It's the Guns, Stupid

It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103293 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

GunShow1

“Shall NOT be infringed!”

Since: Apr 13

San Jose, CA.

#107453 May 14, 2013
Stay wrote:
<quoted text>
stupid and spout your old clichés. The world will pass you by.
Here's an old cliche for you, troll:

"Sir, may not human institutions, made by the best wisdom of man for human preservation, receive the light of illustration from institutions established for the same beneficent purpose, by the ordinances of the Diety himself? "The Judge of all the earth" has expounded the laws of the Eternal, so that his prohibition against "shedding man's blood" does aid, not abrogate, his own paramount law of self-preservation, but, in effect, place a weapon in each man's hands to shed that blood in his own defence. Who, then, will, or can deny, to a whole people, united and embodied in the persons of their representatives, under that great institution, their political law--that constitution which makes them a nation, and forms their representatives into a sovereignty--who, I say, dares deny to that sovereignty the same rights of self-defence which appertain, not only to every individual of that nation, but also to every animated being throughout the universe!..."

"[Pages 2971-72]... France has drenched the streets of her own beloved Paris in blood, to secure "freedom of the press." The type, sir, the type must pioneer the sword in the march of freedom. The voice of eloquence may startle the oppressed from his slumber of ages--it may shake the tyrant on his throne of a hundred descents, if they may be found within the compass of its mighty volume; but the more efficient powers of the press may spread out the printed roll of human rights before every human eye. Dare we, sir, dare we snatch that printed roll from the hand of the American people; and that, too, when it is fraught with our own doings touching their own concernments, entrusted by them in our management, but to their use and for their benefit?

"Sir, I do not recollect any thing material, said by the learned advocate, which now remains unanswered: for I pass over, as utterly unworthy of any reply, the allegation that the deed of daring done by the respondent was done by him because a certain letter was not answered by the gentleman from Ohio; not because words were spoken, or because words were printed, but because words were not written; not for a wrong done, but for not doing a wrong. Equally unworthy of notice is the poor evasion which labored to censure the gentleman from Ohio for carrying arms to secure his own personal safety. The bravo--the ruffian--may fill his belt with pistols, and his bosom with dirk-knives, and threaten violence to peaceable citizens, and do all this with perfect impunity; but if such citizens take to themselves weapons for purposes of self-defence--the only lawful cause for which men may ever wear such weapons--they are, as it is said, guilty of provoking aggression, and justly liable to punishment for any violation of the public peace, committed by any assault made on their own person."--Mr. Trisam Burges, Representative of Rhode Island, May 11, 1832.[Debates in Congress. Part III. of Vol. VIII. Register of Debates in Congress, Comprising The Leading Debates And Incidents Of The First Sssion of the Twenty-Second Congree: Together With An Appendix, Containing Important State Papers and Public Documents, and the Laws Enacted During The Session; With a Copius Index to the whole. Volume VIII. Washington: Printed and Published by Gales & Seaton. 1838.]
http://gunshowonthenet.blogspot.com/2013/05/t...
Uuuh

United States

#107454 May 14, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>
California leads nation in 2012 tech employment

WASHINGTON, D.C.
May 14, 2013 8:57am

• State’s tech workers earn highest wage –$123,900

•“California remains a critical state for the technology industry”

California's tech industry added 17,700 net jobs between 2011 and 2012, for a total of 968,800 jobs, the most tech workers in the nation, according to a report Tuesday from TechAmerica Foundation.

The report, now in its 15th year, looks at tech employment, wages, and other key economic factors nationally and state-by-state.

California’s growth was led by such industry sectors as computer systems design (+9,600) and R&D and testing labs (+4,600).

California continued to lead the nation by most tech industry metrics, including employment, wages, payroll, and establishments. The state’s tech workers had the nation’s highest annual average wage at $123,900, which is 131 percent more than the state’s average private sector wage of $53,600.

“California remains a critical state for the technology industry,” says Matthew Kazmierczak, vice president of TechAmerica Foundation and author of the report.

He says the tech industry employs some 7.8 percent of California’s private sector workforce.

