The Gay Awakening

Nov 18, 2013 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The American Prospect

Supporters of same-sex marriage outside Camp Innnabah, the Methodist retreat center where Rev.

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“... truth will out.”

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#42
Nov 23, 2013
 
Rick not in Kansas yet wrote:
<quoted text>Wasn't the one you posted good enough for you? Gee whiz. Reality check, neither Jesus nor His early Christians were opposed to the practices of slavery ...
Openly opposing slavery in the Roman world usually ended with the protestor's death, but YOUR claim was that Christians APPROVED of it, or don't you know the difference?
Rick not in Kansas yet

Salina, KS

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#43
Nov 23, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
Openly opposing slavery in the Roman world usually ended with the protestor's death, but YOUR claim was that Christians APPROVED of it, or don't you know the difference?
Joey, Joey, Joey, you read the book, didn't you? Slavery was blessed by God for the Jewish folk too, you know. The private thoughts of Jesus and His Apostles appear throughout the New Testament, It isn't opposed there either. Early Christians included both slaves and their masters. There are even accounts of some early Bishops in the Church being slave holders. As always, you're free to prove me wrong.

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#44
Nov 23, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Openly opposing slavery in the Roman world usually ended with the protestor's death, but YOUR claim was that Christians APPROVED of it, or don't you know the difference?
Have you lost your "Christian" marbles?

We all can read what Paul or some of his followers wrote. That should be enough for you, considering that he was educated as a Hebrew Scribe.

Here is what Jesus is reported to have said:

"Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's. Give unto God that which is God's."

Jesus did NOT condemn slavery. He approved of it as a matter of course in social law. He openly referred to the practice of slavery and used it to make teaching examples numerous times in many parables. The Romans, the Greeks and the Jews were accepting of the practice.

Even Jesus used allegorical references, such as, "My yoke is easy and my burden is light." To be yoked is to be placed in servitude. To his own disciples, He told them to strive to make themselves servants.

If you do not understand this, you do not understand the essential nature of the required personal submission, the indentured servitude in discipleship to the Master, Jesus - and, yes, it is a form of personal discipline that takes its cues in slavery.

Rev. Ken

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#45
Nov 23, 2013
 

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Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Going on in what Testament, the New, or the Old, or can't you tell the difference between them?
State a single instance, just one citation, in the "NT" where slavery was forbidden.

“... truth will out.”

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#46
Nov 24, 2013
 
lides wrote:
<quoted text>
Congratulations, you have found a new testament reference. However, it is neither by Christ, nor can you prove that the translation is correct. The original language had no word for homosexual ...
... so are now you claiming that homosexuals didn't exist back then because the word wasn't yet coined?

Leviticus 20:13: "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them."

Romans 1:26-27: "For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence [sic] of their error which was meet."

“... truth will out.”

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#47
Nov 24, 2013
 
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you lost your "Christian" marbles?
We all can read what Paul or some of his followers wrote. That should be enough for you, considering that he was educated as a Hebrew Scribe.
Here is what Jesus is reported to have said:
"Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's. Give unto God that which is God's."
Jesus did NOT condemn slavery. He approved of it as a matter of course ...
Because he approved of paying taxes? Have you lost YOUR marbles?

“... truth will out.”

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#48
Nov 24, 2013
 
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
State a single instance, just one citation, in the "NT" where slavery was forbidden.
State a single instance, just one citation, in the "NT" where slavery was approved of.
I of Discernment

Concord, CA

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#49
Nov 24, 2013
 

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If we accept that homosexuality is wrong according to the bible, shouldn't we also accept that, as it also states in the bible, gluttony and drunkenness are wrong?

I see a lot of beer guzzling morbidly obese people waddling around condemning homosexuality.

Isn't this hypocrisy?

And what about judgment of others?

Again, the bible clearly says that it is wrong for humans to judge each other.

Doesn't this just add to the hypocrisy of a calling one's self a Christian while going through the bible and picking and choosing which rules to follow?

You judge the fat guy sitting next to you in the pew listening to the sermon and smelling of whiskey as being a good church going Christian,

yet with your harsh and arrogant judgment you condemn the young adolescent sitting in the back of the church struggling with the sexuality he was born with to your imaginary hell!

Disgusting Mithra worshipers!

“No Headline available”

Since: Jan 08

Defiance, Ohio

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#50
Nov 24, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
... so are now you claiming that homosexuals didn't exist back then because the word wasn't yet coined?
Not at all. However, you are working from a translation, and it is unlikely that such a reference would have been made. But that's the lovely thing about faith, isn't it? Since we have 2000 years or more of distance from it an none of the writers are still around, no one can confirm the initial intent. Maybe God has grown tired of the antics of the earth, he hasn't sent a profit in quite some time?
Joe DeCaro wrote:
Leviticus 20:13: "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them."
Leviticus governed the levites, from who tribe came the priests. Are you a levite priest?
Joe DeCaro wrote:
Romans 1:26-27: "For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence [sic] of their error which was meet."
You seem to quote everyone but Jesus. I wonder why that is?

