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Katie

Auburn, WA

#295768 May 12, 2013
LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly Katie! Without the exploitation of Terri, the PLM fools like Randall Terri and Freaky Frankie Pavone would be nothings.
It is disturbing these two are taken seriously by anyone!

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295769 May 12, 2013
razzmatazz wrote:
<quoted text>So, you are for Euthanasia, you are not pro life at all. Do you know what Christ said about the most vulnerable? What ever you do to the least of your brother, you do to Me ...so in other words you are putting Christ to death. Every life is important, from conception to natural death.
Knutter, seriously. Shut the hell up. Not wanting to be on a vent isn't euthanasia. Neither is removing life support.

You dont even know what euthanasia is.
rosesz

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#295770 May 12, 2013
And foo. I hear what you say about the tube.

The press was hysterical on the starving. If it was peaceful that is better.. But still think it could have been avoided. HOW LONG WAS she on LIFE SUPPORT.not tube..
One poster says they only out her in hospice when they removed it.. I think.

This thread has been all day. Hard to remember it all!!

And yes I am sure it was horrible to watch her die..you I mean.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295771 May 12, 2013
rosesz wrote:
Now here is a Catch 22 I...think the peaceful way pets are put down is good.
I TRUST MY CHILD with my life.
I DO NOT WANT to be a vegetable.
BUT I could not want her to be responsible ACTIVELY for my death..That would be sin for both of us
What do you mean "actively" for your death? I was actively responsible for telling the doctors to remove my mothers ANH. That was what her wishes were, but I had to make that determination. I did not sin - I followed HER wishes.

When my father died two months later, I was responsible for stopping treatment as well, as that was also HIS wish, he didn't ever want to be on machines of ANY kind either. Again, I did not sin, nor did the doctors that made the recommendations that while we COULD have kept him alive almost indefinetly on machines, we shouldn't as it was futile care.
BUT if we ALLOW ACTIVE LIFE ENDING. Families will put down loved ones maybe too early..
Rose, we're not dogs or cats or other animals. We dont "put down" loved ones. Stopping invasive medical care is not 'putting anyone down'.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295772 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
I know who you are, when people write you can clearly see. The name fools only yourself..
ANyone have any idea what this fool is babbling about this time?

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#295773 May 12, 2013
Inane comments and ridiculous accusations--what more does FFJ have to work with, really?
AyakaNeo wrote:
<quoted text>So you're linking Cpeter to charges of indecent solicitation of a child on a public forum? I feel pretty good about my opinion not being worth shit in comparison to your stupidity.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295774 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
It happened about 8 years ago in a nursing home in mempis tn. I watched this old woman and her daughter give the man jello, and thought they knew what they were doing. The note above bed said no solid foods, and I didn't know any different, but the man started to asperate and when the nurse came in, she asked what was his code? The wife said, what do you mean??? Is he dying, and the nurse said yes! She said please save him!?! They were all crying, well wife and 60 yo daughter, but I was on the other side of the room, waiting for another man to dye.
My story is true, whether you want to believe it or not :)
Gtown, you're full of shit. FIrst off, someone in a coma or in the process of dying, someone's who's NPO isn't going to be swallowing either. They would have had to do more than spoon some jello into a closed mouth that's not cooperating for them to asperate.

Second, no nurse is going to come in and ask a visitor "what the code is". They're not going to blurt out that the patient is dying, and they're NOT going to do all this with strangers in the room. Period.

BOH is right, you're an idiot.

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#295775 May 12, 2013
Sorry about your mom. I don't think some people can understand what it means until it involves a loved one. It's an act of charity to release a body from that situation. It benefits no one but those who are in denial of the situation.
LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly Cpeter!
A couple years ago, my mom, who had been on ANH, started to refuse her insulin. In 4 days, she would occasionally look around - respond to pain reflexes - but nobody was home and that was very clear. We had the ANH removed that day, and it took her body 14 days to shut down. She did NOT starve to death, and it was a surprisingly peaceful process. No murder, just dying naturally.
The way these idiots talk, they act like its something bad, something to fear. While it wasn't the ideal way to go, it was worse on those of us waiting with her than it was for her.
To MOST people, the something to fear would be to be hooked up to machines the way Terri Schiavo was.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295776 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
He was shacked up with another woman.
Big deal. So were you. Difference is, he didn't "shack up" until well over 10 years and knowing for a fact she wasn't going to recover. And he DIDNT give up on her, he stood by her 100% and what SHE Would have wanted.
She was worth way more to him dead.
And the sad part is you dont even know how stupid this comment is.

