Gay teacher fired by Catholic school claims discrimination

Apr 23, 2013 Full story: World Magazine 1,746

Carla Hale, 59, a lesbian P.E. teacher, has filed a grievance against the diocese of the Ohio Catholic school where she worked for 19 years until administrators fired her for "violating moral law." According to The Columbus Dispatch , Hale's sexual orientation became public when an obituary for her late mother published Hale's name along with the ... (more)

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SHAWN

Wilkes Barre, PA

#1322 May 6, 2013
They cannot kill a Spook wrote:
The real problem is not.that she was FIRES for being a carpet chewer. The real problem is how passed courses RECEIVED a teaching certificate, and was hired yet cannot read.
Good thing you have the ability to spell.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1323 May 6, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
Ms. Hale was confronted regarding her immoral lifestyle.
Ms. Hale refused to repent.
Therefore, Ms. Hale was terminated per the terms of their mutual contract.
Choices have consequences.
Eye witness?

She was asked to repent?

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1324 May 6, 2013
-tip- wrote:
<quoted text>
You have no authority to rebuke me.
Your words reveal that you are no "brother" of mine.
And the "gospel of hatred" to which you refer is articulated in the Holy Scriptures: homosexual behaviors are sinful.
Should I forgive you?

You have not acknowledged your error nor repented.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1325 May 6, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
You really should offer to defend Hale in court-you alone seem very clear on what the contract does and doesn't say, infer and imply (while the rest of us aren't, per your estimation).
Ms. Hale has an attorney who has said essentially the same things.

My knowledge of the contract comes from the relevant portions that have been posted here by people who swear that the morality clause is clear (despite not saying so) that lesbians are not to enter into quasi-marital couplings, or they will be summarily fired. I have challenged those in the know (according to their own estimation) to bring forth the words which make this clear, but so far, none have been able to.

I absolutely get that many here believe that people who are gay are by their very nature sinful and to be avoided.

The question is how far, legally, a church-run school can go in denying such people employment based on that belief.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1326 May 6, 2013
-Clayton Bigsby wrote:
<quoted text>Stop lying, Reader:
Hale signed a morality clause as part of her contract, affirming that “Catholic school personnel are expected to be examples of moral behavior and professionalism,” and acknowledging her employment could be terminated for “immorality” or “serious unethical conduct.” Because the Roman Catholic Church holds homosexual behavior to be gravely immoral, the Diocese of Columbus found her to be in violation of her contract, and fired her.
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/columbus-bis...
You are reading in a good many words that do not appear in the contract.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1327 May 6, 2013
-Clayton Bigsby wrote:
<quoted text>You ought to see her on the George Zimmerman threads...you can see the spittle flying as she tells you how he should be executed for killing one of her pets.
Speaking of prevarication ...

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1328 May 6, 2013
Zoe wrote:
<quoted text>
It didn't, she has been terminated and needs to move on. This goes for the rest of you liberal knuckleheads!
The accusation currently is that her firing was in violation of a city ordinance banning employment discrimination based on sexuality.

Since: Apr 13

Hilliard, OH

#1329 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
You are reading in a good many words that do not appear in the contract.
YOU haven't seen the contract, either.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#1330 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Ms. Hale has an attorney who has said essentially the same things.
My knowledge of the contract comes from the relevant portions that have been posted here by people who swear that the morality clause is clear (despite not saying so) that lesbians are not to enter into quasi-marital couplings, or they will be summarily fired. I have challenged those in the know (according to their own estimation) to bring forth the words which make this clear, but so far, none have been able to.
I absolutely get that many here believe that people who are gay are by their very nature sinful and to be avoided.
The question is how far, legally, a church-run school can go in denying such people employment based on that belief.
So, you haven't read the contract.

You sure post like you have. You post as if you wrote it.

To my knowledge, neither Hale nor her attorney have denied the facts presented thus far.

SCOTUS heard a case very similar to this (Tabor) last year-the religious school won 9-0. The City of Columbus can or cannot exempt religious employers, but federal protections trump Columbus city statutes.

Since: Apr 13

Hilliard, OH

#1331 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Speaking of prevarication ...
No, Reader...the Zimmerman threads are full of your absolute BS. You spew as if you were an eyewitness to an event that didn't take place the way you desperately hope it did.
HUmm

Westerville, OH

#1332 May 6, 2013
If she wins her case does this mean my drunk uncle can be hired back to teach after being fired years ago for being drunk on the job?

Makes you wonder?
If you sign a contract you should know what you are signing, for a teacher she doesn't seem to be to well educated on that part.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1333 May 6, 2013
-Clayton Bigsby wrote:
<quoted text>YOU haven't seen the contract, either.
I saw the portion that you posted.

And I have asked multiple times for the wording that people seem convinced is there that she "clearly" agreed to.

I await enlightenment.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1334 May 6, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
So, you haven't read the contract.
You sure post like you have. You post as if you wrote it.
To my knowledge, neither Hale nor her attorney have denied the facts presented thus far.
SCOTUS heard a case very similar to this (Tabor) last year-the religious school won 9-0. The City of Columbus can or cannot exempt religious employers, but federal protections trump Columbus city statutes.
Hannah-Tabor will not provide the Diocese with much protection. The grounds on which it was decided were that the teacher in question (let go rather than provide disability accommodations that would have otherwise been required under the ADA) was a "called" teacher. That is, she had been provided with religious instruction beyond her content area certification and as a part of her job was required to provide instruction in the religious area. Using this criteria, the court ruled that she was included in the ministerial exemption and therefore not protected under ADA.

