Green Bay Packers: Does 19-0 Season Make Them the Best Team in NFL History?

Dec 7, 2011 Full story: BleacherReport 15

The Green Bay Packers currently hold a 12-0 record and are a measly seven wins away from becoming the second team in NFL history to ever complete a truly perfect season.

Full Story
answerman

Appleton, WI

#1 Dec 7, 2011
It's not time for this discussion yet. They aren't 19-0, they are 12-0. Once they win the Super Bowl, start presenting your case.

I'm pretty sure that Coach McCarthy is focusing the team on getting to 13-0 this weekend. Past that? It'll wait.
GBPfan

Colorado Springs, CO

#2 Dec 7, 2011
This discussion is legitimate any time, any year and with any team, including the Packers this year. Does a 19-0 record make any team the best in NFL history? Would it have made the Patriots the best team ever? If a team does it 3 years from now or 20 years from now, will it make them the best ever? There have been other undefeated teams. Who's to say if past undefeated teams played more games that they wouldn't have ended up 19-0? Is a 19-0 undefeated team automatically better than a 17-0 undefeated team? What about the 1985 Bears? I hate to admit it, but I'm not sure I've ever seen a team play any better than the Bears that year. Does their one loss take them out of consideration? Personally, I don't think 19-0 would automatically make the Packers the best team ever, but I guarantee that many people would say otherwise.
eric

Marshfield, WI

#3 Dec 7, 2011
Kind of hard to argue with perfection though.
If the Packers go 19-0,SB champs
IF the Packers go 18-1 SB Champs
is there really a whole lot of difference besides being the fist team in 40 years or so to go undefeated and having that label? In other words,Undefeated would be great,winning the SB is the ultimate prize and goal.
Im sure the Players would love to go undefeated as would the fans,but,If GB wins the SB with 1 reg. season loss,im sure Charles Woodson in a post game interview wont say,We are super bowl champs but its lesser because we didnt go undefeated
PackerBacker-Wic hitaKs

Wichita, KS

#4 Dec 7, 2011
GBPfan wrote:
This discussion is legitimate any time, any year and with any team, including the Packers this year. Does a 19-0 record make any team the best in NFL history? Would it have made the Patriots the best team ever? If a team does it 3 years from now or 20 years from now, will it make them the best ever? There have been other undefeated teams. Who's to say if past undefeated teams played more games that they wouldn't have ended up 19-0? Is a 19-0 undefeated team automatically better than a 17-0 undefeated team? What about the 1985 Bears? I hate to admit it, but I'm not sure I've ever seen a team play any better than the Bears that year. Does their one loss take them out of consideration? Personally, I don't think 19-0 would automatically make the Packers the best team ever, but I guarantee that many people would say otherwise.
I would not say the '72 Dolphins were the best team ever eventhough they went undefeated. I would take a look at the franchise as what they have accomplished as a whole. Montreal Canadiens in hockey. New York Yankees in baseball. Boston Celtics in basketball and yes, our Green Bay Packers in football. Judging who is the best team for a single year is pretty suggestive and opininated. But, like you I hate to admit this, but the '85 Bears had one of the most dominate teams ever.
GBPfan

Colorado Springs, CO

#5 Dec 7, 2011
Isn't it weird? A team can go 18-1 and yet a 17-0 team would be considered better by most people. But if that 18-1 team happens to not lose that one game and instead finishes 19-0 nearly everybody will be certain that team was the best ever. Take this year. The Packers could have lost to the Giants with a bad bounce or one more dropped pass. Yet if the Packers run it out, they will be considered the best team ever for a single season. Going undefeated would certainly be an unmatched accomplishment due to the longer season now. However, I think it's partly happenstance.
PPenguinsX

Gaithersburg, MD

#6 Dec 7, 2011
CAN YOU SAY MIAMI DOLPHINS?
eric

Marshfield, WI

#7 Dec 7, 2011
Its a tough one! Hard to top being undefeated like the Dolphins were,,,NE was und. until they lost in the SB..
Dallas had a huge run in the 90s with all those HOFers
SF,,,see above.
Steel curtain Steelers were tremendous
85 Chicago Bears
Lombardi's Packers 5 championships in 7 year span.
Hard to compare.but i will say...
Players today are much bigger,stronger,faster,athleti c and teams today would crush teams of years ago.
Average oline back then 260 or so,
now 300+
todays teams are much bigger,stronger,better conditioned
ect
PackerBacker-Wic hitaKs

