Lost in a Rising Sea

Sep 3, 2012 Full story: Biscayne Boulevard Times 34

Reality check: One day in the foreseeable future, most homes and businesses along the Biscayne Corridor will be under water Thanks in large part to centuries of spewing greenhouse gases into the atmosphere, we can expect higher temperatures, unstable weather patterns, and rising seas.

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LessHypeMoreFact

Toronto, Canada

#1 Sep 4, 2012
Excellent article. Anyone want in on gondola shares??

Since: Apr 10

Milwaukee, WI USA

#2 Sep 8, 2012
LessHypeMoreFact wrote:
Excellent article. Anyone want in on gondola shares??
Only if you think gross exaggeration is excellent, the article says:

"...the best estimates are that by 2030, Biscayne Bay and the near-shore ocean...will be between three and seven inches higher than they are today. By 2060 sea level is projected to rise between nine inches and two feet. The bay and ocean won’t stop rising at nine inches or two feet, either ... By the end of the century, a little under 100 years from now, there could be four to six feet or more of sea level rise above the present sea level ...”

A quick check at the Permanent Service for Mean Sea Level (PSMSL)
http://www.psmsl.org/data/obtaining/stations/...
tells me that at Miami Beach sea level is going up at a rate of almost 2.3 mm/yr which will accumulate to about 115 mm (4˝") in 50 years. By the end of the century that works out to 200 mm (8") far short of the six foot exaggeration in the article.

Tell me Mr. LessHypeMoreFact why do you believe this stuff?

Since: Apr 10

Milwaukee, WI USA

#3 Sep 8, 2012
Here's a graph of the Miami Beach tide gauge with a 2nd order polynomial trend
http://oi45.tinypic.com/29clwkl.jpg
I'm sure you can see that the rate of sea level rise is slowing down. When are you going to begin to understand that the gurus on your side of the issue are lying to you?
LessHypeMoreFact

Toronto, Canada

#4 Sep 9, 2012
Denial is a bit pathetic, especially when it it based on confused misinformation about how sea level rise occurs or a faulty assumption of linear trends in the future (which is not supported by the past).

We are clearly showing the first signs of 'tripping points' and accelerated warming as the arctic melts and this will change the rate of melting (and sea level rise) for the Greenland Ice Sheet at the minimum. http://www.agu.org/pubs/crossref/2011/2009JB0...

Deny all you want. The planet is warming from AGW. The ice sheets are melting. There is plentiful evidence that ice sheet loss is accelerating, doubling every decade or less.

And the sea is bound to rise between about one and two meters in the next eighty or ninety years. About what the article is commenting on (or rather the economic consequences of the sea level rise)

“Happy, warm and comfortable”

Since: Oct 10

Mountain hideaway, SE Spain

#5 Sep 10, 2012
NobodyYouEverWantToKnow, aka:
LessFactMoreHype wrote:
the first signs of 'tripping points'
WTF are "tripping" points, Mr Undoubtably Spelt Fourty?
NoFactAllHype wrote:
one and two meters[US] in the next eighty or ninety years.
Why not simply admit that you've been led over to the dark side, away from British English, and that you now spell like your Americousins?
LessFactMoreHype wrote:
The point is that I learned 'correct English spelling' very well and will use it even if MS-word takes over the rest of the world.
http://www.topix.com/forum/energy/nuclear-ene...
PHD

Houston, TX

#6 Sep 10, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
NobodyYouEverWantToKnow, aka:
<quoted text>WTF are "tripping" points, Mr Undoubtably Spelt Fourty?<quoted text>Why not simply admit that you've been led over to the dark side, away from British English, and that you now spell like your Americousins?
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/energy/nuclear-ene...
Well we are on the fence with you dirtling. Your leaning more towards the Dumb Assumption of your self and getting away from the useless babble. Did you forget to take your meds this morning?
Fun Facts

Las Cruces, NM

#7 Sep 10, 2012
LessHypeMoreFact wrote:
We are clearly showing the first signs of 'tripping points' and accelerated warming as the arctic melts and this will change the rate of melting (and sea level rise) for the Greenland Ice Sheet at the minimum. http://www.agu.org/pubs/crossref/2011/2009JB0...
You could be right about the 'tripping points' except it may not 'trip' the way you think.

