God helps the Israelites slaughter the Amorites by sword, then finishes them off with rocks from the sky.

[9] God burns two cities to death. In Genesis 19:24, God kills everyone in Sodom and Gomorrah with fire from the sky. Then God kills Lot’s wife for looking back at her burning home.

[10] God has 42 children mauled by bears. In 2 Kings 2:23-24, some kids tease the prophet Elisha, and God sends bears to dismember them.

The god of the bible goes on to command:

• KILL anyone who wears mixed fabrics.
• KILL any child that disrespects its parents
• KILL anyone who works on Saturday
• KILL anyone who eats meat AND cheese together
• KILL anyone who swears by god
• KILL any man who goes into the temple after having sex with a woman who is on her •

More?

• "Show No Mercy!" Deut 7:2
• "March to War!" Numbers 32:20
• "Ethnic cleanse!" Deut. 20:15
• "Commit genocide!" Joshua 10:20
• "Enslave!" Lev. 25:44
• "Beat to death!" Ex. 21:20
• "Kill women and chilldren!" Numbers 31:17, 1 Samuel 15:3
• "Kill all prisoners!" Deut 7:2
• "Destroy!" Deut. 7:16
• "Annihilate!" Deut. 17:29
• "Slaughter!" Deut. 13:15, Joshua 8:24
• "Burn!" Deut. 13:15
• "Torture!" Lev. 24:23, Numbers 5:11
• "Massacre!" Numbers 21:2
• "Exterminate!" Deut 2:34, Deut 3:3
• "Crush!" Deut. 33:29
• "Kill!" Joshua 9:24
• "Destroy!" Deut 31:4
• "Smite!" Esther 9:5
• "Slash!" Judges 15:8
• "Burn!" joshua 6:24
• "Kill!" Joshua 10:10
• "Kill!" Judges 11:33
• "Kill!" Deut 9:3
• "Loot!" Deut. 20:10
• "Plunder!" Numbers 31:9, Deut 2:35
• "Rape!" Numbers 31:18, Deut. 21:10, Judges 21:11
• "Pillage!" 1 Samuel 23:5
• "Kill!" Deut 9:3
• "Kill!" Deut 20:15
• "Kill!" Judges 21:11

How different would the universe be under the rule of a psychopath like Hitler?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212241 Feb 13, 2014
Bongo wrote:
There is a 58% chance of being rounded up and killed should atheism proliferate unrestrained.
Most atheists are humanists.There is almost zero chance of genocide without authoritarianism, which is an essential aspect of Christianity, Stalinism, Islam, and Maoism, to name a few..
Bongo wrote:
What about the plethora of wackos who ruin the hearts and minds of children who mistakenly accept them as mentors and role models. Religion is good, its a better way.
Are you talking about the Catholic priesthood?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212242 Feb 13, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Really.
Care to do a comparative kill list of religious violence for today?
Gay couples have a piece of paper claiming that your mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered relationship equates to marriage. That distinction bothers you immensely, in spite of your claim otherwise.
You know as well as I do that nothing can change the inferior status of your relationship. It is visibly a counterfeit, scientifically defective mating behavior, factually fallacious and socially a forced sympathy to denial.
Smile.
The system that put such ideas in your head can't disappear from the world soon enough. A man who speaks like you do has nothing to say to decent people.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#212243 Feb 13, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
Yeah, when I was still to be counted a Christian, the Xmas thing was one they really ranted about. Leaving the Christ out of Christmas. BUT...from early Christian times, X was a symbol for Christ, a version of the cross. Early Christians would have considered Xmas and Xtian as perfectly acceptable terminology. But Christians have always had a persecution complex, and they absolutely LOVE to gripe about how downtrodden they are. This is just one more aspect of their faux outrage.
X is also the Greek chi, which stands for christos - annointed - in the acronym IChThYS, short for Iesous Christos, Theou Yios, Soter (Jesus Christ, God's Son, Savior).

I'm sure that you also know that ichthys is the Koine Greek word for fish and the basis of the fish symbol seen on bumper stickers.

“Seventh son”

Since: Dec 10

Will Prevail

#212244 Feb 13, 2014
Bongo wrote:
<quoted text> 1) Spiritual things , which science has limited understanding, should not be insinuated as majic. There is no abra cadabra. 2) Ok, but as the story goes, God created man and has made a prescription for his behavior. Righteousness according to him.
What we have here is an active case of ad ignorantiam causing cognitive dissonance. Don't sprain your last brain cell there Bongo.

