It's the Guns, Stupid

Apr 20, 2007 Full story: Truthdig 103,363

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

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Larry

Australia

#105799 Apr 28, 2013
so whats the Americans opinions of gun crime in Canada? Want to know where is safe to holiday.
Larry

Australia

#105800 Apr 28, 2013
There you go again wrote:
<quoted text>
why do you think you should wish your will on us? Are you that jealous over us?
Ah no, I m glad I live somewhere where automatic and semi automatic weapons are strictly prohibited.

Since: Oct 12

Moultrie, GA

#105801 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
so whats the Americans opinions of gun crime in Canada? Want to know where is safe to holiday.
what is "to holiday"? You are putting out that Australia has total band on guns but in reality they are just controlled who gets them.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#105802 Apr 28, 2013
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
If a store clerk is being robbed at gunpoint and the clerk pulls out a gun and shoots the robber and kills him, it was protection. A different perspective from behind the counter.:-)
Before you get into property crimes and give him what he wants, we have animals here that would shoot you just for the fun of it after he has what he wanted. I don't believe you have that element in your society yet. Before you get into gun control, these animals aren't supposed to have them now.
So how DO the crims get the guns then?
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105803 Apr 28, 2013
The Melbourne gangland killings were the murders in Melbourne, Victoria, Australia, of 36 criminal figures or partners between 16 January 1998 and 13 August 2010. The murders were in a series of retributional murders involving various underworld groups. The deaths caused a sustained power vacuum within Melbourne's criminal community, as various factions fought for control and influence. The majority of the murders are still unsolved. Purana Taskforce believe that Carl Williams was responsible for ten of them. The period culminated in the arrest of Carl Williams, who pleaded guilty on 28 February 2007 to three of the murders. On 19 April 2010, Carl Williams died while incarcerated at Barwon Prison after allegedly being bashed by an inmate. Investigations have been hampered by a "code of silence", with few organised crime figures willing to risk their lives to provide details to state and federal authorities. Victoria's state police have lamented the death of gang figures who were killed before they were able to aid their investigation.
pistol

Anonymous Proxy

#105804 Apr 28, 2013
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
In your dreams...see what I mean about getting rid of men and why!
australian old boilder like you can only buy a firearm in your dream
Larry

Australia

#105805 Apr 28, 2013
australias 2002,2003 rate of gun related homicides was 0.27 per 100 000 this is actually a whopping one fifteenth that of the USA.

We had a decade free of mass shootings of a fatal nature and a pretty sharp decline in our suicide rate.

Your own research published in the american journal of law and economics shows the Australian gun buyback cutting suicides by gun by 74 %, which equals 200 lives per year. I m reading these statistics from a well known literary source, I didnt remember them, but you must concede that this is a very desirable set of statistics!
Larry

Australia

#105806 Apr 28, 2013
There you go again wrote:
<quoted text>
what is "to holiday"? You are putting out that Australia has total band on guns but in reality they are just controlled who gets them.
No, automatic and semi automatic guns cant even be imported. There is no need for that type of weapon. They are prohibited here.
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105807 Apr 28, 2013

Finalised

ANZSOC Division/Subdivision(b)
Not finalised

No offender proceeded against



Total(c)
Homicide and related offences
Murder
51

7

171

229
Attempted murder
52



142

194
Manslaughter
12



19

31
Total
115

7

332

454
Sexual assault
10 651

3 325

3 781

17 757
Kidnapping/abduction
353

55

195

603
Robbery
Armed robbery
3 757

204

1 687

5 648
Unarmed robbery
6 339

521

2 074

8 934
Total
10 096

725

3 761

14 582
Blackmail/extortion
295

69

109

473
Unlawful entry with intent
Involving the taking of property
137 069

2 811

12 799

152 679
Other
56 735

1 384

6 088

64 207
Total
193 804

4 195

18 887

216 886
Motor vehicle theft
47 306

1 761

5 669

54 736
Other theft
380 736
Larry

Australia

#105808 Apr 28, 2013
Honestly I think there must be some culture difference in why Americans like their guns so much.
I cant believe how different the mentality is towards guns. At the end of the day the American people will do what they want, but it would not hurt to have a look at what we have done.
I hope that the American gun crime does decline, but I cant see it happening with out taking any action.
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105809 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
australias 2002,2003 rate of gun related homicides was 0.27 per 100 000 this is actually a whopping one fifteenth that of the USA.
We had a decade free of mass shootings of a fatal nature and a pretty sharp decline in our suicide rate.
Your own research published in the american journal of law and economics shows the Australian gun buyback cutting suicides by gun by 74 %, which equals 200 lives per year. I m reading these statistics from a well known literary source, I didnt remember them, but you must concede that this is a very desirable set of statistics!
If it were relevant. You already had an almost nonexistant mass shooting rate. You have 1/ 5th the population of the US so yes logic says less number of victims. Suicide rates are not linked to method PROVEN by Japans high suicide rate. You are fed carefully worded propaganda and facts twisted to fit an agenda. You heard what you wanted to hear with no question. I can say 99.9% of crimes were committed by criminals wearing shoes but that does not link shoes to criminal behavior but if you are anti shoe chances are you would buy it.
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105810 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
australias 2002,2003 rate of gun related homicides was 0.27 per 100 000 this is actually a whopping one fifteenth that of the USA.
We had a decade free of mass shootings of a fatal nature and a pretty sharp decline in our suicide rate.
Your own research published in the american journal of law and economics shows the Australian gun buyback cutting suicides by gun by 74 %, which equals 200 lives per year. I m reading these statistics from a well known literary source, I didnt remember them, but you must concede that this is a very desirable set of statistics!
But you have higher rates of everything else. Not a good trade.
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105811 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
No, automatic and semi automatic guns cant even be imported. There is no need for that type of weapon. They are prohibited here.
Self defense is also prohibited there. Not a good trade.
pistol

