Judge signs order to return polygamists' kids

Jun 2, 2008 Full story: Lubbock Avalanche 90

Members of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints file out of the Tom Green County Courthouse following the custody hearing in San Angelo, Texas on Friday, April 18, 2008.

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Since: Feb 07

San Jose, CA

#1 Jun 2, 2008
Why aren't these creepy State officials rounded up and charged with kidnapping, conspiracy, and civil rights violations, and child abuse?

And the parents are to allow these state criminals to continue to abuse the children?

Completely insane nonsense.
Barry Kitchkeesic-Wynn

Thunder Bay, Canada

#2 Jun 5, 2008
Here I am in Thunder Bay, Ontario, 14 Regent St. Apartment 2 to be exact; exact means at the spot. My question? Are all those ladies and gentlemen related including the children? If they are then no one in the USA or Canada can beat their utopia.
The Queen of England has a large family bu not as large as 400 and more living souls, is that the father Warren Jessop? Lord he must be lonely been locked up in prison, 400 and more hearts is a lot to love and to miss their love, if h is the father of them all then the state has no business locking him up because of his relations and numbers. Friend Barry Kitchkeesic-Wynn

Since: Feb 07

San Jose, CA

#3 Jun 5, 2008
Where is CPS for our most vulnerable children? The ones that are dying by the millions with their umbilical cord attached?

A bunch of freakin cultist Satanists.
Chris

United States

#4 Jun 5, 2008
Good. Justice is served. The state does not get to dictate religious views. Christians should be thrilled with this ruling. The same logic could be used to force all home schooled kids to attend public schools.
test

Makati, Philippines

#5 Jun 5, 2008
test
Proud Texan

Lubbock, TX

#6 Jun 5, 2008
scout wrote:
Why aren't these creepy State officials rounded up and charged with kidnapping, conspiracy, and civil rights violations, and child abuse?
And the parents are to allow these state criminals to continue to abuse the children?
Completely insane nonsense.
Those "creepy State officials" were doing their jobs. There was widespread sexual abuse on that ranch, as evidenced by CPS' investigation. They couldn't tell who the perpertrators were, or which children were at risk, because everyone was lying to them. So, they had to assume all the kids were at risk, remove them, then try to sort out which ones could go back home.
Proud Texan

Lubbock, TX

#7 Jun 5, 2008
scout wrote:
Where is CPS for our most vulnerable children? The ones that are dying by the millions with their umbilical cord attached?
A bunch of freakin cultist Satanists.
That's not CPS' job. And, unfortunately, abortion is not against the law....write your Congressman.

The FLDS children are very vulnerable, too. It's sad that they have to go back to that life of abuse and isolation.

Since: Feb 07

San Jose, CA

#8 Jun 5, 2008
Proud Texan wrote:
<quoted text>
Those "creepy State officials" were doing their jobs. There was widespread sexual abuse on that ranch, as evidenced by CPS' investigation. They couldn't tell who the perpertrators were, or which children were at risk, because everyone was lying to them. So, they had to assume all the kids were at risk, remove them, then try to sort out which ones could go back home.
Nope, complete lies. These CPS officials must be fired, and held criminally accountable for child abuse and kidnapping.

Since: Feb 07

San Jose, CA

#9 Jun 5, 2008
Proud Texan wrote:
<quoted text>
That's not CPS' job. And, unfortunately, abortion is not against the law....write your Congressman.
The FLDS children are very vulnerable, too. It's sad that they have to go back to that life of abuse and isolation.
Murder is not legal. The problem is that many, like yourself, glorify death and disruption.
someone who cares

Los Angeles, CA

#10 Jun 5, 2008
scout wrote:
<quoted text>
Murder is not legal. The problem is that many, like yourself, glorify death and disruption.
Good point.

“CPS Must Go.”

Since: Jan 08

Lansing, MI

#11 Jun 5, 2008

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.parenting....

Number of Cases per 100,000 children in the US
These numbers come from The National Center on
Child Abuse and Neglect in Washington.(NCCAN)
Recent numbers have increased significantly for CPS

Perpetrators of Maltreatment

Physical Abuse CPS/Foster care 160, biological Parents 59
Sexual Abuse CPS/Foster care 112, biological Parents 13
Neglect CPS/Foster care 410, biological Parents 241
Medical Neglect CPS/Foster care 14 biological Parents 12
Fatalities CPS/Foster care 6.4, biological Parents 1.5

6.4 children die at the hands of the very agencies that
are supposed to protect them and only 1.5 at the hands of parents per
100,000 children. CPS perpetrates more abuse, neglect, and sexual abuse
and kills more children then parents in the United States.

