created by: Enzyte Bob | Mar 27, 2012

Columbus, OH

18 votes

If ObamaCare unconstitutional, who benefits most?

Click on an option to vote

  • Barry Soetoro (public forgets it ever happened)
  • Barry Soetoro (will run against the Supreme Court)
  • Mitt Romney (public forgets about RomneyCare)
  • Mitt Romney (public still angry about ObamaCare)
  • None of the Above.
Comments
21 - 40 of 70 Comments Last updated Mar 6, 2013
The Author

Grove City, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#22
Mar 28, 2012
 

Judged:

1

1

George Jefferson Hilliard wrote:
It's toast, folks!
Justices poised to strike down entire healthcare law
By David G. Savage
March 28, 2012, 8:35 a.m.
Reporting from Washington—
The Supreme Court's conservative justices said Wednesday they are prepared to strike down President Obama’s healthcare law entirely.
Picking up where they left off Tuesday, the conservatives said they thought a decision striking down the law's controversial individual mandate to purchase health insurance means the whole statute should fall with it.
The court’s conservatives sounded as though they had determined for themselves that the 2,700-page measure must be declared unconstitutional.
"One way or another, Congress will have to revisit it in toto," said Justice Antonin Scalia.
Agreeing, Justice Anthony Kennedy said it would be an "extreme proposition" to allow the various insurance regulations to stand after the mandate was struck down.
Meanwhile, the court's liberal justices argued for restraint. Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg said the court should do a "salvage job," not undertake a “wrecking operation." But she looked to be out-voted.
Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. and Justice Samuel A. Alito Jr. said they shared the view of Scalia and Kennedy that the law should stand or fall in total. Along with Justice Clarence Thomas, they would have a majority to strike down the entire statute as unconstitutional.
http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-ju...
You do know they won't actually decide until sometime later, right? They are just ruminating out loud right now.

If your crystal ball is so good, who's gonna win next year's Super Bowl?
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#23
Mar 28, 2012
 
The Author wrote:
<quoted text>
You do know they won't actually decide until sometime later, right? They are just ruminating out loud right now.
If your crystal ball is so good, who's gonna win next year's Super Bowl?
You also know that oral arguments are a very minor part of this whole exercise. This is more of an exercise in brief writing and legal justification. This will be judged by what they think of the writings that have been submitted on behalf of each of the interested parties.

“Accept No Substitutes”

Since: Oct 11

Cardington, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#24
Mar 28, 2012
 

Judged:

1

1

The Author wrote:
<quoted text>
You do know they won't actually decide until sometime later, right? They are just ruminating out loud right now.
If your crystal ball is so good, who's gonna win next year's Super Bowl?
I know all about June. These comments coming from the justices, especially Kennedy, are quite telling. Add the amateurish high school debate performance by the solicitor general and it certainly looks grim for Obama.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#25
Mar 28, 2012
 
FKA Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
I wouldn't place any bets either way at this point, despite the way things looked in court today.
What do you think of the possibility of a narrowly tailored finding? In other words, tossing the individual mandate but only that? Seems as though that would toss it back to Congress. They would have to do something (Congressional inertia was one of the topics of discussion today)--because the elimination of pre-existing conditions really rests on being able to bring in all the young, healthy gamblers.
From what I've been reading, Obama cut so many deals to get the various crony capitalists on board, that this thing will be unworkable without the mandate. Big PHARMA took an $80 billion haircut on the premise that with everybody paying into the system, the market would be bigger and they would end up in the same place, for example. Without confiscating more premiums, this becomes unworkable to the tune of billions.

I predict it either all goes or it all stays for this reason via, like you said, narrowly tailored finding. Since stare decisis (legal precedent) underpins the entire legal system, they would find doing this just as distasteful as they find overruling Congress on something this big.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#26
Mar 28, 2012
 

Judged:

1

George Jefferson Hilliard wrote:
<quoted text>I know all about June. These comments coming from the justices, especially Kennedy, are quite telling. Add the amateurish high school debate performance by the solicitor general and it certainly looks grim for Obama.
Again, please see the post right before yours. This is a "Paper Chase" exercise. The oral arguments, though obviously not helpful, are still going to be a small part of this exercise. The justices have read the briefs, their law clerks have reviewed the legal precedent. The judges have already formed their opinions by now.

