Attn. Armstrong Wood Products Plant E...
wtf-

Forsyth, MO

#43 Feb 7, 2013
You have to get 50% of the work force to agree to unionize in the first place. I really doubt you can get that much support.
hmmm

Branson, MO

#44 Feb 8, 2013
hmmm wrote:
You do have good points west plains so many people are misinformed including me when I previously posted after running into a couple of Armstrong employees I have to say I agree with them going union also now.
So you are going to pretend to be me, say I am admitting to being misinformed, and I now agree that unions are great??? NICE TRY. We have different writing styles and my location will always show up as Ozark, MO or West Plains, MO.

I was only pointing out the cons of a union. If the employees do their research and feel that this particular union is the best way to go I fully support that. I fully support that EVERYONE should be paid fair wages, have benefits including decent/affordable insurance with paid time off, and be appreciated for the work they do. Employers should willfully do those things and not be forced to but we all know that generally doesn't happen.

I was never trying to sway anyone's opinion one way or the other. That is the reason I have not posted anymore until you pretended to be me. Please don't pretend to be me or accuse me of working for the company anymore. I was innocently pointing out the other side of unions but you and others are pulling some pretty deceitful tactics on this thread.
really

West Plains, MO

#45 Feb 8, 2013
How interesting it is to read all these comments!So many opinions on things "NOBODY" knows anything about. Now, since I've been deemed an Idiot' How much of an Idiot can I be? I still have my job(no threats)I still have my home, food on the table and clothes on my back, and the backs of my children! I thank God for these blessings not a Union! Maybe this is simple enough to understand, In God we trust, not man, Union, or company! God bless us all, we will all be better for it!

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#46 Feb 8, 2013
really wrote:
How interesting it is to read all these comments!So many opinions on things "NOBODY" knows anything about. Now, since I've been deemed an Idiot' How much of an Idiot can I be? I still have my job(no threats)I still have my home, food on the table and clothes on my back, and the backs of my children! I thank God for these blessings not a Union! Maybe this is simple enough to understand, In God we trust, not man, Union, or company! God bless us all, we will all be better for it!
Amen ;)
fyi

United States

#47 Feb 8, 2013
Hmm if you was framed well so be it but your location is different a lot not always where you say. It's ok to just admit wat you say no one really knows anyone on here or cares so its ok don't get your feelings hurt or your life to wrapped up over topix about like this was prob not the best site to post this topic anonymous. Just sayn yall
FYI

United States

#48 Feb 9, 2013
Let me preface my opinion with a couple of facts:

I possess a B.A.S. in Business Administration graduating some years ago Summa cum laude (latin for "with highest honors") which included the study of unions and their effect on society and business.

I have owned multiple businesses, one of which included transporting raw materials into Armstrong.

It is my opinion that, due to the study of union and real-world observations of the effects of unions, and stories related to me by union-member family members, that unions have outlived their usefulness and are now are detrimental to business and capitalism. I would go as far to say that they are not much above street gangs and organized crime who extort business operators.

Unions, many years ago, did serve a purpose that benefitted society. That, however, was prior to the emerges of governmental agencies that protect the rihts of the worker, such as the Equal Employment Opportuniy Commission; the American Civil Liberties Union; the Americans with Disabilities Act, and the Occupational Safety and Heath Administration.

I believe that most of those that are employed by Armstrong are freedom loving and capitalistic Americans - not Socialists or Communists.

Capitalism is fueled by the laws of supply and demand. Just as consumers vote with their dollars (i.e. looking for the best "bang for your buck" whether they are shopping for groceries, durable goods, or an automobile).

The same holds true for employment. Any employer has to be competitive on salaries and working conditions to attract the most qualified workers. It is this competitive free enterprise concept that determines working conditions and not the unions. To believe that the corporate world would quickly revert to primitive and abusive working conditions without the unions is a very naive and uneducated opinion.

An employee looking for a job is in the same position as a shopper looking to buy a car or a refrigerator; they are looking for the best product for the money.

A merchant must be competitive to attract customers and in the same way an employer must be competitive to attract employees. They are both the free enterprise system at work. Unions are simply not needed and the fact that, in some industries, the employees are forced to join the union and pay union dues is un-American.

When the additional costs are added to the existing cost of goods sold, taxes, etc, there comes a point of equalibrium - costs equal profits. NO company will continue to operate if there is NO RETURN ON INVESTMENT.

A company can be privately owned or publicly owned, in which case, it is most likely offers publicly traded stock. Everyone complains about how much money the oil companies make, but never mention that MANY of their own 401K's INVEST IN THOSE PUBLICLY TRADED STOCKS!

The shareholds of Armstrong DESERVE to make a profit for it is THEM that is investing (risking) their money, NOT THE UNIONS!

If YOU owned stock in Company A, would you want the union to take half of your stock dividends? No!

One does not work their way up the socio-economic ladder for minimum wage increases or strong-arm tactics. You improve your earning potential by increasing your skills and marketability - education, experience, trade skill, etc.

It is entirely possible that Armstrong could shut down and move to a friendlier operational environment. Then what? Another empty building and people complaining about the lack of opportunity?

If you think things are bad now, just wait a few years. At this time, China imports about 1.5 billion bushels of U.S. corn. Due to the increasing size of the middle class in China (due to the industrial revolution they are experiencing), in a mere 3 years, it is expected that they will import 12 BILLION bushels of U.S. corn, thereby putting the cost of beef and chicken out the reach of MANY, MANY AMERICANS!$7 for a gallon of milk!

We live in a GLOBAL ECONOMY, people. Be prepared for harder times.

FYI

United States

#49 Feb 9, 2013
BTW, I have been "FYI," with CAPITAL letters long before noticing the "fyi" that posted just prior to my previous post.

