La Sierra University slammed on evolu...

La Sierra University slammed on evolution teaching

There are 411 comments on the Examiner.com story from Nov 22, 2009, titled La Sierra University slammed on evolution teaching. In it, Examiner.com reports that:

A leading critic of La Sierra University' s teaching on evolution accuses the Seventh Day Adventist university of "bordering on outright lies" in its campaign to convince people that its biology department abides by the Genesis story of creation.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Examiner.com.

Since: Jul 09

Reno, NV

#21 Dec 4, 2009
Lay Worker wrote:
<quoted text>
EC
Maimo has the Immaculate Conception down pat!
Who made ADAM?

Was there something wrong with him before he ate the fruit?

Since: Jul 09

Reno, NV

#22 Dec 4, 2009
LW,

Because the SDA's agree with some catholic teachings doesn't make them apostate..
It just means they have some things in common..

The light shines where it will.

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#23 Dec 4, 2009
Lay Worker wrote:
<quoted text>
Why? Dont you like to agree with TRUTH?
Why ????? And you have to ask ~ WHY?

I will agree when it is Truth!

Cinders
Lay Worker

United States

#24 Dec 4, 2009
Messenger4truth wrote:
LW,
Because the SDA's agree with some catholic teachings doesn't make them apostate..
It just means they have some things in common..
The light shines where it will.
Name them, if you can!

Since: Jul 09

Reno, NV

#25 Dec 4, 2009
Messenger4truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Who made ADAM?
Was there something wrong with him before he ate the fruit?
Respect! And maybe I will answer your question?

When was the last time you prayed to JESUS?
Earthcaller

Orlando, FL

#26 Dec 4, 2009
maimonides wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, perfect. The Human Nature operated at 100% perfection.
Hebrews 5:7 contradicts you

[7]

In the days of his flesh, Jesus offered up prayers and supplications, with loud cries and tears, to him who was able to save him from death, and he was heard for his godly fear.

[8] Although he was a Son, he learned obedience through what he suffered;
[9] and being made perfect he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him

Conclusion

He was made perfect by his experience. Your point of view brings into play your erroneous concept of the Immaculate Conception that somehow Jesus was protected by Mary and that he was born again in her womb and totally protected

Hebrews 2:10 contradicts your assertion by stating that he was made perfect through suffering.

For it was fitting that he, for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through suffering.

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#27 Dec 4, 2009
Messenger4truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Respect! And maybe I will answer your question?
When was the last time you prayed to JESUS?
Do you really believe Lay Worker does not pray to Jesus ?

:-)
maimonides

Seattle, WA

#28 Dec 4, 2009
Earthcaller wrote:
<quoted text>
Hebrews 5:7 contradicts you
[7]
In the days of his flesh, Jesus offered up prayers and supplications, with loud cries and tears, to him who was able to save him from death, and he was heard for his godly fear.
[8] Although he was a Son, he learned obedience through what he suffered;
[9] and being made perfect he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him
Conclusion
He was made perfect by his experience. Your point of view brings into play your erroneous concept of the Immaculate Conception that somehow Jesus was protected by Mary and that he was born again in her womb and totally protected
Hebrews 2:10 contradicts your assertion by stating that he was made perfect through suffering.
For it was fitting that he, for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through suffering.
Jesus was a Person not a Nature Earthcaller. Mary was the Mother of a Person and not the Mother of a Nature. The Scripture explicitly states that Christ "BEING MADE PERFECT BECAME the source of Salvation"

I.E. Luke 1,35

"""And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."""END QUOTE"""" "

"That Holy Thing", Earthcaller, is Christ, as in Christ was holy at the moment of conception.
maimonides

Seattle, WA

#29 Dec 4, 2009
Eartcaller, try to focus on the reality of your situation. A Denomination funded school that teaches evolution is permissible SDA belief provided it's Theistic Evolution.