I think where this really hurts the government is that if the swing vote judge wanted to err on the side of caution, the government didn't give them anything they could use to justify upholding the law.

Again, Con Law was my weakest subject (don't have the ability to read 100 page nightly reading assignments - I'm a talker, not a reader), so I could be dead wrong on this.
The Author

Grove City, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#27
Mar 28, 2012
 

Judged:

1

George Jefferson Hilliard wrote:
<quoted text>I know all about June. These comments coming from the justices, especially Kennedy, are quite telling. Add the amateurish high school debate performance by the solicitor general and it certainly looks grim for Obama.
And you may be right. But I'm not a betting person, I'll wait and see what the actual decision is. I've seen too many times where cases lean one way during arguments and completely go the other way in the decision. No sure thing is all I'm saying.
Enzyte Bob

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#28
Mar 28, 2012
 
The Author wrote:
<quoted text>
And you may be right. But I'm not a betting person, I'll wait and see what the actual decision is. I've seen too many times where cases lean one way during arguments and completely go the other way in the decision. No sure thing is all I'm saying.
I took a free continuing education class on this topic. I didn't get much out of it other than the fact that as complicated as the whole system now is, you may as well be designing new flavors of derivatives or building the next space shuttle. Which goes back to why all these health care schemes are failures. Government and unions want to do things in a rule-based manner. This ties the hands of natural innovation. Case in point: Yesterday's stories on the PUCO mandating that phone companies continue to offer land lines. This is like mandating that people still build horse carriages, or rotary phones, or typewriters. This is why these things can never work.

K.I.S.S. is how you make things cheaper and affordable.

This is also why
The Author

Grove City, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#29
Mar 28, 2012
 
Enzyte Bob wrote:
<quoted text>
I took a free continuing education class on this topic. I didn't get much out of it other than the fact that as complicated as the whole system now is, you may as well be designing new flavors of derivatives or building the next space shuttle. Which goes back to why all these health care schemes are failures. Government and unions want to do things in a rule-based manner. This ties the hands of natural innovation. Case in point: Yesterday's stories on the PUCO mandating that phone companies continue to offer land lines. This is like mandating that people still build horse carriages, or rotary phones, or typewriters. This is why these things can never work.
K.I.S.S. is how you make things cheaper and affordable.
This is also why
I suppose we could go back to paying doctors with chickens or bushels of corn or oats...or a bottle of single malt or case of beer. One thing we gotta get rid of is people who expect to live forever and sue if the doc makes an honest mistake. This is NOT an endorsement for tort reform, if a doctor or surgeon is clearly at fault, they should pay through the nose. But judges need the power to toss frivolous crap, and impose fines on those who bring those cases. One time I asked my doc about a new test, I trust him implicitly, but because I asked about it, he ordered it up as a reflex because he didn't want to be held liable. Now I would say, just tell me about it and if it doesn't make sense, don't do it. If I get told I'm terminal, I'll do some reasonable things, but I'm not gonna demand stuff that'll give me two more weeks at a cost of half a million, that's just insane.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#30
Mar 28, 2012
 
George Jefferson Hilliard wrote:
<quoted text>I know all about June. These comments coming from the justices, especially Kennedy, are quite telling. Add the amateurish high school debate performance by the solicitor general and it certainly looks grim for Obama.
I think that was the Idea to begin with by Socicitor General because in the news people said he is alot better than how he handled in front of the SCOTUS.
Reality Speaks

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#31
Mar 29, 2012
 

Judged:

2

2

1

FKA Reader wrote:
None of the above.
The problem of unaffordable and inaccessible health care will remain unabated. The dream of a bipartisan solution will fade. In 20 more years we may have another scramble at solving the problem--which by then will impact the cost of every American product, the education of our children, our safety from public health threats and on and one.
hey you O brilliant one!

