Thousands Protest Roe V. Wade Decision

Full story: Newsday 305,851
Thousands of abortion opponents marched from the National Mall to the Supreme Court on Tuesday in their annual remembrance of the court's Roe v. Wade decision. Full Story
Katie

Federal Way, WA

#307082 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
<quoted text>
Elise
I do not believe its false .
And for purposes of the debate ..it does matter THST .I disagree.
It's my opinion ..my meaning is I will not change my mind..She or you are not going to change yours .
She and I argued. This last week..Same outcome .
The height of folly is to keep repeating something ..That has the same
Result .
We will never see eye to eye on it ..
:) Peace
We don't debate opinion, Rose.
We debate fact.

And my facts outnumber your opinions and opinion pieces.

You have every right in the USA to hold close to your opinion. Even as they show your blatant hypocrisy.

This is not meant unkindly, but as an eye opener.

Number one, I link you to images of fetal brains showing a smooth cortex at 22 weeks. That is fact. At 22wks gestation, the brain is not formed for any sensory input or output. Therefore there is no possibility of a fetus feeling pain. Period.

But hold dear to your opinion. Your opinion will not outweigh fact.

“Truly Pro-Life”

Since: Nov 11

Proudly Pro-choice

#307083 Aug 5, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
It is happening here. A woman was flipping court ordered to remain pregnant even though she needed cancer treatment to survive. She and her fetus died in a Florida hospital.
"Unfortunately, during the 25th week of gestation, Angela was admitted to GWUMC and eventually diagnosed as having a lung tumor. Again, fighting to live, she wanted everything possible done to prolong her life. Surgery was ruled out, leaving chemotherapy and radiation as the only means of prolonging her life. Angela was informed that her baby was too small to be born, meaning too premature to have a good chance to survive, 2 and that her doctors did not consider intervention on behalf of the fetus appropriate until 28 weeks.3 She was also informed of the added risks to the fetus from chemotherapy and radiation, but Angela still decided to institute aggressive treatment of her cancer. This course was so clearly understood that her attending obstetricians did not consider, much less attempt, intervention for the fetus later that night when Angela's condition rapidly deteriorated, depriving Angela and the fetus of substantial amounts of vital oxygen for many hours.
The next morning, events took an unexpected turn. The hospital's administrators (who were also its liability risk managers) learned of the decision not to attempt delivery of the fetus. The administrator questioned the right of anyone but a court to make decisions affecting a potentially viable fetus, particularly in light of the political controversy over fetal rights. Although the decision was supported by Angela's parents and husband and by the obstetrical department as a whole, as consistent with the wishes of their patient, and despite the advice of legal counsel that the doctors should exercise their best medical judgment under the circumstances (which was not to deliver the - extremely premature and highly compromised fetus), the hospital required a court to decide what should be done for the fetus. Technically, the hospital sought a declaratory judgment as to "what it should do in terms of the fetus, whether to intervene and save its life."
http://advocatesforpregnantwomen.org/main/pub...
just your run of the mill court order for bed rest while pregnant.
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/florida-court-or...
Sick and appalling, that a court would rule a woman must 'stay pregnant' even though it will likely kill her. As I said, these laws render pregnant women disposable.

“Let the Children”

Since: Aug 08

Come To Me

#307084 Aug 5, 2013
not a playa1965 wrote:
<quoted text>Couple of things? As Katie has pointed out, current laws are NOT protecting the life of the mother. You want everyone to make sure and read your links - did you read Katie's post?
And the 'foolish administrator' didn't know how to interpret the law, because it's ambiguously written...that is ABSOLUTELY the legislators' fault. Of course it's the administrator's fault that he/she came down on the side of protecting his/her OWN ass, at the expense of that woman's life. But so what, right? Just one more dead mom...no biggie. Apparently, we're disposable.
Have I ever said mom was,disposable ..NO.

they should have treated the woman period I agree.

People do stupid things .

The administrator / owner of the clinic here who threw a breathing
Baby right out with the garbage was covering HER CLINIC TOO. Baby was OBVIUOSLY DISPOSABLE..except in this case mom...MOM..at that point disagreed ..the admin did it anyway while mom.was on table after delivering ..thought mom was supposed to be the final arbitrator ???

there is no 100 percent right on either side of this .

Saw this on the news ..

These three people are pro choice

http://www.delawareonline.com/article/2013073...

Hospitals and clinics are not infallible ..even PP.

“Let the Children”

Since: Aug 08

Come To Me

#307085 Aug 5, 2013
not a playa1965 wrote:
<quoted text>Sick and appalling, that a court would rule a woman must 'stay pregnant' even though it will likely kill her. As I said, these laws render pregnant women disposable.
It is I Agree. And this WOUKD be the same wrong is this case under Roe,.

