Church Leaders Vow Political Backlash if Gay Marriage Passes

Jan 7, 2013 Full story: NBC Chicago 17,568

Leaders of several Chicago-area African American churches on Monday urged state lawmakers to vote against pending legislation that would allow same-sex marriage in Illinois.

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Since: Jun 11

AOL

#1874 Jan 24, 2013
"An unjust law is a code that a majority inflicts on a minority that is not binding on itself. This is difference made legal. On the other hand a just law is a code that a majority compels a minority to follow that it is willing to follow itself. This is sameness made legal."
MLK

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#1875 Jan 24, 2013
"All, too, will bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will to be rightful must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal law must protect, and to violate would be oppression." - Thomas Jefferson

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#1877 Jan 24, 2013
"it is instructive to recall in this regard that the traditional, well-established legal rules and practices of our not-so-distant past (1) barred interracial marriage,(2) upheld the routine exclusion of women from many occupations and official duties, and (3) considered the relegation of racial minorities to separate and assertedly equivalent public facilities and institutions as constitutionally equal treatment." ""If we have learned anything from the significant evolution in the prevailing societal views and official policies toward members of minority races and toward women over the past half-century, it is that even the most familiar and generally accepted of social practices and traditions often mask unfairness and inequality that frequently is not recognized or appreciated by those not directly harmed by those practices or traditions."

"Conventional understanding of marriage must yield to a more contemporary appreciation of the rights entitled to constitutional protection. Interpreting our state constitutional provisions in accordance with firmly established equal protection principles leads inevitably to the conclusion that gay persons are entitled to marry the otherwise qualified same sex partner of their choice." "To decide otherwise would require us to apply one set of constitutional principles to gay persons and another to all others." In re Marriage

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#1878 Jan 24, 2013
Sexual orientation is not a behavior or choice but rather an enduring pattern of emotional, romantic, and physical attraction. While forming a lifelong marriage relationship based on mutual love and respect is not harmful to anyone, it is often compared to behaviors that do cause clear and direct harm to an unwilling victim.

Yet even people convicted of child abuse, prostitution, rape, spousal abuse, and other crimes against unwilling victims are still allowed the fundamental right of marriage, even while locked up in prison. The gay law enforcement people who protect us from dangerous criminals are not afforded the same legal rights guaranteed to those convicted criminals.
Jane Dodo

Hoboken, NJ

#1879 Jan 25, 2013
Bill wrote:
<quoted text>So do you think others who base their lives on sin should be considered minorities who merit discriminatory special benefits and protections, like adulterers, drunks, child molesters, whores, etc., or just those who choose to define their lives by engaging in the God-forbidden unspeakable acts that alone define and identify homosexual?
Unspeakable acts? Like typing with one hand? We know what you're up to, David. Found any new ads on your page lately?
Deja vu all over Again

Alpharetta, GA

#1880 Jan 25, 2013
Bill wrote:
<quoted text>So do you think others who base their lives on sin should be considered minorities who merit discriminatory special benefits and protections, like adulterers, drunks, child molesters, whores, etc., or just those who choose to define their lives by engaging in the God-forbidden unspeakable acts that alone define and identify homosexual?
Religious superstition is voluntary; including yours
.
Sex orientation is not voluntary; including yours

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#1882 Jan 25, 2013
"If Jesus ever said anything about homosexuality, it is not recorded in the Bible, even mistranslated. He did, however, speak extensively on God's unconditional love. Yet instead of dwelling on biblical love, Christians have historically been more concerned with obscure passages of Levitical cleanliness codes and Paul's misunderstood comments in Romans. Instead of focusing on the incredible injustice and hatred demonstrated by Christians and others, tying to deny homosexuals even basic civil rights, people appear more concerned with the specific homosexual acts between consenting adults who are naturally have a homosexual orientation. As James B. Nelson notes, the Bible more clearly advocates a "love ethic" rather than a "sex ethic."

