“animis opibusque parati”

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#105 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok. I will regret asking this I am sure, but what constitutionally-guaranteed freedoms does a single payer health system destroy?
Thank you for acknowledging the end-game in the Obamacare fiasco: single-payer. And that amounts to loss of personal freedom with respect to:

1) one's own health care choices [now government-controlled for all], and
2) one's own earnings [now confiscated from all by government to pay for the health care of others].
Che Reagan Christ

Lodi, OH

#106 May 15, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for acknowledging the end-game in the Obamacare fiasco: single-payer. And that amounts to loss of personal freedom with respect to:
1) one's own health care choices [now government-controlled for all], and
2) one's own earnings [now confiscated from all by government to pay for the health care of others].
That's a secret? The only reason we ended up with "Obamacare" is because of GOP resistance to anything better.

Which constitutional provisions do you think are violated by either of your two complaints? There is absolutely nothing in "Obamacare" that will prohibit you from going to any doctor you would like.

“Meh.”

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#107 May 15, 2013
I'm still pretty confused as to how paying almost twice as much to make sure that other people can't benefit from your pay ins serves anyone.

I can see how "We want you to pay for national healthcare for everyone" would cause many to balk.

But "We want you to pay for national healthcare for everyone, which will result in a massive decrease in your personal health spending" seems pretty clearly a great deal.

I'm just really interested in the thought processes of people willing to pay twice as much to avoid sharing. Is it just a lack of information about other options in place worldwide? A lack of education about the systems? Some cultural component I've missed that makes paying twice as much worthwhile?
They cannot kill a spook

United States

#108 May 15, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for acknowledging the end-game in the Obamacare fiasco: single-payer. And that amounts to loss of personal freedom with respect to:
1) one's own health care choices [now government-controlled for all], and
2) one's own earnings [now confiscated from all by government to pay for the health care of others].
And don't forget the elimination of the forth amendment.

“animis opibusque parati”

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#109 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a secret? The only reason we ended up with "Obamacare" is because of GOP resistance to anything better.
Which constitutional provisions do you think are violated by either of your two complaints? There is absolutely nothing in "Obamacare" that will prohibit you from going to any doctor you would like.
You call yourself a legal secretary?

Congress now has an unlimited power to tax -- a power that enables government to force citizens to pay for any product they may not individually choose to purchase, and to provide that product to other citizens as well.

And if you believe Obamacare allows you to see any doctor you choose, you're grossly uninformed. But, that was clear upon your arrival to Topix.

“animis opibusque parati”

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#110 May 15, 2013
tranpsosition wrote:
I'm still pretty confused as to how paying almost twice as much to make sure that other people can't benefit from your pay ins serves anyone.
I can see how "We want you to pay for national healthcare for everyone" would cause many to balk.
But "We want you to pay for national healthcare for everyone, which will result in a massive decrease in your personal health spending" seems pretty clearly a great deal.
I'm just really interested in the thought processes of people willing to pay twice as much to avoid sharing. Is it just a lack of information about other options in place worldwide? A lack of education about the systems? Some cultural component I've missed that makes paying twice as much worthwhile?
"...true rights, such as those in our Constitution, or those considered to be natural or human rights, exist simultaneously among people. That means exercise of a right by one person does not diminish those held by another… For Congress to guarantee a right to health care, or any other good or service, whether a person can afford it or not, it must diminish someone else's rights, namely their rights to their earnings."

-- Walter Williams

Spending other people's money at the cost of their individual freedom is by no means compassionate.

"Collectivism is the doctrine that the social collective -- called society, the people, the state, etc.-- has rights, needs, or moral authority above and apart from the individuals who comprise it. We hear this idea continually championed in such familiar platitudes as 'the needs of the people take precedence over the rights of the individual,''production for people, not profits,' and 'the common good.'

"Collectivism often sounds humane because it stresses the importance of human needs. In reality, it is little more than a rationalization for sacrificing you and me to the desires of others."

-- Jarret B. Wollstein in The Causes of Aggression
Che Reagan Christ

Lodi, OH

#111 May 15, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
You call yourself a legal secretary?
Congress now has an unlimited power to tax -- a power that enables government to force citizens to pay for any product they may not individually choose to purchase, and to provide that product to other citizens as well.
And if you believe Obamacare allows you to see any doctor you choose, you're grossly uninformed. But, that was clear upon your arrival to Topix.
You left out the constitutional provision that was violated.

