Sadie

Ottawa, Canada

#21 Jun 2, 2009
My husband has not been drinking for several years now.(I think) I banned alcohol from the house, we don't frequent night clubs or any drinking establishments. I have found that living with him sober is no easier than before. He is moody, nasty, sarcastic, very negative about unimportant things, unkind. He still doesn't do the things he says he will, he is still unreliable with little understanding of the concept of responsability. He is emotionnaly deficient or immature. Somedays he says one thing and the next the opposite as if he always believed it. I don't miss getting up in the morning to vomit sprayed all over the place, but at least when he had one drink he was fun to be with. He now goes into this lecturing mode were he recites everything he knows about world war II (for example). He is regularly scolding the children for something they have done or if they have lost something. He never offer solutions to their problems, just negative reinforcement. I also have no idea what to do. It is difficult for me not to get angry or saddened. He replaced his alcohol addiction with stock trading for a short while. He would literally get the shakes at lunch and would have to check his portfolio. He claimed he was investing money for the children's future. He regularly used the 'children's wellbeing' to justify his actions. Or will justify something by saying 'I do this every year, therefore I am going to do it this year'. He seems to have always needed someone to emulate. When he was drinking it was always Brian does this so it a good thing. Now he is mimicking his brother. It is painful.
tom

Hope, Canada

#22 Jun 4, 2009
Living with a recovering alcoholic...Is a nightmare for me... I am always defending myself...

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#23 Jun 4, 2009
tom wrote:
Living with a recovering alcoholic...Is a nightmare for me... I am always defending myself...
Defending yourself how? Against what?

I don't mean that in an argumentative way, I'm curious.
Volfan12

Murfreesboro, TN

#24 Jun 4, 2009
I was a raging alcoholic with a nasty temper and depression that made me angrier. I alienated everyone for years then I got into AA and a good supportive church. But I am not a saint nor a Big Book thumper. I believe in the steps and I believe in God but the anger and problems I had didn't just disappear. It took work and a lot of self examination. I am sober and have been for five years minus two weekends that I drank and was sprinting back to AA and my support system.I did not start treating people like I demanded to be treated until after the second year and then it was up and down for a while. I didn't become an alciholic over night or even over five years. I drank to oblivion for about 15 years and it will take a while for me to finish the process of getting rid of the self hatred, guilt, remorse and anger. Given time and guidance if he is honest with himself he will start to want to treat others well because he will not want to apologize for his mouth and attitude. You will need to be strong and you are in recovery with him. I hope you both hang on, there is light and the miracle is coming!
Sadie

Ottawa, Canada

#25 Jun 4, 2009
I cannot see that there could be a light at the end the tunnel for us. He is not the person I thought I married. Now he is only the father of my children. I am not even worried anymore of him relapsing. It doesn't matter. I still support him financially and we still live together but our lives are now separate. I cannot allow myself to be held back from life or pulled down into his dark holes and I must protect my children from his negativity. I have run out of inspiration and fundamentally I would like him to become whole but it is for the sake of my children. What can I do? The wait and see is not getting us anywhere.

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#26 Jun 4, 2009
Sadie wrote:
I cannot see that there could be a light at the end the tunnel for us. He is not the person I thought I married. Now he is only the father of my children. I am not even worried anymore of him relapsing. It doesn't matter. I still support him financially and we still live together but our lives are now separate. I cannot allow myself to be held back from life or pulled down into his dark holes and I must protect my children from his negativity. I have run out of inspiration and fundamentally I would like him to become whole but it is for the sake of my children. What can I do? The wait and see is not getting us anywhere.
Have you considered a trial separation? Perhaps some time apart would help everyone put some things in perspective.
Volfan12

Murfreesboro, TN

#27 Jun 5, 2009
The trial seperation may help but it may not. You might try Alanon meetings. They are for people who live with, love and support alcoholics. It treaches you to take care of yourself and gives you people to talk to in the same situation. A lot of people have found help and answers there. Good luck and tell him to get on here and chat with me about his problems it will help . That is if he is willing and wants to work toward a positive and healthy change.
Elle63

Atlanta, GA

#28 Jun 7, 2009
My husband has been sober for 10 months and sometimes I think things are just as bad. No, I don't have to watch him fall down flat on his face drunk in front of my two children and the piano teacher but he isn't very pleasant to be around. Like Sadie's husband, very negative. Also just not nice. Very argumentative and aggressive in inappropriate ways. He was nicer when he was drinking (and he wasn't that nice then...).

