It's the Guns, Stupid

Apr 20, 2007 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: Truthdig

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

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Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

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#106358
May 2, 2013
 

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Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>so now your discrediting you own posted facts.
Just giving you a taste of your own medicine...anyone can pull statistics out to back up an argument, the difference is I know they don't, idiots like you keep using them and the only thing you understand is if someone one ups your argument with statistics...and it is all bunkum...If it wasn't the NRA wouldn't catch so many of you losers with them...

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

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#106359
May 2, 2013
 

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Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>you don't like the facts that are true and want to keep denying them besides just look at the suicide rate in Australia compared to the US and you Australians kept posting that after the guns were banned it went down but it is still higher than the US who allows their citizen to possess guns so it proves guns were not the problem for Australia's suicide rate or extremely higher then.
http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Australia...
Our suicide rate has been in decline since gun control...It is lower than the US and the reason again you can't provide statistics to prove or disprove this is because a person intent on committing suicide might do it by making it look like an accident or go in and shoot up a school and get killed by law enforcement...can you see why you can't get an accurate account with statistics...they can only prove the ones that look like suicide and some of them have proved to be murder you noong...here suck on these statistics seeing you are so hell bent on using them dummy..looks like you rate of suicide is higher than Australia's here...go figure...sheesh.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countrie...
America at 19.5 Australia are at 14.9 that means you are wrong again....if you believe such shite.
And in all of our statistics suicide has steadily declined since gun control....you tit..
GoGoBar

Bangkok, Thailand

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#106360
May 2, 2013
 

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Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
Our founders were radical alright. They were against big oppressive, forceful, imposing governments of the day. Progressives are not. They expand the scope and power of government.
FDR was a hysterical right winger? LOL What history book are you reading?
FDR died well before the decision to nuke Japan.
Most historians agree that he would not have given the order.

I dont see any radical gun bearing founders sons fighting the new "Monarchy" in Washington. Just a call for the Federal Govt. to supply more armed guards to stop gunnuts massacreing people.
EuroBoy

Sweden

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#106361
May 2, 2013
 
GoGoBar wrote:
<quoted text>
FDR died well before the decision to nuke Japan.
Most historians agree that he would not have given the order.
I dont see any radical gun bearing founders sons fighting the new "Monarchy" in Washington. Just a call for the Federal Govt. to supply more armed guards to stop gunnuts massacreing people.
So sayeth GoGoBar the pedophile
Larry

Australia

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#106362
May 2, 2013
 

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FormerParatrooper wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a difference between smoking and committing a crime. While both are choices, only one is unlawful.
Reduce the amount of criminals, reduce crime.
If it were the fault of the gun, there would be more crime. Yet 99% of all gun owners do not commit crime. It is the person
People take up smoking every day

People take up crime every day

The cigarette causes lung cancer

The bullet causes a shooting death.
Larry

Australia

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#106363
May 2, 2013
 

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Without the cigarette there is no lung cancer.

Without the gun there is no shooting deaths.

There will always be people who dont care for their health.

There will always be people who resort to crime.

Since: Aug 11

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#106364
May 2, 2013
 
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
Just giving you a taste of your own medicine...anyone can pull statistics out to back up an argument, the difference is I know they don't, idiots like you keep using them and the only thing you understand is if someone one ups your argument with statistics...and it is all bunkum...If it wasn't the NRA wouldn't catch so many of you losers with them...
you are not giving me any medicines its idiots like you know those statistics are are true and Chicago Illinois is proof and you would deny those statistics about Chicago Illinois too.
Larry

Australia

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#106365
May 2, 2013
 
EuroBoy wrote:
<quoted text>
So sayeth GoGoBar the pedophile
you are a sackless fool at times mate, if I m in sydney am I all of a sudden a bikie selling speed?

Since: Aug 11

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#106367
May 2, 2013
 

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Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
Our suicide rate has been in decline since gun control...It is lower than the US and the reason again you can't provide statistics to prove or disprove this is because a person intent on committing suicide might do it by making it look like an accident or go in and shoot up a school and get killed by law enforcement...can you see why you can't get an accurate account with statistics...they can only prove the ones that look like suicide and some of them have proved to be murder you noong...here suck on these statistics seeing you are so hell bent on using them dummy..looks like you rate of suicide is higher than Australia's here...go figure...sheesh.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countrie...
America at 19.5 Australia are at 14.9 that means you are wrong again....if you believe such shite.
And in all of our statistics suicide has steadily declined since gun control....you tit..
you are full of BS because those suicide rates have went up in Australia and here comparing the United States V Australia side by side.

http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Australia...

Suicide rates in ages 15-24 (most recent) by country

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat...

Suicide rates in ages 25-34 (most recent) by country

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat...

