Ingrown facial hair, cysts, multiple ...

Since: Jul 07

Saint Albans, UK

#81 Nov 5, 2007
I am an ex smoker, I gave up 5 years ago. I believe that anything like smoking, drinking etc that effects your immune system will obviously aggravate conditions like these more, I do not however think they are the cause.
I have tried dietry means to beat this condition as well and it did not work, but healthier eating will make your skin look and feel healthier in general so it is obviously going to help somewhat.
Jeff

Fort Walton Beach, FL

#82 Nov 25, 2007
Bill, I am 36 and your story sounds so painfully familiar. I have been battling this very same issue for 2-3 years now. Have you had any recent luck on improving this situation?
Jeff in Florida
Bill Riggs wrote:
I'm a 38 y.o. male and until two years ago, I never had the problem I'm constantly experiencing.
Habits since age 18: When I shave, I always done so dry, and usually with double and triple razors. I rarely shave all the way to the skin. Most often, I use my beard trimmer and get it close. I don't use lotion or pre/after shave. I've never trained my hair to grow in one direction by only shaving in one direction. Seems impossible to get all the hair doing it that way.
Two years ago, I got a couple of painful bumps on my chin, and noticed the hairs on the bumps were colorless (I have dark hair) so I plucked each one, and out came a nasty-looking, thickly coated hair with a light bulb. I then applied a slight amount of pressure to the bump, and out popped another hair...and then another hair. The last thing that came out resembled a pore, and blood filled inside that wormy pore (no blood was touchable with a finger - it was like the pore was push outward through itself), and then I plucked out that pore, and it didn't hurt.
This happened repeatedly and seriously for about 1.3 years, and at one point I had about 30 cysts. I kept thinking they'd go away eventually. Amazing how quickly time can pass... I decided not to shave for about 1 month, and everything seemed to get better, but I did have the random hair.
A few months ago, everything started happening all over again, and antibiotics (cyclocenic or something like that) did get rid of the swelling/bumps, but after the meds were done, everything came right back in a few days. I feel that the swelling is due to the body sending in the troops to dissolve the hair, and the meds were trying to eliminate the troops. Soon after I took the meds, my chest, neck and face broke out in tiny white pimples EVERYWHERE, and it's been 8 days since I stopped the meds and things are starting to calm down, but the cysts are still here.
I've also had problems where 3-6 hairs clump together in one hair follicle/pore, I eventually have to pull it out because it looks bizarre.
I just don't know what to do. One dermatologist had me using some lotion, saying my face was producing too much of something, and the other doctor was had no clue and just gave me some topical and oral meds.
Nothing is solving the problem.
Any help or insight is greatly appreciated.:)
Michael

Jackson, NJ

#83 Nov 25, 2007
I have had folliculitis for aleast 15 years I first had it on my scalp. I got rid of it by letting my hair go out and not shaving it. I been free of bumps on the back of my head for about 2 years, but all of a sudden I shaved my face with a close razor about a year ago and now I have them under my chin. Derms told me to grow out my facial hair for 30 days which I did and it got better. I then used a trimmer not completely shaving it but just trimming and they seem to have come back. A barber once told me that the vibration from the clipper irrates the hair? Not sure about that but would make sense in this case. But it seems I will have to try to grow out my facial hair again. I tried tins of medications and other things I believe the only way to cure it is to leave the hair alone and let it natural do it thing.
Paul