The Gulf Stream is slowing. The Gulf Stream is the ocean current that brings warmth to the eastern US and Europe. When the Gulf Stream slows less warmth is distributed to the US and Europe and the temps get cooler.

The freshening of the MOC, the larger current in the Atlantic causes the Gulf Stream to slow. The freshening is caused by the colder waters from the ice melt.

If enough colder fresher water is added, then the natural process would indicate a colder eastern US and Europe.
litesong

Lynnwood, WA

#8 Sep 10, 2012
fun farts wrote:
If enough colder fresher water is added, then the natural process would indicate a colder eastern US and Europe.
For years, lots of topix AGW deniers have complained that AGW advocates attribute AGW to both warming Earth events AND cooling Earth events.

Now, a topix AGW denier starts saying what AGW advocates have said for years.... but he makes it sound like something new he discovered, giving no credit to AGW scientists.

topix AGW deniers at their denial best.
Fun Facts

Las Cruces, NM

#9 Sep 10, 2012
litesong wrote:
<quoted text>
For years, lots of topix AGW deniers have complained that AGW advocates attribute AGW to both warming Earth events AND cooling Earth events.
Now, a topix AGW denier starts saying what AGW advocates have said for years.... but he makes it sound like something new he discovered, giving no credit to AGW scientists.
topix AGW deniers at their denial best.
Nothing new, this is the process that scientists think caused the Younger Dryas and the cool down after the thermal max. There's even some scientist who think it was part of the transition between the MWP and the LIA.
LessHypeMoreFact

Toronto, Canada

#10 Sep 10, 2012
Fun Facts wrote:
<quoted text>
You could be right about the 'tripping points' except it may not 'trip' the way you think.
But the arctic is clearly opening up. This is very solid evidence for the increase in solar insolation in the polar regions. There is VERy little doubt about the albedo of water vs ice.
http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/cgi-bin/seaice-m...
Fun Facts wrote:
<quoted text>
The Gulf Stream is slowing. The Gulf Stream is the ocean current that brings warmth to the eastern US and Europe. When the Gulf Stream slows less warmth is distributed to the US and Europe and the temps get cooler.
First off, this will (if it happens) not change the OVERALL solar insolation affecting GLOBAL temperatures.

Second, there is no current evidence that it is happening. It could maybe but I don't heed flights of fancy so much as the REALITY of arctic melting (as a tipping point in climate changes).

If it DID happen, though, it is likely that it would induce about a 10C warming over Greenland.
http://www.pik-potsdam.de/~stefan/thc_fact_sh...
and the resulting rapid collapse of the Greenland Ice Sheet would be MUCH more drastic than the change in Europes climate due to sea level changes (increasing water vapor warming due to increased area of oceans as well).
Fun Facts wrote:
<quoted text>
The freshening of the MOC, the larger current in the Atlantic causes the Gulf Stream to slow. The freshening is caused by the colder waters from the ice melt.
Yet recent measurements show no such slowing. The melting of greenland ice is not enough to stop the WIND driven THC gyre, and the melting of SEA ICE has no effect on salinity.
Fun Facts wrote:
<quoted text>
If enough colder fresher water is added, then the natural process would indicate a colder eastern US and Europe.
If we are working with phantasms of your mind alone, why bother with the arctic at all? For teh rest of us, reality is too important to be ignored.

“Happy, warm and comfortable”

Since: Oct 10

Mountain hideaway, SE Spain

#11 Sep 10, 2012
Fun Facts wrote:
Nothing new, this is the process that scientists think caused the Younger Dryas and the cool down after the thermal max. There's even some scientist who think it was part of the transition between the MWP and the LIA.
The alarmist dummies who post here won't understand that, sadly.