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#295777 May 12, 2013
Like most deaths of this kind, it's about ending suffering for all concerned, and allowng the dying a dignified exit.
AyakaNeo wrote:
<quoted text>My oldest sister died in 2007. She was 51, on a vent, organs failing one by one and unconscious. She got a C diff infection on top of everything and the medications she was being given were not being metabolized because of the C diff so she was dying, just very slowly. Her daughter decided to take her off the vent which was fine, everyone else agreed it was best. Killed me to see my mother crying like that ya know? Took about 10 minutes and she just stopped breathing. It's a beautiful death.
rosesz

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#295778 May 12, 2013
LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>
What do you mean "actively" for your death? I was actively responsible for telling the doctors to remove my mothers ANH. That was what her wishes were, but I had to make that determination. I did not sin - I followed HER wishes.
When my father died two months later, I was responsible for stopping treatment as well, as that was also HIS wish, he didn't ever want to be on machines of ANY kind either. Again, I did not sin, nor did the doctors that made the recommendations that while we COULD have kept him alive almost indefinetly on machines, we shouldn't as it was futile care.
<quoted text>
Rose, we're not dogs or cats or other animals. We dont "put down" loved ones. Stopping invasive medical care is not 'putting anyone down'.
NO NO

I WAS TRYING TO BE CIRCUMSPECT..active sin would be like oh a whole bunch of narcotics...which if it wasn't sinful would be MY choice

INVASIVE CARE BEYOND MY TIME is NOT putting down..I agree..think I said that later in posts..

As I said a lot of posts on this lol..I had been accused of being in favour of euthanasia..I'm not but only because it's a sin..I really want to leave life as quickly and painlessly as possible if there is no hope..it sounds like you followed your mom's wishes..And I don't think anything at all like you put her down..
That phrase was because of how instantly peaceful they go..And we don't.

I am reading that autopsy automatons. Maybe it will say just how long Terry was on life support

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295780 May 12, 2013
rosesz wrote:
<quoted text>

Did you have a good moms day
I did. My daughter is in college in Pa, but is coming up in two weeks, so we'll have our day then, but ran a great estate sale today and got myself a wonderful old antique whistle cane! I collect old canes, and this one is very cool!

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295781 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
Anyone can goggle it, and really it is up to which side they want. Plenty of support on both sides.
Except the Schindlers side has no PROOF. Only idiots support them based on ignorance as you're doing.
Many people in nursing homes, that need to be fed, and have no idea who they are.
So? They're not brain dead. Terri Schiavo was.
Again, she breathed, heart beated, she was starved /thirsted to death.
Again, no she was not you moron. I posted the autopsy report. Read it and stop with the stupidity already.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295782 May 12, 2013
rosesz wrote:
<quoted text>
ANH??? And sorry for the loss. Moms are esp hard.......imo
ANH stands for Artifical Nutrition and Hydration.

Both were hard for me, as they were so close together.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295783 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey math whizz, do your own math, 10's of thousands??? 5 % of those result in pregnancies, and only half of those end up aborted??? We straight soo far????
Over 3,500 abortions a day??,?
Yes I stand behind my numbers :)
You stand behind them because you're an idiot.

You claimed it was "rare" when it came to rape and incest. It is NOT rare you stupid fk.

“Truly Pro-Life”

Since: Nov 11

Proudly Pro-choice

#295784 May 12, 2013
rosesz wrote:
<quoted text>
maybe I wasn't clear..Lol.probably.
POLITICAL INCENTIVE to actually make abortion RARE. From the PC side.
THE stuff I said about PSA s specifically telling girls that indiscriminate lookups are not in THEIR interest. TELLING BITH about STDS. AND TELLING WOMEN birth control beats abortion by a long shot.
There was a lot of political and social incentive to get abortion legal. Use that same capital to promote knowledge ..The internet is a good place to start..And TV. CABLE AND LATE EVENING TV..
But because of whatever reason. the incentive is Not there to discourage pregnancies..then no need for abortion.
But abortion has become a huge business and political industry.
The PL side can PRAY and post and even rant..That will never cut the number of abortions..
THE PC POLS could make an atmosphere to actually make abortion more rare.
And yes adoption could be promoted for sure..on both sides.
BUT getting the women NOT to be preggers is the biggest thing.
IMHO
Rose, I'm very much with you on the idea that the pro-choice side could advocate for public service announcements detailing what happens in an abortion, what happens before and during pregnancy, what childbirth entails, what it's like to have responsibility for a newborn, toddler, etc....and lauding birth control. Pro-choice agrees - and NARAL has attempted to float similar PSA's many times. You know who stands in the way of those PSA's? I'll tell you: so-called 'conservatives' who own the media outlets. They don't want sex education in schools, and they are assuredly not going to accede to sex education on the radio and tv. Doesn't garner a lot of advertising support either - and media is a business too.

