Garden Parkway opponents fund TV ads to criticize project

There are 20 comments on the Apr 8, 2011, The Gaston Gazette story titled Garden Parkway opponents fund TV ads to criticize project. In it, The Gaston Gazette reports that:

Opponents of a nearly $1 billion toll road that would cross southern Gaston County have taken their fight to television.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Gaston Gazette.

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Michael Moore

Belmont, NC

#1 Apr 11, 2011
From the article on why they're running TV ads:

"We’re reaching out to folks who don’t read"

LOL!
Why Not

Gastonia, NC

#2 Apr 11, 2011
I think they have a good point. Considering how high our dropout rate is in this county and how many people watch tv instead of reading the paper, why wouldn't they run tv ads?
Redneck Yankee

Gastonia, NC

#3 Apr 12, 2011
The newspaper, in case you haven't heard, is gradually being replaced by technology. The rise of the internet & the expansion of cable news network.
Redneck Yankee

Gastonia, NC

#4 Apr 12, 2011
Michael Moore wrote:
From the article on why they're running TV ads:
"We’re reaching out to folks who don’t read"
LOL!
In case you haven't heard the newspaper is gradually being replaced by the rise of the internet & the expansion of cable news network.
Malcolm III

Charlotte, NC

#5 Apr 12, 2011
Unfortunately, the way that the majority of people make up their minds about most issues is from 10 to 30 second advertisements and videoclips on TV.

Personally, I was shocked that they would really even consider this parkway if it meant that we were going to lose jobs, but then I read that the reason they made those job loss predictions is that they couldn't assume that the land surrounding the parkway would be rezoned.

Just like the movie producer Michael Moore told half truths in the movie "Farenheit 911", these ads will be telling a half truth about jobs loss as well.
TheTruthWillSetY ouFree

Gastonia, NC

#6 Apr 12, 2011
Malcolm III wrote:
Unfortunately, the way that the majority of people make up their minds about most issues is from 10 to 30 second advertisements and videoclips on TV.
Personally, I was shocked that they would really even consider this parkway if it meant that we were going to lose jobs, but then I read that the reason they made those job loss predictions is that they couldn't assume that the land surrounding the parkway would be rezoned.
Just like the movie producer Michael Moore told half truths in the movie "Farenheit 911", these ads will be telling a half truth about jobs loss as well.
Malcolm, tell us some truths about how he road will help us. And I mean hard facts. All the "truths" the "for the road" crowd tells turn out to be outright lies! And we know the TPA can't tell the truth. The job loss data seems to be fixed as well as the data behind the Monroe bypass. Let's not talk about who is not being truthful my friend.
anon

AOL

#7 Apr 12, 2011
I'm glad to see cable 14 get some ad dollars.$$$$ It'll run out soon. Let's not mention where's the money for the ad's coming from. Maybe you should look a little deeper into to that, or should we just let it go and call ignorance bliss. Let's just ass-u-me it's free.

They could do a better job on selling their position. Promoting fear and anger ain't going to get you BETTER support. The best you can hope for is bottom feeders who hate anything to do with goverment and business. Of course, they yell the loudest and usually get their way. Ain't politics grand.
Malcolm III

Denver, NC

#8 Apr 12, 2011
TheTruthWillSetYouFree wrote:
<quoted text>
Malcolm, tell us some truths about how he road will help us. And I mean hard facts. All the "truths" the "for the road" crowd tells turn out to be outright lies! And we know the TPA can't tell the truth. The job loss data seems to be fixed as well as the data behind the Monroe bypass. Let's not talk about who is not being truthful my friend.
I'm pointing one - and only one - instance of these TV ads telling a half truth: and that is the job loss numbers. The only way those job loss prediction numbers from the impact statement are valid estimates is if they don't re-zone the land from Agricultural or residential to industrial/commercial.

If they do rezone the land (and of course they will), then there's obviously the potential for more jobs right here in Gaston County.

And yet the front page of the www.stopthetollroad.com website still has a picture of a car driving off a cliff with an excerpt about us losing jobs.

We can debate the finer points of City Planning, etc, but the job loss argument is 100% bunk, and they keep trying to scare people with it.

