Seeking Common Ground: Gun Politics

Seeking Common Ground: Gun Politics

There are 4298 comments on the The Boerne Star story from Dec 19, 2008, titled Seeking Common Ground: Gun Politics. In it, The Boerne Star reports that:

Sales of guns and ammunition are soaring. It's the hottest retail sector now and the main reason is the election of president-elect Obama.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Boerne Star.

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“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#1 Dec 20, 2008
An interesting read.

However, there is =>ONLY ONE<= common ground: The Second Article of Amendment.

Any thought of demanding that we surrender ~something~ of our rights —in an effort to appease the conniving— is tantamount to demanding that a woman surrender something of her body to a rapist or other evil person intent upon possessing her in one way or another.

And, any thought of appeasement is of necessity a first step into the gates of Hell, inasmuch that appeasement is nothing short of beginning the stepwise process of complete surrender of whatever right: You surrender something now, and =>THEY WILL<= be back for more later, USING THE VERY SAME ARGUMENT.

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GPM

“DILLIGAF?”

Since: Aug 08

San Antonio, TX

#2 Dec 20, 2008
Here's the common ground I'd like to see us reach: Criminals who commit their crimes with weapons get an automatic 20 years with no parole in a maximum security federal prison tacked on to any other sentence(s) to be served consecutively.

Any criminal who murders a person or causes to be murdered a person (even an accomplice) in the course of committing the crime gets an automatic death sentence to be carried out with-in two weeks of sentencing.

Honest, law-abiding citizens are allowed to own any type of firearm they can afford and to carry it on or about the person anywhere except into a court, a jail/prison or in the secure area of an airport. Any ammunition that fits their weapons of choice is allowed. All gun laws from GCA 1934 forward will be expired. No bans or limittions on any firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens will ever again be passed.(Basically, I am taking the 2nd Amendment literally.)

Punish criminals severely and allow the rest of us to go about our lives unfettered by stupid, misguided laws that only benefit criminals and their supporters.

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WesternPA

Leonardtown, MD

#3 Dec 20, 2008
The author nailed the American Culture (Urban V. Rural ideologies).

but fails to point out "shall not be infringed"...

“Rodeo Redneck Cowboy!”

Since: Jun 08

Texas

#4 Dec 20, 2008
GPM wrote:
Here's the common ground I'd like to see us reach: Criminals who commit their crimes with weapons get an automatic 20 years with no parole in a maximum security federal prison tacked on to any other sentence(s) to be served consecutively.
Any criminal who murders a person or causes to be murdered a person (even an accomplice) in the course of committing the crime gets an automatic death sentence to be carried out with-in two weeks of sentencing.
Honest, law-abiding citizens are allowed to own any type of firearm they can afford and to carry it on or about the person anywhere except into a court, a jail/prison or in the secure area of an airport. Any ammunition that fits their weapons of choice is allowed. All gun laws from GCA 1934 forward will be expired. No bans or limittions on any firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens will ever again be passed.(Basically, I am taking the 2nd Amendment literally.)
Punish criminals severely and allow the rest of us to go about our lives unfettered by stupid, misguided laws that only benefit criminals and their supporters.
Boo-Rah !!!

GunShowOnTheNet

“Shall NOT be infringed.”

Since: Dec 06

Phoenix, AZ.

#8 Dec 20, 2008
"Shall NOT be infringed" means EXACTLY that which was written. ALL of American laws our based upon "the TRANSCENDENT laws of nature and of Nature's God". According to those laws a citizen can be disarmed only AFTER they have posed an actual threat. When the threat ceases, and/or they have paid the lawfully imposed sentence for crime(s) committed. Then their arms are RESTORED to them as before. For, "the right of Self-Defense NEVER CEASES".

"An avidity to punish is always dangerous to liberty. It leads men to stretch, to misinterpret, and to misapply even the best of laws. He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."

- Thomas Paine, July, 1795, Dissertations on First Principles of Government.
http://gunshowonthenet.blogspot.com/2008/06/d...

“Rodeo Redneck Cowboy!”

