Rand Paul: Let the Dumbocrats own it...

Rand Paul: Let the Dumbocrats own it (higher taxes)!

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Enzyte Bob

Powell, OH

#1 Dec 7, 2012
Rand Paul: We Should Let Dems Raise Taxes And Then Let Them Own It

SEN. RAND PAUL: I have yet another thought on how we can fix this. Why don't we let the Democrats pass whatever they want? If they are the party of higher taxes, all the Republicans vote present and let the Democrats raise taxes as high as they want to raise them, let Democrats in the Senate raise taxes, let the president sign it and then make them own the tax increase. And when the economy stalls, when the economy sputters, when people lose their jobs, they know which party to blame, the party of high taxes. Let's don't be the party of just almost as high taxes.

LARRY KUDLOW, CNBC: Some people have called that the doomsday scenario. Others have said,'Look, it's a strategic retreat on the Republicans' behalf.' Would you vote present for that in the Senate if that came up?

RAND PAUL: Yes, I don't think we have to in the Senate. In the House, they have to because the Democrats don't have the majority. In the Senate, I'm happy not to filibuster it, and I will announce tonight on your show that I will work with Harry Reid to let him pass his big old tax hike with a simple majority if that's what Harry Reid wants, because then they will become the party of high taxes and they can own it.
Enzyte Bob

Powell, OH

#2 Dec 7, 2012
This is brilliant. Let them own it like they own ObamaCare.
VADoc

United States

#3 Dec 7, 2012
I still don't think it will do much. Enough people vote D that don't pay taxes or won't feel the sting of higher taxes. They usually also don't feel job loss or inflation because they often don't purchase their own food or work.

Now if raising taxes meant taxing their benefits then woo buddy I think you'd see them take to the streets with torches and pitchforks.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#4 Dec 8, 2012
I WANT to go over the fiscal cliff. The only way these fucquers will ever get it is to get a big heaping dose of consequences.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#5 Dec 8, 2012
VADoc wrote:
I still don't think it will do much. Enough people vote D that don't pay taxes or won't feel the sting of higher taxes.
If they consume, they'll feel the sting. Their "free money" won't buy as much.
VADoc

Warrenville, SC

#6 Dec 8, 2012
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
If they consume, they'll feel the sting. Their "free money" won't buy as much.
Not true. They will just give them a cost of living adjustment on their checks. I'm sure it will be written into the new budget.

Private sector employees and federal employees aren't deserving of cost of living raises, but welfare recipients are.

Kosmik

Since: Sep 10

Delaware, OH

#7 Dec 8, 2012
That's all Republicans have left in their arsenal is flat out fear mongering. Their policies have wrecked the economy and they want more of the same.

Right now Republicans are scared to death, our economy can't be held back the way they've hindered it the past two years without appearing to be guilty of such.

All they're left with is gloom and doom projections based upon nothing realistic.

Look at what the tax rates did in the 30's, they didn't kill anything. The depression was lenghthened because Roosevelt didn't do enough, not because he did too much.

Hugh Victor Thompson III

“Larchmont's Leading Citizen”

Since: Dec 12

Hilliard, OH

#8 Dec 8, 2012
Kosmik wrote:
That's all Republicans have left in their arsenal is flat out fear mongering. Their policies have wrecked the economy and they want more of the same.
Right now Republicans are scared to death, our economy can't be held back the way they've hindered it the past two years without appearing to be guilty of such.
All they're left with is gloom and doom projections based upon nothing realistic.
Look at what the tax rates did in the 30's, they didn't kill anything. The depression was lenghthened because Roosevelt didn't do enough, not because he did too much.
Our economy in the 1930s was not consumer driven with low manufacturing capabilities as it is today. As much as I despise globalism, this is now a planetary economy and one nation cannot pull itself out of a down economy by itself.
Obama's proposals run counter to every accepted course of action to improve an economy. In top of that, his lies about his proposals are further dividing the nation.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#9 Dec 8, 2012
I agree with Tony. George Will says the so-called "fiscal cliff"' will result in a 3% decrease in spending. Good.

As for the tax increases, let Barry own them.

