Church Leaders Vow Political Backlash if Gay Marriage Passes

Jan 7, 2013 Full story: NBC Chicago 17,568

Leaders of several Chicago-area African American churches on Monday urged state lawmakers to vote against pending legislation that would allow same-sex marriage in Illinois.

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“abstractions of thought...”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#18692 Apr 6, 2014
Pietro Armando wrote:
Hmmmmm....I agree with you on sexual behavior. SSSB is definitely not new. Sexual "orientation" ....that's a different matter.
No doubt you think "atoms" and "DNA" are recent inventions too.
Pietro Armando wrote:
Defined as that, it would appear you are correct. Defining it as an "orientation" though, I still think is a modern concept.
Our understanding of ourselves and the world around us increases over time. The quest for greater understanding has often been sidetracked or set back by people and/or organizations resistant to change.
Pietro Armando wrote:
But not solely by religious beliefs.
That's the implication of my use of the word "often" and not always.
Pietro Armando wrote:
That does raise the question, if it is a innate characteristic, why the opposition?
It contradicts religious scripture for one thing. But then much of science historically has contradicted religious scripture or religious doctrine.
Pietro Armando wrote:
Ohhhhhhh...and we doing so well there for a while. Ya know if you put aside your insults for a moment, ya might learn something.
Other than perhaps a few miscellaneous words of Italian, I've yet to see anything worth learning from you based on your postings. I don't really care to add being stupid, intellectually dishonest, a liar, a bigot or generally uneducable to my skill set. While I make no claims of knowing everything, I generally look to experts or at least people with some modicum of knowledge on a particular topic in order to learn something.

“abstractions of thought...”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#18693 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
In the name of love, there is no greater hate than sex segregationist marriage supporters and their allies against their political opponents. They will try to take your livelihood if you voice the opinion marriage is one man and one woman. Their latest victim Brendan Eich, ex CEO of Mozilla.
If you oppose their political goals; you're next.
And yet the Christian florists, bakers and/or photographers all willfully chose to break the law to discriminate against others, resulting in the current lawsuits in which they find themselves embroiled. The Mozilla CEO donated to a political campaign to infringe the fundamental rights of gays and enshrine discrimination and harm to them into a state constitution that was later found to violate the federal constitution. Contrary to your lies, Brian, their speech has not been curtailed nor their livelihoods "taken" except to the extent they themselves voluntarily resigned their jobs or closed their retail shops. They are simply learning their actions have consequences, some immediate, some deferred. Their decisions to inflict harm on others have rebounded against them. And their cries and those of apologists like you of "victim" ring falsely, Brian.

“abstractions of thought...”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#18694 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>So what law did Brendan Eich or what service did he deny any customer? What do you use to justify hounding him out of business?
The same justification Christians, secular anti-gay groups and extreme social conservatives use for their boycotts, attack ads, social media campaigns and other expressions of free speech against companies, people and organizations with whose policies they disagree. Of course Brian the hypocrite ignores it when his side uses the same tactics for which he condemns gays and there supporters.

“abstractions of thought...”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#18695 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
Please note, none of the sex segregationist marriage supporters here have condemned driving Eich out of business. Since none of them condemn the evil, they are all just as guilty as the radicals who actively hunt people who believe marriage is one man and one woman and hound them out of their livelihood.
I don't respond to every one of your posts pointing out your lies and bigotry either, Brian. However, that doesn't make me or anyone else culpable for YOUR actions. The Mozilla CEO is merely the latest of numerous people whose lives or stories you've personally exploited in an attempt to score political points in a public forum. You no more care about them than Pietro cares about the plight of polygamists. These people are simply weapons you grab to fight your losing battle to defend your indefensible advocacy of discrimination against and infringement of the fundamental rights of a minority group you dislike and want to punish.
Brian_G wrote:
Same sex marriage is bad because so many of its supporters are radical extremists who will commit almost any evil in the name of love.
As opposed to you who who exploit anyone or tell any lie in the name of your personal prejudice and bigotry against a minority group you dislike. You might as well stand in front of the mirror and condemn yourself for all the moral credibility you have, Brian.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#18696 Apr 6, 2014
I've never called for a boycott, the sex segregated marriage supporters defend boycotts; this is where we differ. People make up their own minds about right and wrong and are known by the company they keep.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#18697 Apr 6, 2014
Terra Firma wrote:
The same justification Christians, secular anti-gay groups and extreme social conservatives use for their boycotts, attack ads, social media campaigns and other expressions of free speech against companies, people and organizations with whose policies they disagree. Of course Brian the hypocrite ignores it when his side uses the same tactics for which he condemns gays and there supporters.
I've never called for a boycott or attacked political opponents, everyone is entitled to earn a living even if they disagree with me.

