It's the Guns, Stupid

It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103340 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

Spocko

Oakland, CA

#99954 Feb 13, 2013
The ADELAIDEAN wrote:
<quoted text>
Patience good sir! All shall be revealed.:)
Do you see any *material difference* between these two statements"
"Almost all mammals, avian, reptiles, etc., are on alert for most of their waking moments."
"Most creatures are vigilant most of their conscious life"
Both statements are meaningless without qualification, i.e. there are birds that do not learn how to fly because they have no natural enemies and so on ...

“REFUSE ALL IMITATIONS!!”

Since: Jan 11

Australia

#99955 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't agree that both statements are the same, but let's put that aside for the moment.
I wouldn't stake my life on it, but it does ring a bell of sorts.
Of course both statements are not the same. They use different words!

But one would surely have to be a 'hair-splitting fetishist' to fight to the death for a meaningful difference in their meanings. No?:)

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99956 Feb 13, 2013
Spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
Both statements are meaningless without qualification, i.e. there are birds that do not learn how to fly because they have no natural enemies and so on ...
That's interesting,, I know of flightless birds, but tell me, which of these flightless birds could fly if they relly felt like it.
Is it truly a case of learning.

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99957 Feb 13, 2013
Opps, really

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99958 Feb 13, 2013
The ADELAIDEAN wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course both statements are not the same. They use different words!
But one would surely have to be a 'hair-splitting fetishist' to fight to the death for a meaningful difference in their meanings. No?:)
I suggested we put that to one side for the moment.

Please move on to the ringing bell.

“REFUSE ALL IMITATIONS!!”

Since: Jan 11

Australia

#99959 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
I suggested we put that to one side for the moment.
Please move on to the ringing bell.
With respect, bear with me. Before moving on we need to resolve what degree of correlation could be argued to exist between the two statements I have presented, one of which you have encountered before.:)
Guppy

Englewood, FL

#99960 Feb 13, 2013
No Hello Kitty guns. All sold out.

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99961 Feb 13, 2013
The ADELAIDEAN wrote:
<quoted text>
With respect, bear with me. Before moving on we need to resolve what degree of correlation could be argued to exist between the two statements I have presented, one of which you have encountered before.:)
Fair enough,,, consider an army of the past,,whilst approaching their opponents they would be in the open and exposed to arrows or large rocks from trebuchet, ALERT to a danger, but esentially every man for himself.

Now consider a modern army, how they approach their opponents, substitute vigilant.

Guppy

Englewood, FL

#99962 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
If you want to look really stylish,, you know, the lady about town sort of look,, check out the Hello Kitty flak jackets.
Very funny. Looked on internet, but couldn't find one.

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99963 Feb 13, 2013
Guppy wrote:
No Hello Kitty guns. All sold out.
You could allways purchase,,,ahhh now lets see,,,a desert eagle,,some nice paint and transfers from a craft shop,,,create your own custom made,,,job done.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#99964 Feb 13, 2013
Mr Punjab wrote:
You just think anyone that disagrees with your fat self (that means eveeyone) is a troll.
And you are not one? really you are a dumb dick troll!

“REFUSE ALL IMITATIONS!!”

Since: Jan 11

Australia

#99965 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
Fair enough,,, consider an army of the past,,whilst approaching their opponents they would be in the open and exposed to arrows or large rocks from trebuchet, ALERT to a danger, but esentially every man for himself.
Now consider a modern army, how they approach their opponents, substitute vigilant.
I would say that the meanings of 'alert' and 'vigilant' are interchangeable.

I would add that situational usage would make 'alert' the word more likely to be hollered by officers in the noise of battle because its very sound is more forceful, it has fewer syllables and is more amenable loud and carrying utterance.

But that is peripheral.

In all other respects I would equate the conceptual thrust 'alert' and 'vigilant'.

“REFUSE ALL IMITATIONS!!”

Since: Jan 11

Australia

#99966 Feb 13, 2013
* of 'alert' and 'vigilant'

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99967 Feb 13, 2013
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
Very funny. Looked on internet, but couldn't find one.
Now that is dissapointing, but look on the bright side,, this could be an excellent business opportunity for a female entrepreneur, in fact you could manufacture and outlet a wide range of goods to the ladys.