Since: Jun 08

Texas

#9 Dec 20, 2008
But,to THEM we are posing a threat.The threat that we understand that the 2nd Admendment allows for any threat to our rights.
Wolverine

Cumberland, MD

#10 Dec 20, 2008
GPM wrote:
Here's the common ground I'd like to see us reach: Criminals who commit their crimes with weapons get an automatic 20 years with no parole in a maximum security federal prison tacked on to any other sentence(s) to be served consecutively.
Any criminal who murders a person or causes to be murdered a person (even an accomplice) in the course of committing the crime gets an automatic death sentence to be carried out with-in two weeks of sentencing.
Honest, law-abiding citizens are allowed to own any type of firearm they can afford and to carry it on or about the person anywhere except into a court, a jail/prison or in the secure area of an airport. Any ammunition that fits their weapons of choice is allowed. All gun laws from GCA 1934 forward will be expired. No bans or limittions on any firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens will ever again be passed.(Basically, I am taking the 2nd Amendment literally.)
Punish criminals severely and allow the rest of us to go about our lives unfettered by stupid, misguided laws that only benefit criminals and their supporters.
Bravo! I am in agreement 100%.

GunShowOnTheNet

“Shall NOT be infringed.”

Since: Dec 06

Phoenix, AZ.

#11 Dec 20, 2008
GPM wrote:
Here's the common ground I'd like to see us reach: Criminals who commit their crimes with weapons get an automatic 20 years with no parole in a maximum security federal prison tacked on to any other sentence(s) to be served consecutively.
Any criminal who murders a person or causes to be murdered a person (even an accomplice) in the course of committing the crime gets an automatic death sentence to be carried out with-in two weeks of sentencing.
Honest, law-abiding citizens are allowed to own any type of firearm they can afford and to carry it on or about the person anywhere except into a court, a jail/prison or in the secure area of an airport. Any ammunition that fits their weapons of choice is allowed. All gun laws from GCA 1934 forward will be expired. No bans or limittions on any firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens will ever again be passed.(Basically, I am taking the 2nd Amendment literally.)
Punish criminals severely and allow the rest of us to go about our lives unfettered by stupid, misguided laws that only benefit criminals and their supporters.
Works for me.
Julietiquiette

Topeka, KS

#12 Dec 20, 2008
If criminals were truely punished. We would not have the some of the problems we have today. Some, not all, waltz in and out of prison like a revolving door....to "some" it is a badge of honor to serve time in prison, and certain prisons.

Silly wingnuts.
WesternPA

Leonardtown, MD

#13 Dec 20, 2008
Now if we can as a society, accept the accountable for our actions, then the criminals would be punished, with harsher sentences.

But the do-gooders tell them, its not their fault for a host of reasons; and give the repeat offendors all the breaks, hoping the will change their ways...

GunShowOnTheNet

“Shall NOT be infringed.”

Since: Dec 06

Phoenix, AZ.

#14 Dec 20, 2008
"No law ever written has ever stopped any robber, rapist or killer, like cold blue steel in the hands of their last intended victim. The answer is simple. We will keep and bare arms, like our forefathers did, and we will defend ourselves."

- W. Emerson Wright

"Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."

- William Pitt, 18 Nov 1783

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."

- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

"Beware of the leader who bangs of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind.

"And when the drums of war have reached a fevor pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind is closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and do it gladly so. "How do I know? I know for this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."

- Julius Caesar.

"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined."

- Patrick Henry, June 9, 1788. The Debates in the Several State Conventions,(Virginia), on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution [Elliot's Debates, Volume 3]
TruthVersusEvil

Hayes, UK

#15 Dec 20, 2008
GPM wrote:
Here's the common ground I'd like to see us reach: Criminals who commit their crimes with weapons get an automatic 20 years with no parole in a maximum security federal prison tacked on to any other sentence(s) to be served consecutively.
Any criminal who murders a person or causes to be murdered a person (even an accomplice) in the course of committing the crime gets an automatic death sentence to be carried out with-in two weeks of sentencing.
Honest, law-abiding citizens are allowed to own any type of firearm they can afford and to carry it on or about the person anywhere except into a court, a jail/prison or in the secure area of an airport. Any ammunition that fits their weapons of choice is allowed. All gun laws from GCA 1934 forward will be expired. No bans or limittions on any firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens will ever again be passed.(Basically, I am taking the 2nd Amendment literally.)
Punish criminals severely and allow the rest of us to go about our lives unfettered by stupid, misguided laws that only benefit criminals and their supporters.
Y'know, the anti-gun people would never go for this.

