One dead in "stand your ground" shooting in Osage County

Jun 11, 2011 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Bigheart Times

Osage County had a "stand your ground" aka "Make My Day" fatal shooting this morning, at the same time Bigheart Times staffers were heading to drug busts and Joplin.

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Barbie

Tulsa, OK

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#1
Jun 12, 2011
 

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Homeowner states... the two men backed a truck at him.

I'm thinking the two guys were in their vehicle leaving and the homeowner shot them from behind as they were leaving. Could the homeowner have gotten the vehicle tag number and called police? Why KILL someone from behind as they are leaving (because you think they were stealing from you)? Was any of the homeowners belongings found in the vehicle, I don't believe so (I could be wrong but didn't hear of anything being found).

I'm not saying what these two guys were doing (accused of) is ok but I don't believe for a second that the two guys tried backing over the homeowner, I think they were trying to leave, the homeowner shot them from behind and then made up the "they tried backing over me... I feared for my life"... story just to cover his butt.

Burglary charges... yes if there is evidence and can be proven.

1st degree murder charges against Eschbach... absolutely not... Baker knew what he was doing (if burglary was his intentions), Eschbach did not force anything upon Baker.

1st degree murder charges against Eschbach... absolutely not... homeowner shot them from behind as they tried leaving. If any murder charges, the homeowner should be held accountable. He straight up shot Baker from behind as Baker was leaving.

I know how this discussion board can get at times so let me say this... This is just my opinion based on what I have heard and what I myself know. I'm not looking for some knock down drag out internet rage so please let's all act as adults and discuss this as this is an internet discussion board not an internet rage board.:)

Full story: The Bigheart Times

Osage County had a "stand your ground" aka "Make My Day" fatal shooting this morning. Homeowner found two men allegedly breaking into his garage and stealing tools, investigators said. The homeowner approached, the two men backed a truck at him, and the homeowner shot at them. One died of a single gunshot wound, the other ran, was subsequently apprehended and is jailed. Homeowner is not charged. According to the Sheriff's Office, dead is Steven Baker, 22, of Skiatook. Another man, Harley Eschbach. was jailed this afternoon on pending charges of 2nd degree burglary and 1st degree murder (in commission of a felony, i.e. the burglary). Shooting occurred around 4:15 a.m. on N 36 W Ave. Details unavailable at the moment: Investigation is continuing.
Sandra

United States

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#2
Jun 12, 2011
 

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I completely agree, burdlary charges yes, murder, i dont see how you could charge him with that
Ang

Dallas, TX

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#3
Jun 12, 2011
 
I hate that these 2 young boys made an awful decision that will forever effect the lives of many. From what I understand they have been doing this for sometime, the law has been written up in a way where Eshbauch will be charged with murder. It's a sad story any way you look at it, but they were doing things that were cometely wrong...and they knew this, surely they knew the chances they were taking!
Help

Inola, OK

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#4
Jun 12, 2011
 
These kids that many want to consider adults are not. You are not offically an adult until the age of 25, at least your mind is not. Why is there not help for these kids. Why do we just want to put them away forever. I really think drugs have taken over Skiatook and our Police Officers don't really care about these kids. I am starting to think they are in a race to see how many they can get each. How about helping them understand and getting them help. That young boy should never have died. It is wrong to steal, but how could anyone want to kill someone over drugs or tools? If your life is not in danger DON'T SHUT......
Help

Inola, OK

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#5
Jun 12, 2011
 
sorry for the spelling but DON'T SHOOT
Concerned Friend

Fort Worth, TX

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#6
Jun 12, 2011
 
I agree no shots at the kids. Yes they were in the wrong but not enough to be shot and killed. I think the papers story is missing some information but that's my opinion. It's very heartbreaking to hear. Steven was just beginning the journey into life. He was a great person, friend and son. Had respect towards everyone he met and knew. I think (my opinion) that they were just turning around in this mans driveway but well maybe never know. So sorry for his family and friends! He will forever be remembered!
Get the facts

Dallas, TX

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#7
Jun 12, 2011
 
I fully understand that a persons full frontal lobe is not fully developed until their about 20 years old, if I'm not mistaken, Harley is around 27 years old. And I also was unaware that "they were turning around" in this mans driveway, which is not right off the main road, at 4:00 in the morning. I suppose, we should hear all the real facts of what really happened, because I'm not sure if we have heard everything yet. None the less, it is a heartbreaking tragedy for this young mans family. My prayers go out to them.
Anonymous acquaintance

Houston, TX

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#8
Jun 12, 2011
 

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Tragedy: story of a person who falls to disaster through the combination of a personal failing and circumstances with which he cannot deal.