“animis opibusque parati”

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#112 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
You left out the constitutional provision that was violated.
One with an ounce of intellect would infer that a citizen's right to property becomes meaningless when government is permitted to confiscate and redistribute it.
Che Reagan Christ

Lodi, OH

#113 May 15, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
One with an ounce of intellect would infer that a citizen's right to property becomes meaningless when government is permitted to confiscate and redistribute it.
So you think sales taxes are unconstitutional?
They cannot kill a spook

United States

#114 May 15, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
"...true rights, such as those in our Constitution, or those considered to be natural or human rights, exist simultaneously among people. That means exercise of a right by one person does not diminish those held by another… For Congress to guarantee a right to health care, or any other good or service, whether a person can afford it or not, it must diminish someone else's rights, namely their rights to their earnings."
-- Walter Williams
Spending other people's money at the cost of their individual freedom is by no means compassionate.
"Collectivism is the doctrine that the social collective -- called society, the people, the state, etc.-- has rights, needs, or moral authority above and apart from the individuals who comprise it. We hear this idea continually championed in such familiar platitudes as 'the needs of the people take precedence over the rights of the individual,''production for people, not profits,' and 'the common good.'
"Collectivism often sounds humane because it stresses the importance of human needs. In reality, it is little more than a rationalization for sacrificing you and me to the desires of others."
-- Jarret B. Wollstein in The Causes of Aggression
Liberals can't understand a genius like Dr. Walter E. Williams. They are confused as to why a man with dark skin pigmentation is tell them to stop stealing and get to work. They are used to Barry and Barney Frank telling them that not only do they not need to work the government will steal for them.

“animis opibusque parati”

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#115 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
So you think sales taxes are unconstitutional?
A sales tax is not a penalty for failing to purchase a product, is it now, moron?

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#116 May 15, 2013
tranpsosition wrote:
I've lived under a single payer system (Nippon, cha cha cha) and while it was vastly better than the US system, it's really not half as good as the NHS.
I've never understood why Americans are so determined to pay so much more per capita than anyone else. Here in the UK, everyone is covered. And in covering everyone, we manage to cut the percentage of our GDP paid into healthcare by almost half.
I'm just not sure I see the logic of a system that deliberately excludes service to some while still managing to cost more than any other system yet developed. Even if people don't want to share, don't want their funds put towards making others well (which, written down, seems rather insane) how are they willing to pay twice as much to make sure that others are excluded?
Individual liberty has a cost to the individual. Many are OK with that.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#117 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok. I will regret asking this I am sure, but what constitutionally-guaranteed freedoms does a single payer health system destroy?
The freedom to do as I want with the fruits of MY labor.
Che Reagan Christ

Lodi, OH

#118 May 15, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
A sales tax is not a penalty for failing to purchase a product, is it now, moron?
That's not what you said. You said it was unconstitutional because it took money from you and redistributed it to others.

You should stick to the Bible. You struggle with issues that require actual thought.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#119 May 15, 2013
tranpsosition wrote:
I'm still pretty confused as to how paying almost twice as much to make sure that other people can't benefit from your pay ins serves anyone.
That presupposed that the reason for one's existence is to serve others.
Che Reagan Christ

Lodi, OH

#120 May 15, 2013
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
The freedom to do as I want with the fruits of MY labor.
No one is stopping you.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#121 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
So you think sales taxes are unconstitutional?
They are voluntary.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#122 May 15, 2013
Kemosahbe wrote:
<quoted text>
You're texting and driving, which I have read you claim you can do, only you don't do it, your truck runs off the road, you slide sideways into a tree, and your head whacks said tree. Unfortunately, it didn't kill you, but gave you a traumatic brain injury. You spend a month in a coma, three more recovering, and you can no longer work. Because Obamacare hasn't fully kicked in, your insurance company finds some pre-existing condition and drops you. You get home and the bills come in and they are $500k. And climbing.
How do you pay for that?
I guess according to you, you should just off yourself.
I'm not that cold-blooded.
18% of GDP goes to pay for healthcare. And the neverland its nine percent and their healthcare system is arguably equal to or better than ours.

Obama can't be bothered with the boring details of making healthcare affordable. He only knows how to take for mothers and pass goodies around like abortion pills to sluts like Sandra Fluke want to live in urban lifestyle on somebody else's dime.

Obamacare increases cost lowers choice and makes the whole system worse than it ever was. But as long as the underclass gets more freebies paid for by working and saving taxpayers who cares right?

“animis opibusque parati”

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#123 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
That's not what you said. You said it was unconstitutional because it took money from you and redistributed it to others.
You should stick to the Bible. You struggle with issues that require actual thought.
You failed logic, didn't you?
Wait...I'll bet that course isn't offered at ACME School of Legal Secretaries.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#124 May 15, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
No one is stopping you.
Of course they are when they take some of it away and give it to others.

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