I Cor 6:9, no way refers to homosexuality. The original Greek word often quoted as sexual immorality, Paul used was "porneia" which means "a harlot for hire". In Corinth in the temples of Venus, the principal deity of Corinth, where Christians went to worship, a thousand public prostitutes were kept at public expense to glorify and act as surrogates for the fertility Gods. This sex with the pagan Gods is what Paul was talking about - fornication is an admitted mistranslation and has nothing to do with gays or singles sex. This rendering reflected the bias of the translators rather than an accurate translation of Paul's words to a culture of 2000 years ago worshipping pagan sex gods.

Romans 1:26-27 mentions homosexual acts performed by people who are clearly described as heterosexual. The men in the NT patriarchal culture exerted dominance not only over women, but over younger males as well. The nature of homosexual acts in the Bible are so very different from what we know as homosexuality today that the passages have no application to today's homosexuality. Such practices as in NT times simply no longer exist. Alleged references to homosexuality in I Corinthians and I Timothy are the inventions of anti-gay translators. They are not in the original Greek texts." (Rev.Dr. Mel White)

The word "homosexual" wasn't even invented until 1869. When you see it in the bible, you know it is a modern mistranslation and misinterpretation of the original texts.

"What the Bible forbids is acts of lust, rape, idolatry, violation of religious purity obligations, or pederasty, but no condemnation of homosexuality in relationships of mutual respect and love. "On the other hand, the Bible pointedly celebrates instances of same-sex emotional intimacy, a fact often overlooked by fearful homophobic readers." James B. Nelson, Professor of Christian Ethics, United Theological Seminary

Yet Jesus told us:

John 13:34: A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

John 15:12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.

John 15:17: This is my command: Love each other.

Matthew 7:1: "Do not judge, or you too will be judged.

Luke 6:37: "Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

Matthew 7:12: So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

Meanwhile, the irrational prejudice promoted by some who claim to be Christians, continues to cause needless suffering and death, here and around the world.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#1883 Jan 25, 2013
nhjeff wrote:
<quoted text>
Frankly, I don't think God cares one way or the other about homosexual activity. He doesn't even care whether we love one another or we destroy one another. But Jesus did walk the earth to bring the message that man is better off when he loves fellow man and the world around him.
I also don't think your Bible has any more to do with God than Homer's Ulysses. I only try to point out that there are very different readings than the ones you insist on, as there are in any profound literature. And I try to point out some of the history and subtleties that most people seem to miss.
so, you don't believe in God, but you believe in Jesus?

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#1884 Jan 25, 2013
Not Yet Equal wrote:
"The conservative movement, to which I subscribe, has as one of its basic tenets the belief that government should stay out of people’s private lives. Government governs best when it governs least - and stays out of the impossible task of legislating morality. But legislating someone’s version of morality is exactly what we do by perpetuating discrimination against gays." (Conservative Icon, WW2 hero, former AZ Senator and Republican Presidential candidate Barry Goldwater, 1993)
Changing law to create same sex marriage where culture and the consent of the governed isn't governing least. Keeping marriage as is, between one man and one woman is governing least; changing the definition of marriage to make it unisex, a gender segregated version of marriage is radical change. The left promotes equality; same sex marriage is ersatz equality where nature dictates male and female differences.

A Constitutional amendment to support DOMA; imagine if more democrats received family support thanks to a new definition of marriage, a new way to spend taxpayer's cash.

Be very careful spending tax money on same sex dependent beneficiaries. Who knows where it could end?

