Town, dam owners at odds over appraisal

Full story: Brattleboro Reformer

The Selectboard has received a copy of the state's new appraisal of the Bellows Falls hydroelectric station, and they don't like it.

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Jack Shear

Williamstown, VT

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#1
Jun 9, 2010
 
We will be bankrupt soon. The Select board always thought they were smarter then every one else. Maybe you shouldn't of used the $126,000,000. figure for your budget.

The Trustees at least used common sense setting their budget, using a smaller amount.

Let the Trustees negotiate!!!!
Megawatt

Newport, NH

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#2
Jun 9, 2010
 
The trustees should have strong representation at any negotiations with TC and use the argument as TC goes so should all the tax payers this time.

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#3
Jun 9, 2010
 
Is anyone surprised by this.
LawyerCalhoun

Chester, VT

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#4
Jun 9, 2010
 
The residents and taxpayers of Rockingham who scuttled the "Dam Deal" a few years ago are getting what they should have expected. They were rabble roused by Trans Canada who played them like a Stradivarius.

The value of any income producing asset, such as the power station, is usually estimated by doing a discounted cash flow of expected future earnings. Right now, wholesale power prices are low, so any valuation will also be low. Then there are other factors open to dispute, such as what discount factor to use when performing the calculation.

Rockingham residents, you did not want a deal with a dam operator that provided a defined annual payment, regardless of the state of wholesale power markets. Had you agreed to that very fair proposal, yo would not be suffering these endless valuation disputes.

Enjoy paying those valuation consultants and lawyers working on this matter. You are getting what you deserved.
adirondack motherinlaw

Clifton Park, NY

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#5
Jun 9, 2010
 
im looking for my x son in law by the name of matt lockhart.I have been trying to let him know that i have steven and i would like to get ahold of him for a personal question so if your out there Matt please get ahold of me PLEASE!!!!!!!!
I Vote Vermont

Jeffersonville, VT

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#6
Jun 9, 2010
 

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#7
Jun 9, 2010
 
I Vote Vermont wrote:
http://www.topix.net/forum/sou rce/brattleboro-reformer/TJT3G T70EAG0PA1SU
More shameless shilling for VY. did you know they just had another leak? Tsk tsk. Not many ppl use their own comments as a source link, and link to their own opinions w/o a reason....A bit off topic, don't you think?
Marty

South Royalton, VT

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#8
Jun 9, 2010
 
the whole town isn't worth 126 million
Jamey Berrick

Kincardine, Canada

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#9
Jun 9, 2010
 
I personally feel that the board is to be held accountable for this! How could you as a board decide and state at the Town Meeting that your figure is what we as a community need this valuation to come in at. Oh wait, that was I believe to level fund the budget. Okay so moving forward; What do we do now? The Town will have to fight the valuation costing us even more in this already over taxed community. So Business Valuations are down, Home property values continue to drop and we look forward to how many new businesses coming into our community? Realistically we have to look at the nations demand on electricity usage with the depressed economy. Businesses are closing throughout the northeast as well as in Vermont and demand is down, So why would anyone expect the valuation to go up by that much? Hold on to your wallets Rockingham this is going to be a real bumpy ride. Letís look to the future and not continue to spend money that we do not have. Just my outlook on this.
Joe Shlabotnik

Claremont, NH

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#10
Jun 9, 2010
 
Could the dam valuation be the real reason behind "the resignation"?????
Spuds

Chester, VT

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#11
Jun 9, 2010
 
Joe Shlabotnik wrote:
Could the dam valuation be the real reason behind "the resignation"?????
It would be a good reason to get out of Dodge. There will be some very unhappy taxpayers when the tax on something a little under 19 million is borne upon the rest of us. Thanks Tom,Ann, and all, we knew this would happen. Maybe that new ten wheeler needs to be a good USED 6 wheeler instead, and get a good USED pickup to go with it! The rest of us make do with used work vehicles. It won't hurt your union subordinates to ride their butts around in a used seat. Get em an air freshner. One with that new car smell and some paper dealer advertising floormats and they'll be good to go. Get a manager that can do accounting and planning. Other towns have one and save bundles. Hell, many don't even have a manager and they do just fine. Many businesses handle more money with far less staff. I've worked there and seen it done first hand. Government always does the same job as the private sector with three times as many people and it needs to stop. We can't afford it.
B Parsons

Bellows Falls, VT

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#12
Jun 9, 2010
 
wow just as i said in another blog, you all flip flop cut cut cut and now you blame them for doing what you wanted, old vehicles are not always cheaper.
What needs to happen in this town is there needs to be jobs created and not cut services.
Without services and jobs and recreation people will move and not want to come live here and that will bring the taxes up for the ones left here.
There's so many experts on these blogs who have all the answers, i don't know how the towns in such trouble with you all. oh wait the only time you speak is on here which doesn't count, well not all of you, Jamie is a good resident and speaks at the meetings and a few others.
Spuds