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#29 Jun 8, 2009
Elle63 wrote:
My husband has been sober for 10 months and sometimes I think things are just as bad. No, I don't have to watch him fall down flat on his face drunk in front of my two children and the piano teacher but he isn't very pleasant to be around. Like Sadie's husband, very negative. Also just not nice. Very argumentative and aggressive in inappropriate ways. He was nicer when he was drinking (and he wasn't that nice then...).
Has he seen a doctor? Perhaps some sort of medication would help. Alcohol and drug abusers are often self-medicating becuase they have an actual chemical imbalance or other issues. Or perhaps he's just a jerk.
Hope

Edmonton, UK

#30 Jun 10, 2009
Lynn wrote:
<quoted text>
No Denise, I'm not a drinker. I'm just finding that living with a recovering alcoholic isn't much easier than living with an active alcoholic. He's still moody, and reclusive, and has actually developed some new habits, like sarcasm. I was wondering if other people living with recovering alcoholics had the same experiences, and if they had any ideas for me.
I hate to say this Lynn but maybe thats who he really is? I drink alot and it makes me happy therefor a happier person, and im nicer when im drinking than when im not, if your husband was a big drinker and for a long time, that person who u thought he was isnt really him? i dont mean to sound negative but 5 months is a long time and you seem like a very caring wife its not fair on you that he repays your support but acting that way. Ppl will push u as far as u let them and i think he's novelty period is over, u really should sit him down and talk to him. tell him u love him and willing to support him all the way but he cant treat u that way and be firm! xXx
Volfan12

Murfreesboro, TN

#31 Jun 11, 2009
Hope is full of crap. An alcoholic brain takes a year to really dry out and get all the alcohol and affects of it out. It will take him time and a lot of work to be a changed man though. He must make ammends and understand why he makes them, he must make a list of all of his resentments and see his part in them, he must realize that he cannot hang on to the past and must embrace a sober future. It is going to take a lot of work and pain on his part. Tell him to get involved with AA and just do what they suggest even if it doesn't feel good or make sense. It will in the end and he will be a different person and will treat everyone differently.

“look up and laugh”

Since: Jun 08

guess, where

#32 Jun 14, 2009
I too hate the terms sometimes used. What I really hate hearing(I was ONLY a drinker) was a drug is a drug, alcohol and heroine are the same thing. I would argue and say no it isn't. It is not illegal to buy a bottle of gin if you are of age but buying and selling crack and heroine is so how the hell is it the same.
kdh

Essex Junction, VT

#33 Sep 8, 2009
My husband is also trying to recover- only 3wks - but it's a start. I also feel sad, depressed and empty. It's like a roller coaster ride. One minute we can be laughing with each other and the next minute I'm so sad and depressed. I don't know who I am anymore. I know this doesn't help you but know that you are not alone.
BigOldTits

United States

#34 Sep 21, 2009
AA is a cult, slogan chanting, rituals, and things get uncomfortable for you if you don't go along. The basic problem with drinking is that people are getting pleasure from it instead of normal things. They need to get pleasure from other things, and replace the alcohol. It's a freeking choice, not a disease!! This disease crap is what legitimizes fake doctors and counselors in those rehab trickment centers for 10 to 20K a month. A bunch of crap. Sometimes after people stop drinking -- hey, surprise, they are Still assholes!! Divorce that sorry ass if that's the case. Being unable to face ones problems in a constructive way does not make on an alcoholic -- the drinking is a symptom of their problem of not dealing with their life problems and finding pleasure in a healthy way.
MNVA38