30% of the nationís homeless are former foster children.
27% of the males and 10% of the females had been incarcerated
33% were receiving public assistance
37% had not finished high school
2% receive a college degree
50% were unemployed

Children in foster care are three to six times more likely than children
not in care to have emotional, behavioral and developmental problems,
including conduct disorders, depression, difficulties in school and
impaired social relationships. Some experts estimate that about 30% of
the children in care have marked or severe emotional problems. Various
studies have indicated that children and young people in foster care
tend to have limited education and job skills, perform poorly in school
compared to children who are not in foster care, lag behind in their
education by at least one year, and have lower educational attainment
than the general population.
*Casey Family Programs National Center for Resource Family Support

80 percent of prison inmates have been through the foster care system.

The highest ranking federal official in charge of foster care, Wade Horn
of the Department of Health and Human Services, is a former child
psychologist who says the foster care system is a giant mess and should
just be blown up.

“CPS Must Go.”

Since: Jan 08

Lansing, MI

#12 Jun 5, 2008
Protected to DEATH:
http://suncanaa.com/in_memory_

Membership growing daily.
someone who cares

Los Angeles, CA

#13 Jun 5, 2008
Proud Texan wrote:
<quoted text>
That's not CPS' job. And, unfortunately, abortion is not against the law....write your Congressman.
The FLDS children are very vulnerable, too. It's sad that they have to go back to that life of abuse and isolation.
My Congressman is not going to do jack about putting a stop to abortion. There is too much money involved in the baby murder industry, and they are lining their pockets with some of it. They want their issue, too, you know.

Yes, if the FLDS children have indeed been abused, it is sad and must be dealt with legally. But nothing has been proven, so why are you jumping the gun?CPS jumped the gun and got a good solid rebuke from the higher courts.They let them know,in no uncertain terms, things have to be done in proper order.I for one am grateful that the Courts had the back bone to stand up for and back up what is right.You can't just bulldoze people on suspicions.

And I don't know why you keep saying that these children are having to go back to a life of abuse and isolation.
Didn't you hear the conditions placed upon the parents before the children were even allowed to go home? They have to allow the CPS access to the ranch and children at all times, unannounced. With all the children involved, that means that your beloved CPS is going to be an ever present reality to these people.They might as well move into one of the houses there.They also have to allow any medical exams to be performed on the children. If there is any abuse, it will be discovered and CPS will take it from there.The parents signed agreements to allow these things and if they then turn around and refuse to abide by them, there will be serious consequences that they will face.

So please, think before you post. And stop with the mob/ the sky is falling mentality. It serves no purpose other than to spread misinformation.Some people (not all) don't seem able to think for themselves and will hear you and get whipped into a frenzy over nothing.

Thank you.:)
someone who cares

Los Angeles, CA

#14 Jun 5, 2008
CpsHarmsKidz wrote:
Protected to DEATH:
http://suncanaa.com/in_memory_
Membership growing daily.
Absolutely appalling and heartbreaking. People need to be aware of these atrocities. Nobody loves a child like a parent. Thanks for the link.
someone who cares

Los Angeles, CA

#15 Jun 5, 2008
CpsHarmsKidz wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.parenting....
Number of Cases per 100,000 children in the US
These numbers come from The National Center on
Child Abuse and Neglect in Washington.(NCCAN)
Recent numbers have increased significantly for CPS
Perpetrators of Maltreatment
Physical Abuse CPS/Foster care 160, biological Parents 59
Sexual Abuse CPS/Foster care 112, biological Parents 13
Neglect CPS/Foster care 410, biological Parents 241
Medical Neglect CPS/Foster care 14 biological Parents 12
Fatalities CPS/Foster care 6.4, biological Parents 1.5
6.4 children die at the hands of the very agencies that
are supposed to protect them and only 1.5 at the hands of parents per
100,000 children. CPS perpetrates more abuse, neglect, and sexual abuse
and kills more children then parents in the United States.
30% of the nationís homeless are former foster children.
27% of the males and 10% of the females had been incarcerated
33% were receiving public assistance
37% had not finished high school
2% receive a college degree
50% were unemployed
Children in foster care are three to six times more likely than children
not in care to have emotional, behavioral and developmental problems,
including conduct disorders, depression, difficulties in school and
impaired social relationships. Some experts estimate that about 30% of
the children in care have marked or severe emotional problems. Various
studies have indicated that children and young people in foster care
tend to have limited education and job skills, perform poorly in school
compared to children who are not in foster care, lag behind in their
education by at least one year, and have lower educational attainment
than the general population.
*Casey Family Programs National Center for Resource Family Support
80 percent of prison inmates have been through the foster care system.
The highest ranking federal official in charge of foster care, Wade Horn
of the Department of Health and Human Services, is a former child
psychologist who says the foster care system is a giant mess and should
just be blown up.
Very enlightening and eye opening info and statistics.

