Islam and Science:Road to Renewal

Jan 29, 2013 Full story: Free Republic 315

THE sleep has been long and deep. In 2005 Harvard University produced more scientific papers than 17 Arabic-speaking countries combined.

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Since: Feb 13

Vanderhoof, Canada

#128 Feb 7, 2013
Don't get me wrong, I do not support the complete eradication of Islam from Pakistani society. I feel like such a thing is impossible.

However, I push for a move similar to Ataturk's secularization of Turkey in the 1920s. Turkey remains a secular, free (mostly, things have been changing with the rise of Erdogan), democratic, and advancing society.

As Turkey did, secularization, the advancement of women rights, freedom of speech and religion, the governmental regulation of mosques and imams, the abolishment of the madrassa system of governance, and the lessening of religon in government (both local and federal) are necessary to Pakistan's future.

Unfortunately most Muslims will flame up at the thought of these ideas. Which is unfortunate because they are the very things we are sorely lacking that have made us so low and terrible.

“Alea iacta est!”

Since: Oct 06

Oh it's ON!

#129 Feb 7, 2013
Irzath wrote:
<quoted text>
you are hallucinating.
Come back when you're ready to post facts.
Rabbeen Al Jihad

Salt Lake City, UT

#130 Feb 7, 2013
Faith wrote:
<quoted text>So what happened? You animals haven't advanced one inch in 1400 years. Meanwhile, we have walked on the Moon and have robots driving around on Mars.
Salaamz! LOL! its as plain as the snot on a camels face that YOUR God is only science. Truely your loss . Cheerz

“Facts, not fiction”

Since: Apr 07

Earth

#131 Feb 7, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
Learn to quote properly.

I do note that you have completely ignored that the one Nobel Prize winner from Pakistan was educated in the evil colonial English India (completely contradicting your claim), instead focusing on his citizenship. The notion that the English were responsible for the formation of the Ahmadiyya community shows how completely idiotic some muslim zealots are. It certainly wasn't the English who decided to add to the Pakistani consitution that Ahmadiyya are non-muslims, ultimately resulting in the vandalisation of Salam's gravestone.

“Facts, not fiction”

Since: Apr 07

Earth

#132 Feb 7, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
We know Pakistan is going through a serious political turmoil. I know we do not have a competatnt, progressive and honest government. I know it is a corrupt regime and should be replaced ASAP. But, why is the US protecting sch a regime?
It's always the same with muslims: damned if you do, damned if you don't. Of course, the US does not "protect" the Pakistani regime. I'm 100% certain it would be immensely happy if the Pakistani regime would be more like, say, France. No concerns about the nuclear weapons arsenal there. No hugely incompetent leadership allowing religious zealots to kill at random for supposed "insults to islam". No laws that allow the death penalty for such victimless crimes. No safe haven for some of the worst murderers in history. Instead, yet another country to trade with.

In the meantime, muslims are killing muslims in Syria, and the muslim world once again does nothing, just like it did in Darfur (in fact, the Sudanese government got praised by the OIC). Suppression of the majority of the population in Bahrain is met with an indifferent shrug ("they're just shia anyway"). Morocco's occupation of part of Western Sahara, removing its indigenous population is unworthy of any discussions (but don't even dare to mention Israel!). When in Mali muslims were killing muslims, again the muslim world just shrugged, and a Western country was needed to stop the bloodshed. Somalia has in essence been given up, but at least the West tried to stop the bloodshed there. Muslim countries once again did nothing at all.

Muslims apparently don't care about fellow muslims being killed. It's only when the one doing the kiling is a non-muslim that it becomes a problem.
Khan

Wichita, KS

#133 Feb 7, 2013
Ex Muslim wrote:
Don't get me wrong, I do not support the complete eradication of Islam from Pakistani society. I feel like such a thing is impossible.
However, I push for a move similar to Ataturk's secularization of Turkey in the 1920s. Turkey remains a secular, free (mostly, things have been changing with the rise of Erdogan), democratic, and advancing society.
As Turkey did, secularization, the advancement of women rights, freedom of speech and religion, the governmental regulation of mosques and imams, the abolishment of the madrassa system of governance, and the lessening of religon in government (both local and federal) are necessary to Pakistan's future.
Unfortunately most Muslims will flame up at the thought of these ideas. Which is unfortunate because they are the very things we are sorely lacking that have made us so low and terrible.
I completely agree with your statement and genuine concerns about Pakistan. The wisdom, compassion and spirit of Islam has been misrepresented and exploited very severely by the Mullahs and Extremist Muslims.

