Auto industry bailout pulls Kokomo back from brink

Nov 22, 2010 Full story: The Plain Dealer 39

Jerry Price remembers the eerie silence less than two years ago when he walked through one of the transmission plants that long provided the economic lifeblood of this town steeped in auto industry history.

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“Truth to Power!”

Since: Apr 07

Wake Forest, NC

#24 Nov 23, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
Bankruptcy would mean liquidation, period.
AND offshoring those jobs. If you hate American workers that much, maybe you should lobby for the communist Chinese like most Republican policy makers do.
The action saved jobs that would have been eliminated, period.
China, Europe and Japan all provide massive subsidies to keep their corporations profitable in the form of socialized medicine, pension plans, infrastructure improvements, why was Toyota and Nissan so successful?
Their costs of doing business was supplanted by government intervention. Nothing wrong with us doing it once every 60 years or so.
You really need to realize putting your faith in American corporations to do the right thing is a fatal mistake.
Bankruptcy, in many cases, means RE-ORGANIZATION you stupid idiot. Geesh!

Read Moron:
http://www.uscourts.gov/FederalCourts/Bankrup...

“Truth to Power!”

Since: Apr 07

Wake Forest, NC

#26 Nov 23, 2010
Why are progressives like Barbie so Utterly STUPID? Their lack of fundamental facts is so typical of the leftist Filth.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#28 Nov 23, 2010
Why are Flegagging Fascists like Gaffing Gliberal, AKA Boretime, AKA dozens of other trolls on Topix, so utterly vapid and socially retarded?

Their lack of dealing with FACTS is so typical of Repunklican filth.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#29 Nov 23, 2010
The laughing liberal wrote:
<quoted text>
Bankruptcy, in many cases, means RE-ORGANIZATION you stupid idiot. Geesh!
Read Moron:
http://www.uscourts.gov/FederalCourts/Bankrup...
Not in the case of GM or Chrysler- they were slated for liquidation, no debating that.

And Fascist Cheerleaders like Bitch McConnell, Richard Shelby, John Boner, were all itching to destroy the middle class and 1.4 million jobs in one fell swoop.

They were denied, and real American prevailed.

So take your elitist, fascist, knuckle dragging mental retardation and stuff it, troll.
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#30 Nov 23, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
Bankruptcy would mean liquidation, period.
AND offshoring those jobs. If you hate American workers that much, maybe you should lobby for the communist Chinese like most Republican policy makers do.
The action saved jobs that would have been eliminated, period.
China, Europe and Japan all provide massive subsidies to keep their corporations profitable in the form of socialized medicine, pension plans, infrastructure improvements, why was Toyota and Nissan so successful?
Their costs of doing business was supplanted by government intervention. Nothing wrong with us doing it once every 60 years or so.
You really need to realize putting your faith in American corporations to do the right thing is a fatal mistake.
Penske has bought two bankrupt companies, kept the unions and made their ponzi scheme pensions solvent. He was in line to buy Saturn in the government sponsored bankruptcy, bailout, and got cheated by the fools in DC and walked away.

Please respond to the teachers, firefighters and police in Indiana who lost 70cents on the dollar with bonds so the unions equities could retain dollar for dollar value.
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#31 Nov 23, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
Not in the case of GM or Chrysler- they were slated for liquidation, no debating that.
And Fascist Cheerleaders like Bitch McConnell, Richard Shelby, John Boner, were all itching to destroy the middle class and 1.4 million jobs in one fell swoop.
They were denied, and real American prevailed.
So take your elitist, fascist, knuckle dragging mental retardation and stuff it, troll.
Look, if Chrysler was to go to bankruptcy court the good assets would be liquidated to the highest bidder. Take the transmission workers of Kokomo, they would be a hot asset.....they make money.

Penske offered to buy Saturn, eliminating the need to liquidate.

If the bankrupt companies would get no buyers at bankruptcy, they deserve none.....they are failures....that what free market capitalism is all about. Reward success, clear away the failures. Let those assets be bought and operated by competent people.

COnsider this fact - On the same week we bailed out failures China executed two executives who ran a company that killed people with bad milk.........and you wonder why we cant compete....we reward failures.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#32 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>Penske has bought two bankrupt companies, kept the unions and made their ponzi scheme pensions solvent. He was in line to buy Saturn in the government sponsored bankruptcy, bailout, and got cheated by the fools in DC and walked away.
Please respond to the teachers, firefighters and police in Indiana who lost 70cents on the dollar with bonds so the unions equities could retain dollar for dollar value.
Yet they still support liberal candidates. Guess your meme didn't pan out. Even union pension funds were hit hard by the Republican caused economic collapse, so what's your point?