They justify hounding someone from his livelihood because six years ago he donated to a referendum. I still don't understand how. Eich has never condemned gays, he only expressed his belief marriage is one man and one woman. His company has a strong record of gay benefits, but when between money and power; the left has a totalitarian streak that always wins out.

“Together for 24, legal for 5”

Since: Sep 07

Littleton, NH

#18698 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
Here's the letter OKCupid used to hound Eich out of business:
“Hello there, Mozilla Firefox user. Pardon this interruption of your OkCupid experience,” read a message for those that visited the site using Firefox.“Mozilla's new CEO, Brendan Eich, is an opponent of equal rights for gay couples. We would therefore prefer that our users not use Mozilla software to access OKCupid."
http://www.itproportal.com/2014/04/01/okcupid...
There is no hate like the left's; they have a totalitarian instinct that's harmed many Americans. Bernard Eich is just the latest.
Don't you find it rather ironic that NOM, et al, chastised OK Cupid for boycotting Mozilla in the same press release that they called for boycotting Mozilla for firing Eich? The heart of their consistency is their hypocrisy.

“Together for 24, legal for 5”

Since: Sep 07

Littleton, NH

#18699 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
I've never called for a boycott, the sex segregated marriage supporters defend boycotts; this is where we differ.
Neither have I called for boycotts. Nor have any of the mainstream gay rights organizations called for Eich's ouster. Yet you stereotype the entire group based on the actions of the noisiest. And those actions are no different than the actions of the organizations that you whole-heartedly support.

When you denounce NOM and AFA for their boycotts, then someone might take you seriously.(But really, you'll have to drop this sex-segregated marriage meme. Aside from your consistent hypocrisy, your arguments cannot be taken as anything but laughable.)

Jorja Fox

Nellysford, VA

#18700 Apr 6, 2014
Jonah1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Aw, poor Brian still doesn't understand how freedom of speech works. It works for EVERYONE Brian. Sorry if you don't like that. Would you like some cheese to go with all your childish whining?
Brian G = village idiot
Everyone? Didn't work to well for Eich did it. Brian is right--Eich lost his job for exercising his right to freedom of speech.

I prefer sharp cheddar

“abstractions of thought...”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#18701 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
I've never called for a boycott, the sex segregated marriage supporters defend boycotts; this is where we differ.
You whine about boycotts called for by gays and their supporters but never mention much less complain about boycotts or attack ads or political smear campaigns called by those who share YOUR desire to discriminate against and infringe the fundamental rights of gays, Brian.
Brian_G wrote:
People make up their own minds about right and wrong and are known by the company they keep.
And you keep company with those who have advocated and practiced discrimination against minority groups throughout history, Brian. And you'll end up on the ash heap just like them.

“abstractions of thought...”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#18702 Apr 6, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
I've never called for a boycott or attacked political opponents, everyone is entitled to earn a living even if they disagree with me.
But you're still condemned by your own words, Brian, since you've not condemned the evil perpetrated by those on your side calling for boycotts, attack ads and the like against gays and their supporters. Further, you even advocate yourself for discrimination and economic, financial and emotional harm to gays and infringement of their fundamental rights.
Brian_G wrote:
They justify hounding someone from his livelihood because six years ago he donated to a referendum.
You can lie and mischaracterize others' freedom of speech as "hounding someone from their livelihood" all you want, Brian, but it doesn't change the fact the CEO chose to resign voluntarily.
Brian_G wrote:
I still don't understand how. Eich has never condemned gays, he only expressed his belief marriage is one man and one woman.
He supported a citizens' ballot initiative that targeted gays and only gays to strip away one of their fundamental rights and make them unequal and second class citizens. That's not an act of kindness or love.
Brian_G wrote:
His company has a strong record of gay benefits, but when between money and power; the left has a totalitarian streak that always wins out.
One has to wonder how he could work at a company whose culture and values regarding gays were apparently so at odds with his own. If you believe gays are so undeserving of exercising a fundamental right like marriage that was extended to them by the California Supreme Court that you work to rescind it, even after the courtdeclared sexual orientation a suspect class based on the historical animus and discrimination that gays had suffered, why would anyone think you're OK with maintaining gay benefits or gay friendly policies within a company of which you're the CEO?