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#1885 Jan 25, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>Changing law to create same sex marriage where culture and the consent of the governed isn't governing least. Keeping marriage as is, between one man and one woman is governing least; changing the definition of marriage to make it unisex, a gender segregated version of marriage is radical change. The left promotes equality; same sex marriage is ersatz equality where nature dictates male and female differences.
A Constitutional amendment to support DOMA; imagine if more democrats received family support thanks to a new definition of marriage, a new way to spend taxpayer's cash.
Be very careful spending tax money on same sex dependent beneficiaries. Who knows where it could end?
Poor you. It's all happening and you can't stop it.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#1886 Jan 25, 2013
Not Yet Equal wrote:
"If Jesus ever said anything about homosexuality, it is not recorded in the Bible, even mistranslated. He did, however, speak extensively on God's unconditional love. Yet instead of dwelling on biblical love, Christians have historically been more concerned with obscure passages of Levitical cleanliness codes and Paul's misunderstood comments in Romans. Instead of focusing on the incredible injustice and hatred demonstrated by Christians and others, tying to deny homosexuals even basic civil rights, people appear more concerned with the specific homosexual acts between consenting adults who are naturally have a homosexual orientation. As James B. Nelson notes, the Bible more clearly advocates a "love ethic" rather than a "sex ethic."
I Cor 6:9, no way refers to homosexuality. The original Greek word often quoted as sexual immorality, Paul used was "porneia" which means "a harlot for hire". In Corinth in the temples of Venus, the principal deity of Corinth, where Christians went to worship, a thousand public prostitutes were kept at public expense to glorify and act as surrogates for the fertility Gods. This sex with the pagan Gods is what Paul was talking about - fornication is an admitted mistranslation and has nothing to do with gays or singles sex. This rendering reflected the bias of the translators rather than an accurate translation of Paul's words to a culture of 2000 years ago worshipping pagan sex gods.
Romans 1:26-27 mentions homosexual acts performed by people who are clearly described as heterosexual. The men in the NT patriarchal culture exerted dominance not only over women, but over younger males as well. The nature of homosexual acts in the Bible are so very different from what we know as homosexuality today that the passages have no application to today's homosexuality. Such practices as in NT times simply no longer exist. Alleged references to homosexuality in I Corinthians and I Timothy are the inventions of anti-gay translators. They are not in the original Greek texts." (Rev.Dr. Mel White)
The word "homosexual" wasn't even invented until 1869. When you see it in the bible, you know it is a modern mistranslation and misinterpretation of the original texts.
"What the Bible forbids is acts of lust, rape, idolatry, violation of religious purity obligations, or pederasty, but no condemnation of homosexuality in relationships of mutual respect and love. "On the other hand, the Bible pointedly celebrates instances of same-sex emotional intimacy, a fact often overlooked by fearful homophobic readers." James B. Nelson, Professor of Christian Ethics, United Theological Seminary
Yet Jesus told us:
John 13:34: A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.
John 15:12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.
John 15:17: This is my command: Love each other.
Matthew 7:1: "Do not judge, or you too will be judged.
Luke 6:37: "Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.
Matthew 7:12: So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.
Meanwhile, the irrational prejudice promoted by some who claim to be Christians, continues to cause needless suffering and death, here and around the world.
not wanting to edit your post so that it would be possible to reply, i will reply directly below this repost of your post.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#1887 Jan 25, 2013
the "rev dr mel white", seriously?

apparently modern scholars either do not all agree or at least they don't all agree with you.

"I Cor 6:9, no way refers to homosexuality."
The latest version of the popular NIV Bible translation has had its verses on homosexuality reworded, making them clearer in denouncing the practice, a theologian who helped with the translation says.
These clarifications include the verse in 1 Corinthians 6:9, where the 1984 NIV version uses the phrase “homosexual offenders,” while the 2011 translation changes the phrase to "men who have sex with men."

