Monroe militia? Man's arrest leads Feds to look into training range

There are 31 comments on the The Monroe Monitor & Valley News story from Jun 18, 2009, titled Monroe militia? Man's arrest leads Feds to look into training range. In it, The Monroe Monitor & Valley News reports that:

Clad in a dapper gray suit with a blue tie, a clean-cut Andrew Steven Gray, 32, of Monroe, sat in before a judge in a federal courtroom in Seattle Thursday and heard the penalties he could pay if convicted of the charges he faces.

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GPM

“DILLIGAF?”

Since: Aug 08

San Antonio, TX

#1 Jun 18, 2009
Why are pot and machineguns illegal in the first place? There is no Constitutional authority for these laws that the feds have forced upon us. They tried and failed to control alcohol and wound up giving us organized crime and corrupt officials. They banned ownership of fully automatic weapons without dispensation from the feds and payment of a bribe. The war on drugs started after drugs left the ghetto and became a white problem and no longer just a black thing. Suddenly drugs were evil.

Yeah, Gray broke the laws. If the laws are illegal and immoral, is it wrong to violate them? Once it was a crime to assist runaway slaves. Was it immoral to violate that law?

There are so many things wrong with this whole nasty mess that I could go on for pages here. But I won't. I hope that he gets someone on the jury like me who believes in jury nullification.
Dan from America

Ireland

#2 Jun 19, 2009
GPM wrote:
Why are pot and machineguns illegal in the first place? There is no Constitutional authority for these laws that the feds have forced upon us. They tried and failed to control alcohol and wound up giving us organized crime and corrupt officials. They banned ownership of fully automatic weapons without dispensation from the feds and payment of a bribe. The war on drugs started after drugs left the ghetto and became a white problem and no longer just a black thing. Suddenly drugs were evil.
Yeah, Gray broke the laws. If the laws are illegal and immoral, is it wrong to violate them? Once it was a crime to assist runaway slaves. Was it immoral to violate that law?
There are so many things wrong with this whole nasty mess that I could go on for pages here. But I won't. I hope that he gets someone on the jury like me who believes in jury nullification.
GPM, the many things wrong can be summed up like this, the controlled media and proagandists of the anti rights crowd has a picture to paint for future justification of rights violations. The event in the article and the "possibilities" of "criminal activity" is a stroke of the brush.

“Constitutionist/ SAF”

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#3 Jun 19, 2009
Well GPM, I know you're speaking for yourself because, according to your other posts, you're very much interested in controlling crime.
----------

Laws that make militias illegal are illegal and immoral.

Prohibition harms more than it protects, and govt should not be telling people what to ingest or not to ingest.

This case, topic, clearly proves that gun control laws fail.

Because of hypocritical people, like GPM and KBM, we have drug and gun laws that harm more than they protect.

Never forget, the most antigun people of all antigun people are police officers. They write the most letters to the most politicians asking them to regulate firearms. Cops (the cowardly ones who falsely claim they risk their lives everyday to keep us safe) benefit the most from gun control laws. Ninety-nine percent of all gun laws are designed (by cops) to disarm everyone except cops.

Most cops are Nazis by nature, and believe every individual should be forced to surrender their freedom for the benefit of every cops' safety (which they also claim is the same as the common good).

The typical cop believes his safety is more important than the safety of any other citizen. That's why we have gun control and hoplophobes. Police have a strong influence on the antigun newsmedia, which is responsible for the brainwashing of countless numbers of hoplophobes.

The primary role of police is to maintain public safety. Because of gun control, the safety of thousands of people has been compromised. Thousands have been robbed, beaten, raped and or murdered because they were unarmed at the time they were victimized.

Never forget, cops create more trouble than they prevent and harm more than they protect (as is typical of most govt entities). The crimes committed by police on society are so great, the cops could never admit their complicity (even if they wanted to).

Of course, I speak for myself, most folks would not have the courage to stand up to the most powerful bullies in America, and many more have been brainwashed by watching episodes of the reality based, edited, tv show COPS.

If we had half the numbers of cops we would all be more free and more safe.

GPM

“DILLIGAF?”

Since: Aug 08

San Antonio, TX

#4 Jun 19, 2009
Tory II wrote:
Well GPM, I know you're speaking for yourself because, according to your other posts, you're very much interested in controlling crime.
----------
Laws that make militias illegal are illegal and immoral.
Prohibition harms more than it protects, and govt should not be telling people what to ingest or not to ingest.
This case, topic, clearly proves that gun control laws fail.
Because of hypocritical people, like GPM and KBM, we have drug and gun laws that harm more than they protect.
Never forget, the most antigun people of all antigun people are police officers. They write the most letters to the most politicians asking them to regulate firearms. Cops (the cowardly ones who falsely claim they risk their lives everyday to keep us safe) benefit the most from gun control laws. Ninety-nine percent of all gun laws are designed (by cops) to disarm everyone except cops.
Most cops are Nazis by nature, and believe every individual should be forced to surrender their freedom for the benefit of every cops' safety (which they also claim is the same as the common good).
The typical cop believes his safety is more important than the safety of any other citizen. That's why we have gun control and hoplophobes. Police have a strong influence on the antigun newsmedia, which is responsible for the brainwashing of countless numbers of hoplophobes.
The primary role of police is to maintain public safety. Because of gun control, the safety of thousands of people has been compromised. Thousands have been robbed, beaten, raped and or murdered because they were unarmed at the time they were victimized.
Never forget, cops create more trouble than they prevent and harm more than they protect (as is typical of most govt entities). The crimes committed by police on society are so great, the cops could never admit their complicity (even if they wanted to).
Of course, I speak for myself, most folks would not have the courage to stand up to the most powerful bullies in America, and many more have been brainwashed by watching episodes of the reality based, edited, tv show COPS.
If we had half the numbers of cops we would all be more free and more safe.
Would you care to provide links or citations to my interest in controlling crime?

