Visalia Calvary Church pastor, the Rev. Bob Grenier, and his wife, Gayle, have sued their estranged son, Alex Grenier, accusing him of defamation and cyberbullying.
Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Fresno Bee.
#372 Nov 26, 2012
"...If a current calvary chapel pastor gave testimony that he witnessed another pastor being "stoned on pills" would you believe it?..."
Not necessarily. People lie about other people every day of the week. Plus, if it is YOU that is transferring that claim into the court of public opinion, well it's just hearsay at this point.
If, instead of simply stating it, I had the actual person saying it, then I would be able to question that person, wouldn't I?
And, why ins't that person stating such here at topix.com ?
As it stands now, it is YOU saying so and so said such and such, and therefore Bob is a bad guy that shouldn't be in ministry.
But so and so said such and such is not enough for ME (and others) to infer that Bob is a bad guy.
#373 Nov 26, 2012
"...i have concrete proof bob and you have contacted many, some have leaked the info to me ;-)..."
I've not contacted anyone from PP. You must have me confused with someone else, or there is no someone else and you are just typing to bolster the credibility of your hate campaign.
"...ask Geoff, he says he didn't, he was tested in college and pros and never had a positive test etc..."
First, I have no way to ask Geoff. Second, no positive is not enough to infer to your conclusion---I mean, after all, Lance Armstrong never tested positive, did he?
I don't care about Geoff at 10. Is it possible for a child to exhibit extraordinarily aggressive behavior that requires reproof and correction? Yes. Is it possible for said behavior to occur without the help of steroids? Yes.
Is you stating your belief about Geoff enough evidence for me to reach a conclusion that agrees with your conclusion. If you want to get technical, no, it's not enough of a reason.
Is you saying Bob was abusive enough for me to reach a similar conclusion? No.
Perhaps Bob was a hard-ass. Perhaps his sons were not exemplary, well-behaved children that required no correction.
Perhaps you are lying when you paint your father as more than a hard-ass, and perhaps you are lying when you paint yourself as a well-behaved child that required no correction.
My name is Who.
#374 Nov 26, 2012
as i stated above, spin, obfuscation, denial, intellectual dishonesty
You've lost your credibility long ago, but thanks for continuing the discussion
#375 Nov 26, 2012
also , i don't know anyone who reads here who buys your canard, it's tired, you aren't foolin' anyone
but by all means keep it up LOL, it's a great opportunity to counter the spin coming out of camp bob etc
#376 Nov 26, 2012
"reproof and correction" as state defined child abuse at age 10 or any age of a minor in the care of a parent or guardian is illegal and sinful and wrong no matter your continued efforts to obfuscate, spin, deny and play apologist for camp bob/cc
#377 Nov 26, 2012
No. You claimed I've contacted people; that paints a particular portrait and it's false. But you just SAY I've contacted people about you and move on, and that little bit of falsehood paints a decidedly different portrait than what the reality is---then you just move on. It is completely intentional and dangerously manipulative, especially if such tiny little obfuscations will cause others to make misinformed decisions about your family.
I think it is stuff like this that is getting you sued.
My name is Who.
#378 Nov 26, 2012
camp bob has contacted people, context, context, context. you are claiming you personally didn't, but who knows, you've proven yourself dishonest many times over
anyone can sue anyone over anything, the fact of being sued means nothing other than bob decided to sue as a tactic to try and shut me up even though I and others are telling the truth
#379 Nov 26, 2012
yawn. That's ONE of your problems. You lump me in with camp bob, I have no idea if there was any contact, I am not in a position to determine whether or not what you say is true.
I just have to take your word for it.
Your accounts all down the road have been quite inconsistent, and yet you get bent if I or others don't simply take your word for it.
If some bum walked up to me on the street and told me he was a bum because he was abused by his father, do I take the bum's word for it?
Or could he be lying about the abuse so as to take the responsibility for his being a bum off of his shoulders?
You are like the bum that says
"oh I own a pawn shop because my family life was crappy. If my family life wasn't so crappy I would be President right now."