Nationally, the U.S. tech industry added 67,400 net jobs in 2012, for a total of 5.95 million workers, growing at 1.1 percent, and representing 5.4 percent of the entire private sector workforce. Overall, the average U.S. tech wage was $93,800 compared to $47,700 for the average private sector worker.

The report is based data from the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics.

http://www.centralvalleybusinesstimes.com/sto...
Yep

United States

#107455 May 14, 2013
GunShow1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's an old cliche for you, troll:
"
old and irrelevant, like yourself.
spocko

Oakland, CA

#107457 May 14, 2013
GunShow1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's an old cliche for you, troll:
"Sir, may not human institutions, made by the best wisdom of man for human preservation, receive the light of illustration from institutions established for the same beneficent purpose, by the ordinances of the Diety himself? "The Judge of all the earth" has expounded the laws of the Eternal, so that his prohibition against "shedding man's blood" does aid, not abrogate, his own paramount law of self-preservation, but, in effect, place a weapon in each man's hands to shed that blood in his own defence. Who, then, will, or can deny, to a whole people, united and embodied in the persons of their representatives, under that great institution, their political law--that constitution which makes them a nation, and forms their representatives into a sovereignty--who, I say, dares deny to that sovereignty the same rights of self-defence which appertain, not only to every individual of that nation, but also to every animated being throughout the universe!..."
"[Pages 2971-72]... France has drenched the streets of her own beloved Paris in blood, to secure "freedom of the press." The type, sir, the type must pioneer the sword in the march of freedom. The voice of eloquence may startle the oppressed from his slumber of ages--it may shake the tyrant on his throne of a hundred descents, if they may be found within the compass of its mighty volume; but the more efficient powers of the press may spread out the printed roll of human rights before every human eye. Dare we, sir, dare we snatch that printed roll from the hand of the American people; and that, too, when it is fraught with our own doings touching their own concernments, entrusted by them in our management, but to their use and for their benefit?
"Sir, I do not recollect any thing material, said by the learned advocate, which now remains unanswered: for I pass over, as utterly unworthy of any reply, the allegation that the deed of daring done by the respondent was done by him because a certain letter was not answered by the gentleman from Ohio; not because words were spoken, or because words were printed, but because words were not written; not for a wrong done, but for not doing a wrong. Equally unworthy of notice is the poor evasion which labored to censure the gentleman from Ohio for carrying arms to secure his own personal safety. The bravo--the ruffian--may fill his belt with pistols, and his bosom with dirk-knives, and threaten violence to peaceable citizens, and do all this with perfect impunity; but if such citizens take to themselves weapons for purposes of self-defence--the only lawful cause for which men may ever wear such weapons--they are, as it is said, guilty of provoking aggression, and justly liable to punishment for any violation of the public peace, committed by any assault made on their own person."--Mr. Trisam Burges, Representative of Rhode Island, May 11, 1832.[Debates in Congress. Part III. of Vol. VIII. Register of Debates in Congress, Comprising The Leading Debates And Incidents Of The First Sssion of the Twenty-Second Congree: Together With .]
http://gunshowonthenet.blogspot.com/2013/05/t...
I’m sorry but you Sir are a friggen idiot!
I wouldn't use the word "smarter." But I will say, as a whole, humanity knows more, a lot more, about the workings of the world we live in than we did 200 years ago. But I would also say it's due to the wisdom & collective learning from those who came before us. Does it not seem crazy to think that I know stuff Einstein didn't know? Not because I’m as smart as he, not even close, but because it wasn't known during his time. I would say we owe a great deal to those who came before us so we could appreciate where we are now (at least some of us), and we should do the same for future generations.
Teaman

