Wait for sex and marriage? Evangelicals conflicted

When Margie and Stephen Zumbrun were battling the urge to have premarital sex, a pastor counseled them to control themselves.

[Light Sensitive]

"Regnerus is not saying that premarital sex is OK. But he does suggest that abstinence has its limits, and that intensifying the message won't work. When people wait until their mid- to late 20s to marry, he writes, it's unrealistic and "battling our creator's reproductive designs" to expect them to wait that long for sex."

"I think marriage is just a fantastic institution for people who think rightly about it, have realistic ideas about it and put the requisite work into it."

Quote #1 - great point. and #2 has to be sung from the tree-tops in this country!

too much myth is placed on marriage in the US. too many people, especially females think that its a fairytale, that life falls into perfect order when they get married...

we also need to start looking a the very real fact that the children in the US are not maturing in the same way as their parents, grandparents, etc...while they may be exposed to sex much earlier, they are not developing the necessary personal boundaries (sexual and mental) that the older gens did...

studies are showing that boys are developing mentally much slower and are being quickly outpaced in academics in this nation. they are in their 30's still playing childhood games, not working full-time, living at home, etc...being coddled by a society that has elevated the worst of male behavior to a virtue...

while females are being indoctrinated younger and younger by a culture that - like no other time in our history - has made male-sexual fantasies the bar by which they should judge themselves. be it a music celeb like a spears, or miley cyrus, or any of the female celebutards who have no other talent than their good looks.

marriage is a HUGE responsibilty but we dont teach such notions as responsibilty as a culture. we've made marriage into a TV sitcom joke and now a political battleground to promote religious ideology...and our children see it as an escape route and automatic entre into maturity and adulthood...where life is all hunky dory and full of romance...

[gundee123]

Light Sensitive wrote:

"Regnerus is not saying that premarital sex is OK. But he does suggest that abstinence has its limits, and that intensifying the message won't work. When people wait until their mid- to late 20s to marry, he writes, it's unrealistic and "battling our creator's reproductive designs" to expect them to wait that long for sex."
"I think marriage is just a fantastic institution for people who think rightly about it, have realistic ideas about it and put the requisite work into it."
Quote #1 - great point. and #2 has to be sung from the tree-tops in this country!
too much myth is placed on marriage in the US. too many people, especially females think that its a fairytale, that life falls into perfect order when they get married...
we also need to start looking a the very real fact that the children in the US are not maturing in the same way as their parents, grandparents, etc...while they may be exposed to sex much earlier, they are not developing the necessary personal boundaries (sexual and mental) that the older gens did...
studies are showing that boys are developing mentally much slower and are being quickly outpaced in academics in this nation. they are in their 30's still playing childhood games, not working full-time, living at home, etc...being coddled by a society that has elevated the worst of male behavior to a virtue...
while females are being indoctrinated younger and younger by a culture that - like no other time in our history - has made male-sexual fantasies the bar by which they should judge themselves. be it a music celeb like a spears, or miley cyrus, or any of the female celebutards who have no other talent than their good looks.
marriage is a HUGE responsibilty but we dont teach such notions as responsibilty as a culture. we've made marriage into a TV sitcom joke and now a political battleground to promote religious ideology...and our children see it as an escape route and automatic entre into maturity and adulthood...where life is all hunky dory and full of romance...

Excellent post...I totally agree (smile)!

[Michael Ejercito]

The only way you are going to convince people to wait until marriage to have sex is to convince them to get married before they are 20.

There is no way people will wait until their thirties to get married AND wait until they are married to have sex.

[Light Sensitive]

agreed, sex and marriage should never be linked for any reasons...procreation diff story.

[MrsHayes]

My husband and I were virgins when we got married. I will be honest that was 3 months ago so yes we are still in the honeymoon period I admit it. He waited until he was 22. I was only 19 then but now I am 20. I know alot of people get married rashly and some will assume that is the case with us. In all honesty we were just friends for years since we were little. I was the first person he dated and he was my first boyfriend also. I realized though you had to know what you want in a person and be secure in yourself before you even dated someone. Girls my age aren't looking for a fairytale they are looking for someone to love them(in a world where a lot of abuse happens 1 out of 3 women now get abused??) and make them feel worth something in a world where we get these images of perfect women throw at us in television, magazines and etc. Men just want some peace, rest and someone they can come home to that respects them as a person. Men don't get validated much anymore. You can get married and yes it is hard you have to learn be patient and kind. You fight and stuff but you bear those things together. And it is lovely!!

P.S. I have seen my fair share of bad marriages too

[Atheist]

Hello

Every Car I've bought,, I Drove First ...