To complete the analogy, I am like the dude that, rather than simply agreeing with the bum in the hopes that the bum would leave me alone, continues a conversation with the bum and asks the bum probing questions to determine whether or not what the bum (you) is telling me is the truth or not.
That is all.
My name is Who.
#380 Nov 26, 2012
"...you've proven yourself dishonest many times over..."
No! You just say this kind of thing and then move on. When I say I have nothing to do with Bob, you say "yeah right. You're a liar."
And with the strokes of a keyboard, in your book I am a quarterback for camp bob.
Show me exactly how I've proven myself dishonest, JUST ONE TIME OVER!
When have I said anything that wasn't true? Examples, please?!
#381 Nov 26, 2012
Excellent points, Who!
#382 Nov 26, 2012
Thanks, you dirty stinking bum!
#383 Nov 26, 2012
"it's not that I defend Bob its that Alex won't answer my stupid poorly worded open ended questions. I asked really stupid things and when nobody answered them, I made up my own answers and that's how I know he truth, I created it"
#384 Nov 26, 2012
Good points fatty girl.
#385 Nov 27, 2012
you've proven yourself intellectually dishonest by moving the goal posts many times, by misrepresenting key facts about the issues, by discounting personal testimonies from Glen C, Paul, Geoff, Tina, Edna, myself and dozens of others, etc.
You don't answer questions forthrightly when the shoe is on the other foot.
If the stuff is true, is it wrong legally or morally to speak out about it? Yes or no?
Is a pastor and police chaplain a position of trust in society? Does the law view these positions differently than a janitor?
Does the bible hold pastors to a "stricter" judgment and higher standard?
Does the bible command us to expose, warn, tell it unto the church, etc, if bad stuff happens the person who committed the sin denies it and doesn't repent and doesn't take responsibility for their bad actions?
#386 Nov 27, 2012
you also display your dishonesty in changing your story about your identity and hiding it (you have something to hide which is telling).
you've claimed your mother who you implied was inner-circle CC was insulted by people early in the topix threads
you've claimed to be single, male, a food service worker at a restaurant/bar, drunk, then a UC Berkley law school grad or attendee, a philosopher, a Christian, then not a Christian, etc etc etc. Lots of misinformation from you and contradictions.
you also vacillate back-and-forth between claiming to have knowledge of inside stuff, then you've let slip a few times over the years pieces of information that were not public, then you revert to the "my name is who" i am a random luddite troll canard, rinse and repeat.
again, all supporting my assertion that you've proven yourself dishonest
#387 Nov 27, 2012
i have first-hand testimony from former CCV insiders about people who spent their time on the internet "all the time"...people who created "fake facebook identities" to spy on me on and give information to Camp Bob, people who spent much time on the blogs reading every word I write etc etc...these former CCV insiders and "friends" of Camp Bob saw this first-hand.
if you think anyone who is in tune with this situation buys your b.s. at all...you're a fool.
now, I do think you're a fool, so keep believing folks are stupid enough to buy into your game
who would spend the time you do reading every word I write on the internet, following me around the internet, commenting when I comment and spending as much time as you have and do if you don't have skin in the game?
I do what I do b/c I have skin in the game and the abuse I suffered by Bob is a great motivator and driver to speak out about what I experienced and the much larger issue of abuse in CC and the evangelical church. It's one of many natural human responses to abuse, as it has been validated by credible experts like Kelly Clark and several others including real Therapists who deal in abuse and victims of abuse etc. I used to think I was weird, now I understand why I have the drive to confront the stuff. It's not how "everyone" overcomes their abuse, but it's within the range of "normal" and how "some" folks deal with it in a healthy manner.