Abingdon, VA

#107458 May 14, 2013
Uuuh wrote:
<quoted text>
California leads nation in 2012 tech employment
WASHINGTON, D.C.
May 14, 2013 8:57am
• State’s tech workers earn highest wage –$123,900
•“California remains a critical state for the technology industry”
California's tech industry added 17,700 net jobs between 2011 and 2012, for a total of 968,800 jobs, the most tech workers in the nation, according to a report Tuesday from TechAmerica Foundation.
The report, now in its 15th year, looks at tech employment, wages, and other key economic factors nationally and state-by-state.
California’s growth was led by such industry sectors as computer systems design (+9,600) and R&D and testing labs (+4,600).
California continued to lead the nation by most tech industry metrics, including employment, wages, payroll, and establishments. The state’s tech workers had the nation’s highest annual average wage at $123,900, which is 131 percent more than the state’s average private sector wage of $53,600.
“California remains a critical state for the technology industry,” says Matthew Kazmierczak, vice president of TechAmerica Foundation and author of the report.
He says the tech industry employs some 7.8 percent of California’s private sector workforce.
Nationally, the U.S. tech industry added 67,400 net jobs in 2012, for a total of 5.95 million workers, growing at 1.1 percent, and representing 5.4 percent of the entire private sector workforce. Overall, the average U.S. tech wage was $93,800 compared to $47,700 for the average private sector worker.
The report is based data from the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics.
http://www.centralvalleybusinesstimes.com/sto...
Enjoy it while it lasts. Nebraska is catching up.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#107459 May 14, 2013
GunShow1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's an old cliche for you, troll:
"Sir, may not human institutions, made by the best wisdom of man for human preservation, receive the light of illustration from institutions established for the same beneficent purpose, by the ordinances of the Diety himself? "The Judge of all the earth" has expounded the laws of the Eternal, so that his prohibition against "shedding man's blood" does aid, not abrogate, his own paramount law of self-preservation, but, in effect, place a weapon in each man's hands to shed that blood in his own defence. Who, then, will, or can deny, to a whole people, united and embodied in the persons of their representatives, under that great institution, their political law--that constitution which makes them a nation, and forms their representatives into a sovereignty--who, I say, dares deny to that sovereignty the same rights of self-defence which appertain, not only to every individual of that nation, but also to every animated being throughout the universe!..."
"[Pages 2971-72]... France has drenched the streets of her own beloved Paris in blood, to secure "freedom of the press." The type, sir, the type must pioneer the sword in the march of freedom. The voice of eloquence may startle the oppressed from his slumber of ages--it may shake the tyrant on his throne of a hundred descents, if they may be found within the compass of its mighty volume; but the more efficient powers of the press may spread out the printed roll of human rights before every human eye. Dare we, sir, dare we snatch that printed roll from the hand of the American people; and that, too, when it is fraught with our own doings touching their own concernments, entrusted by them in our management, but to their use and for their benefit?
"Sir, I do not recollect any thing material, said by the learned advocate, which now remains unanswered: for I pass over, as utterly unworthy of any reply, the allegation that the deed of daring done by the respondent was done by him because a certain letter was not answered by the gentleman from Ohio; not because words were spoken, or because words were printed, but because words were not written; not for a wrong done, but for not doing a wrong. Equally unworthy of notice is the poor evasion which labored to censure the gentleman from Ohio for carrying arms to secure his own personal safety. The bravo--the ruffian--may fill his belt with pistols, and his bosom with dirk-knives, and threaten violence to peaceable citizens, and do all this with perfect impunity; but if such citizens take to themselves weapons for purposes of self-defence--the only lawful cause for which men may ever wear such weapons--they are, as it is said, guilty of provoking aggression, and justly liable to punishment for any violation of the public peace, committed by any assault made on their own person."--Mr. Trisam Burges, Representative of Rhode Island, May 11, 1832.[Debates in Congress. Part III. of Vol. VIII. Register of Debates in Congress, Comprising The Leading Debates And Incidents Of The First Sssion of the Twenty-Second Congree: Together With An Appendix, Containing Important State Papers and Public Documents, and the Laws Enacted During The Session; With a Copius Index to the whole. Volume VIII. Washington: Printed and Published by Gales & Seaton. 1838.]
http://gunshowonthenet.blogspot.com/2013/05/t...
Get help!
downhill246

Boca Raton, FL

#107460 May 14, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps that is why CA is 8th largest economy in world - ye brainless moron!!