Vancouver, WA

#84 Nov 25, 2007
Chris...I am interested in how your "home therapy" is going. I too have this condition and I have found your thread tonight for the first time. I believe the exclusive reason for all of us getting this condition is an overactive immune system. I know that is the case for me. I have Crohn's disease and take an immune suppressant medication known as "Purinethol." What is happening in my case is my immune system is attacking my hair follicles and causing them to become inflamed. Most dermatologists will quickly dismiss this as folliculitis, prescribe some oral antibiotics and you are on your way. The antibiotics have little if any effect on the condition. I have seen many regarding the condition and most look at me like I have a "picking problem." It was my Gastrointestinal Specialist who told me that the immune system is responsible for the adverse reaction to your hair follicles in general. regardless of where on the body they reside. I have had my entire beard lasered. After ther first 6 sessions the hair just fell out. Having dealt with this condition for 10+ years I thought hope was on the horizon. Sadly the traumatic effect on my face caused the worst episode I have ever had. Lasting 5 months. I am not sure if Lasering is the right choice. I plan on finishing my lasering process, however, find myself worried that what happened last time may happen again. Anyway, there may not be any absolute fix for this problem but - I have found that keeping your face extremely clean will slow the manifestation of this disease. Many of us may find that we chronicaly touch our faces. According to my doctor this is what creates the bacteria in the pores that the immune system goes ballistic on. This creates this inflamed follicle. When we're pulling out this "coated hair" we've been talking about, this is actually the entire hair and the fair follicle that is completeley inflamed. When you are using the electrolysis process, you are immediatley deadening the follicle which makes it slide out very easily. When it is alive, it must be pryed out with tweezers or whatever. You may have the cheapest and easiest answer for many of us!! So I am very certain this is a side effect of an overactive immune system. If you look at other side effects of an overactive immune system this will really start to make sense. I hope this helps - Good luck to all.
FrenchGuy

Cincinnati, OH

#85 Nov 26, 2007
Ben, I have exactly the same problem since I started shaving (I am 40 yo). It was a nightmnare when I was in the Artmy or worked in finance because I could not shave and people were convinced the reason was that I was lax or neglectful. Now that I live in the US, it is not easy either because there is such as a culture of being 'clean shaven'. At work, I got nasty remarks and even a guy who gave me a razor and some shaving cream... When I mention pili multigemini and pili incarnati, people seem taken aback. The only way I found is to grow a beard, which is not my style at all but I have no choice.
Ben wrote:
I have had similar problems with ingrown hairs and multiple hairs since I started shaving. I am 28 now and just tonight I have pulled 15 or 20 "plugs" of hair each bright white, some with as many as 12 or 14 hairs per follicle(also with the white sheath around them). They seem to be fused together sometimes, but can be pulled apart with tweezers. Whenever I shave almost every hair becomes ingrown, and for weeks after I am left with a needle picking out the ends of my hair from under my skin waiting for everything to heal. I have resorted to using hair clippers to shave with. This gives me a constant "stubble look" whether or not it is in style. It does drasticly help with the ingrown hairs though, because they don't get shaven down below skin level. I highly recomend doing this if you have a job where you don't have to be clean shaven. The multiple hair follicles still persist, but they don't seem to get infected nearly as often as when I was shaving with a razor. I also still get a random ingrown hair, but again it is nothing like when I shave with a razor. I have contemplated having electrolisis but it is so expensive I haven't found room in my budget for it yet. Thank you all for all the coments, I know how you all feel. This is the first place I have seen anyone talk about this problem with any kind of intelligence. Everyone I have talked to before seems to think it is as simple as a problem with my shaving technique.
JCP

Lahaina, HI

#86 Nov 27, 2007
Thanks to all who have written previously. I have many of the same symptoms as many of you. It's a pity that dermatologists aren't themselves canvassing these discussion groups: it would certainly help them to see that the symptoms their patients are experiencing are not isolated or random, and might even contribute to an eventual treatment regime. I guess the best contribution I can make at this point is to accurately, systematically describe the symptoms and talk about treatments that have and have not worked, and try to present some hypotheses.

Part I

Symptoms:

The main symptom is the cyst or lesion. When I first began to get them, they were small, but within a couple of years they regularly involved significant swelling, often distending my face by about the volume of a golf ball. I agree that they usually center on hair follicles, most frequently on "pili multigemini", or follicles with multiple hairs. Sometimes there is purulent drainage. Frequently a focal follicle can be located and squeezed and a hair, or hairs, variously deformed, will emerge, along with puss and sebum. Sometimes a single, impossibly thick hair (6 or 7 hair-widths in diameter, thicker at the base) pops out, other times a number of tightly packed hairs, and sometimes just a mass of “hair-like” substance. Normally the hair or hairs come out packed with a hard white substance that appears to be hardened sebum. Many times, however, there is no surface focal point of the cyst, merely a hard cyst under the skin (a half inch to an inch in diameter) and a surrounding area of painfully swollen skin (for a total affected diameter of up to 2 inches). The cysts cause intense dull pain and discomfort. I was told by a dermatologist that the infection can, if left unattended, extend downward to the jawbone. When I first started experiencing the cysts, I would investigate different ways of “treating” them, including lancing them with a sterilized needle. This is not a good idea, as it only increasing the chance of complicating the infection.