Since: Jan 11

Mount Holly, NJ

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#106368
May 2, 2013
 

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GoGoBar wrote:
<quoted text>
FDR died well before the decision to nuke Japan.
Most historians agree that he would not have given the order.
I dont see any radical gun bearing founders sons fighting the new "Monarchy" in Washington. Just a call for the Federal Govt. to supply more armed guards to stop gunnuts massacreing people.
FDR approved the development of the bomb. Another progressive used it. FDR's New Deal simply became Truman's fair Deal.

The sons of the founders fighting the new monarchy in Washington would be us.:-) Legally that is. It's difficult to overcome a partisan press though. Actually enforcing the laws we have now would be nice. State laws, that is.

Since: Jan 11

Mount Holly, NJ

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#106370
May 2, 2013
 

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Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
What would you call the NRA then Teaman?
I wouldn't call them hysterical.:-)
Larry

Australia

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#106371
May 2, 2013
 

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Not every person that smokes dies of lung cancer.

not every person that owns a gun commits suicide or shoots someone.

But we know that cigarettes cause cancer and we know that guns kill people.

Someone has to light up a cigarette, someone has to pull the trigger of the gun, both choices, but if we know some thing is highly undesirable like lung cancer and shooting deaths, do we just do nothing, or do we take action, cooperate and implement change?

Since: Jan 11

Mount Holly, NJ

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#106372
May 2, 2013
 
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
You cannot call what you have gun control Teaman...in order for it to be affective all states, territories etc must get on board...it is good that some have started but they are fighting an uphill battle in a country where most states are still lax and free with their gun laws....:)
That wouldn't really work here. NJ really doesn't have a need for guns, therefor most people don't own one by choice. Someone living in the wilderness of Alaska would have a real need for a gun. A one size fits all law wouldn't work. The states have the ability to adjust to their own needs.

Most guns used in crimes in Chicago were straw purchased within the boundaries of the same state. Yet, Illinois doesn't address it with tougher state regulations. Why should someone who is abiding by the law in another state be punished for it?

http://www.suntimes.com/news/crime/14715658-4...
Larry

Australia

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#106373
May 2, 2013
 

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Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text> you are full of BS because those suicide rates have went up in Australia and here comparing the United States V Australia side by side.
http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Australia...
Suicide rates in ages 15-24 (most recent) by country
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat...
Suicide rates in ages 25-34 (most recent) by country
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat...
the point is,our suicide rate has been quite high in the past. Not as high as Finland, but higher than the US. Since gun control, the rate dropped dramatically, especially in the age range that is likely to be able to own or access a gun.
All suicde is a tragedy, but the massive drop that has occurred in Australias rate happened in the year after gun control.
Larry

Australia

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#106376
May 2, 2013
 

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Just like the USA, Australia is a big place and some areas or regions have a much higher suicide rate than others.

Since: Jan 11

Mount Holly, NJ

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#106377
May 2, 2013
 

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Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
People take up smoking every day
People take up crime every day
The cigarette causes lung cancer
The bullet causes a shooting death.
A person must fire that bullet and put the cigarette in his mouth.

People choose not to smoke and people choose not to own a gun. That's different from government force.

Since: Jan 11

Mount Holly, NJ

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#106378
May 2, 2013
 

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Larry wrote:
Without the cigarette there is no lung cancer.
Without the gun there is no shooting deaths.
There will always be people who dont care for their health.
There will always be people who resort to crime.
"There will always be people who resort to crime."

So, enhance the sentences of criminals who commit crimes with a gun instead letting them plea bargain to a lesser crime.

No need to screw with people who committed no crimes.
Larry

Australia

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#106382
May 2, 2013
 
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
"There will always be people who resort to crime."
So, enhance the sentences of criminals who commit crimes with a gun instead letting them plea bargain to a lesser crime.
No need to screw with people who committed no crimes.
The person who has owned a gun for ten years and never used it, but in an entirely sensible way is most people.

Now let me explain. That person suffers a relationship break up, they loose their job, suicide?

That person comes home to find his wife with another man, murder?

In both cases the gun has been used for most of the time in the right way.

What if a younger son gets the gun?

An angry spouse?

There is no risk free ownership of a gun.
Larry

Australia

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#106383
May 2, 2013
 
Off topic, where is your best farmland in the US?
Larry

Australia

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#106384
May 2, 2013
 

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Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
That wouldn't really work here. NJ really doesn't have a need for guns, therefor most people don't own one by choice. Someone living in the wilderness of Alaska would have a real need for a gun. A one size fits all law wouldn't work. The states have the ability to adjust to their own needs.
Most guns used in crimes in Chicago were straw purchased within the boundaries of the same state. Yet, Illinois doesn't address it with tougher state regulations. Why should someone who is abiding by the law in another state be punished for it?
http://www.suntimes.com/news/crime/14715658-4...
yeah I ll recognise that point, we dont have the bears, just venemous snakes and monster crocodiles, like I mean monsters.

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