Is Entergy trying to sell Yankee?

Full story: Brattleboro Reformer

According to Energy Daily, Entergy is looking for a buyer for its Vermont Yankee nuclear power plant in Vernon.

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Since: Jul 10

Brattleboro, VT

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#1
Aug 28, 2010
 
For Sale: 38-year-old power plant. Needs work. Has 2 years of service left and then decommissioning work and costs begin. Comes with radioactive waste on-site that needs to go somewhere. Any reasonable offer accepted. Send unreasonable offers too.

Any question that Entergy wants to unload the responsibility for VY's decom ASAP? The State will have to chase them through the courts for years to get them to pay for their cleanup, and in the end it's going to have to come out of our pockets.
Get Over It

Gloversville, NY

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#2
Aug 28, 2010
 
For Sale: 38 year-old nuclear power plant. Comes with 20 year extension, and a minority of pissing and moaning progressives with no idea where the state will get their power if the plant closes down or how they'll replace the taxes lost so they can still fund their social programs.
Mike Mulligan

Boston, MA

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#4
Aug 28, 2010
 
A. The Cultural Theory of Risk
The cultural theory of risk perception (Douglas & Wildavsky 1982; Rayner 1992) asserts that individuals’ perceptions of risk reflect and reinforce their commitments to visions of how society should be organized. Individuals, according to the theory, selectively credit and dismiss claims of societal danger based on whether the putatively hazardous activity is one that defies or instead conforms to their cultural norms. Debates that on the surface feature instrumental, and often highly technical, claims of risk and benefit are in essence “the product of an ongoing debate about the ideal society”(Douglas & Wildavsky 1982:36).

The competing positions at stake in this debate are reflected in Mary Douglas’s (1970)“group-grid” typology, which classifies competing sets of norms, or “worldviews,” along two cross-cutting dimensions (Figure 1). The “group” dimension represents the degree to which “the individual’s life is absorbed in and sustained by group membership”(Douglas 1982:202). Those with a low group or individualistic orientation expect individuals to “fend for themselves and therefore tend to be competitive”; those with a high group or communitarian worldview assume that individuals will “interact frequently ... in a wide range of activities” in which they must “depend on one another,” a condition that “promotes values of solidarity”(Rayner1992:86). The “grid” dimension measures the pervasiveness and significance of social differentiation within a worldview. Persons who have a high grid or hierarchical orientation expect resources, opportunities, respect, and the like to be “distributed on the basis of explicit public social classifications, such as sex, color,... holding a bureaucratic office,[or] descent in a senior clan or lineage”(Gross & Rayner 1985:6). Low grid orientations value “an egalitarian state of affairs in which no one is prevented from participating in any social role because he or she is the wrong sex, or is too old, or does not have the right family connections” and so forth (Rayner 1992:86). Groups of likeminded persons, moreover, typically form within the interior of the quadrants demarcated by the intersection of group and grid, thereby becoming committed to social arrangements that combine elements of either “hierarchy” or “egalitarianism,” on the one hand, and with either “individualism” or “communitarianism,” on the other (Douglas 1982; Thompson et al. 1990).

These preferences, cultural theory posits, explain political conflict over risk regulation. Persons who are relatively egalitarian and communitarian are naturally sensitive to environmental and technological risks, the reduction of which justifies regulating commercial activities that produce social inequality and legitimize unconstrained self-interest. Those who are more individualistic predictably dismiss claims of environmental risk as specious, in line with their commitment to the autonomy of markets and other private orderings. So do relatively hierarchical persons, who perceive assertions of environmental catastrophe as threatening the competence of social and governmental elites (Douglas & Wildavsky 1982; Wildavsky & Dake 1990). Building on Douglas’s and Wildavsky’s work, numerous empirical studies have shown that perceptions (lay and expert) of various types of environmental and technological hazards do vary in patterns that conform to these categories (Dake 1991; Ellis & Thompson 1997; Gyawali 1999; Jenkins-Smith & Smith 1994; Jenkins-Smith 2001; Marris et al. 1998; Peters & Slovic 1996; Steg & Sievers 2000; Poortinga et al. 2002; Wildavsky & Dake 1990).

Mike Mulligan

Boston, MA

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#5
Aug 28, 2010
 
B. Identity-Protective Cognition
Group membership, it has been shown,“can affect how people process information about nearly all categories of stimuli in the social world”(Baumeister & Leary 1995:504). Individuals tend to adopt the beliefs common to members of salient “in-groups.” They also resist revision of those beliefs in the face of contrary factual information, particularly when that information originates from “out-group” sources, who are likely to be perceived as less knowledgeable and less trustworthy than “in-group” ones (Mackie & Quellar 2000; Clark & Maass 1988; Mackie et al. 1992).