In some ways, these are similar to pilar cysts. Pilar cysts are filled with semi-fluid keratin. Reports say that pilar cysts ‘can become infected,’ but in my experience the cysts or lesions that we are suffering are almost always infected, and infected and swollen tissue makes up the bulk of the lesion, rather than the liquid and hair that sometimes can be expressed from it.

Cysts virtually always appear in a sort of pentagram (think of the Superman symbol) with its bottom point above the Adam’s apple, its side points at the angles of the jawbone, and its upper points just below the sides of the lips. For me, the most intense region of cyst development is the area that would form the bottom corners of a goatee. I think it’s reasonable to assume that these areas are most common because they have the greatest number of pili multigemini. A negative result of this location is that the jawbone forces swollen tissue outward, so that the cysts can substantially distort the jaw line, which accentuates the appearance of deformation.

Symptoms seem to be aggravated by shaving and, to a lesser degree, trimming the beard. My own sense is that plucking, while effective in cutting down the initial infection time and intensity, may in the long-term cause more cysts. Likewise, any activity that negatively affects the body will also cause a greater likelihood for cysts: lack of sleep, caffeine or alcohol consumption, stress, anxiety, and dehydration all appear to increase the frequency and intensity of cysts.

(continued)
JCP

Lahaina, HI

#87 Nov 27, 2007
Part II

Symptoms seem to be aggravated by shaving and, to a lesser degree, trimming the beard. My own sense is that plucking, while effective in cutting down the initial infection time and intensity, may in the long-term cause more cysts. Likewise, any activity that negatively affects the body will also cause a greater likelihood for cysts: lack of sleep, caffeine or alcohol consumption, stress, anxiety, and dehydration all appear to increase the frequency and intensity of cysts.

The duration of the infection varies. Some cysts are self-limiting. Usually significant swelling occurs within hours of noticing a tiny area of tenderness. In my case, the infection proper usually lasts between a week and a month, depending on what treatments I use to “knock down” the cyst. I imagine, with no treatment at all, some cysts could last much longer. A nodule of scar tissue and/or remnants of the infected material will remain for months after the infection itself has ended. The most serious cysts leave permanent nodules of scar tissue under the skin, or on its surface if the infection reaches it. Expressing the pus, sebum, and hair, in my experience, shortens the course of the cyst, the healing time, and the scarring.

Onset:

One of the strange things about this disease is that it becomes evident in the middle twenties (at least in my case and several of the other posters). It’s possible that this is related to additive increases in testosterone or other hormones, whereby hair or sebum production, or both, reach some threshold at which point occlusion and infection begin.

Treatment

Once the cyst has emerged, abandon ye all hope. Haha. Well, not quite. Nonetheless, treating the cyst itself is not a very encouraging activity. Topical antibiotics are completely ineffective. Corticosteroids can reduce swelling. I use clobetasol propionate to reduce swelling and shorten the course of infection. It is a very strong topical corticosteroid, however, and may break down fats in the skin, cause birth defects, etc, so use at your own risk. In my experience, however, it is the only effective treatment once the infection has begun. I have been told that holding a hot compress to the face will increase blood-flow and open pores, which may be useful both in combating and preventing cysts. I haven’t found it very effective, though it’s always nice to stand in a hot shower with a hot towel on your face.

I think all sufferers are ultimately interested in preventive treatments. I have used coal tar cream recently (for reasons I will explain below), which does not lower the incidence of cysts, but definitely lessens their seriousness when they do appear. I am still in the process of assessing the effectiveness of coal tar products.

