New Pope denounces Capitalism...Right...

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#166 Dec 9, 2013
No economic system except Capitalism allows an individual the opportunity for upward mobility based on their desire to achieve it.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#167 Dec 9, 2013
dpx55 wrote:
No economic system except Capitalism allows an individual the opportunity for upward mobility based on their desire to achieve it.
Nor does any other system allow for charity.
Duke for Mayor

Canton, OH

#168 Dec 9, 2013
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
Nor does any other system allow for charity.
That's simply not true Tony.

woof

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#169 Dec 9, 2013
Duke for Mayor wrote:
<quoted text>
That's simply not true Tony.
woof
You are correct, there was charity under mercantilism, and primitive economies. But under communism, it was a crime.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#170 Dec 9, 2013
Duke for Mayor wrote:
<quoted text>
That's simply not true Tony.
woof
yes it is. Whether donating "money" or something else, it's capital.

“Meh.”

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#171 Dec 10, 2013
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
yes it is. Whether donating "money" or something else, it's capital.
Capital still exists in real world non-capitalist systems but is managed and distributed by different means. In most mainstream non-capitalist working systems the stress is placed on production for use, rather than the accumulation of capital though capital remains quite prominent as a construct.

Are you saying that there's no charity or capital in the economic concept of some pure non-capitalist systems? Because this would become a fiddly but interesting question to look at! I wonder if through a purely Marxist construct that the process through which capital is distributed according to needs would erode the core construct of what capital means within that working construct. The idea of charity would be removed first, in an abstract Marxist system do to need based distribution, but I'm wonderfully interested in the question of if the means and products of production would still be readily identifiable in a system where there isn't multi-level exchange.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#172 Dec 10, 2013
tranpsosition wrote:
<quoted text>
Capital still exists in real world non-capitalist systems but is managed and distributed by different means. In most mainstream non-capitalist working systems the stress is placed on production for use, rather than the accumulation of capital though capital remains quite prominent as a construct.
Are you saying that there's no charity or capital in the economic concept of some pure non-capitalist systems?
I'm saying that without capital (whether it be money or goods or the fruits of one's labor) there cannot be charity. You can't give what you don't have (unless you're a Democrat, that is).
Reality Speaks

Columbus, OH

#173 Dec 10, 2013
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm saying that without capital (whether it be money or goods or the fruits of one's labor) there cannot be charity. You can't give what you don't have (unless you're a Democrat, that is).
you made me laugh

your above statement is 100% accurate. There is no disputing it either.

The thread just ended because you said it all in 1 sentence.

“Meh.”

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#174 Dec 10, 2013
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm saying that without capital (whether it be money or goods or the fruits of one's labor) there cannot be charity. You can't give what you don't have (unless you're a Democrat, that is).
You're talking about conceptual Marxist economic constructs, rather than real world systems, then?
Reality Speaks

Columbus, OH

#175 Dec 10, 2013
dpx55 wrote:
No economic system except Capitalism allows an individual the opportunity for upward mobility based on their desire to achieve it.
fact check with lengthly list of slave descendants earning in the millions annually.

above list is larger than millionaire CEO's of all color combined.

the individuals desire to earn everything, is determining factor of their life and future.

Your post is 100% accurate.

Since: Nov 13

Location hidden

#176 Dec 10, 2013
TonyD2 wrote:
<quoted text>
Nor does any other system allow for charity.
And that is why it is said that the US is the greatest country in the world! What would we become if children with distended bellies begged on the sidewalk in front of Wall Street. Or people walked right over an abandoned baby screaming in the gutter as if it's not there. Is that what the hard right would like to see? No social safety net whatsoever? 100% dog- eat- dog individualism? I'd say no more poor or working poor fight in US wars, not one red penny be taken from the poor in taxes of any kind, and religious organizations be taxed 75% of their "profits" and given to the destitute, because they're not feeding, housing, or clothing the mass majority of poor people as they are called by Jesus to do.
We have a social safety net system because the religious organizations cannot and will not take action to help poor and suffering people on a massive level from the tithes and offerings of their members. Someone like you would strongly protest that ideology. The money should continue to support the private jets,$1,000 dollar suits,$3.5 million dollar mansions,$50,000 dollar cars, and so- called missionary trips to preach dependence on the great white god in the sky, while they fly back to the US in private jets and eat a steak and lobster dinner.