we already have free healthcare for; and have had since you have been on this earth.

the solution is to pay.....that is correct pay.....for any service of any kind you utilize.

in case of healthcare....just go the the hospital.

someone so brilliant as you would ask....what if I can't afford to get to the hospital?

we then will need to provide free taxi's for all to be fair.

all you ever do is make excuses for your failures; and spin them.
d-pants

United States

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#32
Feb 17, 2013
 
Reality Speaks wrote:
<quoted text>
hey you O brilliant one!
we already have free healthcare for; and have had since you have been on this earth.
the solution is to pay.....that is correct pay.....for any service of any kind you utilize.
in case of healthcare....just go the the hospital.
someone so brilliant as you would ask....what if I can't afford to get to the hospital?
we then will need to provide free taxi's for all to be fair.
all you ever do is make excuses for your failures; and spin them.
funny that's what insurance companies say too. So why have a bill written by them and pushed through the courts?
General Franco of Spain

Podgorica, Montenegro

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#34
Feb 17, 2013
 
Barack Hussein Obama is Communist Dictatot who want to make Usa a slave labor Gulag camp.
He want to exterminate everyone who is patriotic and good person..and his Boss is Soros.
Parnell Ribberts

Dayton, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#35
Feb 18, 2013
 
Diversity people are the main beneficiaries of ObamaCare:

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/11/06/11...

"1) Health care costs. Women tend to have higher medical expenses than men do, and insurers often practice “gender rating” to charge women more than men for the exact same health services. Forty three percent of women report that high costs have led them to skip some of the health care services they need. Under Obamacare, gender rating will be illegal and a wide range of important preventative health services for women — such as contraceptive services, cancer screenings, STI testing and counseling, and annual check-ups — will be covered at no additional cost. Issues of gender-based discrepancies in health care costs could reemerge, however, if the health reform law is repealed.

5) Funding for Planned Parenthood. Republican lawmakers have been attempting to defund Planned Parenthood’s health clinics on a state level, denying low-income women access to critical preventative health services in the GOP’s crusade against abortion services. Romney has confirmed his desire to defund Planned Parenthood on a national level, going so far as to promise that he will “immediately” take action to “remove funding” for the women’s health organization.

6) State-level abortion legislation. In several states, voters will decide on proposed abortion restrictions on their ballots today. In Florida, Amendment 6 seeks to ban abortion coverage under state insurance plans. If LR 120 passes in Montana, it would make it the 38th state to instate a parental notification law for teenagers seeking abortions. This year, 76 different abortion restrictions have been approved by at least one legislative chamber on a state level, and nine have been enacted so far.

7) Maternity care. Coverage for maternity care has typically been excluded from insurance plans — but if Obamacare remains in place, the health reform law will guarantee that about 8.7 million women have access to maternity care like prenatal doctor’s visits, emergency care during labor, and breastfeeding support. Obamacare also established the Pregnancy Assistance Fund to aid programs across the country that provide important services for low-income pregnant teens and young adults.

8) Medicaid expansion. As governors across the country debate whether to accept the optional expansion of the Medicaid program under Obamacare, women have the most to lose if states decline to expand coverage to more of their low-income resident. Women make up nearly 70 percent of all Medicaid beneficiaries, partly because women are more likely than men to be poor and women tend to qualify for the program when they are new mothers. Non-elderly women make up 10 million of the 15 million low-income Americans who are eligible for the Medicaid expansion that Republican governors in states like Florida and Texas are currently blocking."
d-pants

United States

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#36
Feb 20, 2013
 
My premiums are more for the same coverage. The corporation I work for gave me a small raise to make up for that. After the tax increase I take home less. I only make roughly 40,000 a year. Gas is skyrocketing, wich in turn inflates the dollar. The corporation I work for is enjoying the new tax loopholes put into the fiscal cliff deal that president obama eagerly signed. So much for the campaign promise of closing some of those loopholes. I will sign an impeachment petition if he lowers the corporate tax rate.
Wait what