Portsmouth, VA

#35 Sep 26, 2009
MY HUSBAND HE HAS BEEN SOBER FOR 5 WEEKS BY GOING TO AA. HE HAS BEEN IN DETOX AND REHAB 3 TIMES SINCE MAY. THIS IS THE LONGEST HE HAS BEEN SOBER. HE HAS BEEN DRINKING FOR OVER A YR W/O STOP AND FOR SEVERAL YEARS W/ SMALL DRYING OUT PERIODS (NO REHAB UNTIL NOW). THE LATESTS BENDERS HAVE BEEN B/C I AM SUPPOSEDLY CHEATING ON HIM AND HE HAS PROOF OF THIS. HE TELLS OUR 14YR OLD AND 2YR OLD THAT I AM CHEATING ON HIM, HE HAS RUN AROUND OUR UPDSCALE NEIGHRBORHOOD TELLING ANYONE WHO WILL LISTEN THAT THIS HAPPENED, HIS FAMILY, FRIENDS EVERYONE AND THAT IS WHY HE FLIPPED OUT, WENT ON BENDERS. THIS HAD BEEN GOING ON FOR 3MOS STRAIGHT BEFORE I GOT HIM TO THE HOSPITAL. HE IS PHYSICALLY, AND MENTALLY ABUSIVE. I DIDN'T REALIZE HOW SERIOUS IT WAS. HE HAS BEEN DRINKING AND DRUNK SO MUCH FOR SOME MANY YRS. NOW THAT HE IS SOBER HE IS CONSTANTLY CHECKING UP ON ME, HUNTING ME DOWN, I CANNOT EVEN GO TO THE GROCERY STORE BY MYSELF. HE IS CHECKING MY PHONE CALLS TOO. HE PROBABLY DOESN'T EVEN WANT ME TO GO TO WORK BUT HE IS MISERLY AND PREFERS THAT I SUPPORT MYSELF, MOST OF OUR CHILDREN'S EXPENSES,MEDICAL AND CAR INSURANCE, AND 1/2 OF THE HOUSEHOLD EXPENSES ON MY SALARY THAT IS IN THE HIGH 30k'S.
I HAVE BEEN WORKING 2-3 JOBS FOR SEVERAL YEARS TO MAKE ENDS MEET. I HAVE FULL RESPONSIBILITY OF THE KIDS AND HHOLD CHORES EXCEPT HE COOKS WHEN IT SUITS HIM. HE IS OBESSED WITH HIMSELF, APPEARNACE, BUYING ALL KINDS OF CLOTHES, GYM MEMBERSHIPS, ETC.
I NEVER CHEATED ON HIM AT ALL. HE CAN'T HAVE PROOF B/C IT DOESN'T EXIST. SINCE HE HAS BEEN GOING TO AA HE IS TELLING ME IT IS OK B/C HE "ACCEPTS" WHAT I DID SO WHY SHOULD I HAVE SUCH A PROBLEM WITH BEING A PRISONER AND TREATED THE WAY HE IS TREATING ME. I TOLD HIM I AM TIRED OF IT AND HIS LIES TO JUSTIFY HIS BEHAVOIR. HE TELLS ME I SHOULD FEEL BAD FOR WHAT I HAVE DONE.
I WANT TO GET AWAY FROM HIM BUT I DO NOT HAVE MUCH $$ AND CANNOT GO TO MY PARENTS RIGHT NOW AS THIS SPRING I HAVE FOUND OUT MY DAD IS TERMINALLY ILL AND I DON'T WANT MY PARENTS TO HAVE THIS BURDEN AND WORRY TOO. IS THIS NORMAL BEHAVIOR
FOR A ALCOHOLIC AND RECOVERING ALCOHOLIC (IN THE EARLY STAGES)?
tomo1164

Pleasantville, NJ

#36 Oct 19, 2009
I am not sure what to make of the things i am reading here headhunter and am not all set to make my complete statements about it, but i will and when i do , i think you will turn it into some sort of the same non sense i am reading here today, i cannot beleive that some one is actually calling AA a cult. and also recommending that people do not seek help from alanon. furthermore, your recomendation of seeking medical attention to produce more drug therapy is really rediculous. i will return when i can put some things in order for rebutle of your most tastless remarks and recommendations to people that need attention here.
signed tomo!
13 years recovering alcoholic and drug addict!! SERENITY- COURAGE- WISDOM AND GOOD ORDERLY DIRECTION <<<<<<< <<
tomo1164

