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EX-PPT wrote:

I would highly advise not doing this.

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the wife wrote:

They both have antagonists in them, but one is a partial antagonist and the other is a full antagonist...but whats the point in trying to get clean with recovery drugs, if you are trying to figure out how to abuse them, hmmmmmmm??

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rcoaster wrote:

after 67 hours????
BULLSHIT!
I was doing a bundle a day for over a year, and after 24 hours of nothing, 8mg of suboxone made me feel better.

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rakaur wrote:

<quoted text>
Not entirely true. Subutex is just buprenorphine, which is a partial agonist (which means at about 32mg it stops working). The reason buprenorphine sets off withdrawal in those already dependent on opioids isn't because of antagonist actions, but because it has an extremely high affinity for mu opioid receptors, so much that it displaces other opioids in the system. If you have a heavy opioid dependency the buprenorphine dose will not be sufficient to prevent withdrawal when this happens, which indeed causes severe withdrawal.
Suboxone has buprenorphine and naloxone (Narcan, an opioid antagonist). The plan for that was that due to the poor oral bioavailability of nalaxone, when taken properly it would be fine, but when injected (thus increasing the bioavailability to 100%) the naloxone would block the buprenorphine. This doesn't work, because of the same reason I mentioned above. Buprenorphine has such a high affinity for the mu receptors it is resistant to full-on high doses of naloxone, let alone the tiny amount in Suboxone.
Buprenorphine (alone or with naloxone as Suboxone) is widely abused, especially in Scandinavia, where it is the principal IV opioid of abuse.

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schugeorge wrote:

<quoted text>
Actually, the second ingredient (naloxone) is what causes the withdrawal..the fact that subutex only has buprenorphine in it allows one to get high by injecting it and why one doesn't get "sick"..once the naloxone is added it is then suboxone and could now cause withdrawal if injected or taken too soon after last heroin or other opiate.

Wikipedia wrote:

Suboxone contains buprenorphine as well as the opioid antagonist naloxone to deter the abuse of tablets by intravenous injection. Controlled trials in human subjects suggest that buprenorphine and naloxone at a 4:1 ratio will produce unpleasant withdrawal symptoms if taken intravenously by patients who are addicted to opioids, but has no such effect when taken sublingually. However, the Suboxone formulation still has potential to produce an opioid agonist "high" if injected by non-dependent persons which may provide some explanation to street reports indicating that the naloxone is an insufficient deterrent to injection of Suboxone.

[...]

Buprenorphine abuse is very common in Scandinavia, especially in Finland and Sweden. In 2007, the authorities in Uppsala county in Sweden confiscated more buprenorphine than cocaine, ecstasy and GHB.