Pioneer, CA

#105812 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
No, automatic and semi automatic guns cant even be imported. There is no need for that type of weapon. They are prohibited here.
the issue isn't about what people need. Its about rights Mexico has the toughest gun laws in the world, yet hundreds of innocent people are murdered every month because they cannot defend themselves. Let's be logical

Since: Oct 12

Moultrie, GA

#105813 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
Honestly I think there must be some culture difference in why Americans like their guns so much.
I cant believe how different the mentality is towards guns. At the end of the day the American people will do what they want, but it would not hurt to have a look at what we have done.
I hope that the American gun crime does decline, but I cant see it happening with out taking any action.
if we wanted to be like you we would still have a queen
Tray

Tupelo, MS

#105814 Apr 28, 2013
Larry wrote:
australias 2002,2003 rate of gun related homicides was 0.27 per 100 000 this is actually a whopping one fifteenth that of the USA.
We had a decade free of mass shootings of a fatal nature and a pretty sharp decline in our suicide rate.
Your own research published in the american journal of law and economics shows the Australian gun buyback cutting suicides by gun by 74 %, which equals 200 lives per year. I m reading these statistics from a well known literary source, I didnt remember them, but you must concede that this is a very desirable set of statistics!
Once again you try to twist the wording. Homicide is the killing of a human, not always murder. Many "homicides" are police or victims killing attackers. You try to link those with murder and that's just a lie. You also fail to link your higher murder with other objects in your country. Twisting facts shows you are attempting to be dishonest and have an agenda. If you were really trying to find a cause of violence you would not need to lie but stand on the merits of the facts without altering them. We are done here.
Larry

Australia

#105815 Apr 28, 2013
Tray wrote:
<quoted text> All debunked. Shooting deaths are acceptable when it's in defense or stopping a criminal. Cops carry guns and yes shoot people and these are acceptable so why should it be different for a victim of a violent crime to do the same? The #1 cause of death for young men in Japan is suicide (no guns) lower suicide with no guns DEBUNKED. Gun control in your country lead to 4x higher violent crime. Not a very good trade. You already had a very low gun crime rate. You have less "firearm" hold ups but by your own admission you still have a high "armed" holdup rate. Only now the victim is at the mercy of the criminal( criminals are not known for mercy). Even your own studies say gun control had little to do with Australian crime rate.
not debunked.

For starters the Japanese. Are a different ethnicity and Japans population is majority Ethnic Japanese. Japanese people have large expectations and pressures to perform accidemically and other cultural differences. There are race differences in suicide rates. Some people are more prone to stress and other emotions.

Japan is actually not a violent place, its stats are not bad..
GoGoBar

Thailand

#105816 Apr 28, 2013
These statistics arent so suprising when you remember that the British debt-gdp and inequality is the same as the USA.
Just look at the HDi adjusted for inequality.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countrie ...

The rate of violent crime is economical, but the rate of murder is definately gun driven in Advanced Industrialised Nations.

Rates of Violent Crime

USA 2250/100K
UK 2050/100K
Aust 1050/100/K

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv11.pdf

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/crime-stats/cri ...

http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/current%20 ...

The USA has a slightly higher rate of sexual assault due to use of firearms(3%) which equals 7500 gun rapes per year

Prisoner per 100,000

USA 716
UK 396 (Incl, Scot.,N.Ireland and wales)
Aust 129
Becky

Yangzhou, China

#105817 Apr 28, 2013
pistol wrote:
<quoted text> the issue isn't about what people need. Its about rights Mexico has the toughest gun laws in the world, yet hundreds of innocent people are murdered every month because they cannot defend themselves. Let's be logical
No, these were drug related and its for sure both victims and killers were armed. And if it weren't for self-indulgent weekend cokeheads in the US, Mexico wouldn't be a conduit for the South American cocaine industry.
GoGoBar

Thailand

#105818 Apr 28, 2013
USA total Murder rate 4.8
USA GUN MUrder rate 3.7

4.8-3.7= 1.1

Australia Total Murder rate =1.1

Looks like the guns are the major difference.
LOL

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