It's less difficult that an ape, by gradations became a man then it is to accept that a perfectly holy God became a sinner which was subsequently cast into hell by "Bigger God" so just accept Theistic Evolution as Adventist Doctrine evolving into a fuller understanding of God's plan.
Earthcaller

Orlando, FL

#30 Dec 4, 2009
maimonides wrote:
Eartcaller, try to focus on the reality of your situation. A Denomination funded school that teaches evolution is permissible SDA belief provided it's Theistic Evolution.
It's less difficult that an ape, by gradations became a man then it is to accept that a perfectly holy God became a sinner which was subsequently cast into hell by "Bigger God" so just accept Theistic Evolution as Adventist Doctrine evolving into a fuller understanding of God's plan.
Sorry Maimonides the SDA mainline is not my denomination. Would you care to present the matter of the evolution you are talking about from the point of view of the bible and not the dialectics of the Pharisees?
Earthcaller

Orlando, FL

#31 Dec 4, 2009
maimonides wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus was a Person not a Nature Earthcaller. Mary was the Mother of a Person and not the Mother of a Nature. The Scripture explicitly states that Christ "BEING MADE PERFECT BECAME the source of Salvation"
I.E. Luke 1,35
"""And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."""END QUOTE"""" "
"That Holy Thing", Earthcaller, is Christ, as in Christ was holy at the moment of conception.
Keep in mind that Holy means set apart for special use. We can say that Jesus was Holy because he loved righteousness from eternity not from the womb of Mary. Also keep in mind what is stated in Hebrews regarding his taking on our human nature.

Hebrews 2:
[17] Therefore he had to be made like his brethren in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make expiation for the sins of the people.

conclusion 1

did you catch that phrase (Therefore he had to be made like his bretheren in every respect).

conclusion 2

So the protection in the womb of Mary theory is blown to pieces by what is stated clearly in Hebrews. The false doctrine of the Immaculate C teaches that Mary out of all humans was born with a sinless nature.
maimonides

Seattle, WA

#32 Dec 5, 2009
Earthcaller wrote:
<quoted text>
Keep in mind that Holy means set apart for special use. We can say that Jesus was Holy because he loved righteousness from eternity not from the womb of Mary. Also keep in mind what is stated in Hebrews regarding his taking on our human nature.
Hebrews 2:
[17] Therefore he had to be made like his brethren in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make expiation for the sins of the people.
conclusion 1
did you catch that phrase (Therefore he had to be made like his bretheren in every respect).
conclusion 2
So the protection in the womb of Mary theory is blown to pieces by what is stated clearly in Hebrews. The false doctrine of the Immaculate C teaches that Mary out of all humans was born with a sinless nature.
1st,
an Adventist is an Adventist no matter the flavor they happen to come in. A Jehovah's Witness or Christadelphian is as much an Adventist as a "Seventh-day" Adventist is so you need not waste time in attempts to distinguish yourself from your brethren.

In your descriptive of Mary you failed to mention that her condition was "an act of God".

2nd,
In your description of Jesus you failed to mention that He was made in all ways like us "APART" from sin. I.E.

""Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me."" Ps 51,5

""Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean? not one."" Job 14,4

Those texts DO NOT refer to Christ Jesus EC. Furthermore, Hebrews does not teach that Jesus needed to be a sinner so he could save sinners. The equivalent would equate to a Medical Doctor contracting AIDS so that he would be able to treat people with HIV! Come on! God created us and if a Doctor does not need to become a drug addict to treat a drug addict then Jesus would not be required to be saturated with sin in order to minister to sinners. Have you thought this logic chain through?

Remember when you read Sacred Scripture where it speaks of Christ make sure you read the Scripture and when it says He was made "LIKE US" it does not mean He was made us.

It would be good if you were to turn to Hebrews 4,15 read it and then read the 1st Chapter of James
Earthcaller

