Lunenburg aims to crack down on trail...

Lunenburg aims to crack down on trail trespassers - Sentinel & Enterprise

There are 60 comments on the Sentinel & Enterprise story from Dec 23, 2010, titled Lunenburg aims to crack down on trail trespassers - Sentinel & Enterprise. In it, Sentinel & Enterprise reports that:

The Conservation Commission is hoping to improve control over the illegal use of all-terrain vehicles on conservation land.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Sentinel & Enterprise.

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BowHunter

Brookline, MA

#41 Jan 4, 2011
ATV Girl wrote:
We can all thank the Guthrie Brothers in Shirley for rutting up the land and ruining it for the rest of us. Came across them today (12/31) on conservation land on their ATVs with one buried in a rut just tearing it up. Anyone want pictures? If those guys knew how to ride and do it responsibly we wouldn't have to worry about where we ride.
Yes, take pictures and send them to the Shirley conservation commission and the Shirley police department, make sure you send it to the Chief, Gregory Massak.
Blogenburgian

Clinton, MA

#42 Jan 4, 2011
BowHunter wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, take pictures and send them to the Shirley conservation commission and the Shirley police department, make sure you send it to the Chief, Gregory Massak.
And don't edit out Bowhunter jacking doe deer on conservation land on a Sunday with a rifle in the background - just kidding hahhaha
BowHunter

Brookline, MA

#43 Jan 5, 2011
Blogenburgian wrote:
<quoted text>
And don't edit out Bowhunter jacking doe deer on conservation land on a Sunday with a rifle in the background - just kidding hahhaha
?????????, Did I miss something????????
Please

Lee, MA

#44 Jan 6, 2011
quad rider wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually there are public lands which are available to ride on. However, there are very few places. Last I knew there were 8 places where riding in state forests are allow, but none in central Mass. There are 3 or 4 places out in the Berkshire's and the rest are down near the Cape, but the places near the Cape are dirt bikes only. It is truly sad that we cannot get more places to ride atv's. I grew up in a small town in central Mass and know of many areas of state forest that are seldom if ever used by anyone other than ATV's, and those all of the trails would become overgrown quite quickly if there were none riding through there. The State should audit the areas of state forest and determine which would be suitable for ATV use, and which should not. This would help to alleviate some of the illegal riding, but definitely not all of it. The problem is that there has not been enough of a push from the pro-ATV community to get some action on something like this.
The state has been keeping an eye on the legal areas and the result has been 2 more have been shut down over the last few years. ATV riders simply aren't willing and/or able to maintain the trails they have been allowed on. Even though there are thousands upon thousands of riders in the state, they are either very poorly organized or for the most part, very lazy when it comes to giving back to the trails. I believe it's a combination of the two.

When was the last time any of you ATV riders made an effort to attend a trail work session on the legal trails in the state? For most, the answer is 'never'. THAT is exactly why you have nowhere to ride. Prove to the powers-that-be that you are willling and able to clean up your messes and obey the rules and doors will open. Keep thinking you can tear up wetlands, blow out and rut up hiking trails, ride during mud season when the trails are the most sensitive, create braids and go-arounds all over te place, ignore no trespassing or private property signs, etc and you'll find yourselves...well, where you are now. Your bed was made by your fellow quad riders, not anyone else. You've got a lot of PR work to do, which goes beyond whining about how you pay taxes and want everything handed to you on a silver platter.
Townsend

Westminster, MA

#45 Jan 6, 2011
There would not be hiking trails if it wasnt for us atv riders that keep the trails from getting over grown . Dont lump everyone together there are those who do make a mess but some of us just like a little time with the kids in the fresh air away from tv , ds , or the wii quality time with the kids . Get a clue please !
Please

Lee, MA

#46 Jan 6, 2011
Townsend wrote:
There would not be hiking trails if it wasnt for us atv riders that keep the trails from getting over grown .
You've got to be kidding me.
Blogenburgian