Wichita, KS

#9 Dec 8, 2011
eric wrote:
Its a tough one! Hard to top being undefeated like the Dolphins were,,,NE was und. until they lost in the SB..
Dallas had a huge run in the 90s with all those HOFers
SF,,,see above.
Steel curtain Steelers were tremendous
85 Chicago Bears
Lombardi's Packers 5 championships in 7 year span.
Hard to compare.but i will say...
Players today are much bigger,stronger,faster,athleti c and teams today would crush teams of years ago.
Average oline back then 260 or so,
now 300+
todays teams are much bigger,stronger,better conditioned
ect
It is tough to compare eras for the reasons you described above. Each decade of the modern era had outstanding teams and hopefully, with the way this team is built, the Packers will be the team of the 2010's. Of course,as stated before, free agency and retirement, will play a big role in any teams' future but I believe we have the right team management in place so that the Packers will not return to the lousy years of the '70s or '80s.
eric

Marshfield, WI

#10 Dec 8, 2011
I can see Capers getting a HC job at some point.
Kevin Greene getting a Defensive Coordinator job from someone.
Im very confident Ted and Mike will be able to replace.
The Way TT has been drafting,theres a good chance he can successfully replace FA leaving keeping the Packers under the cap enough for emergency signings if needed or the massive leap like the one he took to sign Charles Woodson.
We are pretty damn lucky to have Ted Thompson at the helm,He made some pretty damn tough choices nad very unpopular ones at that,but, i think many more will agree then wont agree,he has done a hell of a job with this team and set us up to be a championship calibur team for the next few seasons to come.
Detroit is a team clearly on the rise and will be a tough team to deal with..
Minnesota ( although a very shitty record) has some nice building blocks.A very good qb IMO,a Good RB if they wanted to trade Adrian Peterson( for a high pick or maybe 2).Jared Allen,who will bring back a nice pick or 2.
Kyle Rudolph,a young TE
Alls they need is a GM that knows how to draft better and be a bit better on FA and they will be ready to roll.
Chicago Defense is getting a bit old and will need to be retooled and a few olineman and another WR,the play maker
I know most teams can say that,but, point is,they arent to far from being a very tough team to deal with or in Chicago's case a player here or there.
answerman

Appleton, WI

#11 Dec 8, 2011
We're digressing a bit, but that's ok. It happens a lot here.

Eric, you brought up a valid point about the rest of the division. Part of it's parity (in Detroit's case for example, under the way the league is set up you can only be bad for so long until you can't help but get better), but another part that often goes overlooked is the way the ownership/top management of the team handles things.

Which leads me to a big reason why the Packers have been so successful, along with other teams, while other teams like for example the Bills and Bengals have had trouble recovering from mediocrity. In my mind, one of the biggest reasons for the Packers' success over the past 20+ years goes to the "owner" position. One of the best things the Packers ever did was to make Bob Harlan the team president and de facto "owner" in the case of decision making. He recognized the value in bringing in men like Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson to make the operational decisions that make the team what it is today. And Mark Murphy seems to be doing a fine job in continuing that legacy.

I know Harlan and Murphy are/were not the team owners, but under the team and league structure that's basically the role they fill. Compare that with a Ralph Wilson or Mike Brown, or for that matter a Zygi Wilf (sorry Viking fans) and you see just how important it is to have the right people from the very top down.

Back to the topic: ok, I'll play along. If the Packers do go 19-0, I would have to believe that they are better than the '72 Dolphins on talent alone, but I'm still on the fence between the '11 Packers and the '85 Bears. That team was just so incredibly dominant.
GBPfan

Colorado Springs, CO

#12 Dec 8, 2011
answerman wrote:
Back to the topic: ok, I'll play along. If the Packers do go 19-0, I would have to believe that they are better than the '72 Dolphins on talent alone, but I'm still on the fence between the '11 Packers and the '85 Bears. That team was just so incredibly dominant.
I remember the Dophins. They were great. However, despite the 14-0 regular season record and the 16-0 record enterring the Super Bowl, the Dolphins were 1.5 point UNDERDOGS to the Washington Redskins. The final score was Dolphins 14, Redskins 7. Did anybody in their right mind NOT expect the 1985 Bears to walk through the playoffs? And they did! The only points the Bears gave up in the playoffs were 10 garbage points to the Patriots in the Super Bowl after the game was well under control. The Bears outscored their playoff opponents 91-10. That is dominant.
eric

