3rd recruit dies during basic at Fort Jackson basic training

Oct 28, 2008 Full story: Stars and Stripes 358

A third soldier in about a month has died during basic combat training at Fort Jackson, S.C. Pvt.

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Military Mom

United States

#110 Oct 12, 2009
drake wrote:
<quoted text> Then if you spent 20 years in the military then you wouldn't make a retarded statment like this. So, let me get this straight, you believe that the kids (as you put it) are put through stupid things in the heat of SC. Question: What do you think they will be dealing with in IRAQ or Afghan???? The temps are 2 twice is hot. They are rucking and carrying equipment on there back. Do you think they can survive that heat??? Your kid may not be FAT but maybe out of shape. The three kids that died physically were out of shape and had large amounts of body fat on them for there again. But again, it the military's
fault.
The Army Physical Fittness test current standard has been the same for 18 years. They change it in 1992.
To answer you question, yes, I had a son go through basic training two years agon and he made it without no problems and though the training was easy. Again, most the today's kids are out of shape and simply over weight.
Finally, I don't think you want to compare careers. I am an Infantry officer and I have served on active duty and now in the reserves. My life was put in danger many times. And if I were to provide you my name, you would find me under those who have received a Silver Stars. So...I can talk!
Oh my goodness! Who cares if you got a silver star, I serve with soldiers whom who served over sea's and recieved awards. They don't even mention them because of all the destruction that have concurred. I want to know who you are, so I can look you up. For being a soldier of 27 years, I bet your not very well liked with your negative attitude. I have treated soldiers who have "problems" since the war, but they don't regret serving. As for most of us who thank our young soldier's for serving, however you should say a prayer for yourself and ask for forgiveness. I cannot believe you talk to people the way you do. I want your name!!
drake

Alexandria, VA

#111 Oct 13, 2009
Military Mom wrote:
I don't know who you are or what you do for the military, but how dare you ridicule parents of obsese children. For being in the military, you should be ashamed for yourself. I am too in the military, in the medical corp. As a health provider things happen no matter what size, shape they are. If you were in my company and with this comment, I would have you reprimanded! To all who read I am sorry for this negative remarks made by this person. I applaud all of you who are willing to serve are country and thanks to the parents who support them.
<quoted text>
Who cares what you think??? First of all, my rank is well above your company grade mind set. Second, I can only be reprimanded by a General Officer.
Third, you clearly don't read much...yeah....things happen to all sizes shape etc. to people...that isn't my point. My intial point is parents aren't doing sh-t for their kids to better improved their overall physcially fitness. IF YOU had read you would of also see where I am blaming the school system for taking physcial fittness out of the school systems. By the way since you are in the "medical corp. what is the stat on soldiers dying in Basic Training? Did you bother to even what read I posted on the three deaths of the soldiers? Two died of natural causes and possible supplments taken.

Why don't you read before spewing medical corp crap.

Also, if it bothers you what I posted, then ignore it. It works for me.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#112 Oct 13, 2009
Military Mom wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh my goodness! Who cares if you got a silver star, I serve with soldiers whom who served over sea's and recieved awards. They don't even mention them because of all the destruction that have concurred. I want to know who you are, so I can look you up. For being a soldier of 27 years, I bet your not very well liked with your negative attitude. I have treated soldiers who have "problems" since the war, but they don't regret serving. As for most of us who thank our young soldier's for serving, however you should say a prayer for yourself and ask for forgiveness. I cannot believe you talk to people the way you do. I want your name!!
Sure...you can look me up...please do so. You might learn something. If you want stop on by the Pentagon, I might even given a free tour if my schedule allows. Second, I can post whatever I want when I want. Its a public post.
You are right...I don't talk to people about it face to face about what I have accomplished. I don't need too. I didn't join the military for medals. With you mention "company" it sound like you are a very young immature soldier that knows very little about the miltiary. Yes you are a SOLDIER. You serving??? Okay...you served but what did you do? Not to be little what you have done you probably sat in your little air condition medical building/tent on a FOB worrying about what flavor ice cream you are going to have or trying to find something to screw. Please spare me what you have done. Like you said, if you did all that you wouldn't discuss it...right?
drake