Clinton, MA

#47 Jan 6, 2011
Please wrote:
<quoted text>
The state has been keeping an eye on the legal areas and the result has been 2 more have been shut down over the last few years. ATV riders simply aren't willing and/or able to maintain the trails they have been allowed on. Even though there are thousands upon thousands of riders in the state, they are either very poorly organized or for the most part, very lazy when it comes to giving back to the trails. I believe it's a combination of the two.
When was the last time any of you ATV riders made an effort to attend a trail work session on the legal trails in the state? For most, the answer is 'never'. THAT is exactly why you have nowhere to ride. Prove to the powers-that-be that you are willling and able to clean up your messes and obey the rules and doors will open. Keep thinking you can tear up wetlands, blow out and rut up hiking trails, ride during mud season when the trails are the most sensitive, create braids and go-arounds all over te place, ignore no trespassing or private property signs, etc and you'll find yourselves...well, where you are now. Your bed was made by your fellow quad riders, not anyone else. You've got a lot of PR work to do, which goes beyond whining about how you pay taxes and want everything handed to you on a silver platter.
Well said but let me clear it up a bit. When was the last time you ATVers thought of establishing a lobbiest group and donating heavily to the politicians that you thought would represent you the best. You see you are missing the first point of how things work in this state. We take your money, buy land with it and then expect you to pay hefty fees and permits to use it. Why because the local politicians need to get their kids, nephews, cousins political appoinments and summer jobs as caretakers, rangers etc. You also by acting independently and without the need for all of the cumbersome politcs, state agencies and lobbiest gropus are about the most replusive threat to the rest of us's agendas, kickback schemes and need to control everything - shame on you.
Townsend

Westminster, MA

#48 Jan 6, 2011
I didnt think please would have a come back !!! Beacause truth hurts !
Please

Lee, MA

#49 Jan 7, 2011
Blogenburgian wrote:
<quoted text>
Well said but let me clear it up a bit. When was the last time you ATVers thought of establishing a lobbiest group and donating heavily to the politicians that you thought would represent you the best. You see you are missing the first point of how things work in this state. We take your money, buy land with it and then expect you to pay hefty fees and permits to use it. Why because the local politicians need to get their kids, nephews, cousins political appoinments and summer jobs as caretakers, rangers etc. You also by acting independently and without the need for all of the cumbersome politcs, state agencies and lobbiest gropus are about the most replusive threat to the rest of us's agendas, kickback schemes and need to control everything - shame on you.
Not true...I've never had to pay a trail use fee in this state. Ever. Back in the day, before ATVs, dirt bikers had pretty good access to lots of places. Quads came on the scene and basically ruined motorized access for everyone. Some of it stems from the fact that they have a MUCH larger impact than anything else you'll come across in the woods, even when operated responsibly. Mostly though, it's because your typical quad rider doesn't really have a clue about what it takes to be a responsible trail user.
Townsend

Westminster, MA

#50 Jan 7, 2011
Just spoken like the opinion of one and you know what they say about opinions !You have good and bad in all things in life and people sounds like you dont know how to enjoy yourself !lighten up and take off your tie !
Please

Lee, MA

#51 Jan 7, 2011
Townsend wrote:
Just spoken like the opinion of one and you know what they say about opinions !You have good and bad in all things in life and people sounds like you dont know how to enjoy yourself !lighten up and take off your tie !
No tie here my friend. Lots of time enjoying myself in the woods though; managed to learn a couple things along the way too. It's not my 'opinion' that there are no trail user fees collected in MA; that's a fact. Maybe a parking fee at certain places, but they're few and far between, and there's usually a free option close by. Likewise with the rest - go ahead, so some research and spend some time on the local ATV club websites. They always seem to have trouble getting enough people to volunteer for trailwork days.