If such criteria were to be applied in this case, Ms. Hale would NOT fall under the ministerial exemption because she is not a "called" arm of the clergy and her instruction was limited to physical education.

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1335 May 6, 2013
-Clayton Bigsby wrote:
<quoted text>No, Reader...the Zimmerman threads are full of your absolute BS. You spew as if you were an eyewitness to an event that didn't take place the way you desperately hope it did.
Ah, now you are changing the allegation. You clearly stated above that I was clamoring for Zimmerman's execution.

Perhaps you would care to offer up a specific citation.

And I will be happy to back up anything factual statement that I have made about the Zimmerman case by providing source material.
Zoe

Circleville, OH

#1336 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
The accusation currently is that her firing was in violation of a city ordinance banning employment discrimination based on sexuality.
It does not matter! The church can afford litigation, can she? All of you will have to donate to her! By the way, the City of Columbus, is a cesspool of really stupid folks!

“Don't trust the internet!”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#1337 May 6, 2013
Zoe wrote:
<quoted text>
It does not matter! The church can afford litigation, can she? All of you will have to donate to her! By the way, the City of Columbus, is a cesspool of really stupid folks!
Zoe--Circleville's rep throughout Topix is not that of great intellect. Just sayin'.

I will not be donating to the Catholic church, as I am not Catholic, I have my own denomination to donate to.

But, I would hasten to point out that those who do give like to think that their dollars are all going to benevolent causes. When they begin to suspect that their benevolence is being siphoned off to pay for litigation they start to look for other ways to act on their charitable inclinations. This is/was an issue throughout the pedophilic priest scandals and at least for some is likely to become an issue in this case. The Watterson alumni who have been organizing realize this area of vulterability and have been capitalizing on it.

I would suspect that if the Church is willing to make this a test case for the city ordinance, that they have the bucks and litigators to be able to do so--assuming the Supremes are willing to hear it (they are allowed to say no). However, due to the nature of the case, it is pretty likely that there will be folks lined up on the opposite side just as willing to go after a Supreme Court ruling.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#1338 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Hannah-Tabor will not provide the Diocese with much protection. The grounds on which it was decided were that the teacher in question (let go rather than provide disability accommodations that would have otherwise been required under the ADA) was a "called" teacher. That is, she had been provided with religious instruction beyond her content area certification and as a part of her job was required to provide instruction in the religious area. Using this criteria, the court ruled that she was included in the ministerial exemption and therefore not protected under ADA.
If such criteria were to be applied in this case, Ms. Hale would NOT fall under the ministerial exemption because she is not a "called" arm of the clergy and her instruction was limited to physical education.
The whole school is an extension of Catholic ministry. The Church RUNS the school-thus the teachers are an extension of Catholic ministry by virtue of their being there in their role as teacher.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#1339 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Hannah-Tabor will not provide the Diocese with much protection. The grounds on which it was decided were that the teacher in question (let go rather than provide disability accommodations that would have otherwise been required under the ADA) was a "called" teacher. That is, she had been provided with religious instruction beyond her content area certification and as a part of her job was required to provide instruction in the religious area. Using this criteria, the court ruled that she was included in the ministerial exemption and therefore not protected under ADA.
If such criteria were to be applied in this case, Ms. Hale would NOT fall under the ministerial exemption because she is not a "called" arm of the clergy and her instruction was limited to physical education.
Here's Watterston's Mission Statement:

"Bishop Watterson High School Mission Statement - Restore all things in Christ by educating in the Catholic tradition through prayer, service and study."

http://www.bishopwatterson.com/about/mission

Not terribly ambiguous.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#1340 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Zoe--Circleville's rep throughout Topix is not that of great intellect. Just sayin'.
I will not be donating to the Catholic church, as I am not Catholic, I have my own denomination to donate to.
But, I would hasten to point out that those who do give like to think that their dollars are all going to benevolent causes. When they begin to suspect that their benevolence is being siphoned off to pay for litigation they start to look for other ways to act on their charitable inclinations. This is/was an issue throughout the pedophilic priest scandals and at least for some is likely to become an issue in this case. The Watterson alumni who have been organizing realize this area of vulterability and have been capitalizing on it.
I would suspect that if the Church is willing to make this a test case for the city ordinance, that they have the bucks and litigators to be able to do so--assuming the Supremes are willing to hear it (they are allowed to say no). However, due to the nature of the case, it is pretty likely that there will be folks lined up on the opposite side just as willing to go after a Supreme Court ruling.
Hale, unfortunately, won't be coming to court with clean hands on this. She did violate the contract. She hasn't denied that (to my knowledge). She wants a post facto remedy.

Since: Apr 13

Hilliard, OH

#1341 May 6, 2013
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah, now you are changing the allegation. You clearly stated above that I was clamoring for Zimmerman's execution.
Perhaps you would care to offer up a specific citation.
And I will be happy to back up anything factual statement that I have made about the Zimmerman case by providing source material.
You'd love to see him dead, Reader. You all but say it in your hate-filled posts on the subject.

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