Dublin, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#37
Feb 20, 2013
 
Parnell Ribberts wrote:
Diversity people are the main beneficiaries of ObamaCare:
http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/11/06/11...
"1) Health care costs. Women tend to have higher medical expenses than men do, and insurers often practice “gender rating” to charge women more than men for the exact same health services. Forty three percent of women report that high costs have led them to skip some of the health care services they need. Under Obamacare, gender rating will be illegal and a wide range of important preventative health services for women — such as contraceptive services, cancer screenings, STI testing and counseling, and annual check-ups — will be covered at no additional cost. Issues of gender-based discrepancies in health care costs could reemerge, however, if the health reform law is repealed.
5) Funding for Planned Parenthood. Republican lawmakers have been attempting to defund Planned Parenthood’s health clinics on a state level, denying low-income women access to critical preventative health services in the GOP’s crusade against abortion services. Romney has confirmed his desire to defund Planned Parenthood on a national level, going so far as to promise that he will “immediately” take action to “remove funding” for the women’s health organization.
6) State-level abortion legislation. In several states, voters will decide on proposed abortion restrictions on their ballots today. In Florida, Amendment 6 seeks to ban abortion coverage under state insurance plans. If LR 120 passes in Montana, it would make it the 38th state to instate a parental notification law for teenagers seeking abortions. This year, 76 different abortion restrictions have been approved by at least one legislative chamber on a state level, and nine have been enacted so far.
7) Maternity care. Coverage for maternity care has typically been excluded from insurance plans — but if Obamacare remains in place, the health reform law will guarantee that about 8.7 million women have access to maternity care like prenatal doctor’s visits, emergency care during labor, and breastfeeding support. Obamacare also established the Pregnancy Assistance Fund to aid programs across the country that provide important services for low-income pregnant teens and young adults.
8) Medicaid expansion. As governors across the country debate whether to accept the optional expansion of the Medicaid program under Obamacare, women have the most to lose if states decline to expand coverage to more of their low-income resident. Women make up nearly 70 percent of all Medicaid beneficiaries, partly because women are more likely than men to be poor and women tend to qualify for the program when they are new mothers. Non-elderly women make up 10 million of the 15 million low-income Americans who are eligible for the Medicaid expansion that Republican governors in states like Florida and Texas are currently blocking."
What a joke. At first I thought it was a typo.

"Coverage for maternity care has typically been excluded from insurance plans"
d-pants

United States

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#38
Feb 27, 2013
 
Parnell Ribberts wrote:
Diversity people are the main beneficiaries of ObamaCare:
http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/11/06/11...
"1) Health care costs. Women tend to have higher medical expenses than men do, and insurers often practice “gender rating” to charge women more than men for the exact same health services. Forty three percent of women report that high costs have led them to skip some of the health care services they need. Under Obamacare, gender rating will be illegal and a wide range of important preventative health services for women — such as contraceptive services, cancer screenings, STI testing and counseling, and annual check-ups — will be covered at no additional cost. Issues of gender-based discrepancies in health care costs could reemerge, however, if the health reform law is repealed.
5) Funding for Planned Parenthood. Republican lawmakers have been attempting to defund Planned Parenthood’s health clinics on a state level, denying low-income women access to critical preventative health services in the GOP’s crusade against abortion services. Romney has confirmed his desire to defund Planned Parenthood on a national level, going so far as to promise that he will “immediately” take action to “remove funding” for the women’s health organization.
6) State-level abortion legislation. In several states, voters will decide on proposed abortion restrictions on their ballots today. In Florida, Amendment 6 seeks to ban abortion coverage under state insurance plans. If LR 120 passes in Montana, it would make it the 38th state to instate a parental notification law for teenagers seeking abortions. This year, 76 different abortion restrictions have been approved by at least one legislative chamber on a state level, and nine have been enacted so far.
7) Maternity care. Coverage for maternity care has typically been excluded from insurance plans — but if Obamacare remains in place, the health reform law will guarantee that about 8.7 million women have access to maternity care like prenatal doctor’s visits, emergency care during labor, and breastfeeding support. Obamacare also established the Pregnancy Assistance Fund to aid programs across the country that provide important services for low-income pregnant teens and young adults.
8) Medicaid expansion. As governors across the country debate whether to accept the optional expansion of the Medicaid program under Obamacare, women have the most to lose if states decline to expand coverage to more of their low-income resident. Women make up nearly 70 percent of all Medicaid beneficiaries, partly because women are more likely than men to be poor and women tend to qualify for the program when they are new mothers. Non-elderly women make up 10 million of the 15 million low-income Americans who are eligible for the Medicaid expansion that Republican governors in states like Florida and Texas are currently blocking."
its not going to be free and the bureaucrats will do worse, working with insurance and pharmy corporations to make more poor people with crappy insurance...
Reality Speaks

