Methadone clinic could cause problems

Do you ever get complete "restoration of balance of the endorphin system"? Is there a possiblity that some people are endorphin deficient and their brain has never produced enough of these "feel good" hormones? For those people, if they actually exist, what would be recommended?

EXmethadone

San Francisco, CA

My experience with narcotic addiction would indicate that yes, the natural balance of brain chemistry returns in time, at least for me. There is a documented case of a man who was born without the capacity to produce any endorphins. An apparent unfortunate genetic mutation.

perhaps

EXmethadone wrote:

My experience with narcotic addiction would indicate that yes, the natural balance of brain chemistry returns in time, at least for me. There is a documented case of a man who was born without the capacity to produce any endorphins. An apparent unfortunate genetic mutation.

I wonder how they measure endorphin production?

EXmethadone

San Francisco, CA

I don't know. If my memory is correct I believe this case was a chapter in a book titled "The Man Who Mistook His Wife For a Hatrack", a collection of case studies about people with rare brain disorders. I haven't read the book.

perhaps

Thank you. I will try to see if I can locate this book. I think that sometimes people don't view the brain as an organ just like any other organ in the body; and thus subject to disease too. I believe that is where the belief that addiction is a disease comes in.

hey

to nobody:first of all, you don't know anything about me. the only thing that you know is that i go to the clinic. you do not know anything about my life. i see, you have went back and read some of my older posts, or you wouldn't know how much my habit was a day. yeah, 50 on a day just to keep from being sick, but when i really wanted to get high it was a good 100-150/day. see, you really don't know what kind of habit i had. so, you don't really know how the clinic has helped me. when i did have the addiction, i would get up of the morning, first thing, figure out how i was going to come up with 100 dollars for that day. after coming up with the money which usually took around 2-3 hours i would go start looking for the pills and wouldn't stop until i found them, and sometimes that would take up to 8 hours. i was usually able to afford my habit, me and my husband have been together for 15 years, since i was 19 years old, and he always paid for them unless we were broke, then i would borrow from my family, or use our overdraft honors at the bank. you are talking about all of the people that i have wronged, honestly, i never had anyone to apologize to, except for my kids, and that was for just not being around as much as i could have because all of my day was spent looking for pills. see, another thing you don't know about me. see, every addict is different. i didn't go out stealing like alot of people. i was always taught morals and values. what you said about going to church. i grew up in a church. i still go on occasion, about 2 times a month.my kids and i go every chance that i get. another thing you don't know about me. you act as if you are any different that i am because you took subtex. that is what pisses me off. we were both addicts. we were both being treated for addiction, but you pretend to be better than me because you took a different medication than me. sorry, but i see no different. maybe you are the bad person that you believe me to be, but like i said before, i don't have anyone that i need to apologize for things that i did while i was an addict. no, i do not go around the same people i did before getting treatment either. the only people that i went around anyway before treatment was drug dealers, and i haven't been to any of their houses since i began the clinic. so, i would suggest that you don't pretend to know someone you have never met.

perhaps

hey wrote:

to nobody:first of all, you don't know anything about me. the only thing that you know is that i go to the clinic. you do not know anything about my life. i see, you have went back and read some of my older posts, or you wouldn't know how much my habit was a day. yeah, 50 on a day just to keep from being sick, but when i really wanted to get high it was a good 100-150/day. see, you really don't know what kind of habit i had. so, you don't really know how the clinic has helped me. when i did have the addiction, i would get up of the morning, first thing, figure out how i was going to come up with 100 dollars for that day. after coming up with the money which usually took around 2-3 hours i would go start looking for the pills and wouldn't stop until i found them, and sometimes that would take up to 8 hours. i was usually able to afford my habit, me and my husband have been together for 15 years, since i was 19 years old, and he always paid for them unless we were broke, then i would borrow from my family, or use our overdraft honors at the bank. you are talking about all of the people that i have wronged, honestly, i never had anyone to apologize to, except for my kids, and that was for just not being around as much as i could have because all of my day was spent looking for pills. see, another thing you don't know about me. see, every addict is different. i didn't go out stealing like alot of people. i was always taught morals and values. what you said about going to church. i grew up in a church. i still go on occasion, about 2 times a month.my kids and i go every chance that i get. another thing you don't know about me. you act as if you are any different that i am because you took subtex. that is what pisses me off. we were both addicts. we were both being treated for addiction, but you pretend to be better than me because you took a different medication than me. sorry, but i see no different. maybe you are the bad person that you believe me to be, but like i said before, i don't have anyone that i need to apologize for things that i did while i was an addict. no, i do not go around the same people i did before getting treatment either. the only people that i went around anyway before treatment was drug dealers, and i haven't been to any of their houses since i began the clinic. so, i would suggest that you don't pretend to know someone you have never met.