The young man who died fell victim to poor decisions and the mistake of trespassing on another's property.

The man who now faces murder & burglary charges AND the death of a friend does so from placing himself and his friend in a precarious situation.

The man who shot and killed the young man who trespassed on his property now has to live with the horrible burden that comes from taking a life.

Tragic all the way around. The families of all 3 men will suffer the greatest loss. This was the death of a son, a brother, a friend. This will cause pain and grief for the family of a man who took a life. This will break the hearts of a family who will know the despair associated with the incarceration of a loved one.

This story should upset everyone who hears it. Absolutely tragic.

Rest in peace young Steve. May all the families come to experience healing and peace.
Help

Tulsa, OK

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#9
Jun 12, 2011
 

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As such, the prefrontal cortex is a little immature in teenagers as compared to adults; it may not fully develop until your mid-20s [source: Kotulak]. And if you don't have a remote control to call the shots in the brain, using the other brain structures can become more difficult. Imaging studies have shown that most of the mental energy that teenagers use in making decisions is located in the back of the brain, whereas adults do most of their processing in the frontal lobe [source: Wallis]. When teenagers do use the frontal lobe, it seems they overdo it, calling upon much more of the brain to get the job done than adults would [source: Powell]. And because adults have already refined those communicating synapses, they can make decisions more quickly.
Adult brains are also better wired to notice errors in decision-making. While adults performed tasks that required the quick response of pushing buttons, their brains sent out a signal when a hasty mistake was made. Before 80 milliseconds had passed, adult brains had noticed the blunder, but teenage brains didn't notice any slip-up [source: Monastersky].
An area of the teenager's brain that is fairly well-developed early on, though, is the nucleus accumbens, or the area of the brain that seeks pleasure and reward. In imaging studies that compared brain activity when the subject received a small, medium or large reward, teenagers exhibited exaggerated responses to medium and large rewards compared to children and adults [source: Powell]. When presented with a small reward, the teenagers' brains hardly fired at all in comparison to adults and children.
So what does it mean to have an undeveloped prefrontal cortex in conjunction with a strong desire for reward? As it happens, this combination could explain a lot of stereotypical teenage behavior.
Why is it so hard for our society to get these young people help??? It seems all they want to do is throw them in jail forever.
Praying for Steven Baker's family and Harley and the man that shot Steven. It really is a three way tragedy.
Friend of the victim

Skiatook, OK

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#10
Jun 12, 2011
 

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Steve Baker was a good friend of ours & it's a tragedy that he was killed. I know people will read the story & think maybe he was a guy out joy riding & stealing things, but that's not the case. It's a situation of his being in the wrong place. His "friend" asked him to stop at the old mans house & Steve thought he knew the guy. When Steve figured out the guy was stealing the old man came out. His friend took off on foot & Steve was trying to leave. I don't know how Steve could of been "backing into the old man with the truck". If that was the case he would of shot through the back window & not the drivers side window. Steve Baker was a good guy & friend & he shouldn't be remembered as a thief.
Friend of the victim

Skiatook, OK

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#11
Jun 12, 2011
 

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....And no Steve wasn't backing up at the old man he was just trying to leave. I personally think that was said so they wouldn't of have to charge a 72 year old man with murder charges.

You will be missed Baker!
Barbie

Tulsa, OK

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#12
Jun 12, 2011
 

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"Friend of the victim"... you stated (His "friend" asked him to stop at the old mans house & Steve thought he knew the guy).

I'm curious as to how you know Steve was asked to go to this mans home. Did Steve tell you this before hand?

You also stated...(When Steve figured out the guy was stealing the old man came out). Again, how would you have known this?

Another question... where did you get the info that shots were fired through the drivers side window? I was told it was the back window as they were trying to leave.

These are just questions as I've heard several stories. I don't consider either guy a "thief". I agree, I don't believe Steve was trying to back over the homeowner. I believe this was said either by the homeowner or police to cover the homeowners butt.
Timshel

United States

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#13
Jun 12, 2011
 

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I hardly would call mid-20s a child.
Concerned Friend wrote:
I agree no shots at the kids. Yes they were in the wrong but not enough to be shot and killed. I think the papers story is missing some information but that's my opinion. It's very heartbreaking to hear. Steven was just beginning the journey into life. He was a great person, friend and son. Had respect towards everyone he met and knew. I think (my opinion) that they were just turning around in this mans driveway but well maybe never know. So sorry for his family and friends! He will forever be remembered!
My 2 cents

Madisonville, TX

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#14
Jun 12, 2011
 

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Okay people if you lay with dogs you soon get fleas. DEAL WITH IT. if in fact these two men were robbing somebody they got what was coming. It's to bad that these men chose to waste there lives with drugs and shady dealings but they made their own choices.