In no way was I attempting to mock "fyi" or portray myself to be "fyi." The "FYI" following "fyi" was strictly conincidental.
FYI

United States

#50 Feb 9, 2013
Please forgive my few typos in my original post. I do not proofread as my fingers fly with my thoughts on my fingertips. I DO know how to spell "emergence." It's just that sometimes my fingers develop a mind of their own - kinda like one's legs would if they came face-to-face with a GRIZZLY BEAR in the forest.

"Two men were hunting moose in Alaska when out of the bramble 40 yards up the trail appeared a 10 foot tall sow Grizzly with cubs! One hunter, shaking and attempting to get a round in the chamber of his bolt action rifle, noticed out of the corner of his eye, his companion calmly pulling a pair of tennis shoes out of his backpack. With his voice cracking under the stress of the situation, the rifleman blurted out, "You CRAZY SOB, you KNOW we can't outrun that bear!" Without looking up and continuing to tie his laces, the second hunter responded, "Screw the bear, all I've gotta do is outrun YOU!" :D

;)
really

Ozark, MO

#51 Feb 10, 2013
As I read all these comments I wonder how it will effect my everyday living! I'ts true we've not had a decent raise in about four years, I choose to see what the company has to offer before I decide to disrupt all our lives! Give Armstrong a chance, the Union will always be in the shadows,ready to pounce!That is what they do best. We are the working class people we are intelligent we know what is taking place in our work place! We need to trust ourselves, the person standing next to us, on the line, If we stand together, Union or not, we can make things move! We have the knowledge now let's use it!!!!!!
get real

West Plains, MO

#52 Feb 10, 2013
No Union wrote:
My spouse works at Armstrong and has for 20+ years. He has never had a pay cut. No the raises haven't been great lately, but in today's economy with onlywan a highschool education, you're lucky to make more than minimum wage. Unions only close factories. All of the Armstrong plants that have closed are Union. Why keep a plant open being forced to pay $5 more an hour to employees? Armstrong will keep non-union plants open longer!! Be thankful Armstrong is still here and don't ruin it by going Union!! Also, why would we want to PAY a Union. You'll end up with even less take home pay!!
Yes if you remember we did have a pay cut 3 years ago. We went from a 3% raise to 2% that's 1% deduction in pay and haven't been able to keep our raises for the next year, meaning base pay stays the same. Armstrong has saved at least $500 a year per employee doing this.They have blinded some with these lump sum checks for your raise but really just sticking it to you. Add it up. Mabe a union is what the west plains plant needs.
fools

United States

#53 Feb 10, 2013
Old Timer wrote:
<quoted text>This plant won't last 2 years if it goe's union... Look around busniess are hurting! The last thing they need is some union boss telling them how to run A busniess! I don't work there and never have, But my experince with unions is. They cost the worker and the worker gets screwed! My 2 cents.
its not going to last two years if they don't get new management and quit running the place in the ground!
observer

Branson, MO

#54 Feb 10, 2013
Nothing but a bunch of inbred losers work there so who cares if they go out of business.
get real

United States

#55 Feb 10, 2013
observer wrote:
Nothing but a bunch of inbred losers work there so who cares if they go out of business.
You must have been fired. Just couldn't cut it could you.
really

Ozark, MO

#56 Feb 13, 2013
Well this topic seems to be playing it's self out! Getting rather boring to say the least! Whether Armstrong Bruce's branch becomes union or not looks like a toss up, so let's let the wind blow!
NON-union thug

Sparta, MO

#57 Feb 13, 2013
I believe everyone that is blaming the company for the pay cut probably voted for 0 and are to stupid to realize they have cut their own pay. A union will make your job go away. Think about how many times unions have tried to get in W.P. all have closed shop. If I owned it I know I would close it down. The unions are one of the problems with the USA.
union

United States

#59 Feb 16, 2013
You know that punk ass that made the twinky? We raped and killed it.... because we care. Go Yankees!
On the Inside

Ozark, MO

#60 Feb 24, 2013
IMO The WP Armstrong plant is making lots of money right now ... Warren, AR just is adding another shift, WV is back up to full. I hear talk of bringing jackson back up too. Are the Wp employees the least paid in the company ??? What do you think!!! Who is responsible for screwing up the lumber yard? Lumber is not drying properly because overbought and were forced to stack lumber crosswise disrupting airflow.
WP could afford to pay it's people the same as WV ... Why not?
neo

Sparta, MO

#61 Feb 24, 2013
On the Inside wrote:
IMO The WP Armstrong plant is making lots of money right now ... Warren, AR just is adding another shift, WV is back up to full. I hear talk of bringing jackson back up too. Are the Wp employees the least paid in the company ??? What do you think!!! Who is responsible for screwing up the lumber yard? Lumber is not drying properly because overbought and were forced to stack lumber crosswise disrupting airflow.
WP could afford to pay it's people the same as WV ... Why not?
In the world of the liberal you are not yours. You do not own yourself, nor do you own the fruits of your labors. The government owns you. The government will decide how the money you earned is distributed.
You will be allowed to keep enough to keep you happy – to keep you working. The amount you are allowed to keep will be referred to in Washington, as a “tax expenditure.” The rest of the money you have earned, which will be referred to as “your fair share,” will be spent to create more and more government dependency.
Be pissed at how much the govt takes from your check and gives to your neighbor that sits on their azz all day, making slightly less than you do!
tfdd

Verona, MO

#62 Feb 26, 2013
Unions kill jobs
neighbors

West Plains, MO

#63 Feb 26, 2013
tfdd wrote:
Unions kill jobs
Which jobs did the unions kill at armstrong WV plant?

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