When they say "common-sense", thay don't mean actual common sense, such as the above, they mean "irresponsible" (see: AWB, Hughes Amendment).

As this suggestion is truly sensible, you can be assured they will oppose it.

Shame we can't get people like you and GunShow over here, we'd probably have the GCN on the run by now.

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#16 Dec 20, 2008
TruthVersusEvil wrote:
<quoted text>
Y'know, the anti-gun people would never go for this.
When they say "common-sense", thay don't mean actual common sense, such as the above, they mean "irresponsible" (see: AWB, Hughes Amendment).
As this suggestion is truly sensible, you can be assured they will oppose it.
Shame we can't get people like you and GunShow over here, we'd probably have the GCN on the run by now.
What wrong with =>YOU<= doing what needs to be done?

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#18 Dec 21, 2008
GPM wrote:
Here's the common ground I'd like to see us reach: Criminals who commit their crimes with weapons get an automatic 20 years with no parole in a maximum security federal prison tacked on to any other sentence(s) to be served consecutively.
What a neat tool to use against gun owners who make a simple mistake. The law not only removes their right to possess firearms in the future, it also ensures that we can put our hands on all their goodies while they are away for 20 years.

“FSM is His Noodliness”

Since: Jul 07

venganza.org

#19 Dec 21, 2008
so you dont need gun control... you need more prisoners
usa has 5% of the worlds population and 25% of its prisoners
1 out of every 32 adults is either in prison or on parole from prison,
prisoners per 100k
usa 714
uk 142
Aus 117
Canada 116
TruthVersusEvil

Hayes, UK

#20 Dec 21, 2008
Highlander wrote:
<quoted text>
What wrong with =>YOU<= doing what needs to be done?
Nothing. It's more of a problem that we're outnumbered here.

The gun groups over here don't really get much public time when gun owners come under fire here.

The Gun Control Network, the most unscrupulous of the groups here, has a chairperson whose husband is a MP.

Hell, the last time someone on the pro-gun side of things was invited to a gun control meeting, the same chairperson harassed him, and one of the GCN contingent there assaulted him.

I do what I can when it's needed, but we don't have many people over here who speak out, like the guys here.

GunShowOnTheNet

“Shall NOT be infringed.”

Since: Dec 06

Phoenix, AZ.

#21 Dec 21, 2008
TruthVersusEvil wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing. It's more of a problem that we're outnumbered here.
The gun groups over here don't really get much public time when gun owners come under fire here.
The Gun Control Network, the most unscrupulous of the groups here, has a chairperson whose husband is a MP.
Hell, the last time someone on the pro-gun side of things was invited to a gun control meeting, the same chairperson harassed him, and one of the GCN contingent there assaulted him.
I do what I can when it's needed, but we don't have many people over here who speak out, like the guys here.
Perhaps it's time to gather together those whom will "speak out" and unite with them in concerted effort. It certainly doesn't appear that you have much time left before the Brits are totally subjugated. Surely the ol' Lion still has some teeth, claws, and roar left?!

GPM

“DILLIGAF?”

Since: Aug 08

San Antonio, TX

#22 Dec 21, 2008
jack412 wrote:
so you dont need gun control... you need more prisoners
usa has 5% of the worlds population and 25% of its prisoners
1 out of every 32 adults is either in prison or on parole from prison,
prisoners per 100k
usa 714
uk 142
Aus 117
Canada 116
You've only seen a small slice of my ideas for a better USA.