Since: May 09

Location hidden

#9 Apr 12, 2011
TheTruthWillSetYouFree wrote:
<quoted text>
Malcolm, tell us some truths about how he road will help us. And I mean hard facts. All the "truths" the "for the road" crowd tells turn out to be outright lies! And we know the TPA can't tell the truth. The job loss data seems to be fixed as well as the data behind the Monroe bypass. Let's not talk about who is not being truthful my friend.
Just look at Ballantyne to see what good access can do. How many jobs have been created in that area by good highway access. Bill Toole and Billy Joye should be ashamed of themselves.
TheTruthWillSetY ouFree

Gastonia, NC

#10 Apr 12, 2011
Malcolm III wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm pointing one - and only one - instance of these TV ads telling a half truth: and that is the job loss numbers. The only way those job loss prediction numbers from the impact statement are valid estimates is if they don't re-zone the land from Agricultural or residential to industrial/commercial.
If they do rezone the land (and of course they will), then there's obviously the potential for more jobs right here in Gaston County.
And yet the front page of the www.stopthetollroad.com website still has a picture of a car driving off a cliff with an excerpt about us losing jobs.
We can debate the finer points of City Planning, etc, but the job loss argument is 100% bunk, and they keep trying to scare people with it.
Malcolm, if the job estimates from the impact statement are wrong then what else in the document is not valid? While the number appears to be low, the impact statement does indeed show jobs going south of the border. And it appears the number of jobs going south may be MUCH greater than they are saying. Did you read the quote beside the pic on the site? "I don’t think there would be much support for a project in NC that appears to benefit SC the most and takes away growth from the I-85 corridor on the order of 10- 15 percent.” Jill Gurak, chief project engineer, to Turnpike Authority (May 13, 2010). Oh, the pic is from the Charlotte Observer by the way. It's not some pic someone in the STTR Group came up with.
TheTruthWillSetY ouFree

Gastonia, NC

#11 Apr 12, 2011
Robert Stowe wrote:
<quoted text>Just look at Ballantyne to see what good access can do. How many jobs have been created in that area by good highway access. Bill Toole and Billy Joye should be ashamed of themselves.
You should be ashamed of yourself, sir. Toole and Joye aren't making this stuff up. It's coming from the TPA data. And as I said in my comment to Malcolm it looks like the number of jobs going to SC is in the order of 10-15%.
belmont boy

Gastonia, NC

#12 Apr 12, 2011
Well, Malcolm, I'm sure it would be too much to suggest you read the turnpike authority's documents, so I suppose it makes the most sense just to cut and paste the relevant parts of that $20 million study for you.

"Up to 3,700 additional households and 300 fewer jobs are anticipated in the ICE Study Area as a
result of the indirect development shifts associated with the project." Environmental Impact Study, p 2-69. In plain english, more kids in the schools, and less jobs.

Worse, the Turnpike authority figured 650 jobs would go directly to SC. So that means Gaston County loses 950 jobs (300 +650).

The Turnpike Authority figured all this out by calling together an "expert panel; comprised of local planners, real estate representatives, economic developers, and utility providers," along with the assistance of the University of North Carolina at Charlotte’s Urban Land Institute.

These experts used the gravity model, which assumes there is "no constraint on the growth a zone can experience." This means the experts assumed that water and sewer would be widely available, and that zoning would not be an issue.

The exact quote reads the committee "developed a methodology utilizing economic forecasts, local building permit trends, census data, and local land
development knowledge such as current and future land use, utility improvements, economic
development potential, and land availability." EIS p2-64.

So the question is, do you trust the $20 million study that was put together by people paid to build toll roads, or would you rather believe in fairy dust?