“Happy, warm and comfortable”

Since: Oct 10

Mountain hideaway, SE Spain

#12 Sep 10, 2012
NobodyYouEverWantToKnow, aka:
LessFactMoreHype wrote:
If we are working with phantasms of your mind alone, why bother with the arctic at all?
Good point.
This was from the "phantasm" of your mind:
"One more example of Dirling[sic], the silver spooned aristocrat. "if you have to ask, you can't afford it' never applies to him, of course. Money is something you take for granted at his level of priviledge."
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/global-warmin...
NoFactAllHype wrote:
For teh[sic] rest of us, reality is too important to be ignored.
From the idiot who wrote:
LessFactMoreHype wrote:
I am certainly bordering on being an intellectual
http://www.topix.com/forum/colleges/purdue-un...
litesong

Lynnwood, WA

#13 Sep 10, 2012
steenking piddling diddling middling mudling mudslinger dirtling wrote:
The alarmist dummies who post here won't understand that, sadly.
Idiot topix AGW deniers think the AGW scientists haven't compensated for everything that hi skule (& less) AGW deniers talk about. That's why AGW deniers have so little education. Its the only way they can believe they are intuitively smarter than scientists with 10-16 years more mathematics & science than deniers have. topix AGW deniers have never competed against stunningly intelligent workaholic mathematicians, scientists, engineers, physicists, chemists, & astronomers.
Fun Facts

Las Cruces, NM

#14 Sep 11, 2012
LessHypeMoreFact wrote:
<quoted text>
But the arctic is clearly opening up. This is very solid evidence for the increase in solar insolation in the polar regions. There is VERy little doubt about the albedo of water vs ice.
http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/cgi-bin/seaice-m...
<quoted text>
First off, this will (if it happens) not change the OVERALL solar insolation affecting GLOBAL temperatures.
Second, there is no current evidence that it is happening. It could maybe but I don't heed flights of fancy so much as the REALITY of arctic melting (as a tipping point in climate changes).
If it DID happen, though, it is likely that it would induce about a 10C warming over Greenland.
http://www.pik-potsdam.de/~stefan/thc_fact_sh...
and the resulting rapid collapse of the Greenland Ice Sheet would be MUCH more drastic than the change in Europes climate due to sea level changes (increasing water vapor warming due to increased area of oceans as well).
<quoted text>
Yet recent measurements show no such slowing. The melting of greenland ice is not enough to stop the WIND driven THC gyre, and the melting of SEA ICE has no effect on salinity.
<quoted text>
If we are working with phantasms of your mind alone, why bother with the arctic at all? For teh rest of us, reality is too important to be ignored.
NASA has measured a weakening of the Atlantic currents by satelitte since 2005.
Fun Facts

Las Cruces, NM

#15 Sep 11, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
<quoted text>The alarmist dummies who post here won't understand that, sadly.
I know, for them it's like watching a catastrophe unfold that has never happened before. For me, it's watching a movie rerun.

It's all perspective, if your perspective is narrow, you'll never see the big picture.

“Happy, warm and comfortable”

Since: Oct 10

Mountain hideaway, SE Spain

#16 Sep 11, 2012
Fun Facts wrote:
I know, for them it's like watching a catastrophe unfold that has never happened before. For me, it's watching a movie rerun.
It's all perspective, if your perspective is narrow, you'll never see the big picture.
No one will ever see the 'complete' big picture, not even when it's too late.
Fun Facts

Las Cruces, NM

#17 Sep 11, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
<quoted text>No one will ever see the 'complete' big picture, not even when it's too late.
A true statment. To see the 'complete' big picture would require knowing all there is to know.
LessHypeMoreFact

Toronto, Canada

#18 Sep 11, 2012
Fun Facts wrote:
<quoted text>
NASA has measured a weakening of the Atlantic currents by satelitte since 2005.
More BS from the guys who makes funny 'facts'.

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php...

Truth is that NASA has shown that the THC is NOT slowing.
SpaceBlues

Houston, TX

#19 Sep 11, 2012
Fun Facts wrote:
<quoted text>
A true statment. To see the 'complete' big picture would require knowing all there is to know.
Funny way to correct yourself with "true statment."

You were wrong.
Fun Facts

Las Cruces, NM

#20 Sep 12, 2012
LessHypeMoreFact wrote:
<quoted text>
More BS from the guys who makes funny 'facts'.
http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php...
Truth is that NASA has shown that the THC is NOT slowing.
"The report shows that the sea-level rise hotspot is consistent with the slowing of Atlantic Ocean circulation. Models show this change in circulation may be tied to changes in water temperature, salinity and density in the subpolar north Atlantic."

http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp...

As always, one says yes, the other says no. Until we can get our scientists on the same page, doing something even if it's wrong, is still wrong.

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