I'd immediately release ALL non-violent drug offenders. All current and former non-violent drug related prisoners would have their records expunged. I'd decriminalize the possession and use of pot. I'd make other recreational drugs available through liquor stores and tax the sales just like liquor and tobacco is taxed. I'm make it a capital offense for anyone over 21 to give or sell narcotics to anyone under 18.

I figure if we can take away the insane profits the drug cartels and distributors make off drugs, it will take away their ability to buy governments and cops. Let them sell to Johnny Walker, Phillip-Morris and others for resale in controlled outlets.

That would take a large number of prisoners out of the system leaving room for the real bad guys - the ones who deliberately hurt people. If people want to poison themselves, let them! We have alcoholics who deliberately drink themselves stupid. Some die. Oh well. Darwinism in action.

I'd also decriminalize prostitution. Let the sex workers come in out o the cold. They would be eligible for work sponsored health care. They would be able to go to the police when a customer hurts them. I'd have all convicted and incarcerated sex workers and their customers released from prison/jail and their records expunged. That should decrease our prison population by a good number too.

Basically, if I had my way, I'd decriminalize all current victimless crimes and help increase the tax base. I'm not talking about income tax. That needs to be eliminated. I'm talking about excise and business taxes. The taxes that our founders had in mind to support a nice small federal government that minded its own business which is dealing with foreign nations and protecting us from attack. I want to see people made responsible for their own choices and lifestyles. I want to see violent offenders put away and those who do nothing but make themselves feel good left to do so.

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“Fear is the Mind-Killer”

Since: Jun 08

Albuquerque, NM

#23 Dec 21, 2008
A rural versus city thing, huh?

Well, most crimes do happen in the disarmed cities. Duh.

And why do city-folk think the police will get to them in time to PREVENT a crime?

Self-defense is a personal responsibility, always had been, and always will be.

“Fear is the Mind-Killer”

Since: Jun 08

Albuquerque, NM

#24 Dec 21, 2008
GPM wrote:
<quoted text>
You've only seen a small slice of my ideas for a better USA.
I'd immediately release ALL non-violent drug offenders. All current and former non-violent drug related prisoners would have their records expunged. I'd decriminalize the possession and use of pot. I'd make other recreational drugs available through liquor stores and tax the sales just like liquor and tobacco is taxed. I'm make it a capital offense for anyone over 21 to give or sell narcotics to anyone under 18.
I figure if we can take away the insane profits the drug cartels and distributors make off drugs, it will take away their ability to buy governments and cops. Let them sell to Johnny Walker, Phillip-Morris and others for resale in controlled outlets.
That would take a large number of prisoners out of the system leaving room for the real bad guys - the ones who deliberately hurt people. If people want to poison themselves, let them! We have alcoholics who deliberately drink themselves stupid. Some die. Oh well. Darwinism in action.
I'd also decriminalize prostitution. Let the sex workers come in out o the cold. They would be eligible for work sponsored health care. They would be able to go to the police when a customer hurts them. I'd have all convicted and incarcerated sex workers and their customers released from prison/jail and their records expunged. That should decrease our prison population by a good number too.
Basically, if I had my way, I'd decriminalize all current victimless crimes and help increase the tax base. I'm not talking about income tax. That needs to be eliminated. I'm talking about excise and business taxes. The taxes that our founders had in mind to support a nice small federal government that minded its own business which is dealing with foreign nations and protecting us from attack. I want to see people made responsible for their own choices and lifestyles. I want to see violent offenders put away and those who do nothing but make themselves feel good left to do so.
Well, to achieve this, then go back to when it actaully existed, and see what was different.

Ah, yes. Corporations back in the good ole days could only be chartered by the county government, and easily revoked by public policy. Oh, and corporations could not own property, copyrights, or patents, only real people could.

Go back to limited corporations, and you go back to limited government. A government without its corporations is the like the British Empire without the British East India Company ... utterly inept.

Oh, and people need to quit thinking corporations are "private." They never have been, and they have NOTHING to do with private enterprise.

THEN, you might actually return the USA back to its advanced, progressive, and radical self.

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