“Seventh son”

Since: Dec 10

Will Prevail

#212245 Feb 13, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
The system that put such ideas in your head can't disappear from the world soon enough. A man who speaks like you do has nothing to say to decent people.

It maybe in fact, Archie Bunker you're talking to there IANS.

Since: Dec 12

Yes, I'm an Atheist.

#212246 Feb 13, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Have you seen the list of deaths inflicted or ordered by Yahweh? Here's part of it:

http://commonsenseatheism.com/...

[1] God drowns the whole earth. In Genesis 7:21-23, God drowns the entire population of the earth: men, women, children, fetuses, and perhaps unicorns. Only a single family survives. In Matthew 24:37-42, gentle Jesus approves of this genocide and plans to repeat it when he returns.

[2] God incinerates 51 men to make a point. In 2 Kings 1:9-10, Elijah gets God to burn 51 men with fire from heaven to prove he is God.

[3] God slaughters all Egyptian firstborn. In Exodus 12:29, God the baby-killer slaughters all Egyptian firstborn children and cattle because their king was stubborn.

[4] God kills 14,000 people for complaining that God keeps killing them. In Numbers 16:41-49, the Israelites complain that God is killing too many of them. So, God sends a plague that kills 14,000 more of them.

[5] God helps Samson kill 30 men because he lost a bet. In Judges 14:11-19, Samson loses a bet for 30 sets of clothes. The spirit of God comes upon him and he kills 30 men to steal their clothes and pay off the debt.

[6] God kills 50,000 people for curiosity. In 1 Samuel 6:19, God kills 50,000 men for peeking into the ark of the covenant.(Newer cosmetic translations count only 70 deaths, but their text notes admit that the best and earliest manuscripts put the number at 50,070.)

[7] 3,000 Israelites killed for inventing a god. In Exodus 32, Moses has climbed Mount Sinai to get the Ten Commandments. The Israelites are bored, so they invent a golden calf god. Moses comes back and God commands him:“Each man strap a sword to his side. Go back and forth through the camp from one end to the other, each killing his brother and friend and neighbor.” About 3,000 people died.

[8] The Amorites destroyed by sword and by God’s rocks. In Joshua 10:10-11, God helps the Israelites slaughter the Amorites by sword, then finishes them off with rocks from the sky.

[9] God burns two cities to death. In Genesis 19:24, God kills everyone in Sodom and Gomorrah with fire from the sky. Then God kills Lot’s wife for looking back at her burning home.

[10] God has 42 children mauled by bears. In 2 Kings 2:23-24, some kids tease the prophet Elisha, and God sends bears to dismember them.

The god of the bible goes on to command:

• KILL anyone who wears mixed fabrics.
• KILL any child that disrespects its parents
• KILL anyone who works on Saturday
• KILL anyone who eats meat AND cheese together
• KILL anyone who swears by god
• KILL any man who goes into the temple after having sex with a woman who is on her •

More?

• "Show No Mercy!" Deut 7:2
• "March to War!" Numbers 32:20
• "Ethnic cleanse!" Deut. 20:15
• "Commit genocide!" Joshua 10:20
• "Enslave!" Lev. 25:44
• "Beat to death!" Ex. 21:20
• "Kill women and chilldren!" Numbers 31:17, 1 Samuel 15:3
• "Kill all prisoners!" Deut 7:2
• "Destroy!" Deut. 7:16
• "Annihilate!" Deut. 17:29
• "Slaughter!" Deut. 13:15, Joshua 8:24
• "Burn!" Deut. 13:15
• "Torture!" Lev. 24:23, Numbers 5:11
• "Massacre!" Numbers 21:2
• "Exterminate!" Deut 2:34, Deut 3:3
• "Crush!" Deut. 33:29
• "Kill!" Joshua 9:24
• "Destroy!" Deut 31:4
• "Smite!" Esther 9:5
• "Slash!" Judges 15:8
• "Burn!" joshua 6:24
• "Kill!" Joshua 10:10
• "Kill!" Judges 11:33
• "Kill!" Deut 9:3
• "Loot!" Deut. 20:10
• "Plunder!" Numbers 31:9, Deut 2:35
• "Rape!" Numbers 31:18, Deut. 21:10, Judges 21:11
• "Pillage!" 1 Samuel 23:5
• "Kill!" Deut 9:3
• "Kill!" Deut 20:15
• "Kill!" Judges 21:11

How different would the universe be under the rule of a psychopath like Hitler?
Yeah! Controlling humans is awesome!

@@

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