Pleasantville, NJ

#37 Oct 19, 2009
looks to me that there are alot of people in this world that are assholes and jerks, this is the world unfortunately. just because your sober dont mean your not one of them. alchohol and drugs are merely a symptom of how our inabilities to cope are handled and masked. yes there is chemical imbalances,yes there are bi-polar issues, and yes there is alot of self loathing,guilt, depression and many other things inherited to alcoholism. you dont even have to pickup a drink to be a part of all these symptoms. yes your relationship might not survive the recovery, yes you might not like what you have to do now. This is why there is programs for both sides of the situation. if many of these people would have went to and followed along with a program such as al anon , they would have been educated in what to expect and how to handle the changes of the recovery process. the nastyness, the ego, the reclusive, everything that goes along with an alcoholic mind. alcoholism affects everyone around them. family friends and even work. it is not easy and everyone is told this from the very start of there programs and judging it all the way doesnt help any program. if you make plans to build a house and judge everything about them, will it ever get built? lol get ready for another saying, LIVING LIFE ON LIFES TERMS ... LIVE AND LET LIVE BUT FOR THE GRACE OF GOD GO I , oh its just a terrible way to live isnt it? lol my sarcasm , oh but thats not normal ? hmmmm
mickey

Pickering, Canada

#38 Oct 28, 2009
Lynn wrote:
<quoted text>
I hear what you're saying about the slogan thing.[The program works if you work it!] I really, REALLY hate that stuff! Fortunately, I've yet to hear him quote a slogan or judge anyone. What other problems with the 12-step program have you seen?
Dr. Phil Stringer an authority on alcoholism says that “people are told that the first step to recovery is realizing that their behavior is not their fault. They simply have a disease! But, how many people who never decide to drink ever "catch" the "disease" of alcoholism?” The answer of course is none.
In A.A. the basic underlying contributing factor to all your problems is alcohol. Anything outside of the premise of alcoholism as a disease is considered controversial. In other words, relationships, abuse, authoritarian upbringings, etc. are all considered outside issues. Therefore, in A.A. you will never deal with anything controversial because alcohol is seen as the main contributing component for all of the alcoholic’s issues.
The deception of controversy was an integral component of the 12-step ideology for Bill Wilson and his early followers and will always remain the precept that is supposed to keep the alcoholic sober. The notion that conflict exacerbates resentment and indignation triggers slips is nothing more than a misleading notion that was implemented as an excuse so the alcoholic never has to accept moral responsibility for their past misdeeds. The proof that confirms the truth behind this statement is forever embedded in the book Alcoholics Anonymous chapter eight,“To Wives” page 117 paragraph four.“Never forget that resentment is a deadly hazard to an alcoholic. Just be careful not to disagree in a resentful or critical spirit.” Another mistaken belief surrounding the controversy issue can also be found in the same chapter, where you are told that the alcoholic is a very sick, very ill unreasonable person that you should treat like they have pneumonia. This erroneous belief is little more than the figment of the imagination of a delusional sociopath ( Bill Wilson A.A. Cofounder) that used the disease concept to exonerate himself from his own degenerate exploits.
I could go on for hours about all the bad things about A.A. I tried it 3 times and never got more than 2 years sobriety. When I finally admitted my drinking was a behavioral problem and dealt with some of my past parental abuse issue, drinking was no longer an option. I have been sober for 10 year and I did it on my own. A.A. is a cult and there are far better solutions to recovery than A.A.
As for you feeling guilty because you’re depressed and sad, stop beating yourself up, you should feel depressed and sad. You have been living with a drunk that has neglected you, hasn’t give a damn about your personal well being, never gave you any consideration and now he is sober and your still supposed to fall all over him. Give yourself a break, start living for you. The nights he goes to A.A., go to a movie, go visit a friend, go to bingo. The point is, do something for you and forget about him. He needs to get it; “it” meaning that you are just as damn important as he is and he needs to start paying attention to you.
mickey