I happen to know Roger Penske, a man who puts his money where his mouth is. He wasn't cheated out of anything, he realized it was a losing proposition and walked.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#33 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>Look, if Chrysler was to go to bankruptcy court the good assets would be liquidated to the highest bidder. Take the transmission workers of Kokomo, they would be a hot asset.....they make money.
Penske offered to buy Saturn, eliminating the need to liquidate.
If the bankrupt companies would get no buyers at bankruptcy, they deserve none.....they are failures....that what free market capitalism is all about. Reward success, clear away the failures. Let those assets be bought and operated by competent people.
COnsider this fact - On the same week we bailed out failures China executed two executives who ran a company that killed people with bad milk.........and you wonder why we cant compete....we reward failures.
So now you're advocating for communist methods in dealing with "failure?"

This says alot, and plays into my assertion for years that the American corporate model has taken much from the communist Chinese model, as evidenced by the sweat shops owned by Walmart in China- controlling the means of production, shipment, and distribution in the U.S.

When Wall Street banks, investment houses and hedge funds, who employ very few people in comparison to automotive manufacturing and their suppliers were handed their bailout of 780 BILLION dollars, it was impossible to deny GM or Chrysler the same, which, if you really understood it, realize it was a fraction of that amount, and was given in LOAN GUARANTEES, not monetary handouts like on Wall Street.

GM and Chrysler obtained their own financing for restructuring with the government guaranteeing those loans should the companies fail during this process, and in exchange the government received company stock for collateral, thus prompting the Rethuglican Reich to scream "Government Motors" and all that rot.

The government wants nothing to do with running a car company, thus the IPO which was the most successful in US history.

So your point is moot, it was good for America, good for job preservation and more.

There is no guarantee jobs would gave gone to another firm had these two companies failed, unless of course you advocate for Chinese or Japanese, or Saudi firms coming in and buying our assets and employing Americans on American soil.

You see, we as liberals are more American, think in American terms, and aren't so quick to hand over America to our enemies as corporate right wing elitists are dying to do.

So we consider Republicans and their policies anti-American, which is a fact, proven time and again.
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#34 Nov 24, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
Yet they still support liberal candidates. Guess your meme didn't pan out. Even union pension funds were hit hard by the Republican caused economic collapse, so what's your point?
I happen to know Roger Penske, a man who puts his money where his mouth is. He wasn't cheated out of anything, he realized it was a losing proposition and walked.
Tell us,,,,,,Why did Penske pull out of Saturn.....

And your answer to changing several hundred years of sound law is........get over it....

You change law to put equities ahead of bonds and say "The GOP did it"

Is the expediency of the moment a principle ?
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#35 Nov 24, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you're advocating for communist methods in dealing with "failure?"
This says alot, and plays into my assertion for years that the American corporate model has taken much from the communist Chinese model, as evidenced by the sweat shops owned by Walmart in China- controlling the means of production, shipment, and distribution in the U.S.
When Wall Street banks, investment houses and hedge funds, who employ very few people in comparison to automotive manufacturing and their suppliers were handed their bailout of 780 BILLION dollars, it was impossible to deny GM or Chrysler the same, which, if you really understood it, realize it was a fraction of that amount, and was given in LOAN GUARANTEES, not monetary handouts like on Wall Street.
GM and Chrysler obtained their own financing for restructuring with the government guaranteeing those loans should the companies fail during this process, and in exchange the government received company stock for collateral, thus prompting the Rethuglican Reich to scream "Government Motors" and all that rot.
The government wants nothing to do with running a car company, thus the IPO which was the most successful in US history.
So your point is moot, it was good for America, good for job preservation and more.
There is no guarantee jobs would gave gone to another firm had these two companies failed, unless of course you advocate for Chinese or Japanese, or Saudi firms coming in and buying our assets and employing Americans on American soil.
You see, we as liberals are more American, think in American terms, and aren't so quick to hand over America to our enemies as corporate right wing elitists are dying to do.
So we consider Republicans and their policies anti-American, which is a fact, proven time and again.
No, I am suggesting the communist are out producing us in the free market.......holding executives accountable for their failure.

Did GM and Chrysler fail or were they victims ?

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#36 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>No, I am suggesting the communist are out producing us in the free market.......holding executives accountable for their failure.
Did GM and Chrysler fail or were they victims ?
You call this a "free" market? LOL!!!!!

GM and Chrysler failed because they were victims.

Victims of Republican foreign trade policy that refuses to implement tarrifs on incoming automobiles from foreign manufacturers.

Victims because foreign car manufacturers are supported by their governments with socialized medicine, pensions, housing, infrastructure improvements, favorable monetary and trade policies.

As far back as the late 70's and early 80's, American car companies were demanding tarrifs be placed on incoming autos to balance the playing field, but Reagan was a union buster, and was more interested in destroying the middle class in an effort to pander to the wealthy corporate elites who fund the party, than keep American industry intact. Facts are Facts.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#37 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>Tell us,,,,,,Why did Penske pull out of Saturn.....
And your answer to changing several hundred years of sound law is........get over it....
You change law to put equities ahead of bonds and say "The GOP did it"
Is the expediency of the moment a principle ?
"Is the expediency of the moment a principle?" you say.

Yes, it is.

FDR at the beginning of WWII TOLD car manufacturers they would be converting their plants to war production and doing it short order, or be nationalized.

