Court ruling supports breakaway diocese v. TEC

Mar 7, 2013 Full story: www.fresnobee.com 16

A judge on Wednesday tentatively rejected a motion by the Episcopal Church that would likely have meant victory in its nearly five-year church property battle with the breakaway Diocese of San Joaquin ...

Full Story

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#1 Mar 7, 2013
from fresnobee:

"Bishop Eric Menees of the Fresno-based Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin said he was happy with the ruling.

"'From the very beginning we put this in God's hands and continue to do that and trust that we'll prevail in the sense of no matter what happens, if we win or lose in the courts, everything's been about being able to proclaim the word of God, the good news of Jesus Christ. It's not about the property.'"

But for TEC, it's all about the property.

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#2 Mar 7, 2013
Joe DeCaro wrote:
from fresnobee:
"Bishop Eric Menees of the Fresno-based Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin said he was happy with the ruling.
"'From the very beginning we put this in God's hands and continue to do that and trust that we'll prevail in the sense of no matter what happens, if we win or lose in the courts, everything's been about being able to proclaim the word of God, the good news of Jesus Christ. It's not about the property.'"
But for TEC, it's all about the property.
Oh, Baloney!

For the breakaway group it's all about the property and the money. If it wasn't, they would have declared their act of leaving and renouncing - and then they would have simply walked out the door and not looked back.

For TEC, it's all about our own obligations as stewards and the breakaway group's blatant absconding and theft!

The breakaway group now hails vindication. But, the argument is not settled by any stretch of the imagination.

Also, before any parallels are incorrectly drawn, remember, each state has its own matters to decide first and the various states do have differing perspectives.

The Federal Courts will be looking from yet another perspective.

Lawyers are taking their cut.

Rev. Ken

“Plays well with others.”

Since: Jun 07

LIVING WELL*THE BEST REVENGE

#3 Mar 7, 2013
THOU SHALT NOT STEAL!!! And we will get the paperwork to prove it. TECHNICALITY...JOE. Nothing more.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#4 Mar 8, 2013
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, Baloney!
For the breakaway group it's all about the property and the money ...
THEIR property and money?

Baloney indeed!

“Plays well with others.”

Since: Jun 07

LIVING WELL*THE BEST REVENGE

#5 Mar 8, 2013
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
THEIR property and money?
Baloney indeed!
When you drop your offering in the plate...IT LEAVES YOUR HANDS! YOU ARE GIVING IT AWAY!!! Or are you somehow going to say that it is OK to reach in and take it back out NEXT week when it goes by because you don't like something the preacher said?
George

Jacksonville, FL

#6 Mar 8, 2013
Selecia Jones- JAX FL wrote:
<quoted text>When you drop your offering in the plate...IT LEAVES YOUR HANDS! YOU ARE GIVING IT AWAY!!! Or are you somehow going to say that it is OK to reach in and take it back out NEXT week when it goes by because you don't like something the preacher said?
The question isn't can you take the money back. The questions is who gets to decide how the money is spent -- the local church (wardens, vestry and clergy), the diocesean bishop elected by representatives of all the parishes in the diocese or 815? Is the money given to TEO, the diocese or the local parish? It is fine with me if TEO requires parishes that want to be part of TEO to enter into agreements that give the diocese and/or 815 the right to control parish assets. Parishioners know that and tacitly agree to the rule. It is quite another thing for TEO at its General Convention to adopt a canon that says from now on, anything a parish owns really belongs to the diocese unless we don't like the bishop in which case it belongs to 815.

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#7 Mar 8, 2013
March 7, 2013
Von Rosenberg Seeks Immediate Injunction to Stop Lawrence from Impersonating a Bishop

Lengthy complaint details deceptive acts intended to confuse communicants of the Diocese after he left the Episcopal Church

Ironically, Lawrence was served papers this afternoon in Charleston at the official residence of the Bishop of South Carolina...

