Since: Jun 13

Hilliard, OH

#42 Jul 26, 2013
-The-Artist- wrote:
<quoted text>
I've seen similar decay in parts of Massachusetts and Rhode Island.
The worst decay is in Detroit, and certain Indian reservations.
The decay in New England is confined to smallish areas and much of it has been gentrified...Providence being a leading example. The Eastern Ohio-Western PA situation is heading into its fifth decade with no solutions in sight.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#43 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>The decay in New England is confined to smallish areas and much of it has been gentrified...Providence being a leading example. The Eastern Ohio-Western PA situation is heading into its fifth decade with no solutions in sight.
The drilling has spurred a marginal recovery.

What the area has yet to figure out, is that "healthcare" isn't a base industry.

If you don't manufacture things, you are not going to succeed.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#44 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>Calgary is slipping at the municipal level...and has a Muzzie mayor with a documented anti-Christian and pro homo agenda record.
It's the "Salt Lake City effect". Built it, and they will come. But they bring the leftism with them.

Since: Jun 13

Hilliard, OH

#45 Jul 26, 2013
-The-Artist- wrote:
<quoted text>
It's the "Salt Lake City effect". Built it, and they will come. But they bring the leftism with them.
Typically, when cities crack the 1,000,000 population, things start sliding just out of the laws of large numbers. Calgary is at 1.1 million within the city limits and climbing rapidly. It's only slightly larger in area than Columbus.

Since: Jun 13

Hilliard, OH

#46 Jul 26, 2013
-The-Artist- wrote:
<quoted text>
The drilling has spurred a marginal recovery.
What the area has yet to figure out, is that "healthcare" isn't a base industry.
If you don't manufacture things, you are not going to succeed.
Pittsburgh rebuilt on healthcare and higher education.
Whoops.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#47 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>Pittsburgh rebuilt on healthcare and higher education.
Whoops.
They did not rebuild, they stabilized.

But check the population figure of Pittsburgh.

It's less than half of what it was in 1950.

With the same city limits.

An example of rebuilding would be San Francisco.

It's population in 2010, was higher than in 1950. But from 1960-1980, it declined.

SF built off of the tech industry.

Since: Apr 13

Zanesville, OH

#48 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>Unions never hurt a company? That's one of the most ludicrous statements ever. Ask the American steel industry about that. Ask the retirees of the Big Three whose former employers soon won't be able to pay their benefits because they're so far over the top. Ask the workers at the auto plants in the 70s why they turned out utter junk. There's a reason some of us haven't owned a Big Three car in a quarter century and never will again. I will never drive anything stamped "UAW."
How has "government" taken away unions? Right to work is a basic right...forcing someone to join a union is un-American. And in case you haven't noticed, union growth in government employment is unfettered.
The cities I mentioned WILL NOT follow in Detroit's footsteps...Boston, Houston and Dallas are in the clover. The have thriving middles classes and huge tax bases as a result. So does Columbus.
Mercedes Benz, BMW and Porsche are union companies, how are they fairing?

Idiotic management killed American auto mfg. From capitulating to overreaching by the unions to designing utter crap. That's not the union's fault.

I stuck with GMC, Pontiac and now Buick as I'm an American who looks forward.

You can make any excuse you want, your main problem is that blacks in auto factories made more money than you.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#49 Jul 26, 2013
St of Circumstance wrote:
<quoted text>
Mercedes Benz, BMW and Porsche are union companies, how are they fairing?
Idiotic management killed American auto mfg. From capitulating to overreaching by the unions to designing utter crap. That's not the union's fault.
I stuck with GMC, Pontiac and now Buick as I'm an American who looks forward.
You can make any excuse you want, your main problem is that blacks in auto factories made more money than you.
The German plants in the US are non-union.

How did it work out for those blacks, their industry was once dominant, now it and Detroit, Flint, are in ruins. The Big 3 produce more and more of their production overseas.

Since: Jun 13

Hilliard, OH

#50 Jul 26, 2013
St of Circumstance wrote:
<quoted text>
Mercedes Benz, BMW and Porsche are union companies, how are they fairing?
Idiotic management killed American auto mfg. From capitulating to overreaching by the unions to designing utter crap. That's not the union's fault.
I stuck with GMC, Pontiac and now Buick as I'm an American who looks forward.
You can make any excuse you want, your main problem is that blacks in auto factories made more money than you.
Uh, Kosmik...BMW in South Carolina is NON-UNION. Mercedes in Alabama is NON-UNION. You are clueless.
So, it was management's fault for "capitulating to the union," huh? How would strikes have gone over? Any better?
I couldn't care less what someone in an auto plant makes until it destroys the company...then it becomes everyone's economic and social problem.
Tell us some more lies about you not being a flaming leftist.

Since: Jun 13

Hilliard, OH

#51 Jul 26, 2013
Number of new GM plants opened in the 21st century...
In China: 15
In the US: 0
Enzyte Bob

United States

#52 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>Uh, Kosmik...BMW in South Carolina is NON-UNION. Mercedes in Alabama is NON-UNION. You are clueless.
So, it was management's fault for "capitulating to the union," huh? How would strikes have gone over? Any better?
I couldn't care less what someone in an auto plant makes until it destroys the company...then it becomes everyone's economic and social problem.
Tell us some more lies about you not being a flaming leftist.
German and Japanese unions usually help management drum out the deadbeats and the incompetents. American unions would pad the payroll, engage in make work, and slow up the process to the point where American companies could no longer make money with them.

the untold story of American manufacturers is and how incompetent management was so much as how they were able to keep the operations running as long as they could.if you look at things from that standpoint you would marvel at the skill of American management
Real Tea Party

Columbus, OH

#53 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
Number of new GM plants opened in the 21st century...
In China: 15
In the US: 0
Because workers suck here haven't you figured that out yet old man? Baby boomers cannot build anything but protest signs.
Real Tea Party

Columbus, OH

#54 Jul 26, 2013
Enzyte Bob wrote:
<quoted text>
German and Japanese unions usually help management drum out the deadbeats and the incompetents. American unions would pad the payroll, engage in make work, and slow up the process to the point where American companies could no longer make money with them.
the untold story of American manufacturers is and how incompetent management was so much as how they were able to keep the operations running as long as they could.if you look at things from that standpoint you would marvel at the skill of American management
German and Japanese also have a much much smaller salary gap between management and workers. The managers actually work and American bosses sit their asses all day doing nothing.