Looks like they are getting $$ for trail projects these days though. Squeaky wheel approach paid off

http://www.mass.gov/dcr/stewardship/greenway/...
Blogenburgian

Clinton, MA

#52 Jan 7, 2011
Please wrote:
<quoted text>
No tie here my friend. Lots of time enjoying myself in the woods though; managed to learn a couple things along the way too. It's not my 'opinion' that there are no trail user fees collected in MA; that's a fact. Maybe a parking fee at certain places, but they're few and far between, and there's usually a free option close by. Likewise with the rest - go ahead, so some research and spend some time on the local ATV club websites. They always seem to have trouble getting enough people to volunteer for trailwork days.
Looks like they are getting $$ for trail projects these days though. Squeaky wheel approach paid off
http://www.mass.gov/dcr/stewardship/greenway/...
And just why do people have to do trailwork? If a trail gets a rut go around it. Haven't you ever come across a trail where a large tree has fallen? People make a route around it. And this is not ATV talk. This is what I have seen on some of the side trails from Chowdery or Mt Wachusetts.
Please

Westminster, MA

#53 Jan 8, 2011
Blogenburgian wrote:
<quoted text>
And just why do people have to do trailwork? If a trail gets a rut go around it. Haven't you ever come across a trail where a large tree has fallen? People make a route around it. And this is not ATV talk. This is what I have seen on some of the side trails from Chowdery or Mt Wachusetts.
If you spend some time watching an area where this is how trails are treated, you'll see that the entire character of a trail changes over time. Mt Wachusett is a good example: there's no reason for a hiking trail to be wider than a couple feet. Poor etiquette and laziness on the part of hikers has blown the trails out to 20' wide in places. Ugly and unsustainable. ATVs will typically do this same thing a lot at stream crossings; it'll start as a simple crossing confined to a small area. Once they end up digging a couple deeper ruts in that spot, they'll start 'braiding' 15 or 20 feet away in a different spot. Once they dig that spot up, they keep moving along. Many ATVers actually seek out wetalnds to ride in for some 'mudding'. ONce a trail start getting regular ATV traffic, it takes a surprisingly short time for it to turn into something like what's in the pictures below. Let me know if you don't believe me and I'll post up some directions to local spots you can check out for yourself come springtime.

http://www.saveourtrails.ca/images/csplit02.j...

http://www.newwest.net/images/articles/atv_da...

http://www.outlawatvclub.com/forums/uploads/p...

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_pYeb90V1_go/SjqUVYV...

http://www.northernlife.ca/images/ATV_mud.jpg

http://www.quadcrazy.com/gallery/large/5038-2...
Blogenburgian

Clinton, MA

#54 Jan 8, 2011
Please wrote:
<quoted text>
If you spend some time watching an area where this is how trails are treated, you'll see that the entire character of a trail changes over time. Mt Wachusett is a good example: there's no reason for a hiking trail to be wider than a couple feet. Poor etiquette and laziness on the part of hikers has blown the trails out to 20' wide in places. Ugly and unsustainable. ATVs will typically do this same thing a lot at stream crossings; it'll start as a simple crossing confined to a small area. Once they end up digging a couple deeper ruts in that spot, they'll start 'braiding' 15 or 20 feet away in a different spot. Once they dig that spot up, they keep moving along. Many ATVers actually seek out wetalnds to ride in for some 'mudding'. ONce a trail start getting regular ATV traffic, it takes a surprisingly short time for it to turn into something like what's in the pictures below. Let me know if you don't believe me and I'll post up some directions to local spots you can check out for yourself come springtime.
http://www.saveourtrails.ca/images/csplit02.j...
http://www.newwest.net/images/articles/atv_da...
http://www.outlawatvclub.com/forums/uploads/p...
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_pYeb90V1_go/SjqUVYV...
http://www.northernlife.ca/images/ATV_mud.jpg
http://www.quadcrazy.com/gallery/large/5038-2...
Awesome pictures, makes me want to go out and get a dirt bike. Those pictures are just what riders of serious caliper make riding the dirt what its all about.

I have hiked many parts of conservation land and have never seen this kind of damage, most of this is private land and powerline stuff.

Your sensationalism is not appreciated.