I've Driven some Cars I didn't like,, so I didn't buy them..

Quite simple !

A.

[Nettiebelle]

Light Sensitive wrote:

"Regnerus is not saying that premarital sex is OK. But he does suggest that abstinence has its limits, and that intensifying the message won't work. When people wait until their mid- to late 20s to marry, he writes, it's unrealistic and "battling our creator's reproductive designs" to expect them to wait that long for sex."
"I think marriage is just a fantastic institution for people who think rightly about it, have realistic ideas about it and put the requisite work into it."
Quote #1 - great point. and #2 has to be sung from the tree-tops in this country!
too much myth is placed on marriage in the US. too many people, especially females think that its a fairytale, that life falls into perfect order when they get married...
we also need to start looking a the very real fact that the children in the US are not maturing in the same way as their parents, grandparents, etc...while they may be exposed to sex much earlier, they are not developing the necessary personal boundaries (sexual and mental) that the older gens did...
studies are showing that boys are developing mentally much slower and are being quickly outpaced in academics in this nation. they are in their 30's still playing childhood games, not working full-time, living at home, etc...being coddled by a society that has elevated the worst of male behavior to a virtue...
while females are being indoctrinated younger and younger by a culture that - like no other time in our history - has made male-sexual fantasies the bar by which they should judge themselves. be it a music celeb like a spears, or miley cyrus, or any of the female celebutards who have no other talent than their good looks.
marriage is a HUGE responsibilty but we dont teach such notions as responsibilty as a culture. we've made marriage into a TV sitcom joke and now a political battleground to promote religious ideology...and our children see it as an escape route and automatic entre into maturity and adulthood...where life is all hunky dory and full of romance...

I fully agree with what you said about kids of today! I have experienced this in my own family, my own relatives!

[Twilight]

Light Sensitive wrote:

"Regnerus is not saying that premarital sex is OK. But he does suggest that abstinence has its limits, and that intensifying the message won't work. When people wait until their mid- to late 20s to marry, he writes, it's unrealistic and "battling our creator's reproductive designs" to expect them to wait that long for sex."
"I think marriage is just a fantastic institution for people who think rightly about it, have realistic ideas about it and put the requisite work into it."
Quote #1 - great point. and #2 has to be sung from the tree-tops in this country!
too much myth is placed on marriage in the US. too many people, especially females think that its a fairytale, that life falls into perfect order when they get married...
we also need to start looking a the very real fact that the children in the US are not maturing in the same way as their parents, grandparents, etc...while they may be exposed to sex much earlier, they are not developing the necessary personal boundaries (sexual and mental) that the older gens did...
studies are showing that boys are developing mentally much slower and are being quickly outpaced in academics in this nation. they are in their 30's still playing childhood games, not working full-time, living at home, etc...being coddled by a society that has elevated the worst of male behavior to a virtue...
while females are being indoctrinated younger and younger by a culture that - like no other time in our history - has made male-sexual fantasies the bar by which they should judge themselves. be it a music celeb like a spears, or miley cyrus, or any of the female celebutards who have no other talent than their good looks.
marriage is a HUGE responsibilty but we dont teach such notions as responsibilty as a culture. we've made marriage into a TV sitcom joke and now a political battleground to promote religious ideology...and our children see it as an escape route and automatic entre into maturity and adulthood...where life is all hunky dory and full of romance...

I do not think all kids regard marriage as an escape route and did you when you married? I am more inclined to think they think it as a test drive. Don't like it-get out of it! The positive aspect of marriage is kids raised in a two parent family are less likely to fall into proverty level. The rest I can agree with.

[McMike]

This thread cracks me up. So we're suppose to believe the one religious group who has the highest divorce rate and out-of-wedlock birthrate is going to wait for sex. That's like Sarah Palin talking about teen sex abstinence but yet her daughter is popping out puppies before she even finishes highschool. Typically hypocritical. All talk and no walk.

[S mil e r]

What gets people to do them crimes, which are nowhere in history, but which is Mt. Ewerest bones. It is politics and people need to be inside those funnels and needed. First is this women's thing, which makes the need to shut up and inside that circle, they care them victims death without any hesitations. He is just death and no one have them interest tell nothing, because they need them "spirit hole", which needs food. Then there are mans world, where they have made for example these depressions and in it destroyed almost all our life absolutely and more or less. If someone have against those powers locally or more wide, they usually play him out from work and there to odd women's system and there "kuoliaaksi", which is by Finnish "to death/did die, as/like to A". Inside that press system they just come in clothes of help to make them victims under them will and influence, from which most effective is "goz.sip" made fame etc. Under it there are just to be against them or not and handling under them common good advances level under the big frames layers. So it´s basis is pure Id and own advance like pension. There must see, that local limited agony to be in agony box by funnel evil doings usually makes already in that level those humans to crave, whose should be whit them capabilities ageings great funnel leaders (which do not give work or stage) to protect ordinary small nations people against great mights. This is really evils, the baddest, men's.. to get its power whit stupids inside them system layers. Reason, why noting good exist. Police work is there to keep that political Mt Everest bloody structured crime system inside beings in its lines under "Criminals law".