Have you heard the phrases judge not, lest ye be judged, and may he who is without sin cast the first stone?

I love religious hypocrisy.

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#51
Nov 24, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
State a single instance, just one citation, in the "NT" where slavery was approved of.
Your founding heretic, Saul, told people to play along with it, and there is no record of him preventing his followers from owning purchasing, owning or breeding slaves themselves. There's no record that he ever set up a program to buy and free slaves, either. Neither did any of his followers.

Saul was an accessory to the institution.

“... truth will out.”

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#52
Nov 24, 2013
 
lides wrote:
Leviticus governed the levites, from who tribe came the priests ...
The Levitical Holiness Code applied to all of Israel, or did Paul's letter to the Romans only apply to Italian Catholics?

“... truth will out.”

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#53
Nov 24, 2013
 
snyper wrote:
Saul, told people to play along with it, and there is no record of him preventing his followers from owning purchasing, owning or breeding slaves themselves ...
You obviously never read Paul's letter to Philemon (v. 15-16) where he asks the owner of Onesimus to accept back his escaped slave as a brother in Christ.

Perhaps the reason he was separated from you for a little while was that you might have him back forever no longer as a slave, but better than a slave, as a dear brother. He is very dear to me but even dearer to you, both as a fellow man and as a brother in the Lord (NIV).

“Post-religious”

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#54
Nov 24, 2013
 

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Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
State a single instance, just one citation, in the "NT" where slavery was approved of.
Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. Ephesians 6:5

Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. 1 Timothy 6:1-2

But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. Matthew 18:25

The lord [owner] of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers. And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more. Luke 12:45-48

Masters, give unto your servants that which is just and equal; knowing that ye also have a Master in heaven. Colossians 4:1

For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13

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#55
Nov 24, 2013
 

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Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Because he approved of paying taxes? Have you lost YOUR marbles?
What do you think the taxes were used for, Joe?

The taxes supported a socio-political system.

You have a brain and a functioning mind, Joe. Use it or lose it.

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#56
Nov 24, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
You obviously never read Paul's letter to Philemon (v. 15-16) where he asks the owner of Onesimus to accept back his escaped slave as a brother in Christ.
Perhaps the reason he was separated from you for a little while was that you might have him back forever no longer as a slave, but better than a slave, as a dear brother. He is very dear to me but even dearer to you, both as a fellow man and as a brother in the Lord (NIV).
Good reply, and a good citation.

The balance of my statement regarding the records remain valid.

You will also note that the heretic Saul was asking him to forgive the runaway, not telling him that he shouldn't have had slaves to begin with. We can conjecture, but for some reason such admonishments, if indeed there ever were any, have not been preserved by his followers down to this day.

It is also suggestive that such was NOT a part of his teachings because no such concept appears in the writings of his nearest followers (the Patristics). Were it a keynote in his thought, surely it would have found voice among his followers. They've built complex and elaborate conceptual edifices upon almost every scrap of all the rest (an a lot of other crap besides).

“... truth will out.”

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#57
Nov 25, 2013
 
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
What do you think the taxes were used for, Joe?
The taxes supported a socio-political system ...
... that includes aqueducts and armies, or don't you think they needed water and protection?

“... truth will out.”

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#58
Nov 25, 2013
 
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
Good reply, and a good citation.
The balance of my statement regarding the records remain valid ... Saul was asking him to forgive the runaway, not telling him that he shouldn't have had slaves to begin with ...
Saul told him to welcome his runaway slave back as a brother in Christ, his spiritual equal, or did that escape your balance sheet?

“... truth will out.”

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#59
Nov 25, 2013
 
Rick not in Kansas yet wrote:
<quoted text>Joey, Joey, Joey, you read the book, didn't you? Slavery was blessed by God for the Jewish folk too, you know ...
Jews couldn't own one another, even back in the Old Testament; instead, they were indentured servants, just like the founders of America's first colonies.

However, Jewish indentured servants were freed during the Year of Jubilee.

Or don't you read any history books, Ricky, Ricky, Ricky?

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#60
Nov 25, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Saul told him to welcome his runaway slave back as a brother in Christ, his spiritual equal, or did that escape your balance sheet?
So in his list of anathemas, why isn't slaveownership absent?

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#61
Nov 25, 2013
 
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Jews couldn't own one another, even back in the Old Testament; instead, they were indentured servants, just like the founders of America's first colonies.
However, Jewish indentured servants were freed during the Year of Jubilee.
Or don't you read any history books, Ricky, Ricky, Ricky?
Once every 70 years.

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