By far the most effective preventive treatment is neither to shave nor trim the beard, and to wash it vigorously with antibacterial soap (dial, etc.) as frequently as possible. It takes a while to figure out how frequently you can wash without over-drying the skin beneath the beard. But even this “treatment” will only decrease, rather than eliminate, the appearance of cysts. Furthermore, if the disease is related to sebum production, drying the skin out with soap will only increase the problem in the long-term.

(cont)
JCP

Lahaina, HI

#88 Nov 27, 2007
Thanks to all who have written previously. I have many of the same symptoms as many of you. It's a pity that dermatologists aren't themselves canvassing these discussion groups: it would certainly help them to see that the symptoms their patients are experiencing are not isolated or random, and might even contribute to an eventual treatment regime. I guess the best contribution I can make at this point is to accurately, systematically describe the symptoms and talk about treatments that have and have not worked, and try to present some hypotheses.

Part I

Symptoms:

The main symptom is the cyst or lesion. When I first began to get them, they were small, but within a couple of years they regularly involved significant swelling, often distending my face by about the volume of a golf ball. I agree that they usually center on hair follicles, most frequently on "pili multigemini", or follicles with multiple hairs. Sometimes there is purulent drainage. Frequently a focal follicle can be located and squeezed and a hair, or hairs, variously deformed, will emerge, along with puss and sebum. Sometimes a single, impossibly thick hair (6 or 7 hair-widths in diameter, thicker at the base) pops out, other times a number of tightly packed hairs, and sometimes just a mass of “hair-like” substance. Normally the hair or hairs come out packed with a hard white substance that appears to be hardened sebum. Many times, however, there is no surface focal point of the cyst, merely a hard cyst under the skin (a half inch to an inch in diameter) and a surrounding area of painfully swollen skin (for a total affected diameter of up to 2 inches). The cysts cause intense dull pain and discomfort. I was told by a dermatologist that the infection can, if left unattended, extend downward to the jawbone. When I first started experiencing the cysts, I would investigate different ways of “treating” them, including lancing them with a sterilized needle. This is not a good idea, as it only increasing the chance of complicating the infection.

In some ways, these are similar to pilar cysts. Pilar cysts are filled with semi-fluid keratin. Reports say that pilar cysts ‘can become infected,’ but in my experience the cysts or lesions that we are suffering are almost always infected, and infected and swollen tissue makes up the bulk of the lesion, rather than the liquid and hair that sometimes can be expressed from it.

Cysts virtually always appear in a sort of pentagram (think of the Superman symbol) with its bottom point above the Adam’s apple, its side points at the angles of the jawbone, and its upper points just below the sides of the lips. For me, the most intense region of cyst development is the area that would form the bottom corners of a goatee. I think it’s reasonable to assume that these areas are most common because they have the greatest number of pili multigemini. A negative result of this location is that the jawbone forces swollen tissue outward, so that the cysts can substantially distort the jaw line, which accentuates the appearance of deformation.
JCP

Lahaina, HI

#89 Nov 28, 2007
Part III (I posted Part I twice, sorry)

Discussion

Unfortunately, most physicians these days are just anti-bioticians, prescribing broad-spectrum antibiotics with very little attention to symptoms. This is a disease, however, for which antibiotics are not particularly useful. There may be antibiotics that treat the infection, but the infection itself is clearly only a symptom of a more fundamental cause. Which begs the question: is the disease viral, bacterial, fungal, hormonal, parasitic (demodex), or does it simply reflect a mechanical defect related to hair production?

I’ve thought through dozens of explanations. I’ve tried to figure out what changed at the time of onset (I had a girlfriend who used to tweeze out my compound hairs when she got bored, I got my first dog (canine transmission?), etc.). The conclusion at which I’ve finally settled is that all the strange hypotheses aren’t effective in explaining the disease. My own thinking now is that the fundamental cause of the disease is related to the follicle, as both the location of sebaceous glands and the hair shaft. Thicker hairs have more associated sebaceous glands, and in follicles with multiple hairs, each hair has its own associated sebaceous glands, so that pili multigemini may be packed with sebaceous glands. My own guess is that the disease originates at the nexus between the overproduction of sebum and the raw obstruction of the follicle by multiple or deformed hair shafts. Hair and sebum may plug up the follicle, or an ingrown hair might obstruct it, and then the sebum itself (fat and organic debris) becomes infected. Sebum production increases with androgen and, as I remember, with various stress-related hormones. This may explain, in part, why the formation of these cysts responds to stress, lack of sleep, etc.