California's economy is the 12th largest economy in the world (2012)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Calif...
spocko

Oakland, CA

#107462 May 14, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
California's economy is the 12th largest economy in the world (2012)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Calif...
California is the largest and most productive economy in the US. Although agriculture is gradually yielding to industry as the core of the state's economy, California leads the nation in the production of fruits and vegetables. The state's most valuable crops are grapes, cotton, flowers, and oranges; dairy products, however, contribute the single largest share of farm income. The state also produces the major share of U.S. domestic wine. California's farms are highly productive as a result of good soil, a long growing season, and the use of modern agricultural methods.
Teaman

Abingdon, VA

#107463 May 14, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
California is the largest and most productive economy in the US. Although agriculture is gradually yielding to industry as the core of the state's economy, California leads the nation in the production of fruits and vegetables. The state's most valuable crops are grapes, cotton, flowers, and oranges; dairy products, however, contribute the single largest share of farm income. The state also produces the major share of U.S. domestic wine. California's farms are highly productive as a result of good soil, a long growing season, and the use of modern agricultural methods.
It certainly leads the nation in the production of fruits. No argument there.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#107464 May 14, 2013
Stay wrote:
<quoted text>
stupid and spout your old clichés. The world will pass you by.
world isn't passing me by and I am not part of the Welfare Society.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#107465 May 14, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
California is the largest and most productive economy in the US. Although agriculture is gradually yielding to industry as the core of the state's economy, California leads the nation in the production of fruits and vegetables. The state's most valuable crops are grapes, cotton, flowers, and oranges; dairy products, however, contribute the single largest share of farm income. The state also produces the major share of U.S. domestic wine. California's farms are highly productive as a result of good soil, a long growing season, and the use of modern agricultural methods.
May 10, 2013, 3:00am PDT

Surprise! California ranks worst state for business on another list

It's another day, with another list slapping California as a place unfriendly to businesses. According to a survey of more than 700 CEOs, California ranks dead last.

The survey by Chief Executive magazine ranks the best and worst states, measuring CEO opinions on regulations, tax policies, workforce quality, educational resources, quality of living and infrastructure.

California got dinged for taxes, and workforce quality, but got fairly high marks for living environment. Everyone loves the weather here, right? The state’s relatively high unemployment rate -- 9.8 percent in December -- compared to the national average didn’t help the rating.

http://www.bizjournals.com/sacramento/news/20...
Teaman

Abingdon, VA

#107466 May 14, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>
May 10, 2013, 3:00am PDT
Surprise! California ranks worst state for business on another list
It's another day, with another list slapping California as a place unfriendly to businesses. According to a survey of more than 700 CEOs, California ranks dead last.
The survey by Chief Executive magazine ranks the best and worst states, measuring CEO opinions on regulations, tax policies, workforce quality, educational resources, quality of living and infrastructure.
California got dinged for taxes, and workforce quality, but got fairly high marks for living environment. Everyone loves the weather here, right? The state’s relatively high unemployment rate -- 9.8 percent in December -- compared to the national average didn’t help the rating.
http://www.bizjournals.com/sacramento/news/20...
I thought NJ was third from the bottom. Looks like we're fifth from the bottom. Watta ya know!
surprise

Huntsville, AL

#107467 May 14, 2013
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
It certainly leads the nation in the production of fruits. No argument there.
surprise. teabagging gun nut is a bigot too
Really

Huntsville, AL

#107468 May 14, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>
May 10, 2013, 3:00am PDT

measuring CEO opinions on regulations, tax policies, workforce quality, educational resources, quality of living and infrastructure.
corporate CEO whiners want the good life but don't want to pay taxes or follow the rules.

Meanwhile the state moves forward...
GoGoBar

Thailand

#107469 May 14, 2013
Cut to the chase.
What about the women?
Are the beach boys still correct?
Is it Baywatch all summer?

GunShow1

“Shall NOT be infringed!”

Since: Apr 13

San Jose, CA.

#107471 May 14, 2013
Really wrote:
<quoted text>
corporate CEO whiners want the good life but don't want to pay taxes or follow the rules....
The same ones that supported your 'master' obummer, RIGHT?

