Delta wins mediator ruling in union d...

Delta wins mediator ruling in union dispute

There are 46 comments on the Business Journal story from Nov 21, 2011, titled Delta wins mediator ruling in union dispute. In it, Business Journal reports that:

Federal labor mediators have rejected a union's claim that Delta Air Lines Inc. interfered with a failed drive to organize flight attendants last year.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Business Journal.

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not a fine wine

Starksboro, VT

#1 Nov 21, 2011
Dickey cries, but wins.

The union stacked mediation board sides with the union buster. Wasted tears dicky old boy, wasted tears
Al here

Sicklerville, NJ

#2 Nov 25, 2011
Oh yay, another crush for the big bad union...
hmmmm....what are they afraid of? Oh ya having to bargain in good faith....hohum
Old NWA Guy

Monroe, MI

#3 Nov 27, 2011
Al here wrote:
Oh yay, another crush for the big bad union...
hmmmm....what are they afraid of? Oh ya having to bargain in good faith....hohum
Bargain in good faith. What an overused meaningless term.
not a fine wine

Starksboro, VT

#4 Nov 27, 2011
Old NWA Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
Bargain in good faith. What an overused meaningless term.
You are right about that.
call me Al

Sicklerville, NJ

#5 Nov 27, 2011
Old NWA Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
Bargain in good faith. What an overused meaningless term.
You're right, Companies won't and don't seem to have to follow this. Some States have removed this from the collective bargaining agreements. What ever happened to common decency in this country.
not a fine wine

Starksboro, VT

#6 Nov 27, 2011
Two things you should never bring up at any gathering if you want (common decency). Money & politics. And what is the dominating conversation in this country anymore??
Spade a Spade

Rochester, MN

#7 Nov 27, 2011
call me Al wrote:
<quoted text>
You're right, Companies won't and don't seem to have to follow this. Some States have removed this from the collective bargaining agreements. What ever happened to common decency in this country.
I believe this is what the American people want. They now have higher costs with lower wages and benifits. But gee they get to have all that individual bargaining power now that the unions are gone. I'm sure it will go up from here.
RUDY

Newnan, GA

#8 Nov 27, 2011
Lets see now, the Fa's have been paid less than pre Delta Fa's. They got paid less profit sharing. All because the AFA wanted to continue, even after voted out. If I were a flight attendant that was affected by this, I would start a class action suit against the union. Instead of accepting defeat, they drummed up a lot of BS that not even the appointies from Obama could justify.
Old NWA Guy

Monroe, MI

#9 Nov 28, 2011
RUDY wrote:
Lets see now, the Fa's have been paid less than pre Delta Fa's. They got paid less profit sharing. All because the AFA wanted to continue, even after voted out. If I were a flight attendant that was affected by this, I would start a class action suit against the union. Instead of accepting defeat, they drummed up a lot of BS that not even the appointies from Obama could justify.
Right on Rudy.
not a fine wine

Waitsfield, VT

#10 Nov 28, 2011
Lets see... the real story. Nwa FA's pay was a negotiated pay, negotiated between nwa and AFA. The contract had become amenable back in 05. By 08 no more nwa, and delta chose not to match their pay. But instead live by the AFA contract. You see the contract was not between delta and the AFA so delta could of matched both and delt with AFA when and if they won. However, making the larger group happy, and blaming the union for the reason was just what dicky wanted. Now if the shoe was on the other foot... AFA making more... you can bet delta would have matched nwa FA's with delta long ago. The delta FA's will never see that leverage on their side again. Class action suit? I say yes against both side... delta & the AFA.
Toad