Since: May 09

Location hidden

#13 Apr 13, 2011
TheTruthWillSetYouFree wrote:
<quoted text>
You should be ashamed of yourself, sir. Toole and Joye aren't making this stuff up. It's coming from the TPA data. And as I said in my comment to Malcolm it looks like the number of jobs going to SC is in the order of 10-15%.
The TPA data are based on present zoning which would surely change if the road is built. You don't dispute that many jobs have been created in the Ballantyne area, do you?
TheTruthWillSetY ouFree

Gastonia, NC

#14 Apr 13, 2011
Robert Stowe wrote:
<quoted text>The TPA data are based on present zoning which would surely change if the road is built. You don't dispute that many jobs have been created in the Ballantyne area, do you?
I don't know if jobs have been created there or not. I haven't researched job numbers before or after roads were built. I do know that the road to and from Ballantyne is not a toll road. Every time you get on the proposed GP you'll have to pay to use it. How many people are going to do that, especially in this economy? Not me and not many others I know. I do know of areas where roads have been built and no jobs have been created. You can't assume that just because there is a road jobs will be created.
Lulu

Gastonia, NC

#15 Apr 13, 2011
Robert Stowe wrote:
<quoted text>The TPA data are based on present zoning which would surely change if the road is built. You don't dispute that many jobs have been created in the Ballantyne area, do you?
May I suggest you move to Ballantyne? That's more your style. I'm sure there are PLENTY of houses for sale over there.

Oh yes, there are many jobs there....people drive from miles around to clog the streets there and cause daily wrecks. It's a "paradise". LOL. Pardon me while I take my child to ballet and then on to the 100.00 hairdresser and then to meet my bffs for a 50.00 lunch - before getting the oil changed in my Mercedes. I might even drop in for a 120.00 massage at Ballantyne Resort. LOL.

Taxes? Nothing to me, dearie. I can afford them.:)

Traffic? Oh my, it's so much better than where I came from up north. hehe.

What a facade! "Let them eat cake!"

Sheesh!
Lulu

Gastonia, NC

#16 Apr 13, 2011
TheTruthWillSetYouFree wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't know if jobs have been created there or not. I haven't researched job numbers before or after roads were built. I do know that the road to and from Ballantyne is not a toll road. Every time you get on the proposed GP you'll have to pay to use it. How many people are going to do that, especially in this economy? Not me and not many others I know. I do know of areas where roads have been built and no jobs have been created. You can't assume that just because there is a road jobs will be created.
Most of the jobs are hotel room cleaners, table servers, store clerks, and other low pay jobs to serve the privileged residents of La-La Land. Oh, there are a few office jobs there where most people in them work 10-12 hour days so management can get huge bonuses at the expense of their labor.
Lulu

Gastonia, NC

#17 Apr 13, 2011
Bottom line- if we wanted to live in Ballantyne we'd move there! We don't want that in Belmont!
Malcolm III

Charlotte, NC

#18 Apr 13, 2011
Actually, my last contract job was in Ballantyne.

It's nice, and there are lots of good paying jobs there, but I hated driving all the way there from Belmont.

For those who haven't read it: Here's a link to an interview with Steve DeWitt, chief engineer for the North Carolina Turnpike Authority which is responsible for building the Garden Parkway:

http://www.wfae.org/wfae/1_87_115.cfm...

Since: May 09

Location hidden

#19 Apr 13, 2011
TheTruthWillSetYouFree wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't know if jobs have been created there or not. I haven't researched job numbers before or after roads were built. I do know that the road to and from Ballantyne is not a toll road. Every time you get on the proposed GP you'll have to pay to use it. How many people are going to do that, especially in this economy? Not me and not many others I know. I do know of areas where roads have been built and no jobs have been created. You can't assume that just because there is a road jobs will be created.
The truth is that most road opponents have property in the direct path of the road. Mr. Toole and Mr. Joye are both directly affected. They need to be honest about that fact. It is intellectually dishonest and just plain silly to argue that the road will not be a huge economic engine for southern Gaston County.
TheTruthWillSetY ouFree

Gastonia, NC

#20 Apr 13, 2011
Robert Stowe wrote:
<quoted text>The truth is that most road opponents have property in the direct path of the road. Mr. Toole and Mr. Joye are both directly affected. They need to be honest about that fact. It is intellectually dishonest and just plain silly to argue that the road will not be a huge economic engine for southern Gaston County.
What's the real reason you want the road Mr. Stowe? Isn't it because it provides a straight shot to the DSBG?

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