It sounds as if your choice of medication assisted treatment is working well for you and that is what is important. Congragulations on your success. I wish you the best and continued progress with your treatment.

hey

perhaps wrote:

<quoted text>
It sounds as if your choice of medication assisted treatment is working well for you and that is what is important. Congragulations on your success. I wish you the best and continued progress with your treatment.

thanks, i appreciate it. methadone treatment was not my first choice, believe me. i was in and out of rehab 5 times, from 7-30 day programs. i also tried to quit myself several times to no avail. after i saw that nothing that i had tried was going to work i tried the clinic, twice. the first time, i didn't even get on a stable dose. i stayed about 3 weeks, and quit. it was only the second time that i went that i decided it was going to have to work. i decided i was going to stay no matter what, and after about 2 months, i was stabalized, and the program began to work. i have been clean ever since i began the program the second time. i know what it has done for me and my family. that is how i know what it can do for someone's quality of life. it has certainly changed mine.

perhaps

Sometimes it takes more than one try; in fact, it often seems to. A very dear family member of mine tried the rehab, then methadone and finally suboxone. The suboxone has been the best for them; but I would never negate the value of a treatment that works for someone. That is why I think that choices of treatment are so important. What works for one may not be the best path for another.

I know that it feels so good to have your health, happiness and hope for your life back.

Joined: Mon Nov 2

Comments: 161

Psyche wrote:

<quoted text>
Okay let's talk about the down side. Here are the concepts again I would like to discuss. Opioid hyperalgesia which results in increased pain and a lower pain sensitivity threshhold, opioid receptor downregulation which leads to tolerance, endorphin shutdown which leads to depression, and finally the strong affinity that Methadone has for the opioid receptor making weaning much more difficult as compared to other opioids like buprenorphin (Suboxone). Finally, why doesn't anyone talk about the reasons why people get addicted to begin with and why aren't we addressing the problem at it's source rather than merely touting all the benefits of Methadone.

You are right, they should disclose the side effects long before they even let into a clinic. They are reeling in so many young people at the clinic where I am at now. I don't think they should be there. There's time for them to stop in other ways? I wish they would tell them what will happen in their future. But, they don't care, if someone's willing to pay, why should they care. It's not their child doing it. My daughter was on Methadone, and now she;s been off for the past 8 months. I didn't want her on it. It's no good for her, she's too young and she's not a lifelong addict. That is who this stuff is for, not young people that don't even have enough years alive to be called an addict.They need to stop signing up young people today, I say!!!

nobody

London, KY

Psyche wrote:

<quoted text>
It would work much better if the intent was to stabilize the patient concurrent with receiving intensive psychosocial counseling (i.e. N/A) with active involvement of the physician in weaning, utilizing other adjunct medications as deemed necessary during the weaning process to mitigate withdrawal symptoms, instead of simply allowing the patient to be maintained on a prolonged and often lifetime maintenance schedule with little or no effort at weaning. Suboxone or other short acting opiates could also be used as a bridge prior to complete abstinence. Some of the newer classes of antidepressants which elevate serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine levels could also be used as adjuncts along with some of the newer nootropics which enhance brain function while awaiting restoration of balance of the endorphin system. This would require a concerted effort between a psychopharmacologist, a behavioral psychologist, and a psychiatrist, as well as other counselors if something like this would ever be put into practice.

