It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103340 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105916 Apr 29, 2013
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105917 Apr 29, 2013
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105918 Apr 29, 2013
Becky

Yangzhou, China

#105919 Apr 29, 2013
bread wrote:
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
Shut the f*ck Ahomona up you fat unemployed useless bitch.
Go and die. Stop burdening Australian tax payers with your fat unemployed welfare sponge self.
Why should America listen to what a lowlife welfare cheat who is too lazy to get off her fat ass and work has to say.
You are starting to repeat yourself
Larry

Australia

#105920 Apr 29, 2013
Tray wrote:
<quoted text> If it were relevant. You already had an almost nonexistant mass shooting rate. You have 1/ 5th the population of the US so yes logic says less number of victims. Suicide rates are not linked to method PROVEN by Japans high suicide rate. You are fed carefully worded propaganda and facts twisted to fit an agenda. You heard what you wanted to hear with no question. I can say 99.9% of crimes were committed by criminals wearing shoes but that pldoes not link shoes to criminal behavior but if you are anti shoe chances are you would buy it.


You need to understand what rates are mate. When rates are talked about it does not matter what the population size is. No two countries in the world have the exact same number of people in them, thats the whole reason rates are used aye.

The rate used is per 100 000 , it doesnt matter if your population is one million or one billion, per 100 000.

Can your false logic on bigger population is going to have higher rate. The number of victims proportional to population size is how a rate is formed.

Americas shooting death rates are consistantly many times higher than Australia.

Your take on Japan is very narrow. The Japanese are a different ethnicity, different culture, life pressures and expectations. They actually have quite a low rate of gun violence. Their suicide rate clearly reflects many other factors.
It has not changed significantly.

Australias suicide rate dropped in the years after gun control measures were introduced. A very desirable trend.
Larry

Australia

#105921 Apr 29, 2013
Ahomana wrote:
And for anyone who says we stand by America 100% they are lying...we stand by Britain 100% New Zealand 100% but we only involve ourselves militarily, with America when we have to...that is the truth...not the bullshit others will tell you...they are suck ups and don't know our history well!
Our history has and always will, be tied to Britain and any sovereign British country, they call we go.
America has never had any credibility here even before WW2 and their dismal late entry into that war.
Loyal to the mother country.. If only Qantas went with a British airway, now you cant order a pork chop on your flight. The out rage. I m sure 95 % of the country agrees.
America is a very close international friend of Australias gun differences aside.
Larry

Australia

#105922 Apr 29, 2013
We're all mates, old friends.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#105923 Apr 29, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
You need to understand what rates are mate. When rates are talked about it does not matter what the population size is. No two countries in the world have the exact same number of people in them, thats the whole reason rates are used aye.
The rate used is per 100 000 , it doesnt matter if your population is one million or one billion, per 100 000.
Can your false logic on bigger population is going to have higher rate. The number of victims proportional to population size is how a rate is formed.
Americas shooting death rates are consistantly many times higher than Australia.
Your take on Japan is very narrow. The Japanese are a different ethnicity, different culture, life pressures and expectations. They actually have quite a low rate of gun violence. Their suicide rate clearly reflects many other factors.
It has not changed significantly.
Australias suicide rate dropped in the years after gun control measures were introduced. A very desirable trend.
Crime Rate Increases with Australia's gun Ban

Larry

Australia

#105924 Apr 29, 2013
The united Nations
Larry

Australia

#105925 Apr 29, 2013
Ah I m done .. What about this weather? How I always dream of owning a backyard pool. Put a heap of ice cubes in it and go for a swim at night.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#105926 Apr 29, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
You need to understand what rates are mate. When rates are talked about it does not matter what the population size is. No two countries in the world have the exact same number of people in them, thats the whole reason rates are used aye.
The rate used is per 100 000 , it doesnt matter if your population is one million or one billion, per 100 000.
Can your false logic on bigger population is going to have higher rate. The number of victims proportional to population size is how a rate is formed.
Americas shooting death rates are consistantly many times higher than Australia.
Your take on Japan is very narrow. The Japanese are a different ethnicity, different culture, life pressures and expectations. They actually have quite a low rate of gun violence. Their suicide rate clearly reflects many other factors.
It has not changed significantly.
Australias suicide rate dropped in the years after gun control measures were introduced. A very desirable trend.
Australian Gun Ban Facts & Statistics

It has now been over 10 years since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own Government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.

The statistics for the years following the ban are now in:

Accidental gun deaths are 300% higher than the pre-1997 ban rate
The assault rate has increased 800% since 1991, and increased 200% since the 1997 gun ban.
Robbery and armed robbery have increase 20% from the pre-97 ban rate.
From immediately after the ban was instituted in 1997 through 2002, the robbery and armed robbery rate was up 200% over the pre-ban rates.
In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 171 percent.

There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort, and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns.

The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it. While the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not, and criminals still possess their guns. Criminals in Australia now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws ONLY adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.

Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late! The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson. With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.

One final statistic...

Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 170 million

"The sword is more important than the shield, and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental."- John Steinbeck

http://www.reasonorforce.com/2010/08/australi...
Larry

Australia

#105927 Apr 29, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>Crime Rate Increases with Australia's gun Ban
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =hoAFOHbicqEXX
Not true.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#105928 Apr 29, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
Not true.
whatever Chicago, Illinois has confirmed it too with their Gun Ban that has been in place for years and has seen noting but a high crime & homicide rates.
Teaman

Mount Holly, NJ

#105929 Apr 29, 2013
Larry wrote:
Ah I m done .. What about this weather? How I always dream of owning a backyard pool. Put a heap of ice cubes in it and go for a swim at night.
Enjoy it. We had frost warnings the other night.:-) Springtime.
Larry

Australia

#105930 Apr 29, 2013
Anonymous of Indy wrote:
<quoted text>
Australian Gun Ban Facts & Statistics
It has now been over 10 years since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own Government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.
The statistics for the years following the ban are now in:
Accidental gun deaths are 300% higher than the pre-1997 ban rate
The assault rate has increased 800% since 1991, and increased 200% since the 1997 gun ban.
Robbery and armed robbery have increase 20% from the pre-97 ban rate.
From immediately after the ban was instituted in 1997 through 2002, the robbery and armed robbery rate was up 200% over the pre-ban rates.
In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 171 percent.
There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort, and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns.
The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it. While the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not, and criminals still possess their guns. Criminals in Australia now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws ONLY adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late! The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson. With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
One final statistic...
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 170 million
"The sword is more important than the shield, and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental."- John Steinbeck
http://www.reasonorforce.com/2010/08/australi...
This is quite simply bullshit. We all know the real statisics.
Larry

Australia

#105931 Apr 29, 2013
The statics are that when gun ownership rates dropped after the buyback and strict new measures were put on place we did not see any more mass shootings, suicide rate dropped significantly and the rate of gun related deaths also has dropped significantly.

Deaths by other meathods have not increased.

This is not my opinion but well known fact.

Every murder or suicide is recorded as a statistic, there is no conspiracy by the government, people wanted this, even people that hated the PM thought it was a good idea! The whole country acted.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#105932 Apr 29, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
This is quite simply bullshit. We all know the real statisics.
not bullshit at all even the Australian Bureau of Criminology has acknowledged it true.

It is a common fantasy that gun bans make society safer. In 2002 -- five years after enacting its gun ban -- the Australian Bureau of Criminology acknowledged there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime. In fact, the percent of murders committed with a firearm was the highest it had ever been in 2006 (16.3 percent), says the D.C. Examiner.

Even Australia's Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research acknowledges that the gun ban had no significant impact on the amount of gun-involved crime:
•In 2006, assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
•Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
•Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.

Moreover, Australia and the United States -- where no gun-ban exists -- both experienced similar decreases in murder rates:
•Between 1995 and 2007, Australia saw a 31.9 percent decrease; without a gun ban, America's rate dropped 31.7 percent.
•During the same time period, all other violent crime indices increased in Australia: assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
•Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
•Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
•At the same time, U.S. violent crime decreased 31.8 percent: rape dropped 19.2 percent; robbery decreased 33.2 percent; aggravated assault dropped 32.2 percent.
•Australian women are now raped over three times as often as American women.

While this doesn't prove that more guns would impact crime rates, it does prove that gun control is a flawed policy. Furthermore, this highlights the most important point: gun banners promote failed policy regardless of the consequences to the people who must live with them, says the Examiner.

http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/...
Larry

Australia

#105933 Apr 29, 2013
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
Enjoy it. We had frost warnings the other night.:-) Springtime.
I wish we got frost where I live.. I literally drink tea with ice cubes it..We get a decent dump of snow at the snowy mounrains and in some areas down south in winter. Rest of the time shes pretty warm..
Louiston

Omaha, NE

#105934 Apr 29, 2013
Larry wrote:
The statics are that when gun ownership rates dropped after the buyback and strict new measures were put on place we did not see any more mass shootings, suicide rate dropped significantly and the rate of gun related deaths also has dropped significantly.
Deaths by other meathods have not increased.
This is not my opinion but well known fact.
Every murder or suicide is recorded as a statistic, there is no conspiracy by the government, people wanted this, even people that hated the PM thought it was a good idea! The whole country acted.
No cites to credible sources. Another swing & miss.
GoGoBar

Thailand

#105935 Apr 29, 2013
350,000 gun violent crimes per year.

225 self defense homicides per year

HAHAHAHAHAHA.

I wouldnt laugh if there were 4000 self defence per year.

The cops only kill 370 per year anmd they are at every crime.!

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Guns Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
News No wedding for Bristol Palin 20 hr Tazo 9
Stop white on white crime May 20 Truth and Facts 30
News Concealed Carry Reduced Crime But NOT on Chicag... May 18 Truth and Facts 3
News Local Jews upset by Holocaust references in cam... (Jun '12) May 17 Robbie Siegmyer 115
News The Free Beacon Thinks Purchasing Ammunition Sh... May 17 JEFF1234 1
Democrats: Get A $2,000 Tax Credit For Turning ... May 10 Prep-for-Dep 22
News 'Batman' shooting tragedy exploited on various ... (Jul '12) May 8 gragulum 11
More from around the web