Atlanta, GA

#11 Nov 28, 2011
not a fine wine wrote:
Lets see... the real story. Nwa FA's pay was a negotiated pay, negotiated between nwa and AFA. The contract had become amenable back in 05. By 08 no more nwa, and delta chose not to match their pay. But instead live by the AFA contract. You see the contract was not between delta and the AFA so delta could of matched both and delt with AFA when and if they won. However, making the larger group happy, and blaming the union for the reason was just what dicky wanted. Now if the shoe was on the other foot... AFA making more... you can bet delta would have matched nwa FA's with delta long ago. The delta FA's will never see that leverage on their side again. Class action suit? I say yes against both side... delta & the AFA.
You my friend can always find a hateful and un-truthful view @ anything from afar. DAL did not 'match' pay and benefits for any group until the question of membership was answered thru voting and the courts. AFA didn't want DAL to match the PMNW FA's pay because if they did they would have had to agree the entire contract was null and void and AFA did not want that contract thrown out cause they would have been thrown out as well. Just as they promised.....the minute the NMB ruled DAL started the process of matching pay. The PMNW FA's get allot better holiday pay AND DAL aloud them to keep it thru the rest of this yr. So, rite now, a PMNW FA makes more than I do. It is one thing to have issues w/ members of Mgmt, it is quit the other thing to always have issues w/ everything Mgmt does even when they do great things. Mr Anderson has done great things @ DAL so far. Even b 4 synergies are complete, DAL made 1/2 a billion bucks 3rd quarter. Never saw ur congrats on that. Also know these facts.........b 4 NWA, DAL FA's were made up of 56% former union members @ WAL,EAL,PAA,NEA,BAA etc and still no union was ever on the property. Ask urself why. Better yet, ask a DAL FA. It's because we didn't want folks like you gaining a foothold and turning DAL into another AL w/ huge labor issues, ie AMR. 70yrs of leading pay benefits etc and the last 5 w/ Mr Anderson have been wonderful. Record profit sharing, great work rules, sucky sick pay. Adds up to be a great place to work.
not a fine wine

Waitsfield, VT

#12 Nov 28, 2011
Toad wrote:
<quoted text>
You my friend can always find a hateful and un-truthful view @ anything from afar. DAL did not 'match' pay and benefits for any group until the question of membership was answered thru voting and the courts. AFA didn't want DAL to match the PMNW FA's pay because if they did they would have had to agree the entire contract was null and void and AFA did not want that contract thrown out cause they would have been thrown out as well. Just as they promised.....the minute the NMB ruled DAL started the process of matching pay. The PMNW FA's get allot better holiday pay AND DAL aloud them to keep it thru the rest of this yr. So, rite now, a PMNW FA makes more than I do. It is one thing to have issues w/ members of Mgmt, it is quit the other thing to always have issues w/ everything Mgmt does even when they do great things. Mr Anderson has done great things @ DAL so far. Even b 4 synergies are complete, DAL made 1/2 a billion bucks 3rd quarter. Never saw ur congrats on that. Also know these facts.........b 4 NWA, DAL FA's were made up of 56% former union members @ WAL,EAL,PAA,NEA,BAA etc and still no union was ever on the property. Ask urself why. Better yet, ask a DAL FA. It's because we didn't want folks like you gaining a foothold and turning DAL into another AL w/ huge labor issues, ie AMR. 70yrs of leading pay benefits etc and the last 5 w/ Mr Anderson have been wonderful. Record profit sharing, great work rules, sucky sick pay. Adds up to be a great place to work.
Good reply. However, I don't buy that the union had any say other than there having to be an election. Show me where the NMB ruled that delta had to follow an nwa contract.
Spade a Spade

Rochester, MN

#13 Nov 28, 2011
Toad wrote:
<quoted text>
You my friend can always find a hateful and un-truthful view @ anything from afar. DAL did not 'match' pay and benefits for any group until the question of membership was answered thru voting and the courts. AFA didn't want DAL to match the PMNW FA's pay because if they did they would have had to agree the entire contract was null and void and AFA did not want that contract thrown out cause they would have been thrown out as well. Just as they promised.....the minute the NMB ruled DAL started the process of matching pay. The PMNW FA's get allot better holiday pay AND DAL aloud them to keep it thru the rest of this yr. So, rite now, a PMNW FA makes more than I do. It is one thing to have issues w/ members of Mgmt, it is quit the other thing to always have issues w/ everything Mgmt does even when they do great things. Mr Anderson has done great things @ DAL so far. Even b 4 synergies are complete, DAL made 1/2 a billion bucks 3rd quarter. Never saw ur congrats on that. Also know these facts.........b 4 NWA, DAL FA's were made up of 56% former union members @ WAL,EAL,PAA,NEA,BAA etc and still no union was ever on the property. Ask urself why. Better yet, ask a DAL FA. It's because we didn't want folks like you gaining a foothold and turning DAL into another AL w/ huge labor issues, ie AMR. 70yrs of leading pay benefits etc and the last 5 w/ Mr Anderson have been wonderful. Record profit sharing, great work rules, sucky sick pay. Adds up to be a great place to work.
Where did you get your info on "AFA didn't want DAL to match the PMNW FA's pay because if they did they would have had to agree the entire contract was null and void and AFA did not want that contract thrown out cause they would have been thrown out as well". Scabair did give raises in 2000 on the iam contract that AMFA was negotiating and was amendable and it did not nullify the contract.
Toad