“Let the Children”

Since: Aug 08

Come To Me

#307086 Aug 5, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
We don't debate opinion, Rose.
We debate fact.
And my facts outnumber your opinions and opinion pieces.
You have every right in the USA to hold close to your opinion. Even as they show your blatant hypocrisy.
This is not meant unkindly, but as an eye opener.
Number one, I link you to images of fetal brains showing a smooth cortex at 22 weeks. That is fact. At 22wks gestation, the brain is not formed for any sensory input or output. Therefore there is no possibility of a fetus feeling pain. Period.
But hold dear to your opinion. Your opinion will not outweigh fact.
What bothers,me is yes I have right to my opinion

Yes,Respectfully disagree .

I have had the same opinion all along

That does,not make me a hypocrite .

You have your opinion ..I will have mine
Katie

Federal Way, WA

#307087 Aug 5, 2013
not a playa1965 wrote:
<quoted text>Sick and appalling, that a court would rule a woman must 'stay pregnant' even though it will likely kill her. As I said, these laws render pregnant women disposable.
It is sick and appalling. Unfortunately, I mixed up some of the facts of the first link and another I'm more familiar with out of Florida. The first link I supplied is actually out of Washington DC and from the late '80s. The late '80s! So they were doing it even then.

The one I'm more familiar with out of Florida was more recent. Same scenario though from cancer returning, being court ordered to remain in hospital, and finally both woman and fetus dying in the flipping hospital!

Will we ever learn?

“Let the Children”

Since: Aug 08

Come To Me

#307088 Aug 5, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
You are still wrong. A fetus does not feel pain and it is not aware.
And STILL, 98.7% of all women who have abortions ARE choosing to do so earlier, the laws of many states already PREVENT them from having an abortion at a clinic during the second trimester, and of the very small percentage (1.3%) of women having abortions after 20 weeks, you don't KNOW how many of those are elective, and how many aren't. Please don't continue to ignore these points I'm making.
I'm not ignoring you honestly ..

Until we are able to interview a fetus ..we will never know for sure .

But we do know the science at one time thought babies,had no PAIN.

They were WRONG ..And preemies have pain.

I know it's a small percentage ..But one PURELY ELECTIVE abortion on a healthy mom..at 22 ,23 weeks is too many ...IMO

And if states are passing laws fine ..this federal law,won't pass anyway ...

It was undertaken to be humane to the babies...Not to kill mom s,

“Dan IS the Man”

Since: May 12

Location hidden

#307089 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
<quoted text>
No comment on Obama care. The,Unions,don't even like it now,.
But contraception should be covered on any insurance .
If they can cover cigars ..they should cover the pill
Actually have a friend on disability .get Medicare Medicaid
Think the pill cost,her very little under her coverage ..small Colts
IMO
Some insurances also cover Viagra...go figure.

“Dan IS the Man”

Since: May 12

Location hidden

#307090 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
Lol cover VIAGRA not cigars,..dang Madam
LMAO!! Same thing!

“Dan IS the Man”

Since: May 12

Location hidden

#307091 Aug 5, 2013
elise in burque wrote:
<quoted text>That's the bottom line. If women were respected, these things wouldn't happen.
Yes...exactly.
Katie

Federal Way, WA

#307092 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
<quoted text>
What bothers,me is yes I have right to my opinion
Yes,Respectfully disagree .
I have had the same opinion all along
That does,not make me a hypocrite .
You have your opinion ..I will have mine
The hypocrisies lie elsewhere, Rose. But these become apparent.

Your opinion is that a 22wk fetus is identical to a 22wk preemie.

But you forget one teensy weensy little thing.

Birth! And all the physiological changes which accompany it. Those links showing the preemie brain is behind that of a full term baby explain it far better than I can. But these also indicate that once the preemie reaches its due date at 40wks, the brain is generally on par with a full term newborn.

“Dan IS the Man”

Since: May 12

Location hidden

#307093 Aug 5, 2013
EXPERT wrote:
<quoted text>
What (Men's) rights would you be referring to?
When men are making their own medical decisions do they have the Courts and various religions trying to interfere?

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#307094 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not ignoring you honestly ..
Until we are able to interview a fetus ..we will never know for sure .
But we do know the science at one time thought babies,had no PAIN.
They were WRONG ..And preemies have pain.
I know it's a small percentage ..But one PURELY ELECTIVE abortion on a healthy mom..at 22 ,23 weeks is too many ...IMO
And if states are passing laws fine ..this federal law,won't pass anyway ...
It was undertaken to be humane to the babies...Not to kill mom s,
I didn't say anything about "killing moms". I said the law is unnecessary, as the vast majority of women have their abortions earlier VOLUNTARILY.