Listen up, people!
someone who cares

Los Angeles, CA

#16 Jun 5, 2008
Proud Texan wrote:
<quoted text>
Those "creepy State officials" were doing their jobs. There was widespread sexual abuse on that ranch, as evidenced by CPS' investigation. They couldn't tell who the perpertrators were, or which children were at risk, because everyone was lying to them. So, they had to assume all the kids were at risk, remove them, then try to sort out which ones could go back home.
If they had any good hard evidence, you can best believe they would have used it to back up their reply brief to the court.They didn't want to release those kids.The only reason they did was because the higher courts made them. And if they had reliable information, then they dropped the ball , because they filed reply briefs with not one, but 2 courts and could not convince either one of them they were right.They had NOTHING, and the court told them so very clearly.So now they have to do things right. There you go spreading more misinformation again.

If there is abuse evident, they will find it and take care of it.
Patriot Chilly Willie

Churchville, NY

#17 Jun 5, 2008
someone who cares wrote:
<quoted text>
If they had any good hard evidence, you can best believe they would have used it to back up their reply brief to the court.They didn't want to release those kids.The only reason they did was because the higher courts made them. And if they had reliable information, then they dropped the ball , because they filed reply briefs with not one, but 2 courts and could not convince either one of them they were right.They had NOTHING, and the court told them so very clearly.So now they have to do things right. There you go spreading more misinformation again.
If there is abuse evident, they will find it and take care of it.
SWC - you're absolutely right , if there was sufficient evidence they would have made arrests and not given the kids back ...
someone who cares

Los Angeles, CA

#18 Jun 5, 2008
Patriot Chilly Willie wrote:
<quoted text>
SWC - you're absolutely right , if there was sufficient evidence they would have made arrests and not given the kids back ...
Thanks Willie.I can't believe how the truth will be slapping people in the face and they still will not believe it. And if anyone wants to come back with a reply to this saying that the allegations are true and we refuse to see it, I say to them: What was the court's decision, and was it based on evidence the CPS had submitted supporting their position, or was it based on a lack of that evidence? I think the answer is very clear, if people will honestly look at it and not let their stubbornness and prejudice get in their way.

“"LDS Christian"”

Since: Nov 07

Indianapolis, IN

#19 Jun 5, 2008
So is the gang all here? Here's some interesting Numbers:

The state's Child Protective Services agency released Wednesday what is likely its final count of the children it removed from the YFZ Ranch in Schleicher County:

* 464: Original count
* 2: Children born in state custody
* 26: Number of minors reclassified as adults

* 440: Total number returned this week.

Well, I think the original count was something like 415 at the original 14 day hearing- meaning that 35 children weren't even known to exist when Walthers ruled that they belonged to the court. Then, strangely, the numbers for both adult women AND children went up.
This also indicates CPS couldn't even master a basic task like counting the number of people they put on the buses.

http://heartkeepercommonroom.blogspot.com/

“"LDS Christian"”

Since: Nov 07

Indianapolis, IN

#20 Jun 6, 2008
Its amazing all the disinformation that is out there is this case and the 'tabloid mentality.' Here is a good story about an experience reporter who has been covering polygamy for years and how her articles are about the best and most reliable.

How One Reporter Challenged the Official Story on Texas Polygamy
http://www.poynter.org/column.asp...

Brooke Adams gets some well-deserved recognition:
http://heartkeepercommonroom.blogspot.com/
While Adams was pressing the State of Texas hard on their methods, most national news outlets were doing just the opposite. Newspapers, wire services and cable television programs all told a different story. They relied heavily on Texas authorities, many of them unnamed and leaking information about the case. They turned to academics who have studied polygamy. And they told the stories of women who have left polygamist compounds.

Adams had done all of those stories in the past.
[...]
She was dismayed to see journalists at the scene outside the ranch buying into misinformation they'd been fed by sources in law enforcement. As the cops broke down the gates to the religious groups' temple on April 7 to take away the rest of the children, a medical helicopter hovered overhead. When Adams asked why, another reporter told her that the temple was likely booby-trapped. He heard it from a trustworthy law enforcement official and reported it.

Some readers of Adams' coverage might see an overly sympathetic view of the FLDS. I see something different. Sometimes being a good reporter means taking on an unpopular cause, asking difficult questions. Yes, there are children in the FLDS church who have been forced into marriage and thus sexual relations, Adams says. But there are also families who don't do that, she says.

Read the rest.
One way to judge just how biased a reporter is or isn't might be their track record- how many things did she report that turned out to be true, as compared to, say, the Big Boys at CNN or AP?
I don't know of any time that her stories and theirs differed that she had to recant later.

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