Atlanta, GA

#14 Nov 28, 2011
Spade a Spade wrote:
<quoted text>
Where did you get your info on "AFA didn't want DAL to match the PMNW FA's pay because if they did they would have had to agree the entire contract was null and void and AFA did not want that contract thrown out cause they would have been thrown out as well". Scabair did give raises in 2000 on the iam contract that AMFA was negotiating and was amendable and it did not nullify the contract.
DAL agreed w/ labor leaders from all work groups post merger to maintain their current contract because all labor groups wanted the chance to vote in their current unions. DAL could NOT negotiate w/ a contract that was amendable. The union stated it would be interference. DAL said OK..........and to the best of my knowledge, complied w/ all union rules and regs until voting was settled. The minute NMB ruled in favour of the no vote, DAL started pay equality. Because, at the time, DAL/NWA was the largest AL merger in history, it would have been dis-honest for DAL to do anything but follow contract to the letter. That's what AFA wanted. If DAL had matched NWA pay and regs w/ DAL, it would have voided the contract and AFA said no to that. I have no idea about ur IAM example and never do I expect to know what happens to labor @ any where else but the place I work. The gate agents, rampers, res. and FA's had their union wages in place. AFA would have charged interfernce so why would DAL do something that stupid. I know, u say DAL Mgmt is horrible and that we are stupid for believing them. I can prove you wrong......stats are stats. You can't do anything but gripe and throw DAL under the bus. It is an ignorant approach.
Toad

Atlanta, GA

#15 Nov 28, 2011
Spade a Spade wrote:
<quoted text>
Where did you get your info on "AFA didn't want DAL to match the PMNW FA's pay because if they did they would have had to agree the entire contract was null and void and AFA did not want that contract thrown out cause they would have been thrown out as well". Scabair did give raises in 2000 on the iam contract that AMFA was negotiating and was amendable and it did not nullify the contract.
BTW Spade, you are the perfect example the majority of every work group @ the new DAL, w/ the exception of Pilots, noted NO to union membership. 9 votes, 9 times the majority voted NO. Are you of the mind that says DAL Mgmt scared us all into the no vote? Hee hee. I would love to have a union to rep our 220000 FA's, if it was required. But it isn't, so why have one.
Spade a Spade

Rochester, MN

#16 Nov 28, 2011
Toad wrote:
<quoted text>
BTW Spade, you are the perfect example the majority of every work group @ the new DAL, w/ the exception of Pilots, noted NO to union membership. 9 votes, 9 times the majority voted NO. Are you of the mind that says DAL Mgmt scared us all into the no vote? Hee hee. I would love to have a union to rep our 220000 FA's, if it was required. But it isn't, so why have one.
I don't care if you get a union. I look at the wages and benifits going down and the cost of living going up and people like who exclaim how great it is. Bend over and continue to take it if it makes you happy.
My question to you is where you got your information on a contract is void if the company gives a raise? Nothing more, nothing less?
not a fine wine

Waitsfield, VT

#17 Nov 28, 2011
I have no doubt that AFA would have filed a complaint. But after three years of holding the nwa FA's at a lower pay rate, both sides should be sued. Both sides had something to gain, and both side took their gains from the nwa FA's loss. NMB was the weapon used and Both delta and the AFA exploited The National Mediation Board's policies and processes. The blame on this one... Goes both ways!
not a fine wine

Waitsfield, VT

#18 Nov 28, 2011
More good news. NMB just side with delta on the the IAM complaint. Now I know how the IAM looks at its members. Where I get lost, is who taught who on how to exploit the workers. Did the IAM teach dick or did past management teach the IAM? Kind of a.. "which came first, the chicken or the egg".
Amber

United States

#19 Nov 28, 2011
You guys would be better off being paid with cupcakes! They are delicious! YUM!
Spade a Spade

Rochester, MN

#20 Nov 28, 2011
Amber wrote:
You guys would be better off being paid with cupcakes! They are delicious! YUM!
You may be on to something there!

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