“Crusading Fundies r hilarious!”

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#18703 Apr 7, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
I've never called for a boycott, the sex segregated marriage supporters defend boycotts; this is where we differ.
No, that isn't where we differ. Where we differ is that you try to admonish an entire section of the populace based upon the actions of a few, but then excuse the actions of a few from admonishment, when their entire section of the populace is one that you belong to.

Know why? Because like all fundamentalists, you're a hypocrite and a liar.

Brian_G = Village Idiot

“Crusading Fundies r hilarious!”

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#18704 Apr 7, 2014
Jorja Fox wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone? Didn't work to well for Eich did it.
It didn't? Was his right to speak freely infringed? Was his right to speak freely impaired? Was his right to speak freely denied to him? Nope. He spoke very freely and very candidly. Seems he was able to exercise his freedom of speech just fine.

What you seem to dislike, is that those that heard his free speech, then used their own right to free speech. Freedom of speech is not accompanied by a freedom of repercussion based on exercising that freedom of speech.

For example, if a school teacher went on the web, and expressed his freedom of speech by stating that left handed people are vile, should not be able to marry, and are not to be trusted around children...... that teacher is exercising his freedom of speech. But he would not be free from the backlash of those that are left handed and those that know his comments are grounded in no reality. And he would not be free from repercussions that his school would most definitely have to make in regards to his future employment.
Jorja Fox wrote:
<quoted text>
Brian is right--Eich lost his job for exercising his right to freedom of speech.
I prefer sharp cheddar
Um, that's not what Brian stated. Brian has stated that Eich lost his job as a result of gays marrying. Brian blames everything on gays marrying. From the weather, to women and children getting off a sinking ship, they are all somehow forever altered because gays marry.

You might want to stick around and read some more of his posts before you want to commit yourself to stating that "Brian is right". At least that is, if you are concerned with maintaining a shred of credibility.

“No Headline available”

Since: Jan 08

Defiance, Ohio

#18705 Apr 7, 2014
Brian_G wrote:
I've never called for a boycott, the sex segregated marriage supporters defend boycotts; this is where we differ. People make up their own minds about right and wrong and are known by the company they keep.
Brian, you are a lunatic. You support free speech, only when you agree with what is being said.

Truth be told, free speech comes at a cost, namely accountability. If one says something stupid, or supports an inflammatory cause, they may well be damaged by their actions, but they have no one to blame but themselves.
Jorja Fox

Eagle Rock, VA

#18706 Apr 7, 2014
It didn't? Was his right to speak freely infringed? Was his right to speak freely impaired? Was his right to speak freely denied to him? Nope. He spoke very freely and very candidly. Seems he was able to exercise his freedom of speech just fine.

He exercised his right to free speech 6 years ago and has paid the ultimate price for his so called freedom of speech. He was forced out of his job for exercising his right of free speech. Mozilla was afraid of the backlash from gay rights activists..so "urged" him to resign. When you lose your job for your beliefs or for expressing your beliefs it is the greatest of infringements upon your free speech.

What you seem to dislike, is that those that heard his free speech, then used their own right to free speech. Freedom of speech is not accompanied by a freedom of repercussion based on exercising that freedom of speech.

No, I do not have a problem with the backlash-everything everybody does is subject to some form of backlash. I have a problem with it costing him his job. I blame okcupid for the boycot bs, I blame mozilla and I blame the gay rights activists for his job loss. ok cupid denied the public access by mozilla users to their site not because they objected to mozilla but because they objected to one person expressing their right to freedom of speech. Follow that logic and see where it's going to lead.Mozilla is saying to Eich " you need to resign this is bad for us" soooo we can't support your right to freedom of speech cause it makes us look bad. And the gay rights activists who are rejoicing because he lost his job are "hippocrits."

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/ex-mozilla-ceo-wi...

On "Real Time with Bill Maher," Maher made only a quick joke, but coming from an outspoken social liberal like Bill Maher, it took many by surprise. Maher said, "I think there is a gay mafia. I think if you cross them, you do get whacked, I really do."
But some prominent gay rights supporters, such as writer Andrew Sullivan, expressed alarm.
Sullivan wrote on his widely-read blog: "If this is the gay rights movement today -- hounding our opponents with a fanaticism more like the religious right than anyone else -- then count me out."

http://www.chron.com/business/technology/arti...