And no, you are wrong. It is not necessary to interview the fetus. Knowing that the anatomical structures are not in place in order for pain to be perceived is enough, and that the fetus is not conscious, is enough.

The medical community assumed without evidence. These days we have scientific evidence.

It was "undertaken" to make it as hard as possible for a woman to exercise her legal rights. Just like the superfluous regulation laws. The legislators, catering to special interest groups, know that they can't get at RvW, know that the protests in front of clinics won't change her mind, so now they are passing any kind of law they can think of to make it harder for her to have an abortion.

The result will be more Gosnells, not less.

“Truly Pro-Life”

Since: Nov 11

Proudly Pro-choice

#307095 Aug 5, 2013
Long Night Moon 13 wrote:
<quoted text>
When men are making their own medical decisions do they have the Courts and various religions trying to interfere?
No court in this country would tell a man he had to 'stay cancerous' or 'stay impotent', or 'stay ANY DAMN THING he didn't want to stay', health-wise, and not just to protect somebody else's life. Ever.

No religion does, either.
feces for jesus

Westbury, NY

#307096 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
<quoted text>

Until we are able to interview a fetus ..we will never know for sure .
Interesting point.

Can we apply that same logic to our discussions about Jesus, what "god" said and the bible?

“Let the Children”

Since: Aug 08

Come To Me

#307097 Aug 5, 2013
feces for jesus wrote:
<quoted text>
Interesting point.
Can we apply that same logic to our discussions about Jesus, what "god" said and the bible?
We can it was already done and written about. You just choose not to believe the writings
Lots,of of people heard from Him Him directly ..Not just in prayer ..

They most certainly will again ..

So far no fetus has,spoken ..wish they could .
No Relativism

West Lafayette, IN

#307098 Aug 5, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
NR's post contained a Freudian slip, when he said "contempt" instead of "content".
My point was an aside, and didn't have anything to do with that.
bHitler: "NR's post contained a Freudian slip, when he said 'contempt' instead of content.' My point was an aside, and didn't have anything to do with that."
________

Actually, the post you speak of was
Tamara's from Monson, MA.

http://www.topix.com/forum/news/abortion/T833...

"My point was an aside, and didn't have anything to do with that."

And it didn't have anything to do with me.

Maybe you are the one guilty of a Freudian slip.

Pay attention.
No Relativism

West Lafayette, IN

#307099 Aug 5, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
The hypocrisies lie elsewhere, Rose. But these become apparent.
Your opinion is that a 22wk fetus is identical to a 22wk preemie.
But you forget one teensy weensy little thing.
Birth! And all the physiological changes which accompany it. Those links showing the preemie brain is behind that of a full term baby explain it far better than I can. But these also indicate that once the preemie reaches its due date at 40wks, the brain is generally on par with a full term newborn.
Katie V.: "Once the preemie reaches its due date at 40wks, the brain is generally on par with a full term newborn.
__________

"There is no 'exact moment' as fetus changing to baby is a process begun during labor and continuing after delivery well into the first 24-48hrs AFTER childbirth. The brain continues to adjust for life outside the womb, see." - Katie V.
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/abortion/T833 ...

(Make up your mind w/ your ever changing "facts")
No Relativism

West Lafayette, IN

#307100 Aug 5, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
Please read the links I've left for you.
You have things backward and skewed. No that's not what I'd written in my thoughtful post to you, but like Elise said, don't let your emotions lead you by the nose.
You are all heart... but your heart is willing to let the gov't change the rules where women will die just like they are in the Catholic countries. Ireland, Brazil, other South American countries, etc.
2,000 baby women are scheduled to be executed in American abortuaries today. And tomorrow. And the next day.....

Your faux "feminism" is duly noted.

Again.

Since: Jun 08

Atrisco Village

#307101 Aug 5, 2013
RoSesz wrote:
<quoted text>
Elise
I do not believe its false .
And for purposes of the debate ..it does matter THST .I disagree.
It's my opinion ..my meaning is I will not change my mind..She or you are not going to change yours .
She and I argued. This last week..Same outcome .
The height of folly is to keep repeating something ..That has the same
Result .
We will never see eye to eye on it ..
:) Peace
Okey dokey. Do what you do, you're awesome. However, I seriously doubt that repeating something is the height of folly. I can think of a ton of behaviors that are far worse than that.

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