Identity-protective cognition is one proposed mechanism for this set of dynamics. Individual well-being, this account recognizes, is intricately bound up with group membership, which supplies individuals not only with material benefits but a range of critical nonmaterial ones, including opportunities to acquire status and self-esteem. Challenges to commonly held group beliefs can undermine a person’s well-being either by threatening to drive a wedge between that person and other group members, by interfering with important practices within the group, or by impugning the social competence (and thus the esteem-conferring capacity) of a group generally. Accordingly, as a means of identity self-defense, individuals appraise information in a manner that buttresses beliefs associated with belonging to particular groups (Cohenet al. 2000; Cohen et al. in press; Cohen 2003).

The existence of identity-protective cognition is most convincingly supported by studies that investigate how group membership interacts with diverse forms of reasoning. Even someone whose sense of worth was not invested in any profound way in group membership might treat the views of those he or she associates with and trusts as a rough indicator of the accuracy of a commonly held belief. However, experimental studies show the impact of group membership on belief formation is not confined to this heuristic; the perceived predominance of a belief within a group influences information processing even when a member of that group uses systematic reasoning, which is characterized by a relatively high degree of deliberate, critical analysis (Cohen 2003). In effect, an unselfconscious desire to affirm group beliefs motivates both heuristic and systematic reasoning, determining which form a person will employ and to what end. The motivational effect of group membership on information processing is most easily explained by the inference that individuals do have a profound emotional and psychic investment in seeing their group’s beliefs confirmed (Giner-Sorolla & Chaiken 1997; Chen et al. 1999).

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#6
Aug 28, 2010
 

Judged:

1

1

Not throwing in the towel. VT has an extremely well coordinated & concerted effort in the statehouse & somewhat across party lines to hold Entergy accountable, return VY to Greenfield & begin decom asap-in like 5 yrs.

We are fortunate. Hoping not much change except Dem governor of course.

It is still the legislature that has the more say-all guv can do is gum up the machinery w/appointees such as notoriously complicit O'Brien/Irwin & use vetoes to put a monkey wrench in everything.

Progressive candidate dropped out b/c she sees beating Dubie more crucial than fracturing the effort.

With a change in governor, these projects to force Entergy to ante up will go forward, continuing the bruising of their image nationwide as they hold VT hostage & behave like the arrogant occupiers they are & have been for the whole state so see once again.
ScumDog

Harwich, MA

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#7
Aug 28, 2010
 
Oh now GetOverIt aren't you the pessimist. What do you mean by "having no idea where the sate will get their power". That's the mantra you VY supporters are spewing, with no success. Have you not noticed that our utilities are already securing power contracts because, A) the offer from VY sucked (selling us less than half the power they've been selling us for twice the price) and B)there is a glut of power available (see Hydro Quebec).

Vermont will survive just fine without VY; probably will survive better, actually. So, get over it.
We Deserve Better

Essex Junction, VT

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#8
Aug 28, 2010
 
Just called a friend who works at the plant. He said that he had heard nothing about Entergy selling the plant. Another attempt to keep VY in the news?
Hasn't the Reformer heard the real news? Peter Shumlin failed to achieve a decisive victory in the primary. Not much of a leader if you ask me.

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#9
Aug 28, 2010
 
We Deserve Better wrote:
Just called a friend who works at the plant. He said that he had heard nothing about Entergy selling the plant. Another attempt to keep VY in the news?
Hasn't the Reformer heard the real news? Peter Shumlin failed to achieve a decisive victory in the primary. Not much of a leader if you ask me.
So, selling VY not newsworthy? I beg to differ.

Corporate level decisions not customarily announced & certainly not to the grunts. Not the first place I've seen the story, source was a business publication so your point rather ridiculous imho.
flat lander

United States

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#10
Aug 28, 2010
 
MIKE your"from town has changed and how is it they picked one just up the coast from Plymouth nuke!?

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#11
Aug 28, 2010
 
Get Over It wrote:
For Sale: 38 year-old nuclear power plant. Comes with 20 year extension, and a minority of pissing and moaning progressives with no idea where the state will get their power if the plant closes down or how they'll replace the taxes lost so they can still fund their social programs.
Spoken like a true VY employee or family member. Not the minority who wants to close VY on schedule btw.