Chester, VT

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#13
Jun 9, 2010
 
B Parsons wrote:
wow just as i said in another blog, you all flip flop cut cut cut and now you blame them for doing what you wanted, old vehicles are not always cheaper.
What needs to happen in this town is there needs to be jobs created and not cut services.
Without services and jobs and recreation people will move and not want to come live here and that will bring the taxes up for the ones left here.
There's so many experts on these blogs who have all the answers, i don't know how the towns in such trouble with you all. oh wait the only time you speak is on here which doesn't count, well not all of you, Jamie is a good resident and speaks at the meetings and a few others.
I don't agree with you at all. New vehicles loose 20% of their value the minute they leave the showroom floor. I do speak up at meetings and you can hear a pin drop after I do. You have it exactly backwards. The reason nobody wants to come here is because the unions walk all over this town and have sucked it dry! Look at the empty factory buildings and freight terminals. In the last few decades the unions have come after the municipal jobs and now they walk all over our government too. It's happening all over the country. The union gets what the union want's, it doesn't matter what we vote for. How many union jobs were cut? How many? That's why taxes keep going up. That's why nobody wants to come here. Services? Services? we are getting serviced all right already!
B Parsons

Bellows Falls, VT

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#14
Jun 9, 2010
 
i agree to a point on the unions , but i can understand why the workers would want them in this town , the way the goverment is could you imagine working for a company like that without a union ? you wouldnt have nothing for benifits, i cant speak for all the workers but i know a few that dont make that much, about 30000 gross, i dont believe thats the biggest issue, like i said the big problem is no jobs or industry and thats not just here but the usa as a whole
but i didn't mention any union in my post, and i said not everyone doesn't speak up
Spuds

Chester, VT

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#15
Jun 9, 2010
 
B Parsons wrote:
i agree to a point on the unions , but i can understand why the workers would want them in this town , the way the goverment is could you imagine working for a company like that without a union ? you wouldnt have nothing for benifits, i cant speak for all the workers but i know a few that dont make that much, about 30000 gross, i dont believe thats the biggest issue, like i said the big problem is no jobs or industry and thats not just here but the usa as a whole
but i didn't mention any union in my post, and i said not everyone doesn't speak up
$30,000? Look higher up the food chain. The top ones with seniority make $60,000 and up and get raises through thick and thin. I am not talking just police and fire, that's only a portion of it. Look at the school salaries. Tell me how much of the tax money in this town pays union dues. I will wager that would buy two ten wheelers every five years or less.
Does any of my tax money get me any of those benefits I am forced to furnish them with? Of course not. They get their roads plowed and their kids go to school too, only they get more and more pay and benefits. While we buy our property over and over every 20 to 30 years in taxes. At the rate it's going most will be paying more in taxes than do for their homes during the life of their mortgage.
Does that sound fair to those of us who do not work for the government? Of course not!
B Parsons

Bellows Falls, VT

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#16
Jun 9, 2010
 
agreed 100% i was only talking the town highway workers
Spuds

Chester, VT

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#17
Jun 9, 2010
 
and they work 12 months for it in all sorts of weather. That's union pay grade. There used to be less disparity there, as well, but they told us paying the teachers better would give us better students, funny, they never say that about the roads!
Now we have so many people with bachelor's degree that they are flipping burgers and buying groceries with ebt welfare cards.
Bf Law

Newport, NH

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#18
Jun 10, 2010
 
I have a quick question how did our listers derive the figure at 126 million 4 years ago and if the state is correct in appraisal on the dams then does that not bolster every taxpayer who has been screaming appraisals are to high?

The board of civil authority ruled against most taxperson so this would set up an unusual appeal process or even a class action lawsuit by townsfolk's.

Love some feedback on this.
Bill Grout

Williamstown, VT

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#19
Jun 10, 2010
 
Jamie you hit it right on the head, I couldn't of said it any better. The Select board wasn't even responsible in using that figure. This will end up costing the residents a fortune.

The Select board say they have been level funding for the last 3 years, this is horse shittt. They have been using the extra money in lieu of payment to off set the tax rate. Easy to do when you have the extra guess what , now they don't have it any more.

Hey Tom and Ann try and level fund now. Good luck ,it is all gone. I think you will find Trans Canada played their game and beat the select board. They really set the appraisal at $90,000,00.00 and agreed upon it, for three years. I think the court will look at this and agree with Trans Canada. This is the true value.

I have one question for Tom and Ann . How are we going to pay it back?

Rockingham and Bellows Falls are slowly dieing . Who are we kidding we can't attract any businesses here or create a job if we had to. When was the last time a company came here and provided at least ten jobs?

We can not depend on grants and subsidised money and survive. Sell your houses now while you might get out.
Concerned Citizen

Bellows Falls, VT

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#20
Jun 10, 2010
 
To Lawyer Calhoun,
I've heard that TransCanada had to spend millions of dollars for some repairs a few years ago. Where do you think the Town of Rockingham would have gotten that kind of money to make the repairs.

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