"Romans 1:26-27 mentions homosexual acts performed by people who are clearly described as heterosexual. The men in the NT patriarchal culture exerted dominance not only over women, but over younger males as well. The nature of homosexual acts in the Bible are so very different from what we know as homosexuality today that the passages have no application to today's homosexuality. Such practices as in NT times simply no longer exist."

are you saying that there are no more homosexual men who "exert dominance" over younger males?

so the new niv puts it this way;
In Romans 1:26, the verse “even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones,” was changed to,“even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones.”

and we have to love your "obscure passages of Levitical cleanliness" comment. who was obscuring them?
Leviticus 18:22, the verse “Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman,” was changed to,“Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman.”
Read more at http://www.christianpost.com/news/latest-niv-...
barry

Rainsville, AL

#1888 Jan 25, 2013
Not Yet Equal wrote:
"If Jesus ever said anything about homosexuality, it is not recorded in the Bible, even mistranslated. He did, however, speak extensively on God's unconditional love. Yet instead of dwelling on biblical love, Christians have historically been more concerned with obscure passages of Levitical cleanliness codes and Paul's misunderstood comments in Romans. Instead of focusing on the incredible injustice and hatred demonstrated by Christians and others, tying to deny homosexuals even basic civil rights, people appear more concerned with the specific homosexual acts between consenting adults who are naturally have a homosexual orientation. As James B. Nelson notes, the Bible more clearly advocates a "love ethic" rather than a "sex ethic."
I Cor 6:9, no way refers to homosexuality. The original Greek word often quoted as sexual immorality, Paul used was "porneia" which means "a harlot for hire". In Corinth in the temples of Venus, the principal deity of Corinth, where Christians went to worship, a thousand public prostitutes were kept at public expense to glorify and act as surrogates for the fertility Gods. This sex with the pagan Gods is what Paul was talking about - fornication is an admitted mistranslation and has nothing to do with gays or singles sex. This rendering reflected the bias of the translators rather than an accurate translation of Paul's words to a culture of 2000 years ago worshipping pagan sex gods.
Romans 1:26-27 mentions homosexual acts performed by people who are clearly described as heterosexual. The men in the NT patriarchal culture exerted dominance not only over women, but over younger males as well. The nature of homosexual acts in the Bible are so very different from what we know as homosexuality today that the passages have no application to today's homosexuality. Such practices as in NT times simply no longer exist. Alleged references to homosexuality in I Corinthians and I Timothy are the inventions of anti-gay translators. They are not in the original Greek texts." (Rev.Dr. Mel White)
The word "homosexual" wasn't even invented until 1869. When you see it in the bible, you know it is a modern mistranslation and misinterpretation of the original texts.
"What the Bible forbids is acts of lust, rape, idolatry, violation of religious purity obligations, or pederasty, but no condemnation of homosexuality in relationships of mutual respect and love. "On the other hand, the Bible pointedly celebrates instances of same-sex emotional intimacy, a fact often overlooked by fearful homophobic readers." James B. Nelson, Professor of Christian Ethics, United Theological Seminary
Yet Jesus told us:
John 13:34: A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.
John 15:12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.
John 15:17: This is my command: Love each other.
Matthew 7:1: "Do not judge, or you too will be judged.
Luke 6:37: "Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.
Matthew 7:12: So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.
Meanwhile, the irrational prejudice promoted by some who claim to be Christians, continues to cause needless suffering and death, here and around the world.
the above post is a response to this post. topix is a little off today and may not have posted my previous post.

“Together for 24, legal for 5”

Since: Sep 07

Littleton, NH

#1889 Jan 25, 2013
barry wrote:
<quoted text>so, you don't believe in God, but you believe in Jesus?
I don't believe that God is constrained by the pictures painted in any organized religion. He transcends all of them.

As for Jesus, it doesn't really matter if he was real or if he is a composite--like King David. People follow Jesus' philosophy because the ideas resonate and encourage us to be better to one another. Jesus--like Buddha, Allah, or Vishnu--is merely a facet of the whole God, whom no man can fully comprehend.

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#1890 Jan 25, 2013
Tony C wrote:
<quoted text>
Poor you. It's all happening and you can't stop it.
Did you catch the slippery slope fallacy? Be werrry, werry affwaid!

And the crazy idea the expanding the gender choices is somehow segregation! Laughable if not so sad.

