That's Indoctrination!

[Wait what]

Kemosahbe wrote:

<quoted text>
Only I am on Topix, not my family. Anything about my family is irrelevant and none of your effing business. My apology was to notlocal, if she had been registered at the time I would have sent her a private message, but in any case again is none of your effing business. I said to her, people out here had picked on my wife, nowhere in that sentence did I say whether it was based on any disability she may or may not have. As I have said before, you need a refresher in reading comprehension. If I have no cred with you, then don't respond.

You made up personal stories in part to see how gullible people were - your own words. There is nothing you can say that will remove you from that. I take disabilities very seriously, and I had great compassion for your situation - until.

[TonyD2]

Hugh Victor Thompson III wrote:

<quoted text>Tax dollars pay for all of them. Oaths to God are sworn in courtrooms. A prayer is said everyday in the state legislature and the US Congress.

Public venues with a specific purpose can be limited to that purpose. Violating such can result in a disorderly conduct charge at the least.

[Hugh Victor Thompson III]

TonyD2 wrote:

<quoted text>
Public venues with a specific purpose can be limited to that purpose. Violating such can result in a disorderly conduct charge at the least.

Aside from their obvious use as venues for public education of children, public schools are also used as:

Election polling sites
Evacuation centers
Temporary places of worship
Sports venues
Community meeting facilities
Scout troop venues

[FKA Reader]

notlocal wrote:

<quoted text>
The play was not being presented to a group of school children. The school was 'lending' it's autorium to the church to put on the play for whomever bought a ticket.
The PC nuts interceded screaming about it. The principal held his ground and told the paster to use the autorium nayway.
It was the pastor's decision to decline and take the prinicipal out of the controversy...just end the controversy altogether. Which we have to stop doing.
On the other end of the spectrum, DHS sepnt $35 million tax dollars making a film depicting an invasion of 'zombies' to a small town and how their agents would react to the undead.

Ah, so it wasn't "PC nuts" who forced the decision, after all. If the church was merely using the facility--and this was basically within the school's policy for the use of the building by outside groups--then the principal acted appropriately. I can appreciate the minister's choice however.

But, playing around with the ethics of the situation, imagine if a local gay rights group rented the gym for a gay prom--selling tickets to anyone who cared to participate--would you feel the same about any "religious nuts" who objected?

[FKA Reader]

Hugh Victor Thompson III wrote:

<quoted text>It most certainly does. As much as the public streets are allowed to be turned into venues for Gay-fests and parades every June.

Like I said, there is a considerable body of Supreme Court cases providing much finer definitions regard which rights do and do not exist within a public school.

As an example, neither the free speech nor religious freedom rights of that guy in Mt. Vernon were violated by requiring that he teach the science curriculum rather than creationism.

Some free speech right have been upheld--Tinker for instance established the right of students to wear armbands in protest of the Vietnam War, holding that this was a non-disruptive expression of opinion. Other cases have honed this to a finer point--allowing schools to set policy that limit free speech in fairly across the board ways (such as NO words on t-shirts) but stopping at the line of prohibiting specific messages, unless they can be shown to be disruptive.

Bong hits for Jesus came in under a school policy prohibiting messages in support of illegal drugs (there the issue was that the banner was outside of the building, but at a school sponsored event--as I recall).

And by the way, those same streets that are available for Pride Parades have also been available for Klan marches, display of fetuses, religious events and expressions of ethnic or national origin. Again, I believe that the line drawn has been that the laws have to apply equally to all, rather than a guarantee that the streets be used in this way.

Not certain, but I believe that the rules my be somewhat different when it comes to places like the legislature and so forth--consideration of the right of citizens to petition the government.

[FKA Reader]

TonyD2 wrote:

<quoted text>
Schools aren't public venues in the same sense streets and sidewalks are. Courtrooms aren't either.

Thanks. You said that much more succinctly than I did.

[notlocal]

FKA Reader wrote:

<quoted text>
Ah, so it wasn't "PC nuts" who forced the decision, after all. If the church was merely using the facility--and this was basically within the school's policy for the use of the building by outside groups--then the principal acted appropriately. I can appreciate the minister's choice however.
But, playing around with the ethics of the situation, imagine if a local gay rights group rented the gym for a gay prom--selling tickets to anyone who cared to participate--would you feel the same about any "religious nuts" who objected?

If you're going to comment on one of my posts, don't twist my words, you cow.

If the PC nuts had stayed out of it, as they should, we would not even know about it, let alone discussin it.

I'm sure any gay rights group is going to get anything they want, no matter how outrageous or public.

