Obama embraces charter schools, ouste...

Obama embraces charter schools, ouster of bad teachers in bipar...

There are 64 comments on the South Florida Sun-Sentinel story from Sep 9, 2008, titled Obama embraces charter schools, ouster of bad teachers in bipar.... In it, South Florida Sun-Sentinel reports that:

The Democratic presidential nominee says both parties must work together to improve education, according to remarks prepared for delivery Tuesday at a suburban high school gymnasium.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at South Florida Sun-Sentinel.

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bill2008

Shreveport, LA

#63 Mar 12, 2009
"It's like all the other Great Society/Entitlement programs: mismanagement, waste and failure. The War on Poverty (been fought since the 60s--about 6-7x longer than the War on Terror) has been a costly failure. The result? A whole generation of kids raised without fathers. They became expendable, replaced by the welfare check. More kids? More checks. Ain't it grand?"
There are lots of reasons for the degradation: Problems with our education system to include college as well as primary education; our mortality rate give us a health rating of 28th, or the developed countries as evaluated by the World Health Organization in 2008; 51% of our marriages end up in failure making single parent homes higher than they ever have been our history..these are just a few examples, I could list many more, but my point is that I can not blame the people on welfare for all these problems. The whole of society is to blame. Some believe started in the 70s when women decided they should be liberated and began their transition from homemakers into the work force; and we raised our level of WANTS to accommodate the higher income, until our WANTS and our NEEDS we the same. To support this concept of "not living by our means" we ran up the credit cards, we borrowed against our home equities, and when it got worse we borrowed more until we could not borrow any more and even with two family members working we could not pay all this debt. We drive Trucks and SUVs to work and back, when not too long ago these vehicles were considered "special purpose" vehicles. Why do you think that in most states, tucks must have a license plate that says "private?" Because these vehicles were mainly used for commercial use until we in our wisdom changed that. Yes, we can blame the poor, the lazy and others if we want, but reality fails to support that view.
Reality check

Miami, FL

#65 Mar 13, 2009
[QUOTE who="2008bill]There is research that indicates that the quality of the teacher has more to do with successful learning than any other factor.
[/QUOTE]

I agree but you stopped short. That research doesn't indicate that paying more equals a better quality teacher. The research showed that teachers with degrees in their fields had students who performed better despite classroom size or any of the other smoke screens the unions throw out to cover the issue. Jeb Bush addressed this by closing the door on teachers with teaching certificates. He allowed existing staff to be grandfathered in but put a timeframe on it. A lot of friends found themselves in this boat and scrambling to get their degree.

Now this being said, if you are asking for teachers with degrees, then pay comperable to the education is certainly an equitable trade.

Since: Apr 08

Butler, New Jersey

#66 Mar 13, 2009
Reality check wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree but you stopped short. That research doesn't indicate that paying more equals a better quality teacher. The research showed that teachers with degrees in their fields had students who performed better despite classroom size or any of the other smoke screens the unions throw out to cover the issue. Jeb Bush addressed this by closing the door on teachers with teaching certificates. He allowed existing staff to be grandfathered in but put a timeframe on it. A lot of friends found themselves in this boat and scrambling to get their degree.
Now this being said, if you are asking for teachers with degrees, then pay comperable to the education is certainly an equitable trade.
From my previous posting: "If the teachers had not banded together and used their unions and their self-centered representatives to water down the "highly Qualified" requirements of NCLB, it would have made more of a difference. To think that a teacher would not be willing take an exam to validate they are qualified to teach in their primary area, ie. english, math etc. on one hand, while expecting students to take comprehensive tests every year is sad. The teachers were successul in using "experience" as a way to satisfy the requirement (i.e. do nothing)."

Additionally, I do believe that using a merit system rather than the yearly "if you don't give me a raise, then you don't care about your child's education" blanket raises for teachers would create incentives for teachers to seek higher qualification and professional development. How many of us get to have our pay rasies voted on by the public? The blanket raises are ineffective, and Obama wants to reform this age old concept.
NWGuy

Seattle, WA

#67 Mar 24, 2009
2008bill wrote:
<quoted text>
From my previous posting: "If the teachers had not banded together and used their unions and their self-centered representatives to water down the "highly Qualified" requirements of NCLB, it would have made more of a difference. To think that a teacher would not be willing take an exam to validate they are qualified to teach in their primary area, ie. english, math etc. on one hand, while expecting students to take comprehensive tests every year is sad. The teachers were successul in using "experience" as a way to satisfy the requirement (i.e. do nothing)."
Frankly, I'm not so sure that subject competency of teachers is the real problem in education today.

When we as parents pick teachers as being "outstanding" do we really think we're picking the ones who would score highest in a test in math or English lit?

I do agree that we need to attract academically strong prospects to education, and to insist on excellence in subject areas. However, it seems like the real substance of the excellent teachers comes in education technique and ability to connect and inspire and demand attention and performance.

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