Since: Feb 11

Ely, UK

#99968 Feb 13, 2013
The ADELAIDEAN wrote:
<quoted text>
I would say that the meanings of 'alert' and 'vigilant' are interchangeable.
I would add that situational usage would make 'alert' the word more likely to be hollered by officers in the noise of battle because its very sound is more forceful, it has fewer syllables and is more amenable loud and carrying utterance.
But that is peripheral.
In all other respects I would equate the conceptual thrust 'alert' and 'vigilant'.
I know some gentlemen that allways insisted on a difference between the two, however I will except your view, as would most people.

I don't know if we are now moving on, but I may have to go out shortly. In which case I would have to reply to part B at a later time.

By the way, of the few hours you sleep, what percentage would you call quality time ?

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#99969 Feb 13, 2013
sairla wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you believe that HollybytheSea fits the profile of a troll - someone who posts only to disrupt others, is abusive, often obscene and intimidating? I think if you are going to call someone a troll then you must have some evidence of that and I certainly haven't seen any.
I respond to most people on here as if they don't really exist as a persona outside of this Forum...because I don't believe they do, it is not reality else the debating would reflect that, and it doesn't....ie: most people excluding leaders try to find common ground where they can co exist...that doesn't happen on this forum....I am on a gardening, political, painting, computer and general forum outside of Topix and none of them are as un restricted false or as negative as this site accept the most obvious ones.
So what am I doing here?....I have an opinion and I like to vent in heated debate because it is often envigorating even if I am talking to a computer generated game, nothing more or less and to do that on any other real forum where those people are clearly their persona would be detrimentle to them and me...I believe Holly does not exist outside of her fake persona like "most of those" on this site it is mostly governed by the Topix puppeteers and stirrers, and I treat it accordingly, as a bit of fun and a disconnect from reality....as it is....Now I am off to get started on another painting....

“REFUSE ALL IMITATIONS!!”

Since: Jan 11

Australia

#99970 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
I know some gentlemen that allways insisted on a difference between the two, however I will except your view, as would most people.
It seems then that we can agree that a single meaning can be conveyed by more than one choice of words.
spider1954 wrote:
I don't know if we are now moving on, but I may have to go out shortly. In which case I would have to reply to part B at a later time.
There's no rush.:)

In the meantime let's review what we seem to have so far:

By your own acknowledgement you recall at least something of a past conversation but are no longer certain of the words actually used.

What you do retain however is some approximation of an idea exchanged.

To help you further, this is the actual conversation that you retain some imperfect memory of:

The salient passage being:

"Almost all mammals, avian, reptiles, etc., are on alert for most of their waking moments."
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/australia/TI...

The arguable equivalent was own own re-wording of it:

"Most creatures are vigilant most of their conscious life"

This was done to provide you with an opportunity to recall a *meaning* exchanged, but leaving it to your own memory resources to recall / endorse / dispute the actual words used.

It seems that you were able to recall the essential *meaning* exchanged at the time, better at least than you were able to recall verbatim.

Does that appraisal seem acceptable to you?:)
spider1954 wrote:
By the way, of the few hours you sleep, what percentage would you call quality time ?
Who said I sleep few hours?:)

“REFUSE ALL IMITATIONS!!”

Since: Jan 11

Australia

#99971 Feb 13, 2013
* my own re-wording.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#99972 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps it's a world wide conspiracy against Aho :-)
Smarter people than you have found that to be true in the most unlikely places like the Catholic church sexual abuse conspiracy(who would have believed it?) eh....I am sure that if you try you would be able to list one.....so never say never. BTW a guy like you not to believe in conspiracies is rare.....and almost unbelievable.
Guppy

Englewood, FL

#99973 Feb 13, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
You could allways purchase,,,ahhh now lets see,,,a desert eagle,,some nice paint and transfers from a craft shop,,,create your own custom made,,,job done.
Excellent idea. Heading out now to find everything. Thank you!

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Guns Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
News The new Wild West: Sacramento's sheriff issues ... 6 hr RayOne 1
News Packing pistols: Is Texas safer with more licen... (Jul '11) 21 hr Public farts 6
News Suspect in Louisiana theatre rampage had histor... Jul 28 El Chapo 56
News Local Jews upset by Holocaust references in cam... (Jun '12) Jul 27 swedenforever 123
News Louisiana Moms, Aurora Theater Shooting Survivo... Jul 25 payme 2
News Why assault rifle sales are booming Jul 24 Here Is One 242
News Legal Loophole: Concealed carry law Jul 24 CGiven 2
More from around the web