Alexandria, VA

#114 Oct 19, 2009
tanyahawke13 wrote:
the army was a joke never waste your time with that .
Are you speaking from expirence?
Winne P

Killeen, TX

#115 Oct 19, 2009
Sorry for the families of the soldiers. Always make me sad when hear such things. May they RIP...
the unknown

Fort Worth, TX

#116 Nov 2, 2009
drake wrote:
<quoted text> Huh? That is why they call it the military. What rock did you crawl from under? I am in the Army Reserves and have been for 27 years. I reviewed two to the deaths which two of the three kids were fat, unlike the kids from the 70's-80's era. There death played a role in there being over weight. This should be a lesson for parents to get thre kids in some sort of physcial fitness program since schools have failed to do it.
Second, the military is the military. If your son or daughter is capture what do you think will happen to them? The job of the military is the build them up mentally and physically. If you are so worried about your child maybe you shouldn't of signed the papers for them to join.
My husband is at basic training in for jackson and i was wondering where do you get off being such a butt to people that are wooried about their loved ones???? You are wrong and you shouldnt treat people like crap just because you are in the military. I dont know you but i feel sorry for the people that have to be around you. Maybe you should stop being such a butt and actually be nice to people because you dont know what they are going thou if that was one of your family members and or someone close to you then you would feel the same way and you know you would so the next time you think you are going to tell someone off and tell them they are stupid you should put your self in their shoes. and try to think about what they are going thou and stead of being so dang rude. just because you are in the military doesnt mean you can be a total butt head.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#117 Nov 3, 2009
the unknown wrote:
<quoted text>
My husband is at basic training in for jackson and i was wondering where do you get off being such a butt to people that are wooried about their loved ones???? You are wrong and you shouldnt treat people like crap just because you are in the military. I dont know you but i feel sorry for the people that have to be around you. Maybe you should stop being such a butt and actually be nice to people because you dont know what they are going thou if that was one of your family members and or someone close to you then you would feel the same way and you know you would so the next time you think you are going to tell someone off and tell them they are stupid you should put your self in their shoes. and try to think about what they are going thou and stead of being so dang rude. just because you are in the military doesnt mean you can be a total butt head.
Well...first of all, its obvious you don't read well or FAILED to read what I posted. Trust me, I am not suprised at all. I call it "selective reading skills". I only became an AZZ on this subject because the first thing people wanted to do was blame the Army for three deaths which the Army was cleared from by the State of SC of any wrong doing. Nobody even bother to research and find out the true facts until I posted what actually happen. Typical folks, knee jerk reaction; want to point a finger at what they think is a problem when the finger is pointed back at you. If you read what I posted, you would of read the report or article that discussed it but of course you are one of those guys spewing crap with no facts or no such knowledge.

The standards in the Army have been around a long time and thousands of soldiers have survived the rigerous challenge. All of sudden you have parents and jack-leg people claiming the Army is killing their kids. What a bunch of sh-t. Is your husband surviving Basic Training?

Yeah...I also stated that today's parents are breeding fat kids that sit around and play video games feeding them processed foods. That is a fact. Majority of the kids today between the ages of 8-15 are over weight, fat, and have little to no physically fitness in their daily activity. If you read what I posted, I blamed the parents and the school system (govt), but the parents have majority of the onus or developing their kids.