If you're a Christian, you're a religious nut. If you're Muslim, you're a minority with any right you can dream up and probably this administration will fund it.

Example: DC Convention in Charlotte - 2012: Muslims were welcomed into the convention hall for a prayer and welcoming ceremony. Christians were denied entrance by the democrats because they held 'a different view on abortion.'

The pastor does not need your patronizing approval. And I take offense at your description of 'playing around with the ethics of the situation.'

Sell your faux intellect elsewhere. We're not buying.

[notlocal]

Hugh Victor Thompson III wrote:

<quoted text>Tax dollars pay for all of them. Oaths to God are sworn in courtrooms. A prayer is said everyday in the state legislature and the US Congress.

Last time I was in a courtroom, hands were still being placed on the bible when taking the oath of truthfulness.

[FKA Reader]

notlocal wrote:

<quoted text>
If you're going to comment on one of my posts, don't twist my words, you cow.
If the PC nuts had stayed out of it, as they should, we would not even know about it, let alone discussin it.
I'm sure any gay rights group is going to get anything they want, no matter how outrageous or public.
If you're a Christian, you're a religious nut. If you're Muslim, you're a minority with any right you can dream up and probably this administration will fund it.
Example: DC Convention in Charlotte - 2012: Muslims were welcomed into the convention hall for a prayer and welcoming ceremony. Christians were denied entrance by the democrats because they held 'a different view on abortion.'
The pastor does not need your patronizing approval. And I take offense at your description of 'playing around with the ethics of the situation.'
Sell your faux intellect elsewhere. We're not buying.

Wow--who peed in your corn flakes?

[Kemosahbe]

notlocal wrote:

<quoted text>
Last time I was in a courtroom, hands were still being placed on the bible when taking the oath of truthfulness.

If I ever have to take an oath of truthfulness in a courtroom, it will be on a copy of the U.S. Constitution.

[TonyD2]

Hugh Victor Thompson III wrote:

<quoted text>Aside from their obvious use as venues for public education of children, public schools are also used as:
Election polling sites
Evacuation centers
Temporary places of worship
Sports venues
Community meeting facilities
Scout troop venues

Yes, and disrupting any of these uses can get you thrown in the pokey. It's the disruption that is why proselytizing isn't allowed in these public venues, not the religious content of the speech.

[TonyD2]

Karl Monday wrote:

<quoted text>
If we wanted to have a Gay Pride festival at a school and rent meeting space, I'd figure they would not be able to block it if school was not being disturbed.(During the summer)

Yep. If they make the facility available for any group of non-disruptive citizens for legal use, they have to make it available to all groups of non-disruptive citizens for legal use.

[George Jefferson Hilliard]

Karl Monday wrote:

<quoted text>
AFAIK, you can have a religious club in a public school, but funding and access must not be discriminated, equal access and presumably you could promote it.
Of course it would be better if there were no public schools.

Then the rest of the world would be as dumbed down as you.

[Hugh Victor Thompson III]

George Jefferson Hilliard wrote:

<quoted text>
Then the rest of the world would be as dumbed down as you.

What's your excuse?

[George Jefferson Hilliard]

I need no excuse... I am inexcusable......

[FKA Reader]

Karl Monday wrote:

<quoted text>
AFAIK, you can have a religious club in a public school, but funding and access must not be discriminated, equal access and presumably you could promote it.
Of course it would be better if there were no public schools.

You first paragraph--pretty much sums it up, except that the school can also not be providing leadership for it. If students start such a club, it's different.

As far as your last sentence, I don't know of a single successful contemporary country on earth that does not have public education--although the forms vary widely. Do you?

[notlocal]

Kemosahbe wrote:

<quoted text>
If I ever have to take an oath of truthfulness in a courtroom, it will be on a copy of the U.S. Constitution.

As is your right. Of course, Obama's making the constitution awfully fragile.

[notlocal]

Karl Monday wrote:

<quoted text>
Typically in that scenario you just raise your right hand and "affirm"

Still using the bible here in blue, corporate DE. But if someone prefered the Koran or another document, or just to affirm, I'm sure it would not be resisted by the court.

[Boomer7]

Karl Monday wrote:

<quoted text>You really are just a fart in the mist, eh?

Nice avatar.

[Boomer7]

Karl Monday wrote:

<quoted text>Fan of the "investigator"?

I'm amazed that no one knows who he is, he does have celebrity beyond the Cleveland area, though for infamous reasons.

Not at all.
I compliment those that register and place an avatar.
Our avatars reflect our inner being.
Or some other psycho babble stuff! LOL!

One more glass of Merlot, please!