And by the way, when you go out into the woods do you expect not to get your feet dirty?
Please

Westminster, MA

#56 Jan 9, 2011
Blogenburgian wrote:
<quoted text>
Awesome pictures, makes me want to go out and get a dirt bike. Those pictures are just what riders of serious caliper make riding the dirt what its all about.
I have hiked many parts of conservation land and have never seen this kind of damage, most of this is private land and powerline stuff.
Your sensationalism is not appreciated.
And by the way, when you go out into the woods do you expect not to get your feet dirty?
Maybe you don't see it at your backyard trails, but trust me, there's plenty of spots like that in MA. Why you think the legal trails in Pittsfield, Bradley Palmer and Savoy got shut down?

Turning trails into what you see below is EXACTLY why ATVs don't have many legal places to ride. You can get bent at me all you want about it, but land managers HATE this stuff and if you can't keep them happy, you ain't gonna have anywhere legal to ride.



http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Blogenburgian

Clinton, MA

#57 Jan 9, 2011
Please wrote:
<quoted text>
Maybe you don't see it at your backyard trails, but trust me, there's plenty of spots like that in MA. Why you think the legal trails in Pittsfield, Bradley Palmer and Savoy got shut down?
Turning trails into what you see below is EXACTLY why ATVs don't have many legal places to ride. You can get bent at me all you want about it, but land managers HATE this stuff and if you can't keep them happy, you ain't gonna have anywhere legal to ride.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =CF5mDT5kGewXX
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Too bad for "Land Managers", all people have a right to use our own (what you may imply is State Property)property. There is plenty of room for all and if people are afraid of getting their feet muddy then they should not go out in the woods. I rode out in Temleton years ago and never saw what you depict except for in isolated areas where it is wet in the spring and guess what, that's just the way it is. Your exaggerations are a shameful twist that serve the few with agendas who want to keep everything for themselves.
Ching chang

Leominster, MA

#58 Jan 9, 2011
I can show you gruesome pictures of dog bites. Does that mean all dogs should be shot?
Atheist

Westminster, MA

#59 Jan 9, 2011
Blogenburgian wrote:
<quoted text>
Too bad for "Land Managers", all people have a right to use our own (what you may imply is State Property)property. There is plenty of room for all and if people are afraid of getting their feet muddy then they should not go out in the woods. I rode out in Temleton years ago and never saw what you depict except for in isolated areas where it is wet in the spring and guess what, that's just the way it is. Your exaggerations are a shameful twist that serve the few with agendas who want to keep everything for themselves.
You wanna shoot the messenger to make yourself feel better, go ahead. I didn't fake the video, nor am I making up the fact that that is exactly what gets ATVs shut out. If you want to pretend differently, go ahead and keep your blinders on. And as far as being owed a place to do whatever you want, it's all a matter of degree. Do you believe the state owes us a drag strip or a monster truck mudbog? How about a free downhill ski area? Rally race trails? I paid sales tax when I bought my skis. People pay taxes on their hopped up Subarus.

Personally, if there were places to ride, me and my kids would have a garage full of dirt bikes (I've always found ATVs pretty lame, but that's just how my tastes run). If I thought the local motorized community would be willing to go through what it takes to create and keep legal areas to ride, I'd be first in line at town meetings and out on the trails to help make it happen. 3 decades of being out on the trails shows me that I'd be one of a small percentage around here willing to put in the time and effort to make it work. Most would rather sit back and whine 'I pay taxes, somebody has to build and maintain everything for me'.

Mostly, I feel badly for the responsible riders, specially the dirt bikers who get unfairly lumped in with ATVs when their impact is much lower and they had a proven track record of working with managers and keeping them happy. If anybody out there has a plan other than b*tching and moaning, I'd love to hear it. Being able to take my kids riding would be a hoot.
Please

Westminster, MA

#60 Jan 9, 2011
Ching chang wrote:
I can show you gruesome pictures of dog bites. Does that mean all dogs should be shot?
Yes.
Grizzly Man

Concord, MA

#61 May 1, 2011
Allowing snow mobiles to ride on any land in mass and having ATV's illegal in my opinion is discrimination. It's like telling a black man he can't piss in a white man's bathroom or eat at a white man's lunch counter. Complete discrimonation.Is there anyone out there who feels the same way?

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