Finally, if you don't like what I post, simply ignore it. I think you are being an AZZ but guess what? Who cares....you are entitled to express your views even though you have no clue about what you posting.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#118 Nov 4, 2009
Here is some info to back up my arguement:
Army Times
Most U.S. youths unfit to serve, data show
By William H. McMichael - Staff writer
Posted : Wednesday Nov 4, 2009 5:57:41 EST
U.S. military-age youth are increasingly unfit to serve — mostly because they’re in such lousy shape.
According to the latest Pentagon figures, a full 35 percent, or more than one-third, of the roughly 31.2 million Americans aged 17 to 24 are unqualified for military service because of physical and medical issues. And, said Curt Gilroy, the Pentagon’s director of accessions,“the major component of this is obesity. We have an obesity crisis in the country. There’s no question about it.”
The Pentagon draws its data from the Centers for Disease Control, which regularly tracks obesity. The steadily rising trend is not good news for military recruiters, despite their recent successes, nor for the overall health of the U.S. population.
In 1987, according to the CDC, a mere 6 percent of 18- to 34-year-olds, or about 1 out of 20, were obese. In 2008, 22 years later, 23 percent of that age group — almost 1 out of 4 — was considered to be obese.
The CDC measures obesity by body mass index, a figure calculated from height and weight that is considered a reliable indicator of body fatness for most people. According to the CDC, the body mass index for a man standing 6 feet, 2 inches tall and weighing 170 pounds is 21.8; the normal range lies between 18.5 and 24.9. Below that range is considered underweight; a BMI of 25 to 29.9 is considered overweight. A person with a body mass index of 30 or greater is considered to be obese.
Obese individuals are at increased risk for a number of diseases and health conditions, including hypertension, Type 2 diabetes, coronary heart disease, stroke, some cancers and other problems, according to the CDC. In addition to those concerns, the military rejects obese recruits in part because so much extra weight likely couldn’t be dropped during the course of basic training — even if they could get through the entire program.
“Kids are just not able to do push-ups,” Gilroy said.“And they can’t do pull-ups. And they can’t run.”
The reasons are “almost common knowledge, Gilroy said — what he called “the couch potato syndrome” and the widespread elimination of scholastic physical fitness programs.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#119 Nov 4, 2009
CONT...

Mission: Readiness
In a study being released Thursday in Washington, Education Secretary Arne Duncan and a group of retired military officers led by former Army Gen. Wesley Clark will sound the alarm bells and call young Americans’ relative lack of overall fitness for military duty a national security threat. The group, Mission: Readiness, will release a report that draws on Pentagon data showing that 75 percent of the nation’s 17- to 24-year-olds are ineligible for service for a variety of reasons.
Put another way, only 4.7 million of the 31.2 million 17- to 24-year-olds in a 2007 survey are eligible to enlist, according to a periodic survey commissioned by the Pentagon. This group includes those who have scored in the top four categories on the Armed Forces Qualification Test, or AQFT; eligible college graduates; and qualified college students.
According to the Pentagon, the ineligible population breaks down this way:
•Medical/physical problems, 35 percent.
•Illegal drug use, 18 percent.
•Mental Category V (the lowest 10 percent of the population), 9 percent.
•Too many dependents under age 18, 6 percent.
•Criminal record, 5 percent.
Waivers
Some conditions or situations can be waivered or are periodically loosened by the services, as is the case with certain medical conditions, such as asthma. Waiverable examples include limited marijuana use and having too many dependents. For example, the Pentagon says a waiver is required when an applicant is married and has more than two dependents under 18, or is unmarried and has custody of any dependents under 18. Waiver policies vary depending on the needs of the service.
The group of potential enlistees is further slimmed by the “propensity to serve” among American youths, which social scientists say also is declining. According to Gilroy, research shows that about 12 percent of all U.S. military-eligible youth show an interest in military service.
The Pentagon just finished a record year for recruiting. Every active and reserve component met or exceeded both their numeric and quality recruiting goals for fiscal 2009. Each easily exceeded the Pentagon goal of having at least 90 percent of recruits be high school graduates, and having 60 percent or more score at or above the 50th percentile on the AFQT.
But the weak economy has helped, as has increased spending on recruiting. And given the ever-shrinking pool of potential candidates, concern grows. Bill Carr, undersecretary of defense for military personnel policy, says that to maintain the force, the military has to attract more than 15 percent of qualified young Americans.
The difference is, to some degree, made up through the use of waivers. About 1 in 5 recruits still requires a waiver of some sort to enter the service, with about two-thirds for conduct and one-third for medical issues, Carr said.
kati