[S mil e r]

Etc.

S mil e r wrote:

What gets people to do them crimes, which are nowhere in history, but which is Mt. Ewerest bones. It is politics and people need to be inside those funnels and needed. First is this women's thing, which makes the need to shut up and inside that circle, they care them victims death without any hesitations. He is just death and no one have them interest tell nothing, because they need them "spirit hole", which needs food. Then there are mans world, where they have made for example these depressions and in it destroyed almost all our life absolutely and more or less. If someone have against those powers locally or more wide, they usually play him out from work and there to odd women's system and there "kuoliaaksi", which is by Finnish "to death/did die, as/like to A". Inside that press system they just come in clothes of help to make them victims under them will and influence, from which most effective is "goz.sip" made fame etc. Under it there are just to be against them or not and handling under them common good advances level under the big frames layers. So it´s basis is pure Id and own advance like pension. There must see, that local limited agony to be in agony box by funnel evil doings usually makes already in that level those humans to crave, whose should be whit them capabilities ageings great funnel leaders (which do not give work or stage) to protect ordinary small nations people against great mights. This is really evils, the baddest, men's.. to get its power whit stupids inside them system layers. Reason, why noting good exist. Police work is there to keep that political Mt Everest bloody structured crime system inside beings in its lines under "Criminals law".

[Thizguy]

Being a guy myself, there is something I must say about this issue:

Why is there this stupid societal rule (thanks again to the f'ing media) that a woman who has lots of flings is looked down upon whereas a man who abstains from sex is wimpy, gay and unmasculine?

How pathetic is it in our society that a man is not valued by his humanity but only by how often he uses his genitals- I totally agree that women have suffered being devalued as sex objects in our society (hell, just check out Miami if you don't believe me..)- but if you think about it, so are the men, let me explain..

Masculinity in our western culture is defined by how bestial and animal a man is with his primal animal instincts- by his genitals, NOT AT ALL by any HUMAN qualities- like sincerity, being goodhearted, courageous, giving, compassionate, reliable, having iron self-control, intelligence etc., and in my mind, it takes a REAL MAN to have the strength of mind to discipline and control his sexual urges until marriage- because, there's the old proverb that "a man who can conquer himself rather than trying to control others (ie. have full self-control over his mind and his urges) is truly strong"- and in this world today- men who are truly strong are very rare...

[Lost Sheep]

McMike wrote:

This thread cracks me up. So we're suppose to believe the one religious group who has the highest divorce rate and out-of-wedlock birthrate is going to wait for sex. That's like Sarah Palin talking about teen sex abstinence but yet her daughter is popping out puppies before she even finishes highschool. Typically hypocritical. All talk and no walk.

I have to say your right..Me and my girlfriend have known each other since 1998. Im 19 now
I remeber us both saying no sex before we get marryed..as we got older it got harder and last year we lost it. Im not proud of what we did, Im far from perfect. I love her with all my heart and I know she feels the same I think love and comitment is what matters.

[Lost Sheep]

Thizguy wrote:

Being a guy myself, there is something I must say about this issue:
Why is there this stupid societal rule (thanks again to the f'ing media) that a woman who has lots of flings is looked down upon whereas a man who abstains from sex is wimpy, gay and unmasculine?
How pathetic is it in our society that a man is not valued by his humanity but only by how often he uses his genitals- I totally agree that women have suffered being devalued as sex objects in our society (hell, just check out Miami if you don't believe me..)- but if you think about it, so are the men, let me explain..
Masculinity in our western culture is defined by how bestial and animal a man is with his primal animal instincts- by his genitals, NOT AT ALL by any HUMAN qualities- like sincerity, being goodhearted, courageous, giving, compassionate, reliable, having iron self-control, intelligence etc., and in my mind, it takes a REAL MAN to have the strength of mind to discipline and control his sexual urges until marriage- because, there's the old proverb that "a man who can conquer himself rather than trying to control others (ie. have full self-control over his mind and his urges) is truly strong"- and in this world today- men who are truly strong are very rare...

True

[The_Captain]

What's confusing me is the quote "battling our creator's reproductive designs". Why would they have to do that? I thought the "design" was supposed to be perfect?