Will Gay Marriage Pit Church Against Church?

[NorCal Native]

Jeff wrote:

<quoted text>
A person's sexual orientation is not necessarily fixed. This has been shown to be the case in young people who are confused at one time in their lives and not in another when they get older.
We do know that some adult men are homosexuals today because they were molested as children. There also seems to be a connection when the father is absent in a child's life and in some cases leads to homosexual tendencies.
Ex-lesbian lover of actress Ellen DeGeneres married a cameraman. This would not have been possible if what you say were true.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-...
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There are folks who are BISEXUAL as well as those who QUESTION their sexual orientation.....but for most of....our sexual orientation is fixed.......Anne Heche IS NOT the poster child for someone who is NOTHING more than Bisexual at best!!!

Sorry, but your abuse claim is BS......there are many who were abused as children and ARE NOT GAY OR LESBIAN.......please parrot something else......we've debunked this crap over time and time again!!!

[Not Yet Equal]

Jeff wrote:

<quoted text>
The same could be argued for group marriages and a father marrying his adult daughter.
Society gains nothing from same sex marriages. They don't procreate on their own and they are not the building blocks of society. Only traditional marriage is. Only it can procreate and give a balanced parenting to children.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Hate multiplies hate, violence multiplies violence, and toughness multiplies toughness in a descending spiral of destruction....The chain reaction of evil--hate begetting hate, wars producing more wars--must be broken, or we shall be plunged into the dark abyss of annihilation.

Nonviolence is a powerful and just weapon, which cuts without wounding and ennobles the man who wields it. It is a sword that heals.

Nonviolence means avoiding not only external physical violence but also internal violence of spirit. You not only refuse to shoot a man, but you refuse to hate him.

Nonviolence is the answer to the crucial political and moral questions of our time: the need for man to overcome oppression and violence without resorting to oppression and violence. Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love.

Research has shown the determining factor for success is the quality of the parent child relationship, not the gender of the parent.

Yes, two are better than one in a perfect world, but the gender is not the determing factor. Gay people do just as well, if not better, becasue they are always motivated, while straight couples are not always motivated, and sometimet resentful and abusive.

[madscot]

Liam R wrote:

That is a lot of information to absorb. Take your time and think about what is there.

Good stuff Liam. Thanks.

[NorCal Native]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

not ashamed,
There are many testimonies of men and women being set free from the ugly grasp of homosexuality. Men and women who for years spent time in homosexuality only to realize they were being lied to.
God is able to deliver anyone from this lifestyle if they want to be delivered. A person who is homosexual for 15 yrs and leaves the lifestyle was not just curious. You may want to do some research and stop being ignorant. That is your choice concerning your child. If you want to walk your child right into hell go for it.
<quoted text>

Please provide these so called staged testimonies.....they all had drug issues, absent role models and then FOUND RELIGION, right?

[Liam R]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

Norcal Native,
Does not matter it was inspired by God. Paul like Moses and others were inspired by God to write these words. It was not just to the Corinthian people it was to all who are Christians during that time and today.
<quoted text>

Here is a news flash for you. Paul was NOT Moses. No matter what Paul's opinions on any subject might have been, ALL sins were codified a long time before Paul was born. The Bible CLEARLY states that nothing is to be added to or taken away from the laws of the Torah.

Now, add to that the fact that Paul wrote things that are utterly opposed to the Bible, and it is obvious that Paul's opinions are worthless in any discussion of the Bible. He was a false prophet who should have been stoned to death for attempting to lead peole awat from the God of the Bible.

[Laci Ann 7]

supersinner wrote:

spiritual propblem homosexuality causes
if the homosexual can not admit they sin in this way They wont want the forgivness for that sin Jesus won for them on the cross..
HOMOSEXUALITY IS NOT WRONG BECAUSE mere MEN SAY SO its wrong because God says so..
iF MEN WANT TO HEAR GOD SPEAK TO THEM THEY SHOULD READ HOLY SCRIPTURE,,

I agree.