Orlando, FL

#120 Nov 11, 2009
i was there when all 3 of these recruits died. and it had nothing to do with them being overweight. one kid fell out from heat exhaustion on the ten mile march, the put him in the one ton, didnt close the gates, he fell out and the trailer ran over his head, this is how he was killed. the 10 mile is the last thing for training, how can you disrespect him by saying hes overweight? another kid was running his last pt test to graduate, he told the drill sergeant he was to hot and needed to stop, the ds told him to just keep going, he passed his pt test and when he got back to teh barracks he passed out and died. hmm, he passed his pt test but hes overweight? and the third male died from h1n1. he was scared to tell the drill sergeants he was sick and when he finally wet to the dr it was too late. i was lucky i had great drill sergeants that cared about our health. they pushed us to our max and further but if we felt overheated or sick they made us do something about it.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#121 Nov 12, 2009
kati wrote:
i was there when all 3 of these recruits died. and it had nothing to do with them being overweight. one kid fell out from heat exhaustion on the ten mile march, the put him in the one ton, didnt close the gates, he fell out and the trailer ran over his head, this is how he was killed. the 10 mile is the last thing for training, how can you disrespect him by saying hes overweight? another kid was running his last pt test to graduate, he told the drill sergeant he was to hot and needed to stop, the ds told him to just keep going, he passed his pt test and when he got back to teh barracks he passed out and died. hmm, he passed his pt test but hes overweight? and the third male died from h1n1. he was scared to tell the drill sergeants he was sick and when he finally wet to the dr it was too late. i was lucky i had great drill sergeants that cared about our health. they pushed us to our max and further but if we felt overheated or sick they made us do something about it.
I know for a fact you couldn't of been there and talking out of the side of your mouth. Some time ago, I published a offical Govt and state report that stated the cause of death for the three soldiers. The State of SC declare that all three died of natural causes. NO FAULT OF the govt. Go ahead and go back and read what I posted some time ago. NONE OF THEM DIED OF H1N1. Go back and read the report. Better yet, I will post it again for you.

I made comments about soldiers being over weight and not being able to meet the military standards (on a different note). An article by CNN came out just last week that validates my point. 33% of the youth today between the ages of 17-27 are over weight. Those same over weight children in studies showed they had no or little physical fitness in their daily activities. Furthermore, if you had read what I posted, I also mentioned that the schools as well as the parents are responsible for these over weight kids. Schools have done away with phycial fitness in the schools.

As far as disrespecting the dead....you are entitled to say what you want to say. I challenge you to show me in any of my posting I have directly disrespected any of the soldiers that have died. Don't worry...I will wait for that response. In the mean time I will find my previous. Suggestion: Learn to read and stop making sh-t along the way.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#122 Nov 12, 2009
kati wrote:
i was there when all 3 of these recruits died. and it had nothing to do with them being overweight. one kid fell out from heat exhaustion on the ten mile march, the put him in the one ton, didnt close the gates, he fell out and the trailer ran over his head, this is how he was killed. the 10 mile is the last thing for training, how can you disrespect him by saying hes overweight? another kid was running his last pt test to graduate, he told the drill sergeant he was to hot and needed to stop, the ds told him to just keep going, he passed his pt test and when he got back to teh barracks he passed out and died. hmm, he passed his pt test but hes overweight? and the third male died from h1n1. he was scared to tell the drill sergeants he was sick and when he finally wet to the dr it was too late. i was lucky i had great drill sergeants that cared about our health. they pushed us to our max and further but if we felt overheated or sick they made us do something about it.
Here is the offical report. If you were their as you claimed you were you would of known they DID NOT die of Heat Exhaustion or H1N1. This report came from the State of SC. So, we know at this point, you have no clue what you are talking about. Second, you ASSSUMED they died of Heat Exhaustion and H1N1. In a final report on the third soldier posted in Nov 2008, they had mentioned the soldier had deitary supplements in his system. Soldiers are WARNED about dietary supplements and in the heat. Who's fault is that...the Army?? Hardly not!

"Two of the three died of natural causes -- an embolism and a brain hemorrhage, officials said. The third also appeared to have died of natural causes, although a final determination is pending."
On top of that, they are waiting on the toxicology reports which can take up to six to nine months.
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/11/army_tr ...
Airborne calvary