.Andrew Sullivan
"You want to squander the real gains we have made by argument and engagement by becoming just as intolerant of others' views as the Christians?," he asked. "You've just found a great way to do this. It's a bad, self-inflicted blow. And all of us will come to regret it."

Justin Lee, founder of the Gay Christian Network, which works to build bridges with evangelical opponents of same-sex relationships, described himself as "a passionate supporter of marriage equality." But Lee said he didn't think Eich should have left or been pressured to leave because he donated to Proposition 8.
"As much as I disagree with the donation, this is America, and I believe he has a right to support the political causes he believes in," Lee said.

Hameet Dhillon, vice chairman of the california republican party said Silicon Valley can be intolerant, and noted 52 percent of California voters supported the anti-gay marriage measure.

Um, that's not what Brian stated. Brian has stated that Eich lost his job as a result of gays marrying. Brian blames everything on gays marrying. From the weather, to women and children getting off a sinking ship, they are all somehow forever altered because gays marry.

Perhaps you are right, I, unlike you, have not read all of his posts but of the few I did read I came away with a different perspective of what he meant by what he said. Maybe Brian can clarify for us both.

At least that is, if you are concerned with maintaining a shred of credibility.
Thank you for your concern regarding my credibility.

“TAKIA AND TA TONKA”

Since: Aug 08

HAPPY TOGETHER!!!

#18707 Apr 7, 2014
Jorja Fox wrote:
You seem to ONLY be outraged by this action, yet mute on the boycotts by Million Moms and other hate groups who have costed celebrities their endorsements like Ellen with JCPenny.......seems a bit hypocritical if ya ask me!!!

The reason that Mozilla asked him to step down(if they actually did that) was because his position is in DIRECT conflict with their mission Statement!!!
Jorja Fox

Eagle Rock, VA

#18708 Apr 7, 2014
NorCal Native wrote:
<quoted text>
You seem to ONLY be outraged by this action, yet mute on the boycotts by Million Moms and other hate groups who have costed celebrities their endorsements like Ellen with JCPenny.......seems a bit hypocritical if ya ask me!!!
The reason that Mozilla asked him to step down(if they actually did that) was because his position is in DIRECT conflict with their mission Statement!!!
I didn't ask you anything. And you have no idea what my outrages are. JC Penny & Ellen were not even mentioned in the post I responded to. But since you seem to think I am hypocritical--let me say this...I am FOR freedom of speech-INCLUDING for those whom I disagree with.

His position was "freedom of speech" period. If that is in DIRECT conflict with their mission (and it seems to be) maybe they need to find a new mission.

“Define Necessity”

Since: Mar 13

FOR YOURSELF

#18709 Apr 7, 2014
Jorja Fox wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't ask you anything. And you have no idea what my outrages are. JC Penny & Ellen were not even mentioned in the post I responded to. But since you seem to think I am hypocritical--let me say this...I am FOR freedom of speech-INCLUDING for those whom I disagree with.
His position was "freedom of speech" period. If that is in DIRECT conflict with their mission (and it seems to be) maybe they need to find a new mission.
Here's the thing: Freedom of speech protects one from being jailed for speaking one's mind. It does NOT protect one from non-governmental consequences, incurred by speaking freely, any more than it protects you from being spoken ABOUT.

You have the right to prejudicial speech - you don't have the right to be 'free' from its consequences.

If you were to publicly state that the company you work for is evil because it supports gay marriage, would you expect to keep your job?

Would you WANT to keep your job? Eich didn't.

He resigned.

Get over it.

“TAKIA AND TA TONKA”

Since: Aug 08

HAPPY TOGETHER!!!

#18710 Apr 7, 2014
Jorja Fox wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't ask you anything. And you have no idea what my outrages are. JC Penny & Ellen were not even mentioned in the post I responded to. But since you seem to think I am hypocritical--let me say this...I am FOR freedom of speech-INCLUDING for those whom I disagree with.
His position was "freedom of speech" period. If that is in DIRECT conflict with their mission (and it seems to be) maybe they need to find a new mission.
Nope, maybe he needs to be inline with the Company's Mission Statement!!!
barry

Rainsville, AL

#18711 Apr 7, 2014
Xavier Breath wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh puh-leez. Who is restricting your right to worship?
It's not about just worship, it's about " free exercise thereof."

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