[Laci Ann 7]

epitome wrote:
homosexuality and christianity are not compatable with each other ..a person soon will love one concept and hate the other concept ..
And that is why satan tries to make acceptance of homosexuality the loving thing to do by christians ..
satan wants christians to love homosexuals all the way to hell ..
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Show resources
Add parallel
Matthew 4:16-18
16 the people living in darkness
have seen a great light;
on those living in the land of the shadow of death
a light has dawned.”
17 From that time on Jesus began to preach,“Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near.”
Acts 20:21
I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.

I could not agree more.

[Liam R]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

Not Yet Equal,
No, the word sodomite was used before the word homosexual. Sodomite means one who has anal sex. If you read 1 and 2 Kings you will learn about the Sodomites of the land who were cast out.
<quoted text>

Wrong. The word sodomite was used as a translation of the term qadesh, which is Hebrew for a (male) temple prostitute - a priest dedicated to a fertility Goddess. THAT is what was forbidden in Leviticus, using the qadesh, just like all other aspects of worshiping a foreign God were forbidden to the children of Israel.

[difrntbrdofxian]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

not ashamed,
There are many testimonies of men and women being set free from the ugly grasp of homosexuality. Men and women who for years spent time in homosexuality only to realize they were being lied to.
God is able to deliver anyone from this lifestyle if they want to be delivered. A person who is homosexual for 15 yrs and leaves the lifestyle was not just curious. You may want to do some research and stop being ignorant. That is your choice concerning your child. If you want to walk your child right into hell go for it.
<quoted text>

WTH!! Why can't you just leave the homosexuals alone?? How does their lifestyle even infringe on your life??

PS hell Does not exsist!

[Laci Ann 7]

NorCal Native wrote:

<quoted text>
You unfortunately haven't told any truth.....just spouted your beliefs and they have NO PLACE in our Government!!!

The god that you want to claim as your god, is not the God of the Bible.....The God of the Bible is a God who judges sin, will not look the other way while you live as you please. Not going to happen.

[Liam R]

Jeff wrote:

<quoted text>
Show me the article that a gay gene has been found. Make sure its peer reviewed.
Keep in mind that even if a gene were found it still would not justify homosexuality. Genes also don't determine behavior.

Silly ignorant child. Go back and READ what I just posted. Especially the sections labeled as "Direct Study of Genes" and "Studies of Monozygomatic Twins"...

And your last sentence is merely your ingorance talking. Genes influence behavior all the time.

[Liam R]

madscot wrote:

<quoted text>
Good stuff Liam. Thanks.

Yeah, but the bigots will refuse to learn, no matter how many facts are presented.

[Laci Ann 7]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

Liam,
No body is going to sit and read all that. It is a bunch of garbage.
<quoted text>

It was too long.

[Laci Ann 7]

Liam R wrote:

<quoted text>
Wrong. The word sodomite was used as a translation of the term qadesh, which is Hebrew for a (male) temple prostitute - a priest dedicated to a fertility Goddess. THAT is what was forbidden in Leviticus, using the qadesh, just like all other aspects of worshiping a foreign God were forbidden to the children of Israel.

Liam are you gay? Not trying to be smart, just wondering.

[Not Yet Equal]

Not Yet Equal wrote:

<quoted text>
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Hate multiplies hate, violence multiplies violence, and toughness multiplies toughness in a descending spiral of destruction....The chain reaction of evil--hate begetting hate, wars producing more wars--must be broken, or we shall be plunged into the dark abyss of annihilation.
Nonviolence is a powerful and just weapon, which cuts without wounding and ennobles the man who wields it. It is a sword that heals.
Nonviolence means avoiding not only external physical violence but also internal violence of spirit. You not only refuse to shoot a man, but you refuse to hate him.
Nonviolence is the answer to the crucial political and moral questions of our time: the need for man to overcome oppression and violence without resorting to oppression and violence. Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love.
Research has shown the determining factor for success is the quality of the parent child relationship, not the gender of the parent.
Yes, two are better than one in a perfect world, but the gender is not the determing factor. Gay people do just as well, if not better, becasue they are always motivated, while straight couples are not always motivated, and sometimet resentful and abusive.