Irrational fear mongering (and a few mistranslated ancient texts) is all they have left to support their irrational prejudice.

“Waytogo”

Since: Oct 09

Location hidden

#1891 Jan 25, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>Changing law to create same sex marriage where culture and the consent of the governed isn't governing least. Keeping marriage as is, between one man and one woman is governing least; changing the definition of marriage to make it unisex, a gender segregated version of marriage is radical change. The left promotes equality; same sex marriage is ersatz equality where nature dictates male and female differences.
A Constitutional amendment to support DOMA; imagine if more democrats received family support thanks to a new definition of marriage, a new way to spend taxpayer's cash.
Be very careful spending tax money on same sex dependent beneficiaries. Who knows where it could end?
So keep away freedom and civil rights from a group is good to you?????????TYPICAL NAZUI FASCIST PUKE.....LEAVE THE USA IF YOU HATE FREEDOM SO MUCH....HEAR IRAN WOULD FIT YOUR WANTS......

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#1892 Jan 25, 2013
barry wrote:
the "rev dr mel white", seriously?
apparently modern scholars either do not all agree or at least they don't all agree with you.
"I Cor 6:9, no way refers to homosexuality."
The latest version of the popular NIV Bible translation has had its verses on homosexuality reworded, making them clearer in denouncing the practice, a theologian who helped with the translation says.
These clarifications include the verse in 1 Corinthians 6:9, where the 1984 NIV version uses the phrase “homosexual offenders,” while the 2011 translation changes the phrase to "men who have sex with men."
"Romans 1:26-27 mentions homosexual acts performed by people who are clearly described as heterosexual. The men in the NT patriarchal culture exerted dominance not only over women, but over younger males as well. The nature of homosexual acts in the Bible are so very different from what we know as homosexuality today that the passages have no application to today's homosexuality. Such practices as in NT times simply no longer exist."
are you saying that there are no more homosexual men who "exert dominance" over younger males?
so the new niv puts it this way;
In Romans 1:26, the verse “even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones,” was changed to,“even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones.”
and we have to love your "obscure passages of Levitical cleanliness" comment. who was obscuring them?
Leviticus 18:22, the verse “Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman,” was changed to,“Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman.”
Read more at http://www.christianpost.com/news/latest-niv-...
Who gave them the authority to presume they know that God meant and change it?

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#1893 Jan 25, 2013
*what* God meant
barry

Rainsville, AL

#1894 Jan 25, 2013
nhjeff wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't believe that God is constrained by the pictures painted in any organized religion. He transcends all of them.
As for Jesus, it doesn't really matter if he was real or if he is a composite--like King David. People follow Jesus' philosophy because the ideas resonate and encourage us to be better to one another. Jesus--like Buddha, Allah, or Vishnu--is merely a facet of the whole God, whom no man can fully comprehend.
so you don't know what you believe about God or Jesus?

you did say this;

"Frankly, I don't think God cares one way or the other about homosexual activity. He doesn't even care whether we love one another or we destroy one another. But Jesus did walk the earth to bring the message that man is better off when he loves fellow man and the world around him."

"you don't think God..."
"you don't believe that God..."

but "Jesus did walk the earth..."

however "it doesn't really matter if he was real..."

how do you have a conversation with an ideolog that doesn't know what he believes?

i will say this, Jesus said that he and the Father were one
hje said that he was the only way to God, he was the only truth, and the only life. that either makes him a liar or truly the son of God. therefor he can not be on the same level as "Buddha, Allah, or Vishnu"
barry

Rainsville, AL

#1895 Jan 25, 2013
Tony C wrote:
<quoted text>
Who gave them the authority to presume they know that God meant and change it?
that's funny, i was thinking the same thing about your sources. translating is a science not an opinion. it is what the word of God says. the original niv tried to change it and was challenged and condemned for it. apparently this new niv brings it back to what the manuscripts say.

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