Modesto, CA

#123 Nov 12, 2009
Drake gives of the typical wrong impression of what the army was it's a new era and i would love to have your name rank and true place of origin don't hand me no b/s about the pentagon either you can be demoted and discharged for the way you are presenting yourself officers are trash and your probally a paper pusher nco I'm only 5-9 185 pnds but I deffinately will spar combatives with you. For an officer to talk about enlisted recruits or any enlisted at all is bull what war where you in desert storm? Bogus claim and not only could a general demote you he would probally throw your pathetic wrinkly old body in leavenworth what was your mos trust me don't go facts for facts with me cause you won't win and before you ask me whether or not I have been to bct obviously if any one is in the military they have so quit fronting I was a fat kid and now I'm leading the way. I'm sorry folks for his very narrow views if you have any future references ask me. Ps one of those fat kids was my cousin officer scum and he died from h1m1 so go ahead and run your stupid head hooah!! Airborne leads the way
drake

Alexandria, VA

#124 Nov 12, 2009
Airborne calvary wrote:
Drake gives of the typical wrong impression of what the army was it's a new era and i would love to have your name rank and true place of origin don't hand me no b/s about the pentagon either you can be demoted and discharged for the way you are presenting yourself officers are trash and your probally a paper pusher nco I'm only 5-9 185 pnds but I deffinately will spar combatives with you. For an officer to talk about enlisted recruits or any enlisted at all is bull what war where you in desert storm? Bogus claim and not only could a general demote you he would probally throw your pathetic wrinkly old body in leavenworth what was your mos trust me don't go facts for facts with me cause you won't win and before you ask me whether or not I have been to bct obviously if any one is in the military they have so quit fronting I was a fat kid and now I'm leading the way. I'm sorry folks for his very narrow views if you have any future references ask me. Ps one of those fat kids was my cousin officer scum and he died from h1m1 so go ahead and run your stupid head hooah!! Airborne leads the way
Let me help you out since you know nothing about being an Officer in the Army (of course) First, you can't spar combatives with me. Sorry, I am 6'4 235lbs. The only thing you are sparing with is your refrigrator. You alreaday showed that you don't know much about the Army. Nope...not an NCO, but I was enlisted up to 1986. I was even an E-5 and decided to go to college and while their get my get my commission.
Second, Officers can't be demoted, they are discharge for behavior unbecoming or general dishcarged. NOT DEMOTED! Please show me the regulation showing and office that gets demoted contining his/her service. I will wait for that response.
Please, spare me with the scare tactics about what you think. Third, time has chnged but the Army main core values don't change. Physical Fitness has always been one of its major core efforts. Since you want to spar combatives, why don't you enlight the group how we get our FAT kids in shape...Don't worry...I will wait for that response.
hat conflicts have I served? I am glad to answer that. I have serverd all starting with Operation just cause. I was not involved with Bosnia; ending with three tours in Iraq to this point. And I am sure I will have my time in the near futre in Afghan as a Senior Staff Officer.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#125 Nov 12, 2009
Cont...

Okay...Mr. lead the way...provided the proof that your cousin died from H1N1. I just provided you proof from the State medical exmainer what your cousin died of. None of them mention anything about H1N1. Okay...let's say your cousin did die from the H1N1 then that would prove my point...that death was UNRELATED to Army training. Thanks for validating my point. By the way...I am sorry to hear about your cousin and the other two that have died.
Finally, you obvious don't understand military laws etc. I am officer and I have the right to voice my opnion on a postings. It in no way represent the military. I am respresenting myself and myself only. So, it isn't against military law for a uniform soldier to post his/her thoughts unless I am respresenting the uniform OFFICIALLY. If so, please provide the specific paragraph line and article stating this. Don't worry...I will also wait for your respones to this as well. You claim to be Airborne...please don't give me that b/s about airborne. I am Airborne with one combat jump. I have over 77 jumps. How many do you have...maybe five? It's guys like you that want to argue "times has changed". Bullsh-t! Its guys like you believe gay people should serve but don't understand the ramifications that go with it. You just say it because it sounds fair.
Would you say the phyiscal requirement in Airborne school is to tough? If so, you are a p-ssy because the standards aren't tough. If a soldier is out of shape, he/she can die or cause death to others.
Finally, If you would like to meet, please let me know and I will be more than willing to greet you at the Pentagon front doors with a smile.
drake