I am all for a balanced budget. If they have to raise taxes to do it, so be it. Maybe then people will figure out we can't afford to buy birth control pills for hipster sl|||uuu|||ts and ObamaPhones for the lazy.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#10 Dec 8, 2012
Kosmik wrote:
That's all Republicans have left in their arsenal is flat out fear mongering. Their policies have wrecked the economy and they want more of the same.
Right now Republicans are scared to death, our economy can't be held back the way they've hindered it the past two years without appearing to be guilty of such.
All they're left with is gloom and doom projections based upon nothing realistic.
Look at what the tax rates did in the 30's, they didn't kill anything. The depression was lenghthened because Roosevelt didn't do enough, not because he did too much.
LMAO! Stop reading Daily Kos and the Workers' Daily and use some real data!

LABOR FORCE: Number Of Workers Aged 25-54 Back To April 1997 Levels.“In other words in the past 15 years not a single incremental job has been gained in this most productive and lucrative of age groups!”

How’s that hopey-changey stuff workin’ out for ya?

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-07/numb...
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#11 Dec 8, 2012
Hugh Victor Thompson III wrote:
<quoted text>Our economy in the 1930s was not consumer driven with low manufacturing capabilities as it is today. As much as I despise globalism, this is now a planetary economy and one nation cannot pull itself out of a down economy by itself.
Obama's proposals run counter to every accepted course of action to improve an economy. In top of that, his lies about his proposals are further dividing the nation.
The fact of the matter is that if we give Barry his tax increase on the "rich" they will be paying a marginal tax rate of about 45%. That's without all the other state, local and property taxes they pay.

I don't care how much money they have. That is simply unconscionable.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#12 Dec 8, 2012
TOM BLUMER:

Now They Tell Us: The economy never really got better, and now it’s getting worse.

http://pjmedia.com/blog/now-they-tell-us/
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#13 Dec 8, 2012
Now They Tell Us
Posted By Tom Blumer On December 8, 2012 @ 12:00 am In Column,Elections 2012 | 32 Comments

Now that Barack Obama is safely ensconced in the White House for another four years, several items which should have been noticed or revealed before Election Day have come to the fore. Collectively, they tell us two things: that the pre-election economy was worse than voters were led to believe, and that the prospects for meaningful improvement under the current regime are bleak at best. Additionally, in at least one instance, economic activity itself was likely manipulated.

The probable gamesmanship occurred at Government/General Motors, which is still effectively under Obama administration control, still on track to saddle U.S. taxpayers with a loss of $25 billion or more [1], and still losing market share [2].

Despite already-bloated inventories at its dealers, GM’s production lines ran full throttle during September and October. Thanks to that ramp-up and unimpressive sales growth, retail inventories grew by an astonishing 99,000 in October and November. Dealers received five vehicles for every four they sold during those two months, bringing their on-hand stocks from an already unsustainable 689,000 in September to an absolutely ridiculous 788,000. GM estimates that its dealers have a 4-1/2 month supply [3] of full-size pickups — if the economy doesn’t tank.

It seems all too likely that a presidential campaign which used “GM is alive, Osama is dead”[4] as its campaign theme ordered or pressured GM executives to keep the assembly lines running all-out regardless of the business consequences. The campaign of challenger Mitt Romney should have been paying closer attention, as half of GM’s inventory spike occurred and was reported before Election Day. But instead, it let itself get distracted [5] by mostly irrelevant noise about Chrysler’s plans for its Jeep brand in China. It even missed touting Chrysler parent Fiat’s announcement that it plans to manufacture a new Jeep model [6] for the North American market in Italy.

Earlier this week, almost a month removed from election-related visibility, the Wall Street Journal reported [7] that the company “is taking steps to cut excess production,” specifically citing a plant in the critical swing state of Ohio, and “signaled there may be more to come.” Imagine that. If the economy sputters badly, layoffs could easily begin occurring at GM and throughout its supply chain.

News in the housing market, particularly concerning sales of new single-family homes, suddenly went from pre-election exuberance to post-election bleakness. The Census Bureau’s final pre-election report told us that new-home sales had reached a seasonally adjusted annual level of 389,000. The administration’s press apparatchiks dutifully reported that figure as the highest in 2-1/2 years. The Associated Press, aka the Administration’s Press [8], told readers [9] and subscribing outlets that the news was “further evidence of a sustained housing recovery that could help lift the lackluster economy.”