Across party lines senators voted to close VY on schedule 26-4. Of the four all did not claim to support VY but thought vote too soon. Long time supporter of VY republican Randy Brock voted to close it & said Entergy could not have destoyed their case more if they had been infiltrated by antinuclear activists.

House & Senate claim their is no plan to revisit the issue, there is only 1 1/2 yrs to 3/2012.

Statewide referendums who voted on the issue overwhelmingly against continued operation.

VT resident numbers have hovered around 60-over 70% against VY as well. The slick ad campaign we are bombarded with shares the media w/stories of continued antics of Entergy/VY & NRC. It never ends.

Your ignorance of VT energy & power plans is stunning. We've heard that lie it's older than dirt. An employee who comments off & on had the gall to say if VY's paltry 2% to the grid & now 1/3 of VTs usage is not replaced the lights will go out. There is currently an excess of 5000MW on the grid.

If we relied on the grid until closure VT would be better off. Elec bills would rise nor more than10% if at all.

All VTers do not depend on VY for their power needs. VY amounts to 17% of elec bill.

VT utilities have been planning for over two years for a future w/o VY & since then signed several contracts as well as starting their own projects.

The contract w/Entergy rejected by all utilities & legislature as well-what a joke. We eould recieve a mere 1/6 of our power form VY making them irrellevant.

Solar is booming. Small hydro making a comeback, the H-Q plan a gamechanger & sweet deal. VT can have all we want elec utilities are committing to what they believe VT will need as they have other projects in the works. The plan to replace VY is w/H-Q if necessary.

VELCO also wants their own separate contract w/H-Q to ensure reliability & for emergencies.

H-Q has their own massive projects for more capacity & also has plans to expand into NE and NY & is renewable.
http://www.nukebusters.org/index.php/learn-mo...
Solar Bomb

Little Rock, AR

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#12
Aug 28, 2010
 
Funny, isn't HQ also a nuclear plant owner? So, HQ's nuclear is renewable but Vermont's isn't. Curious logic there, huh?

And you keep mis-understanding and mis-quoting what I said about not replacing 2% of the grid. You obviously do not understand how the grid works, but that isn't unusual for lay persons.

You have to supply the grid with exactly 100% of it's energy needs at all times. If the load goes up the supply must rise to match it. Or the grid shuts down to protect itself. Not speculation, not theory, nothing to do with if the supply is fossil, hydro, solar or nuclear, just how the grid works.

The 5000MW excess capacity includes mostly un-reliable sources like small hydro, wind and solar and old plants that almost never run and would be hughly costly to start-up. Also the 5000MW is above normal usage, a peak load day can eat up the reserve very easily.

In order to have a reliable electric grid you need to have about a 10% reserve of power availible to come on line QUICKLY if required, because as the day goes on the load requirements change. And you ALWAYS have to supply exactly what is needed, no more and no less or the grid will shutdown.

NSD, this has nothing to do with the issue of how you make the electricity, it is about how to run a reliable electric grid. You could do yourself a hugh favor if you would do a little reseach so you could understand the issues invloved with grids.

Grids are not swayed by politics, environment, business rules or lawyers. the grid operates on physics. And if you strain the laws of physics the grid shuts down. This has happen in our generation 3 times in the north east. In third world countries it is almost a daily event.
stanleystanley

Dover, NH

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#13
Aug 28, 2010
 
Golly what are all you idiot antis gonna do if Entergy sells. It will kill you only good argement and Entergy misleading the state and thus being untrustworthy. It was and is your only decent argument even if it is purely political in nature. Shumlin uses it just about every day.

This is so funny. Now you antis will have to resort to arguments about factual stuff like safety and all you have going for you there is a few "experts" who are highly paid to lie on your behalf and no one takes seriously.

Nope now you will be stuck with whatever the NRC decides because all your politica arguments are toast.
Howard Shaffer

Nashua, NH

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#14
Aug 28, 2010
 
What about the wind company that just threatened to take its business out of state if it doesn't get Tax Credits?

Thanks to Mike for posting the info on conflicting belief systems. The anti nuke debate is like that. Also just like gay marriage. Its politics.
I Know More Than You

Concord, NH

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#15
Aug 28, 2010
 
New Clear Idiot wrote:
Any question that Entergy wants to unload the responsibility for VY's decom ASAP? The State will have to chase them through the courts for years to get them to pay for their cleanup, and in the end it's going to have to come out of our pockets.
I see stupid decided to get up early on a Sat.

New Clear Idiot (aka GFNB) has be shown numerous times over the past 9 months how decommissioning funds are funded, managed, and transferred but continues to repeat lie after lie, why is that?