I thought that Subutex is a long acting opiet not a short acting opiet am I wrong?

Joined: Mon Nov 2

Comments: 161

Psyche wrote:

<quoted text>
It would work much better if the intent was to stabilize the patient concurrent with receiving intensive psychosocial counseling (i.e. N/A) with active involvement of the physician in weaning, utilizing other adjunct medications as deemed necessary during the weaning process to mitigate withdrawal symptoms, instead of simply allowing the patient to be maintained on a prolonged and often lifetime maintenance schedule with little or no effort at weaning. Suboxone or other short acting opiates could also be used as a bridge prior to complete abstinence. Some of the newer classes of antidepressants which elevate serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine levels could also be used as adjuncts along with some of the newer nootropics which enhance brain function while awaiting restoration of balance of the endorphin system. This would require a concerted effort between a psychopharmacologist, a behavioral psychologist, and a psychiatrist, as well as other counselors if something like this would ever be put into practice.

I am doing this right now, I am seeing a doctor, a methadone counselor, and a mental psychologist. They are all working together to help me with my needs. Everyone has the chance to do it this way. But so far I am the only one that I know that has even asked for mental health counseling and medical doctors and methadone doctors all in on my case, to make sure that I never go back to using again. I hated being an addict and wasted too many years. I will never go back!!!

Mystic

Venice, FL

Debrinconcita wrote:

<quoted text>You are right, they should disclose the side effects long before they even let into a clinic. They are reeling in so many young people at the clinic where I am at now. I don't think they should be there. There's time for them to stop in other ways? I wish they would tell them what will happen in their future. But, they don't care, if someone's willing to pay, why should they care. It's not their child doing it. My daughter was on Methadone, and now she;s been off for the past 8 months. I didn't want her on it. It's no good for her, she's too young and she's not a lifelong addict. That is who this stuff is for, not young people that don't even have enough years alive to be called an addict.They need to stop signing up young people today, I say!!!

Amen, thats sayin a lot! Mystic

Joined: Mon Nov 2

Comments: 161

perhaps wrote:

Do you ever get complete "restoration of balance of the endorphin system"? Is there a possiblity that some people are endorphin deficient and their brain has never produced enough of these "feel good" hormones? For those people, if they actually exist, what would be recommended?

They need to see a psycological and brain expert. They will do the testing in Seattle, their this doctor doing it. His name is Dr. Amen, look at his site online. He has trying to study addicts brains and how to make sure that everything can start back to the way they were before they started using drugs & alcohol. Have you even heard of him. He's been on public television alot. I have been sending him messages. Cause I live in Oregon, not too far from where he is.

Joined: Mon Nov 2

Comments: 161

hey wrote:

<quoted text>thanks, i appreciate it. methadone treatment was not my first choice, believe me. i was in and out of rehab 5 times, from 7-30 day programs. i also tried to quit myself several times to no avail. after i saw that nothing that i had tried was going to work i tried the clinic, twice. the first time, i didn't even get on a stable dose. i stayed about 3 weeks, and quit. it was only the second time that i went that i decided it was going to have to work. i decided i was going to stay no matter what, and after about 2 months, i was stabalized, and the program began to work. i have been clean ever since i began the program the second time. i know what it has done for me and my family. that is how i know what it can do for someone's quality of life. it has certainly changed mine.

I know methadone wasn't my first choice either. But after using for 30 yrs I was desperate for anything to help me. I tried to get into the detox place 1st, but there full every single day down here. I tired for 3-4 months. Then my friend told me about it, they weren't even going to let me into the clinic, cause I don't have a record of drug use. I can lie and steal and hide my lifestyle for the past 30 yrs. I am here now and I'm doing what works for me, and I will help whoever I can!

Joined: Mon Nov 2

Comments: 161