GunShow1

“Shall NOT be infringed!”

Since: Apr 13

San Jose, CA.

#107472 May 14, 2013
surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
surprise. teabagging gun nut is a bigot too
I'm definitely a "bigot", AGAINST LIE-BERAL SCUMBAGS.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#107473 May 14, 2013
GunShow1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm definitely a "bigot", AGAINST LIE-BERAL SCUMBAGS.
Right the Bigots are the Modern Pseudo Liberals who parade around calling themselves Liberals and there is nothing Liberal about anything they advocate in the name of Liberalism in what it meant to be a Liberal if anything they should be calling themselves Leninist instead which a lot of them align with in Ideology.

Classical Liberalism as an Ideology

Classical liberalism was the political philosophy of the Founding Fathers. It permeates the Constitution, the Federalist Papers and many other documents produced by the people who created the American system of government. Many emancipationists who opposed slavery were essentially classical liberals, as were the suffragettes, who fought for equal rights for women.

Basically, classical liberalism is based on a belief in liberty. Even today, one of the clearest statements of this philosophy is found in the Declaration of Independence. In 1776, most people believed that rights came from government. People thought they had only such rights as government elected to give them. But following British philosopher John Locke, Jefferson argued that it’s the other way around. People have rights apart from government, as part of their nature. Further, people can both form governments and dissolve them. The only legitimate purpose of government is to protect these rights.

http://www.ncpa.org/pub/classical-liberalism-...
GoGoBar

Thailand

#107474 May 14, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>Right the Bigots are the Modern Pseudo Liberals who parade around calling themselves Liberals and there is nothing Liberal about anything they advocate in the name of Liberalism in what it meant to be a Liberal if anything they should be calling themselves Leninist instead which a lot of them align with in Ideology.
Classical Liberalism as an Ideology
Classical liberalism was the political philosophy of the Founding Fathers. It permeates the Constitution, the Federalist Papers and many other documents produced by the people who created the American system of government. Many emancipationists who opposed slavery were essentially classical liberals, as were the suffragettes, who fought for equal rights for women.
Basically, classical liberalism is based on a belief in liberty. Even today, one of the clearest statements of this philosophy is found in the Declaration of Independence. In 1776, most people believed that rights came from government. People thought they had only such rights as government elected to give them. But following British philosopher John Locke, Jefferson argued that it’s the other way around. People have rights apart from government, as part of their nature. Further, people can both form governments and dissolve them. The only legitimate purpose of government is to protect these rights.
http://www.ncpa.org/pub/classical-liberalism-...
Well, it must have been wonderful. Right up until the civil war.
Then the loss of the slave labour, the end of free land to Colonise and bingo. Right back to where Europe is. A socall market based economy with ever shrinking consumer choices between merged corporations.
Walmart just surpassed Exxon-Mobil in profits.

It is still hard to determine what exact rights the USA has over other Advanced Nations.

GunShow1

“Shall NOT be infringed!”

Since: Apr 13

San Jose, CA.

#107476 May 14, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>Right the Bigots are the Modern Pseudo Liberals who parade around calling themselves Liberals and there is nothing Liberal about anything they advocate in the name of Liberalism in what it meant to be a Liberal if anything they should be calling themselves Leninist instead which a lot of them align with in Ideology.
Classical Liberalism as an Ideology
Classical liberalism was the political philosophy of the Founding Fathers. It permeates the Constitution, the Federalist Papers and many other documents produced by the people who created the American system of government. Many emancipationists who opposed slavery were essentially classical liberals, as were the suffragettes, who fought for equal rights for women.
Basically, classical liberalism is based on a belief in liberty. Even today, one of the clearest statements of this philosophy is found in the Declaration of Independence. In 1776, most people believed that rights came from government. People thought they had only such rights as government elected to give them. But following British philosopher John Locke, Jefferson argued that it’s the other way around. People have rights apart from government, as part of their nature. Further, people can both form governments and dissolve them. The only legitimate purpose of government is to protect these rights.
http://www.ncpa.org/pub/classical-liberalism-...
"And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God?"--Thomas Jefferson

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