The only treatment that would deal with both sebum and hair growth would be laser hair removal. As I understand it, laser hair removal destroys or damages both the hair follicle and the sebaceous gland (which is why lasers can be used to treat acne). Lasers also may kill the bacteria causing the infection. On the other hand, electrolysis is still far more effective at removing hair, so if the origin of the disease is primarily hair-related rather than sebum-, electrolysis would still be the better option. It seems like some of the posters are utilizing laser treatment, while others are using electrolysis. It would be interesting to compare notes and see which of the two treatment regimes is more effective.

Finally, it’s possible that this is a fungal infection. I’m going to look into tinea barbae, or ringworm of the beard (maybe it was the dog after all). While anthropophilic dermatphytes usually cause the normal pustules and papules associated with ringworm, zoophilic varieties (acquired from animals) cause deep, pustular infection and inflammation (for photo, see: http://www.lib.uiowa.edu/hardin/md/pictures22... ). It can only be treated with systemic antifungals, ideally 250mg daily of terbinafine (lamisil) in tablet form. This would explain why the cysts do not respond to antibiotics. If anyone can get a dermatologist to prescribe an antifungal, let us know if it is effective.

Anyhow, hope that’s helpful and I am certainly interested in your reports of symptoms, treatments, and hypotheses.
Paul

Vancouver, WA

#90 Nov 28, 2007
Wow - JCP Great Documentary. Your picture is scary. Is that the future? Jeez. Is anyone looking that bad? I think the fungal approach is a great idea. These hair shafts have the appearance of a fungus anyway. Topical antibiotics for me are just not effective. Keep us in the loop :>
The Phil

Nashville, TN

#91 Dec 3, 2007
If I let my beard grow for a week, some hairs start to hurt, and I pick at them and pull them out. Eventually, I lose my mustache, the later my goatee become so sparse, I shave it.

Som hairs I pull are not the culprits, they are just nearby. I do not feel that it is a nervous condition, because when I get the hair that hurts, I know I got that hair.

I think the my body is rejecting the hair because:
IT is very thick and is poking me like a needle OR, my body is rejecting it because it is growing down into my skin, rather than out into the world, OR perhaps there is some fungus causing the hair to die and get hard under the skin.

The hair, if plucked, will have a rice-like bulb on the end (one that especially hurt may be followed with a small bit of blood that is gone moments later, like nothing happened). Usually the hair has stopped growing (and may be stunted in comparison to other hairs, but sometimes the hair will be quite long down below the surface.

I think the body rejecting it could be due to the immune system rejecting the hair as foreign (whether due to fungus or it just being so thick and sharp, that it is like a needle --or a foreign object). Shaving seems to solve he problem, but why? Is it becuase it never gets long enough to feel like a pin, OR does shaving help keeps the fungus at bay (something like white piedra affecting beard hair only?)

Also, being well hydrated seems to lessen the possbility that the hair(s) will "get hard" or grow down, instead of out. Exfoliating also seems to help the hairs grow out, but again, if this is a fungus problem, perhaps it inhibits the fungus.

In contrast, soft hairs, even if thick, seem to be subtle, and usually have no "rice" at the end. Is something speeding up the death cycle of the hair?

Also, I have the problem in my beard, usually starting under my nose, then around my mouth. Sometimes it happen in my sideburns (which I usually have), and to a lesser extent, pubic hairs (which I may also pull out).