Ooops, that didn't turn out right.
I'll try again:

No, you can't make the same argument for group marriage, incest, child abuse, or any of the other excuses offered. Again, those have clearly already been shown to cause harm in a variety of ways. Reasonable restrictions on fundamental rights may be made if they can be shown to provide a compelling governmental interest. Preventing undisputable harm is a valid justification. No such justification can be shown for prohibiting otherwise qualified adults of the same sex. It provides nothing to opposite sex couples. Yet it clearly harms same sex couples and their families, without providing any reasonable justification for doing so.

And again, treating gay people equally under the laws currently in effect does not alter the marriages or the marriage structure, or social dynamics for straight people. All of the slippery slope fallacy excuses you offer require changing the marriage laws for straight people. More of the same does not require doing something different.

Equal treatment as required by law also provides benefits to those citizens, which benefits society. Marriage provides all of the same stabilizing influences as well as the over 1,138 legal rights and protections that accompany marriage.

Society also gains more stable homes that will help take care of some of the unwanted, discarded children of straight people. 100,000 go without homes every year. And some gay people choose to reproduce. You won't stop them by refusing to treat them equally. All you do is add unnecessary burdens you wouldn't accept for yourself.

[Liam R]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

Not yet Equal,
Ruth and Naomi were not lesbians. David and Jonathon were not homosexuals. There are different types of love found in the Bible. Eros, Phileo, and Agape love. Eros is a sexual love. Jonathon and David had Phileo love for one another as a brother for a brother. It is homosexuals who made up the lie that they were homosexual.
<quoted text>

People who actually read the Bible to see what it says rather than to see what they want it to say, can clearly see that David and Johnathan met all three criteria for a traditional Jewish wedding. They were homosexuals (or more likely: bisexuals) who loved one another, excanged wedding vows, and consumated their marriage before politics separated them.

Ruth and Naomi, I'm not sure. The text could be read either way.

Daniel and the prince of the "eunuchs" were another gay couple.

[NorCal Native]

Jeff wrote:

<quoted text>
Show me the article that a gay gene has been found. Make sure its peer reviewed.
Keep in mind that even if a gene were found it still would not justify homosexuality. Genes also don't determine behavior.

Are you dense? Have you NOT been told that NO "GAY" or "STRAIGHT" gene have been found? Can you not grasp that one's sexual orientation is a complex combination of genetics, biology, hormones and environmental factors?

[NorCal Native]

Laci Ann 7 wrote:

<quoted text>Liam are you gay? Not trying to be smart, just wondering.

You're being a pathetic smart azz and nothing else!!!

[Liam R]

Born_Again_Christian wrote:

Jane Dodo,
I have and they are not homosexuals. The word Phileo in the greek was used for their closeness. This means brotherly love. Eros would have been used for them if they were lovers because the word Eros has to do with sexual love. The third love word is Agape. Agape love is the love God had for us by sending Jesus to die for the sins of the world. Go and look up the words Eros, Phileo, and Agape in the Greek and you will see you been misinformed about Jonathan and David as well as Naomi and Ruth. They never had Eros love for one another, but Phileo.
<quoted text>

Here is a hint for you: the Bible was NOT written in Greek. It was written in Hebrew. The Greek words are irrelevant. 1 Samuel shows how David and Johnathan had sex with each other, thus consumating their marriage. And that is NOT "phileo"...

[NorCal Native]

Laci Ann 7 wrote:

<quoted text>The god that you want to claim as your god, is not the God of the Bible.....The God of the Bible is a God who judges sin, will not look the other way while you live as you please. Not going to happen.

Again with the DUMB AZZ COMMENTS.....there is only one God that I am aware of......sorry if you can't grasp that concept!!!

The God I TRUST and believe in gave us the 10 Commandments......what ever you opt to follow wrote that mythical book you claim is God's word......but that might not be correct!!!

How many times must you be hit upside the head before you get that God will judge me and will decide my fate? NOT YOU!!!