Now, to you specifically...you are asking us all to believe that what drives you is a ludditism. Can you explain that again? LOL
You are driven by your hatred of me and my speaking out. You are driven b/c you are compelled to try and muddy the waters and protect the truth coming out about Bob and CCV. You have skin in the game and your overwhelming participation is evidence of such (plus other knowledge I have in addition to what I shared, but there are many cards I choose not to show publicly in these matters).
now, give us your best "i'm a luddite" and "random troll" schpeel, I love being entertained in that manner. tell me again how you have absolutely no connection to bob or CC etc and how you just stumbled upon the original topix thread years ago and your stated goal was to get me to stop posting on topix. How's that goal going by the way? Having much success with that? LOL
#388 Nov 27, 2012
If Bob Grenier was such a good father and so righteous and his only misgiving was our "perceived poor parenting" as Bob puts it in his lawsuit, rather than intense child abuse and what paul accuses him of etc etc...
...why would we just make it up? Why would I have been so profoundly affected by it to speak out so thoroughly as I do? Bob claims some 6,000 comments, I think the number is low, it's probably more like 60,000.
Why can't I let it go? Why am I so passionate about the stuff? Just b/c? Because Bob was such a great dad and pastor? I'm just making it all up, the others are just making it all up, we're in some grand conspiracy b/c we have nothing better to do?
See through the spin and b.s. people (and many do). Bob's a bad guy. The stuff is true and it needs to be dealt with.
When folks don't stand up and deal with the bad stuff, it allows more bad stuff to happen. Bob's not a janitor, he's a pastor and official police chaplain, he's in positions of trust in our church and society and in my opinion, for many many reasons, he shouldn't be trusted.
Don't fall for the who canard or the spin coming out of camp Bob. Keep watching as the lawsuit plays out. Cut through the clutter and muddying by who and bob's attorney etc.
#389 Nov 27, 2012
and know this:
you'll never defeat me, i've already won.
I'm doing what my conscience tells me is right, I'm doing what I believe is right. Win, lose or draw, I've won b/c I've come to terms with the abuse that happened to me and the abuse I personally witnessed to my brother and mother.
It breaks my heart what happened to my brother Paul.
There will always be a negative aspect to the memories and to the knowledge of paul's abuse (and the many others at CCV through the years etc)...no way around that.
But, I've already won, b/c I took a stand and said "enough!" and I've put myself out there and I've made a small dent. I'm being challenged on many sides with the civil lawsuit etc. I've been mocked, threatened, ridiculed, harassed etc etc etc, been called names by Chuck Smith, been rebuked by Chuck Smith from his very powerful Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa Pulpit, etc. It's not easy taking a stand against abuse/corruption and the church and the CC Brand.
But, despite all of that, I've won. I've done the right thing and am doing the right thing and the chips can fall where they may, that is insignificant compared to facing an evil, getting a strong conviction to do something...and then taking a leap of faith and actually doing it, despite knowing it could get very difficult (and it got more difficult than first imagined).
Bob can still come forward and confess and repent and seek reconciliation and stop his lying and his lawsuit and other actions. He probably has to face some consequences for his bad actions, but God is a God of forgiveness. I still hope he comes clean, but realistically, after watching him this past Sunday for a bit on his live internet public broadcast, he looks as dug-in and hardened as ever, much like Pharoah IMO.
#390 Nov 27, 2012
i've found my Voice and no one can take that from me
#391 Nov 27, 2012
OkieDokie Barbra Streisand.
See how this goes? You post, I post. Sometimes I post when you don't, but the record clearly indicates that, when you post I post.
Add your comments below
|Man arrested after giving teens synthetic weed (Nov '14)||Mar 16||Carlos P||8|
|Oklahoma ex-principal gets probation for not re...||Mar 10||As I see it||2|
|Mannington Man Arrested On Child Abuse Charges (Jul '10)||Mar 7||dark square sungl...||8|
|News & views: Why Gary Oldman and Kobe Bryant's...||Mar 7||Circling the Drain||1|
|Thomas Bennett gets 13 years in aggravated chil... (Jan '12)||Mar 6||Ocoeese71||5|
|Partnerships key to Family Justice Center||Mar 4||DeDominicis||1|
|Other days||Mar 4||Guest||1|
Find what you want!
Search Domestic Violence Forum Now
Copyright © 2018 Topix LLC