What I am describing is diferent from the cyst problem, or tree-trunk problems some other have describe.
David

Arvada, CO

#92 Dec 13, 2007
Vitamin E helps a ton. Make sure to get higher I.U. geltabs so that it is easier to spread.(Just simply prick the tab with a pin and then squeeze.)
Most likely what is happening to your skin is that it is not very porous, and the hairs are having a hard time to "push out" through your skin, thereby creating "pili multigemini." If after using the vitamin E for a month, you do not see a rapid response (mine was within 3 days, and I was having about 3-5 multiples at a time appear), try Lanolin. It does smell funny, but it is very moisturizing. I recommend the Lansinoh brand because it is 100% pure, so allergic reactions and contamination are minimal.
I really hopes this helps the others on this board, because I was quite scared when I started getting them.
Our skin is arguable the most important organ in the body, and needs to be taken care of. So many products (especially facial - think aftershave for instance) contain alcohol which robs our skin of it's natural function - to remain living- think about it: can you a.)drink water or b.) drink rubbing (isopropyl) alcohol?
if you said a.) then you understand basic human body technology.
alcohol is man-made and is inherently rejected by the body. No wonder it helps to destroy the skin thereby reducing acne, but not fixing the root of the problem, what's causing the infection.
Paul from Portland makes some excellent points, as does Tanmai Saksena of Gharapuri, India (minus the alcohol)
Sorry for the rambling.
In review. keep skin porous. drink water. shave carefully and patiently.
Chris

United States

#93 Dec 14, 2007
Ok, people asked for an update so here goes....while I posted earlier about the home electrolysis unit working, it still does, but my enthusiasm on it has dimmed. On areas with very deep infections where "those hairs" can be felt and are WAY down in the skin, this unit will not help with those. Anything about 0-1/8" down, well, this unit works great for. I have used it on troubled areas and it has lessened the swelling and appearance of these areas but truly hasn't "gotten at the root" of the problem. Pun intended. So, I am continuing a twice a week regiment of home electrolysis, but it is slow going and in one hour I can probably only kill 10-40 beard hairs. If you rush through it, you just end up plucking and the hair grows back. You have to be patient and take your time and wait for the current to kill the hair. I personally believe that for all the time and trouble I'm taking I'd probably have better and wider spread results by going to an electrolysist and just having several sessions with that person in goatee and chin or jawline targeted areas.
Chris

United States

#94 Dec 14, 2007
JCP,
Your thoughts about the whole thing sum up pretty much everything I have suffered thru the past 10 years. The only thing I am not sure I agree that you said is the whole fungal argument. I really have no idea why I disagree with this, other than I just don't think its fungal.

As for the picture, my issues are not THAT bad. I'd have to guess my issues are 50-70 percent less severe than that image, but still, I've got minor swelling, open wounds from picking out the "sheathed hairs" (when I can get them), wounds that never heal no matter how much neosporin or triple antibiotic you put on them, scarring, mild facial pain in scarred areas, etc etc etc.
Chris

United States

#95 Dec 14, 2007
David,
I agree with your assessment that your skin being porous would help the situation. I have thought of this myself, often, and that was the essence of me saying over and over on past posts to exfoliate as much as possible. As JCP said, if the hairs do not exit the body correctly it can cause the infections and the body to turn on itself. Sidenote: JCP, I've always thought my immune system was weak as I'd get 3-4 colds per year where my wife would only get 1-3. I wonder if the activity of the immune system fighting my own hairs compromises the rest of my body's defense for fighting off other more valid threats. That HAS to make sense somehow I would think.
Anyway, back to the hair not exiting....David I think you misspoke somewhat. The hair not exiting correctly doesn't CAUSE the pili multigemini. The PM is a condition that is already existing, open pores or not, cause from what I have read on it, is simply is a genetic trait. So, if you have pores that are clogged, closed, etc coupled with the PM, you have the basis of a war ground for this issue.
One question I have about the pores would be this. How many of you out there have done the Accutane approach. In previous posts, I have mentioned that I have done it, and with success during the periods on the meds, but once over the situation never got better. To be honest I feel that the situation is now worse after the Accutane. I was told by my doctor that the Accutane would not only shrink and kill many of the sebaceous glands at the top/middle of the pore but would also shrink the size of the pores too. Can anyone confirm this? Cause if so, then oh crap, I probably just worsened my condition...PM coupled with smaller pores? Now the hairs REALLY can't get out!!!!
Chris

United States

#96 Dec 14, 2007
I plan on hitting up my dermatologist one more time with all the thoughts on this thread, even though the past 5 years I've been seeing him he's been no help whatsoever. He just keeps prescribing antibiotics and benzaclin as he thinks my issues are acne related - even though the better dermatologist he referred me to did conclude it was a follicular issue.