It's ironic that these self proclaimed "liberals" and "progressives" who normally champion rational thought and the scientific method are reduced to mouth breathing tea-party dittoheads when it comes to nuclear power. Glad to see Obama is capable of rational thought on the issue at least.
stanleystanley

Dover, NH

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#16
Aug 28, 2010
 
New Clear Waste wrote:
For Sale: 38-year-old power plant. Needs work. Has 2 years of service left and then decommissioning work and costs begin. Comes with radioactive waste on-site that needs to go somewhere. Any reasonable offer accepted. Send unreasonable offers too.
Any question that Entergy wants to unload the responsibility for VY's decom ASAP? The State will have to chase them through the courts for years to get them to pay for their cleanup, and in the end it's going to have to come out of our pockets.
Come on you can't seriously believe that anyone would buy a plant just to decommission it. Start with the facts and fact number one is that these people are a lot smarter than you.

This plant is going to get relicensed so you better start getting used to it.

If VY is safe there is no way the state of Vermont is going to walk away from the $100 million in revenue that it gets from the VY economic engine each year. And that does not even include that second tier income from sales taxes, rentals, mortgage interest earned, automobile purchase taxes and registrations, meals taxes at local restaurants,
donations to local charities like Big Brothers Big Sisters and the Brattleboro Music Center,,,,and on and on. This is big money and the only way Vermonters are going to vote it down is if someone who is unbiased shows that it really is unsafe.

Keep in mind that Vermont is facing several years of deficits. Next years deficit is estimated at $128 million and is probably low because the estimate was done before they knew that July revenues were 20% lowere than expected. What do you think they are going to see for August. Diddly squat. And as of the November elections you can kiss Federal bailouts goodbye.

Get used to it. VY will get relicensed. It has to.
Did I Say That Outloud

United States

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#17
Aug 28, 2010
 
northstardust wrote:
<quoted text>
So, selling VY not newsworthy? I beg to differ.
Corporate level decisions not customarily announced & certainly not to the grunts. Not the first place I've seen the story, source was a business publication so your point rather ridiculous imho.
Garbage...you of all people would have posted this in every thread on topix if you had already seen this story of Entergy trying to sell VY. Just the facts maam, just the facts.

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#18
Aug 28, 2010
 
Solar Bomb wrote:
Funny, isn't HQ also a nuclear plant owner? So, HQ's nuclear is renewable but Vermont's isn't. Curious logic there, huh?
And you keep mis-understanding and mis-quoting what I said about not replacing 2% of the grid. You obviously do not understand how the grid works, but that isn't unusual for lay persons.
You have to supply the grid with exactly 100% of it's energy needs at all times. If the load goes up the supply must rise to match it. Or the grid shuts down to protect itself. Not speculation, not theory, nothing to do with if the supply is fossil, hydro, solar or nuclear, just how the grid works.

In order to have a reliable electric grid you need to have about a 10% reserve of power availible to come on line QUICKLY if required, because as the day goes on the load requirements change. And you ALWAYS have to supply exactly what is needed, no more and no less or the grid will shutdown.
NSD, this has nothing to do with the issue of how you make the electricity, it is about how to run a reliable electric grid. You could do yourself a hugh favor if you would do a little reseach so you could understand the issues invloved with grids.
Grids are not swayed by politics, environment, business rules or lawyers. the grid operates on physics. And if you strain the laws of physics the grid shuts down. This has happen in our generation 3 times in the north east. In third world countries it is almost a daily event.
Solar Bomb:
"The 5000MW excess capacity includes mostly un-reliable sources like small hydro, wind and solar and old plants that almost never run and would be hughly costly to start-up. Also the 5000MW is above normal usage, a peak load day can eat up the reserve very easily."

Comments like this are typical, however I would like to see some proof as these prognostications generally end up being untrue and merely more disinformation. That there is a 'surplus' would indicate it is accessible, that it exists, is there & the lights are not going out as you claimed is the point.

In fact, no one ever makes these claims except VY, supporters & nuclear industry-why is this? They are well known scare tactics.

The npp owned by H-Q changes nothing whether we get our power from them or not it will still be there regardless. It is small about the size of VY.

Kind of a foolish statement since Entergy also owns coal plants & other carbon plants throughout the south, however if VT buys power from Entergy this does not & would not change a thing either. The nuclear plant may not have anything to do w/supplying VT just as all VT elec customers would not even be affected when VY closes.