I don't buy into this bunk about the brain. Just today I saw a story about a 7 year old boy rounding up cattle on a horse, branding, and giving vaccine. This 7 year old boy was doing man's work and doing a damn fine job of it. He was working around dangerous animals and knew how and what to do. How is it a 7 year old boys brain can function on a man's level and two 20 something year men can't? It's not that they can't it's that they won't and don't want to be men.

What a sad thing to happen because of bad choices... One man dead, one man going to prison, 2 families hurting but the law is the law and that is that.
My 2 cents

Madisonville, TX

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#15
Jun 12, 2011
 

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For those of you saying Steve didn't know that Harley was going to vandalize and that he thought Harley was just stopping by an old gerunds house....how the heck could you know what Steve thought? Steve was pronounced dead at the scene. Unless you can talk to the dead I'm fairly certain you have no idea what Steve thought. And again you run with dogs you get fleas...Steve is old enough to have thus figured out... If Steve is such a superb guy why wasn't he hanging with a better class of people?
Help

Tulsa, OK

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#16
Jun 13, 2011
 
How do you know Steve didn't hang out with good people. Good people screw up. Good people make mistakes all the time. I am from Skiatook, I do know that bad things are happening in our town this year. The way our town is handleing it doesn't work. And for every negative remark remember one day this could be someone you love. Skiatook wake up, I will keep saying this. Programs that we have cut lets get them back and help.
Friend of the victim

Skiatook, OK

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#17
Jun 13, 2011
 

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My 2 cents wrote:
For those of you saying Steve didn't know that Harley was going to vandalize and that he thought Harley was just stopping by an old gerunds house....how the heck could you know what Steve thought? Steve was pronounced dead at the scene. Unless you can talk to the dead I'm fairly certain you have no idea what Steve thought. And again you run with dogs you get fleas...Steve is old enough to have thus figured out... If Steve is such a superb guy why wasn't he hanging with a better class of people?
You don't have to be sarcastic about it. I KNOW he was pronounced dead at the scene, and no I don't talk to the dead. I am only saying this is what Harley told the police. No I don't think Steve should of been hanging out with this guy, but I won't sit back & listen to this crap people say about Baker. He was a friend & a good guy.
Friend of the victim

Skiatook, OK

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#18
Jun 13, 2011
 
I hadn't heard anything about the back window. I was told (from what Harley said to police) it was drivers side. I would tend to agree since he was shot in the temple.

Also everything I'm saying about the incident is what I heard that was told to the police by Harley.
Barbie wrote:
"Friend of the victim"... you stated (His "friend" asked him to stop at the old mans house & Steve thought he knew the guy).
I'm curious as to how you know Steve was asked to go to this mans home. Did Steve tell you this before hand?
You also stated...(When Steve figured out the guy was stealing the old man came out). Again, how would you have known this?
Another question... where did you get the info that shots were fired through the drivers side window? I was told it was the back window as they were trying to leave.
These are just questions as I've heard several stories. I don't consider either guy a "thief". I agree, I don't believe Steve was trying to back over the homeowner. I believe this was said either by the homeowner or police to cover the homeowners butt.
Friend of the victim

Skiatook, OK

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#19
Jun 13, 2011
 
Also don't judge someone by one news story you read.....let any man with out blame cast the first stone.....I know before this happened I would of thought the same thing if I heard a similar story, but knowing that it was a friend that was the victim it made me see things in a new light.
just me

United States

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#20
Jun 13, 2011
 
They are both adults I do believe Steven was 22 and Harley 27. They both are friends of mine and both have made bad choice's like this before. And not blaming one or the other but I seen where someone said Steven didn't know what Harley was doing WRONG...it was planned Steven asked to borrow a flash light that goes on your head before they left to go. So I'm pretty sure he knew. I feel sorry for both families and both victims like I said they are both friends of mine. And don't get me wrong by saying this wasn't the first time I'm not saying they are all around bad people Steven was a great person and friend down to earth guy and Harley is the most big hearted person you will ever meet a great friend and wonderful father. I will forever miss Steven but I will not blame Harley for this and I do not feel murder charges are the answer and I will stick by Harley on this. RIP Steven and Harley you are my friend for life love you both.

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