Pickering, Canada

#39 Oct 28, 2009
tomo1164 wrote:
I am not sure what to make of the things i am reading here headhunter and am not all set to make my complete statements about it, but i will and when i do , i think you will turn it into some sort of the same non sense i am reading here today, i cannot beleive that some one is actually calling AA a cult. and also recommending that people do not seek help from alanon. furthermore, your recomendation of seeking medical attention to produce more drug therapy is really rediculous. i will return when i can put some things in order for rebutle of your most tastless remarks and recommendations to people that need attention here.
signed tomo!
13 years recovering alcoholic and drug addict!! SERENITY- COURAGE- WISDOM AND GOOD ORDERLY DIRECTION <<<<<<< <<
Wow, 13 years of A.A. doublespeak had definitely left you with the illusion that their dogmatic thinking is correct. A.A. members to lack the ability, knowledge, understanding or wisdom needed to help another alcoholic truly recover. The disease concept was disproved in the 1890s and provided evidence that alcoholics not only have a conduct problem but they are also subject to magic thinking. This may sound ludicrous, but in his book “Slaying the Dragon,” William L. White noted that the Keeley Institutes helped many thousands of alcoholics to achieve long-term abstinence in the 1890s and later. They offered a miracle cure and provided clients with injections of a secret formula allegedly based on chlorides of gold, which supposedly took away all desire to drink or use drugs or tobacco. The injections were nothing more than a placebo. The secret formula says the author, was "a gimmick that engaged addicts' propensity for magical thinking and helped them through the early weeks and months of recovery." Obviously if a simple token action can arrest alcoholism, then it is definitely not a disease.
George Vaillant, Harvard psychiatrist and AA board member, discovered when following up Cambridge Hospital patients he treated using the twelve steps, including mandatory AA attendance, that 95 percent relapsed. And if that’s not bad enough, people exposed to AA are five times as likely to end up binge drinking (Brandsma study) and six times as likely to DIE as those attempting to quit on their own, according to George Vaillant, Harvard professor, researcher, and member of AA's Board of Trustees, when he went about trying to prove that AA works.
You have been sober 13 years and still consider yourself recovering. I have been sober 10 years and I considered myself recovered after the first year and I never attended one cult orientated 12 step A.A. meeting to do it.

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#40 Oct 29, 2009
mickey wrote:
<quoted text>
Wow, 13 years of A.A. doublespeak had definitely left you with the illusion that their dogmatic thinking is correct. A.A. members to lack the ability, knowledge, understanding or wisdom needed to help another alcoholic truly recover. The disease concept was disproved in the 1890s and provided evidence that alcoholics not only have a conduct problem but they are also subject to magic thinking. This may sound ludicrous, but in his book “Slaying the Dragon,” William L. White noted that the Keeley Institutes helped many thousands of alcoholics to achieve long-term abstinence in the 1890s and later. They offered a miracle cure and provided clients with injections of a secret formula allegedly based on chlorides of gold, which supposedly took away all desire to drink or use drugs or tobacco. The injections were nothing more than a placebo. The secret formula says the author, was "a gimmick that engaged addicts' propensity for magical thinking and helped them through the early weeks and months of recovery." Obviously if a simple token action can arrest alcoholism, then it is definitely not a disease.
George Vaillant, Harvard psychiatrist and AA board member, discovered when following up Cambridge Hospital patients he treated using the twelve steps, including mandatory AA attendance, that 95 percent relapsed. And if that’s not bad enough, people exposed to AA are five times as likely to end up binge drinking (Brandsma study) and six times as likely to DIE as those attempting to quit on their own, according to George Vaillant, Harvard professor, researcher, and member of AA's Board of Trustees, when he went about trying to prove that AA works.
You have been sober 13 years and still consider yourself recovering. I have been sober 10 years and I considered myself recovered after the first year and I never attended one cult orientated 12 step A.A. meeting to do it.
Couldn't have said it better myself.

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