Your explanations designed to only give the part of the picture & of course all roads lead to only one place-VY. There is a continual herding however it is also quite obvious as well This is primarily the built in limitation w/those trying to explain this to public. It enevitably becomes distorted when half-truths & misleading info are used, giving only a part of the picture, the part Entergy/VY wis the public to see.

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#19
Aug 28, 2010
 
Did I Say That Outloud wrote:
<quoted text>
Garbage...you of all people would have posted this in every thread on topix if you had already seen this story of Entergy trying to sell VY. Just the facts maam, just the facts.
Wrong once again! Was posted yesterday on another antinuclear website!

Top left under Reformer story:
http://www.evacuationplans.org/

I simply do not have the time to post everything I see there is so much & often do not even comment until story has been out for a day or two.

Exelon, NRG Energy Eyeing Vermont Yankee -Sources
By Jeff Beattie, Energy Daily
August 27, 2010,
Apparently fed up with the troublesome investment-and the difficult political environment it faces in the state--Entergy Corp. has begun shopping its Vermont Yankee nuclear power plant to potential buyers, with Exelon Corp. and NRG Energy Inc. having...
more:
http://www.theenergydaily.com/publications/ed...
Did I Say That Outloud

Princeton, MA

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#20
Aug 28, 2010
 
Sorry, I guess I need to surf the entire web before I post on here.

“figuresdontlie*l iarscanfigure”

Since: Feb 10

S. Londonderry VT

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#21
Aug 28, 2010
 
stanleystanley wrote:
<quoted text>
Come on you can't seriously believe that anyone would buy a plant just to decommission it. Start with the facts and fact number one is that these people are a lot smarter than you.
This plant is going to get relicensed so you better start getting used to it.
If VY is safe there is no way the state of Vermont is going to walk away from the $100 million in revenue that it gets from the VY economic engine each year. And that does not even include that second tier income from sales taxes, rentals, mortgage interest earned, automobile purchase taxes and registrations, meals taxes at local restaurants,
donations to local charities like Big Brothers Big Sisters and the Brattleboro Music Center,,,,and on and on. This is big money and the only way Vermonters are going to vote it down is if someone who is unbiased shows that it really is unsafe.
Keep in mind that Vermont is facing several years of deficits. Next years deficit is estimated at $128 million and is probably low because the estimate was done before they knew that July revenues were 20% lowere than expected. What do you think they are going to see for August. Diddly squat. And as of the November elections you can kiss Federal bailouts goodbye.
Get used to it. VY will get relicensed. It has to.
You simply do not get it do you. VT HAS voted it down. There are no plans to revisit the vote. There is only 18mo before decom.

A republican gov does not guarantee anything but gumming up boards w/appointees, throwing monkey-wrench in process & pressuring all office holders to march to Entergy drumbeat like Salmon. Hey Tommy where's that report on the decom fund three years late?

Story said companies 'eyeing' VY, since no one will comment we do not know what is going on.

Could be Entergy wishes to pull out as there are a number of various actions filed against them. Keeping the plant running is paramount as once it goes to decom it's more worthless than it is now. It does not look like they have the additional funds to cover decom & expenses which are over one billion @ present.

VT legislature already said the other npp owners were as bad if not a worse option than Entergy, so new ownership is not what VT wants. They cannot stop it but could change the rules to make it more difficult if not umpossible to run profitably or if at all.

Perhaps poising themselves for political climate & the enevitable fallout if things sugar out to a Dem gov & legislature.

Those are not gifts they are bribes. Those connected w/those orgs cannot speak out or say anything negative about the plant. Entergy or VY & would replace them w/other business sources.

What is the source for your numbers? Since less than 1/3 of VY employees live in VT it simply is not so. Over 2/3 live and spend their money, pay property, state & local taxes and/or fees in their own state. Only exception are NH residents who pay VT income tax.

NH taxes:
Interest & Dividends Tax
Gambling Winnings Tax
Inheritance and Estate Tax
Business Profits Tax
Business Enterprise Tax
Communications Services Tax
Electricity Consumption Tax
Meals and Rentals Tax
Tobacco Tax
Real Estate Transfer Tax
Timber Tax
Gravel Tax
State Education Property Tax
Utility Property Tax
Local Property Tax
Property Tax Rates

New Hampshire has two separate corporate taxes: the BPT (Business Profits Tax) and BET (Business Enterprise Tax). New Hampshire charges 8.5% BPT for corporations with gross receipts over $50,000. BET is a 0.75% tax on enterprise value tax base on corporations with gross receipts of over $150,000 or an enterprise value tax base over $75,000.

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