Heck, I may even let him read the whole thing, assuming he'd want to. My only real goal is to get him to agree with my own assessments/self diagnosis at this point and have him suggest a plan of attack. Seeing that he owns a laser, I'm sure he'll suggest that, but seeing that I've already had 4 or 5 treatments with the laser, I'm not going back to that. My hair grew back. I think, from what I have shared earlier and researched, that lasering hair really isn't permanent for many and electrolysis is more permanent. So that would be the way I'm leaning. I also hope he would be able to prescribe some items that would help in the meantime in regards to swelling reduction and infection fighting, but my hopes aren't too high there's much he can give me other than a round of steroids or more antibiotics.

I will also say that I have been re-experimenting with retin-A lately. I've got a couple tubes leftover from earlier "tries" and extended use of it is helping mildly. It is exfoliating the problem areas and softening the skin in areas where I reapply daily. The softening of the skin is helping the hairs to grow through, so I am wondering if a daily regiment of retin-A over the entire beard area, not just the problem areas would help. I will be asking my derm this question too. Stay tuned for more info on this.

Andlark, I'd love to know how your professional electrolysis regiment is going.
Chris

United States

#97 Dec 14, 2007
David,
Just so I understand you right, what exactly are you doing in regards to the vitamin E? Are you putting vitamin E enriched lotions on your face? Or are you putting vitamin E "meant for ingestion" liquids from liqui-caps on your face or what? Sorry to be dense. I'm not up on my vitamin E's for the face. Please better describe what you were mentioning and what your results have been with this. Thanks!
David

Arvada, CO

#98 Dec 14, 2007
Chris wrote:
David,
Just so I understand you right, what exactly are you doing in regards to the vitamin E? Are you putting vitamin E enriched lotions on your face? Or are you putting vitamin E "meant for ingestion" liquids from liqui-caps on your face or what? Sorry to be dense. I'm not up on my vitamin E's for the face. Please better describe what you were mentioning and what your results have been with this. Thanks!
vitamin E "meant for ingestion" - gel tabs. it is the most pure form of the substance :) My results have been much softer skin, my stubble feels thinner and spreads more evenly now. the ingrown and PM are becoming a thing of the past. the patches of bald spots are disappearing at a normal hair growth pace.

as far as PM goes, I read on a couple of UK journals that mentioned the term Pili multigemini means several hairs combined, and not a specific condition - genetic or infected. I'm no doctor and could be wrong.
Chris

United States

#99 Dec 15, 2007
David,
I'll give rubbing the geltab liquid on my face for a couple weeks and see what happens...probably couldn't hurt to digest the extra E as well....

As for the PM thing, you mentioned the hairs are having a hard time pushing out of the facial skin therefore causing the PM. My point was that the PM was already there whether your skin was soft or hard...you either have PM or you don't, and if you do AND the hairs have a hard time pushing out THEN you get the problems we're all facing. You are right though that it means several hairs eminating from one follicle.

Oh, I'm not a doctor either :) nor a dermatologist, but they haven't helped me very much anyway.....
Chris

United States

#100 Dec 17, 2007
Some more thoughts while thinking about this whole issue. While I have been more negative towards laser therapy in the past, simply because I've had 4 or 5 treatments and the hair removal wasn't permanent, as I think back about my results, temporarily, they were good. Swollen areas subsided, some hair was temporarily killed/removed, and the "bad" areas flattened out nicely and my complexion was clear for a week or two. Of course I was looking for permanence, hence me now on my electrolyis kick, of which really is taking a lot of my time in front of a mirror. But I am wondering if I could live with temporary results like I had with the laser therapy. My issue is simply paying for all the laser treatments, which would cause me to go broke, hence me finding this....

http://reviews.ebay.ca/Epila-Laser-Hair-Remov...

I'm going to give it a shot and review it here. Stay tuned!
If anyone else has used this device or similar, let us know!

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