Meanwhile, the SCPL faction puts up billboards that say "BIRTH CONTROL KILLS", and the like. "BC - Get the facts" for example, is a SCPL campaign, which relies on spreading ideas such as "...using birth control leads to cancer...", and that "..having children is beneficial to women..." not to mention "...abortion is a sin..."

And the SCPL is also involved heavily in the 'Crisis Pregnancy Centers' which are not geared toward 'informed consent', or prenatal care, but mainly toward placing infants with the highest bidder, among the religious congregations who provide the balance of donations to the Centers.

And here's the kicker: the CPC's are subsidized by the Federal Government, which the same bunch of folks has successfully lobbied to cease subsidy to Planned Parenthood... the primary providers of contraception, pre-natal care, and preventive testing for those most likely to become unintentionally pregnant (low income women)- none of which is offered by the CPC's.

But as any behavioral therapist will tell you: Positive reinforcement works better than the negative kind, for getting folks to do what is desired of them. So the social safety net works as an incentive not to abort, better than the misinformation and disinformation tactics promoted by the SCPL...
So far, the approach advocated by so-called 'pro-life' folks isn't working too well. And the media movers and shakers who could assist PC in getting the word out, are absolutely opposed to doing so.
rosesz

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#295785 May 12, 2013
cpeter1313 wrote:
Sorry about your mom. I don't think some people can understand what it means until it involves a loved one. It's an act of charity to release a body from that situation. It benefits no one but those who are in denial of the situation.
<quoted text>
Agree seriuosly

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295786 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
I was referring to the man asperating to death on jello, it was not peaceful, he was gasping at air, not peaceable MOM
You like calling me son, so I'll call you mom.
That gives me two new moms -you and bit o honey. L, but not outloud.
I know it don't cross your mind for some one as vile as me, to be the son of someone sooo careing and loveable as you are :)
AGAIN for the stupid child, you would never be a chlid of mine. I wouldn't stand for such ignorance in my home. But I'm not surprised you dont know enough about the English language to understand the use of the word "son" in a sentence that doesn't refer to a child.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#295787 May 12, 2013
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
I geuss you're right, she really hadn't eaten.
Pray for a brain Gtown, because your stupidity is truly sickening.
Katie

Auburn, WA

#295788 May 12, 2013
rosesz wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok first..No I was talking about divorce if he wanted to move on later. Personally let me go way before. PLEASE read my latest posts on this.
Regarding doing brain tests and especially on how they ..if this was Terrys wish..not made her better in the first place.
I READ on one site she,was on ventilation AT FIRST.. critical..dc her then. Not later..Could have avoided all this..And it was her wish.
As far as Mr Schiavo..I was not aware of all he did..But if true HE should have maybe not done so much..No surgery...go off ventilator when she wasn't so "healthy" before the lawsuit. When she was critical
If it wasn't what I feel is sin..And would not ask anyone to commit it..I would wish for a morphine cocktail myself. BUT alas...made it as clear as possible my wishes and both hubby and daughter are joint proxy.
When Terri first collapsed, she was resuscitated. They worked on her for 45 minutes. She was without oxygen about 7 minutes. Low oxygen during that 45-minute period.

They brought her to the hospital. She was in a coma for a while. At some point she was no longer considered in a coma, but she hadn't exactly woke up either. The extent of her brain damage was not showing up yet in the CT scans. Your brain doesn't liquefy instantaneously.

It was during this time they removed the vent. And she breathed on her own.

Mr. Schiavo was young. He loved his wife. He had a lot of hope. False hope, maybe. He worked toward medical miracles, not a one was forthcoming. Even though he tried experimental treatment. Even though he persuaded neurology to continue therapy on her. None of it worked. Physicians had to keep telling him nothing was working. No matter how badly he wanted Terri to improve, she wasn't going to. And he had to learn to accept that.

Part of accepting it was accepting what Terri wanted for herself. Or didn't want. And she didn't want to be kept, maintained, in an incapacitated state.

I don't know what you've read, but I linked a very thorough article for you to read regarding her autopsy results and the circumstances surrounding her collapse and the intervening years. It's pretty obvious you didn't read it, though.

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