If you mean the crime of illegal border crossing and identity theft, yes, I am interested in controlling those crimes.

If you mean crimes like self medicating, suicide, and other crimes where the only victim is the perpetrator, you are very wrong in your understanding of my positions.

Tell me, is everything after the "-------" your stance or what you are ascribing to me? If it is the latter, you are exactly right. If it is the former, why are you attacking me? We agree.

I believe that consenting adults should be free to do anything short of killing each other with other consenting adults and that initiating violence for any reason except to stop the immediate threat of violence (the old "Clear and Present Danger" thing i.e. someone about to shoot you or launch an attack on our nation.) is wrong.
Jeff

Macedonia, OH

#5 Jun 19, 2009
What a waste of goverment...
A Liberal

Birmingham, AL

#6 Jun 19, 2009
Lock him up and throw away the key. He is after all a criminal.
Jeff

Macedonia, OH

#7 Jun 19, 2009
A Liberal wrote:
Lock him up and throw away the key. He is after all a criminal.
You sure about that? Try reading the bill of rights. If you don't like what you see you are free to leave.

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#8 Jun 19, 2009
A Liberal wrote:
Lock him up and throw away the key. He is after all a criminal.
So then, you =STILL= support the Scott v Sanford decision?
.
Uncle sam

Seattle, WA

#9 Jun 19, 2009
Our country was founded by a militia, so what are the Feds so afraid of ?

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#10 Jun 19, 2009
Jeff wrote:
<quoted text>
You sure about that? Try reading the bill of rights. If you don't like what you see you are free to leave.
You must understand that so-called 'modern liberals'(neoliberals) are really COMMUNOFASCISTS.
.
That this, they are communists possessing of a fascist bent: They want to use the force of government to accomplish their utopian wet dream.
.
The only way they can achieve that is to outlaw so many things as to turn the average citizen into a criminal.
.
Here's an apt example:
----------
"There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.
.
"Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced or objectively interpreted – and you create a nation of law-breakers – and then you cash in on guilt.
.
"Now that's the system, Mr. Reardon, that's the game, and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with."
.
Ayn Rand ('Atlas Shrugged' 1957)
----------

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#13 Jun 19, 2009
"It isn’t illegal to have a firing range, as long as shooting is done during daylight hours, but it is illegal to charge for its use without appropriate permits and licenses."

The owner of the land wasn't charging the shooter for using the range, it was club membership dues.

“I won't pay health insurance”

Since: Jun 07

Wenatchee, WA

#14 Jun 20, 2009
Well they caught one of those bad milita members. Now there are only a few million to go... hahaha

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#15 Jun 20, 2009
Uncle sam wrote:
Our country was founded by a militia, so what are the Feds so afraid of ?
The militia.

GPM

“DILLIGAF?”

Since: Aug 08

San Antonio, TX

#16 Jun 20, 2009
Uncle sam wrote:
Our country was founded by a militia, so what are the Feds so afraid of ?
And they are very thankful to those long dead militia members. Without them, the current federal oligarchs would not be in power now.

The feds fear losing power. They know how the militia broke the American public free from the shackles of rogue government when they kicked King George and his stormtroopers out of the colonies and founded our nation.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#17 Jun 20, 2009
Alex wrote:
Well they caught one of those bad milita members. Now there are only a few million to go... hahaha
Try about a couple hundred million and even then, foreigners can be recruited into the state's militia. If that keg need be tapped, the top end is unlimited.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#18 Jun 20, 2009
Highlander wrote:
<quoted text>
The militia.
Try citizens and those who have or shall have declared an intent to become citizens. It gets to be a really big number when all things are considered.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#19 Jun 20, 2009
Uncle sam wrote:
Our country was founded by a militia, so what are the Feds so afraid of ?
I don't think the "feds" are affraid of anything, after all, they are the people. However, their administrators ought to be thinking about how badly they are performing or they might get fired.

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#20 Jun 21, 2009
Richard_ wrote:
<quoted text>I don't think the "feds" are affraid of anything, after all, they are the people. However, their administrators ought to be thinking about how badly they are performing or they might get fired.
I dunno, Richard.
.
You see? The ones in 'permanent' office —the anointed appointed— are the ones you =REALLY= must keep an eye upon, for while the elected ones change, the REAL power behind any elected office is that bureaucracy which sustains the train of thought of the ones who appointed/hired them.
.
Bureaucracy is ~the~ truest essence of what we might refer to as 'hysteresis': That which is least willing to change in the face of change by dint of its 'inertia.'
.
And since the differences —lately— between the R's and the D's really aren't, then you see that it's really the bureaucracy which sustains the whole theme — and scheme.
.
So then, and in that vein, the 'administrators' are really the ones which are the cause of the matter, and they realize that they won't be getting fired anytime soon, if at all.
.
A Liberal

Birmingham, AL

#21 Jun 22, 2009
Jeff wrote:
<quoted text>
You sure about that? Try reading the bill of rights. If you don't like what you see you are free to leave.
And so are you. Feel free to leave anytime. No body is coming to take my guns, or my lack of guns.
Jeff

Macedonia, OH

#22 Jun 22, 2009
A Liberal wrote:
<quoted text>
And so are you. Feel free to leave anytime. No body is coming to take my guns, or my lack of guns.
Huh?

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