The teachings of Quran and my beloved Prophet should be an eternal part of our soul and Iman. Let me express my reservations on certain aspects.

As Carlyle had once said "Islam is the best religion, but has the worst followers. It is my personal assesment that we need to abolish the Shariah laws without any guilt or sorrow. These Shariah laws are impracticel and out-dated.
I was also very disappointed when the Chief Minister of Punjab was gunned down by his own bodyguard, justifying some stupid Shariah law.
Our Beloved Prophet was abused by an old Jewish lady on daily basis, who used to throw garbage on him. One day, when she did not throw the garbage, he went to enquire about her welfare and when she saw him, tears came to her eyes and she embraced Islam. Such kindness and compassion should be a part of every brave Muslim.

The Charter of Medinah as approved by Prophet Mohammad SA was a secular charter and included the rights of the minorities. Pakistan must give the minorities their due protection.
Feudalism and Provicialsm are the birth defects of Pakistan. There should be laws to gradually reduce its bad effects.

There is a lot to be written about all this. And we understand what is going on.
THE ARSE OF KHAN

Croydon, UK

#134 Feb 9, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
Professor Alfred Kroner is one of the world's well-known geologists. He is a Professor of the Department of Geosciences, University of Mainz, Mainz, Germany. He said, "Thinking where Muhammad came from .. I think it is almost impossible that he could have known about things like the common origin of the universe, because scientists have only found out within the last few years with very complicated and advance technological methods that this is the case." (From 'This is the Truth'[video]). Also he said, "Somebody who did not know something about nuclear physics fourteen hundred years ago could not, I think, be in a position to find out from his own mind, for instance, that the earth and the heavens had the same origin."
http://www.scienceislam.com/quran_miracles.ph...
Nice try Muzzard but here is what Alfred Kroner himself has to say on the subject:

http://www.youtube.com/watch...
THE ARSE OF KHAN

Croydon, UK

#135 Feb 9, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
The Roots of Violence:
Wealth without work,
Pleasure without conscience,
Knowledge without character,
Commerce without morality,
Science without humanity,
Worship without sacrifice,
Politics without principles.
That is what America has become
Compared to what Pakistan has become, America is still one of the greatest nations that has ever existed on this Earth.

Can you say the same for your Pakistan?
Khan

Wichita, KS

#136 Feb 9, 2013
THE ARSE OF KHAN wrote:
<quoted text>
Nice try Muzzard but here is what Alfred Kroner himself has to say on the subject:
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
There are many Alfreds who had number of praises for Islam.
Bertrand Russel has stated that eventually Islam will rule the West. The moral and economic decay is very obvious. Remember, 600,000 Iraqis were massacred based on poor intelligence. And you cannot say word about it. The Zionist wanted it, and it happened.
But, enough is enough !
What justice is this?
The problrm with the Muslim world is we are still waiting for leaders who are both intelligent and sincere.
From Saudi Arabia to Pakistan, from Iran to Indonesia, as many as 60 + Muslim countries are not allowed to develop any Nuclear weapons.
If Americans believe that having a gun is their constitutional right, then every Muslim country has a right to protect and defend themselves from the exploitation and genocide of its resources and people.

A good article to read, tells it like it is today in America :
Wake Up and Smell the Fascism < http://www.oldamericancentury.org/14pts.htm&g... ;. In it, the author lists fourteen identifying signs that we are living under a fascist regime. It's a long article with lots of embedded links, but here are the basic points:
1) Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
2) Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
3) Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
4) Supremacy of the Military
5) Rampant Sexism
6) Controlled Mass Media
7) Obsession with National Security
8) Religion and Government are Intertwined
9) Corporate Power is Protected
10) Labor Power is Suppressed
11) Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
12) Obsession with Crime and Punishment
13) Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
14) Fraudulent Elections
The Anglo-American dual power now has the best fascism money can buy, and it's being perfected way beyond any previously fashioned authoritarianism. Having been raped and plundered by corporate Nazis, the U.S. no longer resides as a recognizable constitutional democracy.