Oops. The bureau’s post-Thanksgiving release [10] revised September’s number down by over 5 percent to 369,000 and also reported a slight October decline. Overall, it showed that the housing market has gone nowhere [11] during the past eight reported months. Actual monthly sales during the past five months have badly trailed 2009, when most observers thought that things were already as bad as they could get. Those who believed that clearly underestimated the Obama administration’s ability to perpetuate misery throughout a sector which would have long since recovered if it had simply been left alone. The AP’s still overoptimistic reaction to the September revision was to insist [12] that “the housing market (is) starting to recover more than five years after the bubble burst,” and to push a large portion of the blame for October onto Superstorm Sandy.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#14 Dec 8, 2012
Cont ...

Readers are going to be seeing a lot of Sandy-related excuse-making during the next several months, and — who knows?— maybe even the next several years. Already, Sandy is being peddled as the reason why the ADP-Moody’s November private-sector employment report came in with only 118,000 jobs added [13]. Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody’s Analytics, claimed that the number would have been 86,000 higher if it weren’t for Sandy. Logically then, the December catch-up added to a supposedly typical month with 200,000 jobs added should cause the next ADP-Moody’s report to show a gain of almost 300,000. Wanna bet, Mark? November’s jobs report [14] from the government released on Friday, though presented as pretty decent by the press, really wasn’t [15].

Now even the press is turning dour [16] on the economy, as if lousy conditions totally invisible before November 6 have suddenly (and of course,“unexpectedly [17]“) appeared to ruin things. But so are Obama and Democratic legislators, who while demanding economy-retarding, job-killing pound-of-flesh tax increases and insisting that entitlement spending stay off the table for another ten years [18], want to add [19]“tens of billions of dollars of … stimulus measures” to any deal to prevent the January 1 “fiscal cliff.”

The only things which seem likely to arise out of all of this are trillion-dollar deficits as far as the eye can see, continued lackluster or worse economic growth, and indefinitely higher than acceptable levels of unemployment and under-employment. Oh, and one more thing, courtesy of Howard Dean and despite the administration’s insistence to the contrary: tax increases for everyone [20].

More: 73% of Jobs Created in Last 5 Months Have Been Government Jobs [21]
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#15 Dec 8, 2012
Did you catch that, KOSmik?

More: 73% of Jobs Created in Last 5 Months Have Been Government Jobs [21]

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/12/07/73-of-jo...

Hugh Victor Thompson III

“Larchmont's Leading Citizen”

Since: Dec 12

Hilliard, OH

#16 Dec 8, 2012
Enzyte Bob wrote:
Did you catch that, KOSmik?
More: 73% of Jobs Created in Last 5 Months Have Been Government Jobs [21]
http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/12/07/73-of-jo...
The leftist residents on the "Ohio Governor" thread praise it as a sign of economic strength...imagine that.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#18 Dec 8, 2012
Karl Monday wrote:
<quoted text>
Can we start a new thread of "Who do you want for Governor in 2014, Slow Train Ted or Public Official 14?"
The leftists on there are open Marxists who have said they favor the nationalizing of the oil industry and supporting Hamas over Israel.
I support Hamas over Israel as does (in not so many words) Pope Benedict. In fact, they had this very discussion on Catholic Radio the other day, where the announcer basically admitted what I am saying here that the indigenous Christians of Palestine (that is, the descendants of the original Christians) consider themselves Palestinians!

He was also admitting that he has a jumble of emotions he had been sorting through, being an American and only knowing the side of the story that is being presented here ...

BUT ...

He said he was going to defer to Pope Benedict on this issue and if Pope Benedict is sympathetic toward the Palestinians than we should defer to his judgement because he knows far more about the issue than most lay people do.