Since: Nov 13

Location hidden

#177 Dec 10, 2013
dpx55 wrote:
No economic system except Capitalism allows an individual the opportunity for upward mobility based on their desire to achieve it.
African Americans are being destroyed by this concept of individualism. That is a foreign concept to people who lived communally for thousands of years. We see Black individuals who amass great wealth but do nothing to re-educate a young urban mind to see himself or herself, more than what they're exexpected in society to be. We have multimillion dollar rappers who care shitless about a young urban male heading into trouble and prison. God did not allow these people wealth just to become selfish capitalist individuals that some whites are taught to be. Oprah, and many other Chicago wealthy Blacks are useless in that city because of that individualist ideology. It's the same for the Black conservatives...I got mine phuck the rest of ya.

“Tenured Marxist Radical”

Since: Jan 13

Ivy League-ISIS

#178 Dec 10, 2013
wiseAfricanAmerican wrote:
<quoted text>private jets and eat a steak and lobster dinner.
You do realize people are employed:

-building the private jets
-flying the private jets
-maintaining the private jets
-farming the cows
-slaughtering the cows
-cooking the steak
-fishing the lobster

As in, working class individuals.

Of course, socialists like you add more incentives by the day for the automation of everything listed above.
Conservative

Dayton, OH

#179 Dec 10, 2013
Female wrote:
<quoted text> When you speak of the poor in our county and what all they have, at the same time you want all these things taken away. Most don't care if they beg in the streets along w/ their families.
I do not want things taken from anyone.

What I don't want is money taken from me to give to someone else. I want those who have most of the things I have that declare themselves impoverished to stop receiving handouts.

I'd rather they get off their butt and panhandle than sit and expect you and I to support them. Maybe a little shame would be a motivator.

Our children pay more attention to the example we set rather than the advice we give.

obamacare is ruining 85% of the policies to help 15%. Did that make sense to you? The latest is that uninsured are not flocking to sign up either.

We'll go down that road as we have with every of lame policy and will accomplish nothing.

What do you call it when someone takes from you to benefit themselves?

Robbery comes to mind.
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#180 Dec 10, 2013
Reality Speaks wrote:
<quoted text>
you made me laugh
your above statement is 100% accurate. There is no disputing it either.
The thread just ended because you said it all in 1 sentence.
Two sentences.
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#181 Dec 10, 2013
Conservative wrote:
<quoted text>
I do not want things taken from anyone.
What I don't want is money taken from me to give to someone else. I want those who have most of the things I have that declare themselves impoverished to stop receiving handouts.
I'd rather they get off their butt and panhandle than sit and expect you and I to support them. Maybe a little shame would be a motivator.
Our children pay more attention to the example we set rather than the advice we give.
obamacare is ruining 85% of the policies to help 15%. Did that make sense to you? The latest is that uninsured are not flocking to sign up either.
We'll go down that road as we have with every of lame policy and will accomplish nothing.
What do you call it when someone takes from you to benefit themselves?
Robbery comes to mind.
Simple theft. Not robbery.
Conservative

Dayton, OH

#182 Dec 10, 2013
Where is poll that shows the uninsured want health care insurance. They receive Health Care

How exactly are the uninsured?

Homeless, Drug Addicts, Alcoholics, Spouses working part-time jobs that are on their spouses health care insurance, Teens, people who can't afford it but magically can now.

This law should and I believe covers pre-existing and thiks law was passed 1997.

HIPAA Public Law 104-191 section 2742
Conservative

Dayton, OH

#183 Dec 10, 2013
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
Simple theft. Not robbery.
My contribution to the poor is not voluntary, it's by force thus robbery
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#184 Dec 10, 2013
Conservative wrote:
<quoted text>
My contribution to the poor is not voluntary, it's by force thus robbery
No taking by theft is voluntary. If it were, it wouldn't be theft.

“Ludibrium est onus genio”

Since: Dec 11

Planet Earth

#185 Dec 10, 2013
tranpsosition wrote:
<quoted text>
You're talking about conceptual Marxist economic constructs, rather than real world systems, then?
I'm talking about real life... you can't give anything to anybody unless you have it (or take it from someone else) to give. In the case of taking it from someone else, I would submit that isn't even REALLY charity, because charity implies a VOLUNTARY giving.

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