In the last few years
THE ARSE OF KHAN

Croydon, UK

#137 Feb 9, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
There are many Alfreds who had number of praises for Islam.
May be??? But not that one.
This is your logical answer?
Khan

Wichita, KS

#138 Feb 9, 2013
THE ARSE OF KHAN wrote:
<quoted text>
May be??? But not that one.
This is your logical answer?
Pakistan will lead the Muslim world in near future, inshallah.
For Pakistan, India is a piece of cake. We shall enter India like a hot knife into butter.
Kashmir resolution is very important.
Deccan should be an autonomus country.
There are many other demands.

“Facts, not fiction”

Since: Apr 07

Earth

#139 Feb 9, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
There are many Alfreds who had number of praises for Islam.
Bertrand Russel has stated that eventually Islam will rule the West.
Bertrand Russell didn't mean that in a positive way, Khan!
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
A good article to read, tells it like it is today in America :
Wake Up and Smell the Fascism < http://www.oldamericancentury.org/14pts.htm&g... ;. In it, the author lists fourteen identifying signs that we are living under a fascist regime. It's a long article with lots of embedded links, but here are the basic points:
1) Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
2) Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
3) Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
4) Supremacy of the Military
5) Rampant Sexism
6) Controlled Mass Media
7) Obsession with National Security
8) Religion and Government are Intertwined
9) Corporate Power is Protected
10) Labor Power is Suppressed
11) Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
12) Obsession with Crime and Punishment
13) Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
14) Fraudulent Elections
Try applying that to *any* muslim country, and then compare it to the US. You will find that the US does better than *any* majority muslim country.

“Facts, not fiction”

Since: Apr 07

Earth

#140 Feb 9, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
Pakistan will lead the Muslim world in near future, inshallah.
For Pakistan, India is a piece of cake. We shall enter India like a hot knife into butter.
Kashmir resolution is very important.
Deccan should be an autonomus country.
There are many other demands.
"1) Powerful and Continuing Nationalism"

“image gallery of moenjodaro”

Since: Jan 06

Location hidden

#141 Feb 10, 2013
Islam Promotes Learning and exploring
Khan

Wichita, KS

#142 Feb 12, 2013
Faith wrote:
<quoted text>Islam is pure lies.....pure evil.
Why should we trust Israel with all kinds of Nuclear and chemical weapons but not Korea or Iran?
Faith

New Baltimore, MI

#143 Feb 12, 2013
Khan wrote:
<quoted text>
Why should we trust Israel with all kinds of Nuclear and chemical weapons but not Korea or Iran?
To wit? Because the Israelis are rational and civilized.....something filthy muslims can never be. Only grown ups should be allowed to play with nukes. You seem very unhappy with America. Perhaps you would serve yourself better if you...got the fck out. I'm sure Islamabad would be more comfortable for someone of your evolutionary status.

Since: Apr 12

Concord, CA

#144 Feb 12, 2013
MOMIN ANSARI wrote:
Islam Promotes Learning and exploring
more like Burning and exploding
mICHEAL

Karachi, Pakistan

#145 Feb 13, 2013
Islam promotes Research The First Versus of Quran Says 'Learn'

“Facts, not fiction”

Since: Apr 07

Earth

#146 Feb 13, 2013
mICHEAL wrote:
Islam promotes Research The First Versus of Quran Says 'Learn'
Where would that be? It's definitely not in the first surah. There the muslims just ask their imaginary friend for guidance.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#147 Feb 13, 2013
Islam and Science

“Never judge a religion by its people, judge a religion by its scripture”

http://www.cometoislam.com/IslamandScience.ht...

please look at the link above!

or shall I copy and paste?

Nah I can't be ARSED!

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