Orlando, FL

#33 Dec 5, 2009
maimonides wrote:
<quoted text>
1st,
an Adventist is an Adventist no matter the flavor they happen to come in. A Jehovah's Witness or Christadelphian is as much an Adventist as a "Seventh-day" Adventist is so you need not waste time in attempts to distinguish yourself from your brethren.
In your descriptive of Mary you failed to mention that her condition was "an act of God".
2nd,
In your description of Jesus you failed to mention that He was made in all ways like us "APART" from sin. I.E.
""Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me."" Ps 51,5
""Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean? not one."" Job 14,4
Those texts DO NOT refer to Christ Jesus EC. Furthermore, Hebrews does not teach that Jesus needed to be a sinner so he could save sinners. The equivalent would equate to a Medical Doctor contracting AIDS so that he would be able to treat people with HIV! Come on! God created us and if a Doctor does not need to become a drug addict to treat a drug addict then Jesus would not be required to be saturated with sin in order to minister to sinners. Have you thought this logic chain through?
Remember when you read Sacred Scripture where it speaks of Christ make sure you read the Scripture and when it says He was made "LIKE US" it does not mean He was made us.
It would be good if you were to turn to Hebrews 4,15 read it and then read the 1st Chapter of James
I never said he was a sinner, I stated that he loved righteousness from eternity. Hebrews is specific

16] For surely it is not with angels that he is concerned but with the descendants of Abraham.
[17] Therefore he had to be made like his brethren in every respect,

According to the Catholic version he was protected by Mary a woman who didn't possess a fallen nature.
d-Rock

Quezon, Philippines

#34 Dec 5, 2009
maimonides wrote:
Eartcaller, try to focus on the reality of your situation. A Denomination funded school that teaches evolution is permissible SDA belief provided it's Theistic Evolution.
It's less difficult that an ape, by gradations became a man then it is to accept that a perfectly holy God became a sinner which was subsequently cast into hell by "Bigger God" so just accept Theistic Evolution as Adventist Doctrine evolving into a fuller understanding of God's plan.
Sorry but Theistic Evolution is not acceptable in the SDA beliefs thus the school was questioned about their teaching...look up the website and see for yourselves...http://www.educat etruth.com
d-Rock

Quezon, Philippines

#35 Dec 5, 2009
maimonides

Seattle, WA

#36 Dec 5, 2009
d-Rock wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry but Theistic Evolution is not acceptable in the SDA beliefs thus the school was questioned about their teaching...look up the website and see for yourselves...http://www.educat etruth.com
Given the position of the Seventh-day Adventist Church that Christ had the ability to mutate from God to sinner to not existing at all after He's burned up in Hell what is it about T.E. that violates SDA teaching enough to warrant a thread about it?
Lay Worker

Chippewa Falls, WI

#37 Dec 5, 2009
Maimo failed to provide any quote from EGW

has failed to show the doctrinal claims
maimonides

Seattle, WA

#38 Dec 5, 2009
Lay Worker wrote:
Maimo failed to provide any quote from EGW
has failed to show the doctrinal claims
Forgive me, I thought I had but may have been mistaken. Here you go and if you would like more I certainly have more for you.

""""" """"
One man may be required by God to do a work and stand in a position that is peculiarly trying and taxing. The Lord has a work for him to do and he risks his life, his future eternal life, in standing in that place. THIS WAS the position Christ occupied when He came to our world, entering into conflict with the rebel leader of the fallen angels Ellen White Upward Look, Chapter 34"""" """"" """

That's a direct affirmation Christ "could have burned in hell" Lay Worker, do you require more? Perhaps something more specific as to the type of lusts Christ yearned to commit yet resisted within Himself to commit? I'm happy to serve those as well.

Take Christ and put Him in a beaker, now take the hypothetical Christ Ellen created and put them side by side. One of the two gets to depart into the fire prepared for the Devil and his angels. Inspect the two Christ's and realize that the difference between the two is the difference between God and God's creation therefore I've demonstrated that Theistic Evolution is well within the religious markers of the SDA Church for the simple fact Ellen taught that within God was the ability to Mutate from one species to another by gradations.
Scar

Alpharetta, GA

#39 Dec 6, 2009
Lay Worker,

Do you have a source which breaks down the changes that are interwoven into the 27 fundamental beliefs?

Much appreciated.
Lay Worker

United States

#40 Dec 6, 2009
Scar wrote:
Lay Worker,

Do you have a source which breaks down the changes that are interwoven into the 27 fundamental beliefs?

Much appreciated.
Scar

No problems,,,, Here you go

http://www.adventistlaymen.org/Documents/Stat...

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