Alexandria, VA

#126 Nov 12, 2009
Airborne calvary wrote:
Drake gives of the typical wrong impression of what the army was it's a new era and i would love to have your name rank and true place of origin don't hand me no b/s about the pentagon either you can be demoted and discharged for the way you are presenting yourself officers are trash and your probally a paper pusher nco I'm only 5-9 185 pnds but I deffinately will spar combatives with you. For an officer to talk about enlisted recruits or any enlisted at all is bull what war where you in desert storm? Bogus claim and not only could a general demote you he would probally throw your pathetic wrinkly old body in leavenworth what was your mos trust me don't go facts for facts with me cause you won't win and before you ask me whether or not I have been to bct obviously if any one is in the military they have so quit fronting I was a fat kid and now I'm leading the way. I'm sorry folks for his very narrow views if you have any future references ask me. Ps one of those fat kids was my cousin officer scum and he died from h1m1 so go ahead and run your stupid head hooah!! Airborne leads the way
BTW...its RANGERS LEAD THE WAY...NOT Airborne leads the way. Plus, I don't know of any Airborne Calvary. I am assuming you claim to be airborne but served with 1ST CAV.
Airborne calvary

United States

#127 Nov 12, 2009
You wanna call me a pssy and fat state your name and rank and I will gladly go pushup for push up with you don't open a can of worms you chairborne officers are the worst polluting this army airborne school was not hard when compared to ranger school or pathfinder school but if I wasn't physically and mentally fit it might have posed a problem I get what you are saying but don't you dare criticize peoples family that's crossing the line I highly doubt you are currently serving or work in the pentagon secondly in regards to are ds for the most part they are kinda taking on a stern father role to there whole platoon they care they just have short periods of time to get you war ready. But then you get people like drake the chairborne rangers who think they are the face of the army when it's the pvt and NCOs who do all the work while they do nothing don't say you do cause I have witnessed it myself and try and say something about me a graduate of airborne school pathfinder school with a Spartan patch actually it was a 315 so stuff it old man your a phoney stop reading stuff from military websites and get real be a because earlier you said you where a ds and now u say you where an e-5 well you can't be a ds at that rank so you got caught buddy And impersonating an officer is a pretty big ucmj violation so next time watch the way you talk hooah!! Airborne leads the way
Airborne calvary

United States

#128 Nov 12, 2009
I have a total of 23 jumps and 12 are combat jumps I am airborne when I enlisted I did so as a Calvary scout the I re upped and went to airborne school air assault and when i get done with my next tour I'm going to ranger school hooah!! And you are making the army look horrible it's what you do secondly I have a b/a in criminal justice and turned down OCS because I don't like coffee and desk work I like to be in the field like a real soldier does hooah!! Wow you were airborne so what I guarantee you do not have that many jumps and even if you did so what what major conflict have u jumped in how much blood actually dirtied up that pretty officer rank not near as much as me and my battles guarantee you that much hooah I'm glad warrant officers aren't as big grade a sacks of skin like u so stuff it hooah!!
kati

Orlando, FL

#129 Nov 12, 2009
How can you say i was not there? i got there august 5th 2009 and graduated oct 23rd 2009. and i never said the 1st kid died from heat exhaustion he fell out of a march from heat exhaustion and thats when he was put in the one ton and then ran over when he fell out of it. this was told to us by the drill sergeants. another kid that died from pneumonia and it was written about in the ft. jackson news paper along with the other kid that died during his pt test because he was over heated. i read about all of these deaths in the news papers that were on base when i would do my duty in the JSIIDS office. the drill sergeants also told us about them. we were forced to call home and tell our parents that we were fine because of the H1N1 virus. Our 1st sergeant said it was mandatory that we call home because it was made public that a person from another battalion died from H1N1. im explaining what i was told and what i read from when i was there. and i was there when all three of these deaths occured.
kati

Orlando, FL

#130 Nov 12, 2009
oh and yes there were a lot of people that were there the whole ten weeks and couldnt even come close to the requirments of the pt test which is ridiculous. females only have to do 13 pushups and if you cant do 13 pushups after 10 weeks of training, then theres a problem. but none of the deaths that occured had anything to do with thses kids being overweight. also, i dont understand why you are so rude when you write your comments. i wrote what i know because this is what we were all told by the news papers and the sergeants. i also have feet and hip fractures (i finished basic with both these injuries) and i heard drs and sergeants that worked in the hospitals talk about all 3 of these deaths.

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