Bishop Lawrence’s actions violate the federal trademark law known as the Lanham Act, misleading worshipers and donors, causing confusion, and harming the reputation of the diocese, the memo says.

“In holding himself out as the representative of the Diocese and in using the Diocese’s exact marks, there is no doubt that Bishop Lawrence has endeavored to create the very public confusion that the Lanham Act was designed to prohibit,” the memo says.

Got to keep up joline and not just post what you like.

LOL.....

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#8 Mar 8, 2013
Selecia Jones- JAX FL wrote:
<quoted text>
When you drop your offering in the plate...IT LEAVES YOUR HANDS! YOU ARE GIVING IT AWAY!!!...
... yet you still have a right to know where's it going, esp. when it's given for the upkeep of a parish that holds its own deed.

“Plays well with others.”

Since: Jun 07

LIVING WELL*THE BEST REVENGE

#9 Mar 8, 2013
The whole thing is akin to getting elected as a Republican and then getting into office and changing your affiliation to a Democrat. You took the money as a Republican. You campaigned as a Republican. You said that you were going to uphold the office as a Republican...YOU GET IN AND STEAL THE MONEY AND THE VOTES and CHANGE TO A DEMOCRAT or INDEPENDENT!

THOU SHALT NOT STEAL!

Those folks are welcome to leave and affiliate with and start any church that they please....they just don't get to take the stuff that does not belong to them.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#10 Mar 8, 2013
Selecia Jones- JAX FL wrote:
The whole thing is akin to getting elected as a Republican and then getting into office and changing your affiliation to a Democrat ...
... this story has to do with property, NOT politics.

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#11 Mar 8, 2013
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
... this story has to do with property, NOT politics.
Oh, how wrong you are!

But, the politics are Church politics; not the politics of national to local government.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#13 Mar 10, 2013
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, how wrong you are!
But, the politics are Church politics ...
Do courts rule on politics, or property?

Court ruling supports breakaway diocese v. TEC

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#14 Mar 10, 2013
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Do courts rule on politics, or property?
Court ruling supports breakaway diocese v. TEC
Spin.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#15 Mar 10, 2013
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Spin.
From the FresnoBee?

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#16 Mar 13, 2013
Yes joie, from the Fresno bee What is the difference between the New York Times and the Washington Post.

Did you really pass journalism?

Now for some facts:

March 8, 2013
NEW! Doubt Growing about Lawrence's Stewardship as PECDSC Inc. Annual Meeting Gets Underway in Florence

Unexplained quarter-million dollar loss, declining revenue, skyrocketing lawyers' fees, & cuts in ministry raising questions about where this is all going

Lay people rumored to be balking at paying for nuisance lawsuits at Pee Dee and Charleston parishes

While he has renounced his ministry in the Episcopal Church, Mark Lawrence and his renegade Protestant Episcopal Church in the Diocese of South Carolina Inc.(PECDSC Inc.) did not relinquish de facto control over the financial assets of the Diocese of South Carolina.

http://scepiscopalians.com/

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#17 Mar 13, 2013
VanRozeboom, his attorney, gave less weight to the ruling. "We didn't win, but they didn't win," he said. "The case goes on."

Separate lawsuits against two incorporated churches in Kern County were decided in favor of the Episcopal Diocese earlier this year. VanRozeboom said there are no plans to appeal those decisions, and that negotiations are proceeding to return those properties to the Episcopal Diocese. He called those talks "reasonable and accommodating."

That has not been the experience of St. John the Evangelist Anglican Church in Stockton, which also is an incorporated parish. In that case, unlike the churches in Turlock and Sonora, there is not an Episcopalian congregation waiting to get back in.

"We are in the midst of spending thousands and thousands of dollars that people gave us for ministry and for the kingdom of God, and we're literally throwing it away. Sometimes it's $30,000 a month," said the Rev. Lee Nelson. "I just don't think the Gospel is all about that. My goal in all of this is to end it as soon as possible."

http://www.mercedsunstar.com/2013/03/12/28747...

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