Marshfield, WI

#13 Dec 8, 2011
answerman wrote:
We're digressing a bit, but that's ok. It happens a lot here.
Eric, you brought up a valid point about the rest of the division. Part of it's parity (in Detroit's case for example, under the way the league is set up you can only be bad for so long until you can't help but get better), but another part that often goes overlooked is the way the ownership/top management of the team handles things.
Which leads me to a big reason why the Packers have been so successful, along with other teams, while other teams like for example the Bills and Bengals have had trouble recovering from mediocrity. In my mind, one of the biggest reasons for the Packers' success over the past 20+ years goes to the "owner" position. One of the best things the Packers ever did was to make Bob Harlan the team president and de facto "owner" in the case of decision making. He recognized the value in bringing in men like Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson to make the operational decisions that make the team what it is today. And Mark Murphy seems to be doing a fine job in continuing that legacy.
I know Harlan and Murphy are/were not the team owners, but under the team and league structure that's basically the role they fill. Compare that with a Ralph Wilson or Mike Brown, or for that matter a Zygi Wilf (sorry Viking fans) and you see just how important it is to have the right people from the very top down.
Back to the topic: ok, I'll play along. If the Packers do go 19-0, I would have to believe that they are better than the '72 Dolphins on talent alone, but I'm still on the fence between the '11 Packers and the '85 Bears. That team was just so incredibly dominant.
The 85 bears defense was dominating,the 11 Packer offense is dominating.The 85 Bears offense was hand it to Walter Peyton,nothing else.GB 11 defense,give up a ton of yards until the red zone and slam them back with turnovers or holding them to FG.GB redzone defense is dominating,they just give up a ton of yards between the first 80 yards which makes the numbers look deceiving a bit.
PPenguinsX

Gaithersburg, MD

#14 Dec 8, 2011
eric wrote:
Its a tough one! Hard to top being undefeated like the Dolphins were,,,NE was und. until they lost in the SB..
Dallas had a huge run in the 90s with all those HOFers
SF,,,see above.
Steel curtain Steelers were tremendous
85 Chicago Bears
Lombardi's Packers 5 championships in 7 year span.
Hard to compare.but i will say...
Players today are much bigger,stronger,faster,athleti c and teams today would crush teams of years ago.
Average oline back then 260 or so,
now 300+
todays teams are much bigger,stronger,better conditioned
ect
The teams of the past played at the level for them at their time. It works proportionally. The people of today all play at "this" level.
PPenguinsX

Gaithersburg, MD

#15 Dec 8, 2011
eric wrote:
<quoted text>The 85 bears defense was dominating,the 11 Packer offense is dominating.The 85 Bears offense was hand it to Walter Peyton,nothing else.GB 11 defense,give up a ton of yards until the red zone and slam them back with turnovers or holding them to FG.GB redzone defense is dominating,they just give up a ton of yards between the first 80 yards which makes the numbers look deceiving a bit.
The Steel Curtain
GBPfan

Colorado Springs, CO

#16 Dec 8, 2011
eric wrote:
<quoted text>The 85 bears defense was dominating,the 11 Packer offense is dominating.The 85 Bears offense was hand it to Walter Peyton,nothing else.GB 11 defense,give up a ton of yards until the red zone and slam them back with turnovers or holding them to FG.GB redzone defense is dominating,they just give up a ton of yards between the first 80 yards which makes the numbers look deceiving a bit.
I saw Ron Jaworski today saying how he thought the yards allowed statistic was so meaningless that he would like to see the NFL do away with it. I guess he is coming around. Apparently, Steve Young and Jon Gruden have convinced him that he was wrong. He pointed out that with regard to the Packers many of the yards allowed have been "garbage" yards and that the Packers defense is much better than the yards allowed stat indicates.

I've always been a big proponent of defense. I love great defense and, unlike most people, I appreciate good defense. High scoring games are not as entertaining to me as a good defensive battle. I truly believe that a great defense is more reliable than a great offense. However, the NFL has been shifting the game to more of an offensive geared game for decades through numerous rule changes. I could pretend that isn't so, but it is a fact whether I like it or not. Gone are the days when a defense could dominate like it could in the past. A great offense can dominate and the definition of a great defense has been altered. A great defense can be turnover focused. It certainly can be a terrific compliment to a great offense. The Packers may well be the model for what it means to be a great team now and in the future.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Greg Jennings Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Minnesota Vikings Would Be Wise To Part Ways Wi... Jan 28 VikeTards 2
Rick Spielman's "8 Specific Needs" For The Offs... Jan 22 Tug O Purple Wienerz 8
Vikings Fall to 4-7, Where Can We Point The Fin... Nov '14 Larry 6
Vikings' Captain Munnerlyn laments missed inter... Nov '14 Laughing Bear Fan 1
Vikings: Teddy Bridgewater rebounds after two i... Oct '14 Turdwater 2
Vikings up next to try to contain Packers' Nelson Oct '14 GBPfan 4
Vikings' Bridgewater resting, but not Zimmer Oct '14 Laughing Bear Fan 1
More from around the web