SURPRISED ME that I am not the only person saying this.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#19 Dec 8, 2012
http://www.fsmitha.com/h2/ch16-3.htm

Germany Recovers from the Depression


Like most other economies, Germany's economy had hit bottom in 1932. Under Hitler, the strategy for recovery was largely the work of his economics minister, Hjalmar Schacht, a conservative willing to ignore free market liberalism. Schacht told a US journalist he was going to correct the excesses of capitalism and create a more stable economic system. He forbade the sending of money out of Germany. He reduced foreign trade largely to barter agreements and put strict limits on imports -- all to keep wealth within the country. Under Schacht, private industry was compelled to reinvest its profits in manufacturing approved by the state. And crucial to Germany's recovery was government spending, much of it on public works, the most visible of which was a new highway system -- the autobahn -- which the army wanted for more efficient movements within Germany. There was also an electrification program, and government investment in industry. One third of Germany's income had as its source government payments and investments -- almost three times the percentage being spent by the U.S. government. And, as in Sweden, the government debt that Schacht was creating was quickly offset by the recovery in revenues that came with the rise in the economy.

Wages and the standard of living remained relatively low for Germans, but the aim of the government was increased industrial production of non-consumer goods. Unemployment was falling, and business optimism returned. In 1935 compulsory labor service was introduced, and unemployment was reduced further as tax incentives were introduced to persuade women to leave the labor force, to return to what was considered traditional for German women: cooking, children and church attending (küche, kinder und kirche).

Re-armament (in defiance of the Paris Peace Conference) helped boost Germany's economy, and without independent trade unions, Germany could keep its wages low and it prices stable. Hitler's economy remained low in productivity, as there was little incentive, and some disincentives, to innovate -- the usual incentive for innovation being high profits, which in Germany were heavily taxed. But by 1935, Germany's farmers were prospering, and industrial production was above its 1929 level and rising rapidly.[note] German workers had the right to try their employers in special courts in order to protect themselves from abuse. Although their wages were low, German workers were working and felt more secure. Some were saying that Hitler had saved them from starvation. The German people were grateful to Hitler for his having brought economic recovery.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#21 Dec 8, 2012
Karl Monday wrote:
<quoted text>
Doing the Goebbels trick again, eh?
Stockholm Syndrome tools
1. Pope Benedict wouldn't support Catholics and Orthodox Christians who were propagandist puppets.

2. Read and learn:

http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articl...

Forgotten Christians
By ANDERS STRINDBERG • May 24, 2004

The Palestinian Christians see themselves, and are seen by their Muslim compatriots, as an integral part of the Palestinian people, and they have long been a vital part of the Palestinian struggle. As the Anglican bishop of Jerusalem, the Reverend Riah Abu al-Assal has explained,“The Arab Palestinian Christians are part and parcel of the Arab Palestinian nation. We have the same history, the same culture, the same habits and the same hopes.”

...

In fact, over the decades, many of the rank and file among the secular nationalist groups of the PLO have been Christians who have seen leftist nationalist politics as the only alternative to both Islamism and Western liberalism, the former objectionable because of its religiously exclusive nature, the latter due to what is seen by many as its inherent protection of Israel and the Zionist project.

Among the remnant communities in Palestine, most belong to the traditional Christian confessions. The largest group is Greek Orthodox, followed by Catholics (Roman, Syrian, Maronite, and Melkite), Armenian Orthodox, Anglicans, and Lutherans. There is also a small but influential Quaker presence. These communities are centered in Jerusalem, Bethlehem, Beit Jala, Beit Sahour, and Ramallah.

For them, the conflict with Israel is quite obviously not about Islamism contra enlightenment but simply about resistance against occupation. To be sure, there have been periods of tension between the Christian communities and members of the Islamist groups, yet to many Christian Palestinians the Islamist movements have emerged by default as the heroes in the conflict with Israel. Following the incremental atrophy of leftist ideals, the Islamists are seen as the only ones who are willing and able to fight the occupation. The Lebanese Hezbollah, widely seen as a nonsectarian organization that is able to cooperate with people of all faiths, is particularly admired both among the refugees in Lebanon as well as those who remain in Palestine.“We have received far more support and comfort from the Hezbollah in Lebanon than from our fellow Christians in the West,” remarked one Christian Palestinian refugee in Damascus.“I want to know, why don’t the Christians in the West do anything to help us? Are the teachings of Jesus nothing but empty slogans to them?”
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

#22 Dec 8, 2012
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/mid...

Pope Benedict XVI supports Palestinian state and criticises Israeli barrier

Pope Benedict XVI has pledged his support for the creation of a Palestinian homeland and criticised the 'tragedy' of Israel's separation barrier.

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