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#39
Feb 28, 2013
 

Judged:

2

2

2

d-pants wrote:
My premiums are more for the same coverage. The corporation I work for gave me a small raise to make up for that. After the tax increase I take home less. I only make roughly 40,000 a year. Gas is skyrocketing, wich in turn inflates the dollar. The corporation I work for is enjoying the new tax loopholes put into the fiscal cliff deal that president obama eagerly signed. So much for the campaign promise of closing some of those loopholes. I will sign an impeachment petition if he lowers the corporate tax rate.
laughing at you; and your brainwashed post.

PS: corporations pass on all costs in price of product or service they provide.

That means you are paying the corporate income tax when you purchase something.

making only 40K a year, I ask you why you hate your money?

if jobs and lower costing items is your preference, then I suggest a ZERO corporate tax rate.
The stockholders and employees already pay income tax.
d-pants

United States

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#40
Mar 4, 2013
 
I would agree that they pass the tax down in total price, but if you sparked more competition, they couldn't do that. If you are starting a new business, its kinda hard when a corporation can steal your design, produce the product in china, write off all their waste, and pay almost zero tax on what they do with it here. Hell if you want to sell YOUR OWN DESIGN at a fucn walmart you have to pay a sweedish corporation called iso millions of dollars just to put it on the shelf with a bunch of cheap crap made in god knows where.
I do metal fabrication. I've worked at a few smaller shops and one corporation. If any of the smaller shops wasted so much metal, man power, paint, etc. as the corporation I work for, they would go under.
Reality Speaks

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#41
Mar 4, 2013
 
FKA Reader wrote:
None of the above.
The problem of unaffordable and inaccessible health care will remain unabated. The dream of a bipartisan solution will fade. In 20 more years we may have another scramble at solving the problem--which by then will impact the cost of every American product, the education of our children, our safety from public health threats and on and one.
you are insane....seek help
Reality Speaks

Columbus, OH

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#42
Mar 4, 2013
 
d-pants wrote:
I would agree that they pass the tax down in total price, but if you sparked more competition, they couldn't do that. If you are starting a new business, its kinda hard when a corporation can steal your design, produce the product in china, write off all their waste, and pay almost zero tax on what they do with it here. Hell if you want to sell YOUR OWN DESIGN at a fucn walmart you have to pay a sweedish corporation called iso millions of dollars just to put it on the shelf with a bunch of cheap crap made in god knows where.
I do metal fabrication. I've worked at a few smaller shops and one corporation. If any of the smaller shops wasted so much metal, man power, paint, etc. as the corporation I work for, they would go under.
another insane clueless comment.

go take your meds.

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

Type in your comments below
Name
(appears on your post)
Comments
Characters left: 4000
Type the numbers you see in the image on the right:

Please note by clicking on "Post Comment" you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

•••
•••
•••
•••

Columbus Jobs

•••
Enter and win $5000
•••
•••

Columbus People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

•••

Columbus News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in Columbus
•••

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]
•••