At the end of the day, they are better workers, better ethnics, more team-spirited, less individualism. None of that me sh1t.
Real Tea Party

Columbus, OH

#56 Jul 26, 2013
-The-Artist- wrote:
<quoted text>
The German plants in the US are non-union.
How did it work out for those blacks, their industry was once dominant, now it and Detroit, Flint, are in ruins. The Big 3 produce more and more of their production overseas.
Germans are superior race, if they had the land size and the resource just half of the United States they would easily be the super power for century. You Americans are mutt, less pure = less sophisticated.

There are just as many American whites in GM plants as blacks if not more, and they suck big time in productivity, so are their managers. Total failure since 1965.
Real Tea Party

Columbus, OH

#57 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>Uh, Kosmik...BMW in South Carolina is NON-UNION. Mercedes in Alabama is NON-UNION. You are clueless.
So, it was management's fault for "capitulating to the union," huh? How would strikes have gone over? Any better?
I couldn't care less what someone in an auto plant makes until it destroys the company...then it becomes everyone's economic and social problem.
Tell us some more lies about you not being a flaming leftist.
As long as it was German and Japanese management at the top, the products will be just fine. Them good ole boys are only good at following order and put the parts in, no need to promote them or they are going to be just like Detriot. Foreigners are so much better in building awesome plants and run them, you know it.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#59 Jul 26, 2013
Camel Toe Inspector wrote:
<quoted text>
You can't blame any of their problems on the white man because there aren't any
Many of Detroit's problems can be blamed on white men, as in white liberals such as

Jerome Cavanaugh
Carl Levin
Sander Levin
John Dingell

You can also add a white woman, Jennifer Granholm

Since: Apr 13

Zanesville, OH

#60 Jul 26, 2013
-The-Artist- wrote:
<quoted text>
The German plants in the US are non-union.
How did it work out for those blacks, their industry was once dominant, now it and Detroit, Flint, are in ruins. The Big 3 produce more and more of their production overseas.
It wasn't the workers fault. They didn't make the bad deals, design the crappy product nor overpay themselves.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#61 Jul 26, 2013
St of Circumstance wrote:
<quoted text>
It wasn't the workers fault. They didn't make the bad deals, design the crappy product nor overpay themselves.
They just got drunk on their lunch break and sometimes never even showed up, but had their buddies clock them in

Since: Apr 13

Zanesville, OH

#62 Jul 26, 2013
Diamond Eugene wrote:
<quoted text>Uh, Kosmik...BMW in South Carolina is NON-UNION. Mercedes in Alabama is NON-UNION. You are clueless.
So, it was management's fault for "capitulating to the union," huh? How would strikes have gone over? Any better?
I couldn't care less what someone in an auto plant makes until it destroys the company...then it becomes everyone's economic and social problem.
Tell us some more lies about you not being a flaming leftist.
I place blame where it belongs and the line workers aren't to blame for the failure of management and the idiocy of the executives. Being in middle management, you of course will never admit such.

My father was a union electrician for GM until retirement, I was well aware of the overreaching of the union and the threat of strike. Still, it was management who agreed to the bad decisions, they had no cajones. A working man won't last long with no work, something the executives didn't consider as they worried about lasting too long without a future income stream.
Enzyte Bob

United States

#63 Jul 27, 2013
St of Circumstance wrote:
<quoted text>
I place blame where it belongs and the line workers aren't to blame for the failure of management and the idiocy of the executives. Being in middle management, you of course will never admit such.
My father was a union electrician for GM until retirement, I was well aware of the overreaching of the union and the threat of strike. Still, it was management who agreed to the bad decisions, they had no cajones. A working man won't last long with no work, something the executives didn't consider as they worried about lasting too long without a future income stream.
You'd better get a refund of you're Syracuse degree.it appears you weren't taught any critical thinking skills.

-Krauthammer has one aspect of both stories here:

"It doesn’t take a genius to see what happens when the entitlement state outgrows the economy upon which it rests. The time of Greece, Cyprus, Portugal, Spain, the rest of insolvent social-democratic Europe — and now Detroit — is the time for conservatives to raise the banner of Stein’s Law and yell,“Stop.” You can kick the can down the road, but at some point it disappears over a cliff."

Here are some very simple rules to go by. If you really were in business for yourself you know they are true.

1. NOBODY can afford to pay a lot of people to sit around and not produce.

A. When unions have a lot of restrictive work rules, slow the line, sit in job banks for years and years when there is no work to do (and can't be laid off), sit in retirement for 35 years with a pension check and all of their healthcare paid, and generally take an 'it's not my job" attitude, that is effectively the same as being paid for not producing.

In other words the employer is having to shell out money for people to sit around and do nothing. An employer is supposed to generate revenue and a profit from their efforts and pay them from that revenue. An employee sitting around doing nothing weather through retirement benefits or in efficacy can I generate revenue nor profit.

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