They bitched and moaned, and then capitulated.

I would love to have seen Obama try that with Wall Street banks, but sadly, governed more like a Republican, caving in, and giving in to their demands without any real oversight, or demands for lending to the middle class as a prerequisite to getting their bailouts, which were IN CASH, not loan guarantees as in the case of GM and Chrysler.
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#38 Nov 24, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
You call this a "free" market? LOL!!!!!
GM and Chrysler failed because they were victims.
Victims of Republican foreign trade policy that refuses to implement tarrifs on incoming automobiles from foreign manufacturers.
Victims because foreign car manufacturers are supported by their governments with socialized medicine, pensions, housing, infrastructure improvements, favorable monetary and trade policies.
As far back as the late 70's and early 80's, American car companies were demanding tarrifs be placed on incoming autos to balance the playing field, but Reagan was a union buster, and was more interested in destroying the middle class in an effort to pander to the wealthy corporate elites who fund the party, than keep American industry intact. Facts are Facts.
Here in Indiana we have both Honda and Toyota plants, both thriving.....how ?
Why do foreign companies thrive here when American Companies need handouts ?
Are you suggesting Japan subsidizes the benefits of American workers ?
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#39 Nov 24, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
"Is the expediency of the moment a principle?" you say.
Yes, it is.
FDR at the beginning of WWII TOLD car manufacturers they would be converting their plants to war production and doing it short order, or be nationalized.
They bitched and moaned, and then capitulated.
I would love to have seen Obama try that with Wall Street banks, but sadly, governed more like a Republican, caving in, and giving in to their demands without any real oversight, or demands for lending to the middle class as a prerequisite to getting their bailouts, which were IN CASH, not loan guarantees as in the case of GM and Chrysler.
If the expediency of the moment is a principle, why do we need a Constitution ?
LocalBoy

Indianapolis, IN

#40 Nov 24, 2010
Caribou Barbie wrote:
<quoted text>
"Is the expediency of the moment a principle?" you say.
Yes, it is.
FDR at the beginning of WWII TOLD car manufacturers they would be converting their plants to war production and doing it short order, or be nationalized.
They bitched and moaned, and then capitulated.
I would love to have seen Obama try that with Wall Street banks, but sadly, governed more like a Republican, caving in, and giving in to their demands without any real oversight, or demands for lending to the middle class as a prerequisite to getting their bailouts, which were IN CASH, not loan guarantees as in the case of GM and Chrysler.
Uh, these middle class loans are bankrupt.....credit card loans are bankrupt, mortgages are bankrupt.

These consumer loans raise the price of consumer goods, how does that help the working class to have prices rise ?

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#41 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>If the expediency of the moment is a principle, why do we need a Constitution ?
What does the constitution have to do with corporations???

Corporations exist by the graces of the laws on the books, laws that were written at the state level, and subject to change.

Don't remember anything in the constitution about corporations.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#42 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>Here in Indiana we have both Honda and Toyota plants, both thriving.....how ?
Why do foreign companies thrive here when American Companies need handouts ?
Are you suggesting Japan subsidizes the benefits of American workers ?
I realize that. They thrive because the parent company in Japan pays the social charges, pensions, housing, and related subsidies to the workers in Japan, and other nations where they have factories, including socialized medicine.

They just don't provide them to American workers in their factories, so Americans are getting short shrift.

The American workers in foreign plants pay for their own insurance through insurance pools, drawn from their paychecks.

Many shops aren't unionized, either. I don't know if your Japanese factories are unionized or not, I would guess no- they aren't in Tennessee and other "right to work" states.

“Angry Antlers ”

Since: Sep 08

Miami

#43 Nov 24, 2010
LocalBoy wrote:
<quoted text>Uh, these middle class loans are bankrupt.....credit card loans are bankrupt, mortgages are bankrupt.
These consumer loans raise the price of consumer goods, how does that help the working class to have prices rise ?
Banks are sitting on record profits, and NOT reinvesting in American jobs or our future. The HIGHEST profits in recorded history were made by American corporations in the last two years.

Our productivity is soaring, but our wages are depressed, on purpose, since the owners of 95% of the wealth in this country own the corporations, and the Republican party, and have squeezed the maximum out of workers, many are working overtime, two and three jobs, all by design.

The purpose is to bust unions, drive down wages to Indonesian levels, and maximize profit.

Working class Americans are broke due to 30 years of Reaga/Bush economic policy.

What's amazing is that banks and Wall Street don't seem to care that 70% of our GDP is consumerism. But with no money, no credit, and no jobs, that figure will be permanently dropping, thus they will raise the prices of goods to compensate, as they are doing now.

They are greedy elitists, sitting on over 1.6 TRILLION in net profits and not reinvesting in America or American jobs.

This is partly due to their desire to wait out the clock until the 2012 election, hoping to get a Rethuglican in office, when Obama has been friendlier to corporate America than most presidents in recent memory.
yuk

San Jose, CA

#44 May 27, 2014
me

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